Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Patients Experiences => Topic started by: Descreteuser on May 08, 2015, 04:19:24 PM
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• Saturday February 14th - Arrived at the airport and met 2 men holding my name on a piece of paper. They drove me to a hotel about 2 hours from the airport, where I was to stay before having the operation. It was a very uneasy experience landing in a country that I knew very little about, and knowing the hard process that was awaiting me. The drivers made me feel very comfortable, which helped me relax a little bit.
• Sunday February 15th - One of the drivers visited me at my hotel and showed me around the city and helped me get sorted with a new phone and number so I could keep in contact with the doctor
• Tuesday February 17th – Doctor visited me at my hotel and discussed what the plan was with the operation. I was scheduled to have my operation on Thursday the 19th of February.
• Wednesday February 18th – I met another patient who was 7 months post operation. We went out and got a drink and he shared his whole experience. He was walking without crutches with a slight limp. He told me about certain complications he had during lengthening with misalignments, but the alignments were fixed by the doctor once lengthening had finished with a simple adjustment to the device. He started walking small distances without walker after 5 months. He explained how to stretch every day to avoid ballerina, and how to try an avoid having similar complications that he had experienced by having more frequent x rays.
• Thursday February 19th – Doctor contacted me and told me the operation was delayed until Saturday.
• Friday February 20th – Doctor contacted me again and my operation was delayed yet again until Monday. This caused extreme frustration to me as it gave me more time to think, and I started questioning myself whether or not I wanted to follow through with the operation. I was an emotional rollercoaster changing my mind every few hours.
• Sunday February 22nd – I made a decision and rang the doctor and told him I wanted to cancel the operation and get my money back. He was completely understandable and told me it was totally my decision and to think about it over night, and let him know the next morning if that was my final decision.
• Monday February 23rd – After spending the night tossing and turning trying to decide what to do, I rang the doctor and told him that I was going to go through with the operation. I went to the hospital, shaved my legs and was put on the operating table. I suddenly woke up and was told the surgery was finished, only to find that my right leg was the only one with the device on it. I asked them why this was and they said the doctor made the decision to do this as it would be more comfortable for me. The left leg was due to be done in another week. To be honest this really pissed me off.
• Tuesday February 24th to Sunday 1st March – This was probably the toughest time of my life. Sitting in a hospital with one broken leg, at times in extreme pain. I became an emotional wreck and thought to myself what the hell have I done. I became afraid of the whole experience and when Sunday came around id made the decision that I wouldn’t get the other leg done, let my right leg heal and get a portion of my money back. I left the hospital and returned to the hotel with crutches. I was told it would take 2 months to heal after which time id be able to walk normally like I was before.
• Thursday 5th March – Terrible night to say the least. After going out for a few drinks I spent the night trying to sleep, but the extreme pain in my leg was unbearable. This was due to the fact that I hadn’t started lengthening and the bones were grinding against each other. I yelled a few times and cursed just praying that I could at least get some sleep.
• Friday March 6th – After a long sleepless night I took my self to the hospital and asked to call the doctor as my phone wasn’t working. I asked for a pain shot as every movement was horrific. After waiting in discomfort for 3 hours the doctor told me to go and get an x ray. I got an x ray done and returned to the hospital where the doctor looked at it. Everything was normal. The pain was from over using the leg. I was told to rest it and get some painkillers.
• Saturday 7th March - After another sleepless night I went down to reception and ask if they could get me the painkillers the doctor prescribed. After this time my leg rapidly improved with the pain.
• Tuesday 10th March- Another sleepless night. This time was not during to pain but regrets about not following through with the other leg. I thought to myself I’ve come all this way and now I have to wait 2 months for my one leg to heal, at which point I would have achieved absolutely nothing. I had to make the decision of my life. Whether or not to get the other leg done and be on my way to becoming taller, or to just let the broken leg heal and be on my way. Its like I had let the pain scare me away from doing the whole process. So I told myself to stop being a little bitch and get the other leg broken. So I decided that I would start lengthening my right leg on Thursday, which was given the ok by the doctor, and have my other leg done on the Saturday.
• Thursday 12th March- Spent the day with the other patient Id met earlier. He was now walking without a limp. You could say his walking was at 90%. He was able to walk up and down stairs and the improvement I saw in him inspired me even after all the set backs he had. Its almost like hed never had his legs lengthened. His devices come off in a month at which time im certain he will be walking 100% normal and at normal pace. As I am lengthening less and have the information that he didn’t, I’m sure that my process will be much easier and quicker.
• Saturday 14th March - Had my left leg operated on, but was much more prepared this time. Before I knew it, the operation was over and was time to let the leg heal for a week before beginning the lengthening. I continued to lengthen my right leg and would later reduce the speed of lengthening to allow the left leg to catch up.
• Sunday 15th March to Wednesday 18th March – 4 Sleepless nights in a row. More uncomfortable than painful. I found it hard to sleep on my side as my right leg was still swollen from the operation. I took a few pain killers which helped a little bit. I would sleep during the day only because id be so exhausted from not sleeping all night.
• Thursday 19th of March – Started lengthening my left leg and slowed down the lengthening amount on my right leg to allow the left to catch up. As the swelling had gone down I was finally able to get a good night sleep.
• Friday 20th March to Sunday 29th March – Continued lengthening each day and made sure to do all the necessary stretching etc. No longer had any pain, besides a little niggling strain around my right ankle.
• Monday 30th March – Had my x ray taken of both legs after having my bandages changed. I had roughly lengthened 1cm on both legs. Right leg was still a little bit behind. Doctor came to my hotel and viewed the X rays. The results were good. No mis-alignments had occurred yet and I was given the go ahead to continue lengthening at a moderate amount per day. I had a go at walking with the walker in the evening. The idea is to have both legs support your weight while putting the walker ahead of yourself, and then using the walker to support yourself while walking forward. Although trying several times, my legs were unable to support my weight.
• Wednesday 1st April – I decided to attempt walking with the walker again. This time my legs supported my weight and I was able to walk forward. I probably went 3 steps forward than turned and went 3 steps back to my seat. I was exhausted, but was satisfied that id made progress.
• Thursday 2nd April – On Monday when having my pin sites cleaned I was told I had a slight infection around 1 of the pins. I had to return today to have that pin cleaned again. Doctor told me there was still a little bit of an infection there but nothing to be concerned about. Walked with walker in hotel room again but a bit longer this time. Again, very exhausting.
• Friday 3rd April to Sunday 19th April - Continued lengthening at 0.66mm per day. Continued walking in hotel room with walker back and forth everyday for about 10 minutes per day. Some days worse than others. No real noticeable improvements, as lengthening is still in progress.
• Monday 20th April – Took another X-ray today. Left leg alignments look good but slight mis-alignment in right (to be corrected after lengthening). Doctor looked at X rays and suggested to go to 0.83mm per day for next 2 weeks. Also noticed when sitting on hard surface in x ray place that my legs weren’t sitting too flat. I decided to add weights on upper part of leg while stretching to gradually flatten them out.
• Sunday 26th April – Terrible night. Aching pains in both legs kept me up all night. About 16 hours straight with continuous pain. Almost pushed me to breaking point. My right leg was worse of the 2 though. The most obvious pain was at the top of my fibula, which led me to believe that my fibula had consolidated causing it to be pulled down during the lengthening. I knew that this was due to my indecision's earlier on to begin lengthening.
• Monday 27th April - Exhausted and frustrated from having no sleep, I decided to go and get another X ray even though my next one wasn’t due for another 2 weeks. I thought id better be safe than sorry. Luckily I did because it turned out my fibula had consolidated. I rang the doctor and he came looked at the X ray and we both agreed I would have a small operation to re-cut the fibula. Surgery was booked in for the following Monday setting me back another 1200 euro.
• Monday 4th May – After a week of no walking or lengthening, I went to the hospital to have my fibulas re-cut and the alignment on my right leg was corrected as well. I continued lengthening straight after surgery at 0.83 mm per day as requested by the doctor.
• Wednesday 6th May – I checked out of the hospital and got an x ray on my right leg to check the new alignment. Results were great. Right leg was now back in alignment and after a few days of stretching I was able to get my right leg flattened out. The pain on fibula was now completely gone. Now is just a matter of lengthening another 1.3cm to reach my goal of 4cm. I will continue stretching each day and walking small amounts with walker in my hotel room to maintain the little strength I have left in my legs. My next X ray will be on the 22nd of may, at which point I will have achieved my final height.
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What was your starting height if I may ask?
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Sorry if I missed it but are you doing externals only?
About that patient that limped first then a month later he was almost good, how much did he lengthen, with what and at what month was he at 90 percent?
How is your walking now?
Good Luck and feel better.
I'm lengthening also with LON in Russia, day 10 post op and today took my first three steps.
I can relate to the sleepless nights. Your just up, in pain with no consolation that you'll sleep it off or that the pain will subside soon. I also cursed all night.
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I am doing external monolateral device.. The other patient was 7 months in when I met him.. But he was a month behind where he should have been because he was looking at inaccurate x rays that weren't to scale and he'd thought he had reached his goal.. He ended up realising and had to get another operation to recut his fibulas so he could get to his final height.. He did 5cm.. So he was 90% at 7 months and 100% at 8.5 months.. So you could say without the set back he'd had he would have been walking 100% at 7.5months.. This doesn't mean athletic ability which would take another 6-8months to be 100%.
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which doctor? Bump
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Dr mitkovic
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you mentioned 7.5 months for general recovery for 5cm, I thought it was 6 months for 5cm, or is it different because of the device used.
and are you saying after that time, of 7.5 months you can be expected to go home.
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From past patient experiences here.. 5cm should take 2 to 2.5 months to lengthen..at 5 months you will be able to walk unaided but with a limp.. After 7 months most of the soft callus will be now hard callus.. Fixators can come off anywhere from 7 to 9 months depending on how well you consolidate.. Judging on how quickly I have been consolidating and the fact I'm only doing 4cm I'll be able to have the device off after 7 months.. However just to be extra careful I'm goin to leave them on another 2 to 3 weeks from when the doctor says they can come off..
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so would you say after 5 months i could maybe go home, then 3 months later come back to serbia to get the apparatus removed.
or would i have to stay the full 8 months in serbia, assuming this is 5cm.
may i double check that the same thing applies for the other dosctors in russia, or is it quicker with their method.
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Yes but u would take crutches with u cause u will prob still be a little wobbly.. Also ud need to get ur pins cleaned where u live weekly.. And x rays monthly to send doctor so he can check your consolidation
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oh ok, forgive my lack of knowledge but is cleaning the pins something I can do myself, or do I need a doctor to do it.
and if i get surgery with Bagirov or Barinov will this option also be available.
and do many patients do this, or do they opt to stay in the foreign country until the consolidation is finished.
I think price wise it would be the same to get the extra flights rather than pay for accomodation there for 3 months.
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Yes you could clean it yourself but it's very risky.. You are risking giving yourself infection..I have mine cleaned by the doctors in a very clean environment and they are very careful when cleaning around the pins.. The bandages have to be changed around the pins aswell so if u did it yourself you'd have to be very cautious.. Also the doctors know what to look for if it does get infected.. And know the necessary actions to take if it does get infected.. I've already had one minor infection but it was seen to early so wasn't a problem.. Out of the 4 other patients I have met here, 1 stayed the entire time, 2 left after about 6 months, and 1 is still here.. To be honest if u were to go back home, you should get a trustworthy hospital to clean and change your pin sites.. If you get an infection and don't see to it could cause u big problems
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hmm okay, not sure how feasible it would be to go to a hospital every week for a checkup, I guess I could get a doctor to come out to my place to change the bandages, but I honestly don't know the procedure.
so assuming I do 5cm would you say on average it takes 8 months for to be fully ready to leave the country, and head back home, and in that case, would you be okay for fully walking with no limping, so ready to resume a normal life, this is not including running.
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Yes after 8 months
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Okay thanks, I'm assuming wearing small lifts of about 3cm is okay at that point.
I don't see why it wouldn't be but i thought I'd ask anyway if you knew.
would you recommend staying in hotel for both lengthening and consolodation or would you say to move into apartment for consolidation, I take it in the hotel you are mostly bed ridden and stay in the hotel room at all times, you pay the maid to buy in food, pee in a bottle etc, and in the consolodation you are free to move outside with crutches and then you buy your own food, and could maybe be in an apartment instead?
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If say it's best to stay in the hotel until you can walk without a walker.. When u can't walk u are pretty dependent and being in the hotel makes life a hell of a lot easier
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by without a walker are you referring to crutches, and if so when does that happen, about the same time of consolodation? and during that time, due you stay in hotel or move somewhere else.
I just want to see if you plan to stay in hotel the whole time, I don't see why not really.
what about the communication with the lady who brings you food, is this a general service the hotels offers or was it setup in a special way, what happens if that lady isn't working there anymore, will other people bring you food.
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Na I mean walker.. You don't really need crutches.. The walker is much safer and after about 5 months your bones have consolidated enough that you can walk without walker.. But it's very poor walking at that stage.. I suggest only to use crutches if u go home.. Otherwise if u stay u should be able to get around without walker after 5 months.. For the sake of an extra few hundred euros it's probably best just to stay in the hotel the whole time just incase something goes wrong..
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forgive me if this is mentioned elsewhere, but what about physiotherapy.
is that not something you need a trained person to do to you each day, or are you somehow getting by doing it yourself.
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There's a few basic stretches you need to so each day.. I stretch for about 10 minutes for each turn I do.. As long as you stretch everyday and do a little walking each day you will be fine
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So weird and confused in the preliminary, but you are happy about it now?
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I have everything under control now so yeah I'm pretty happy but it's been stressful.. I've had to do a lot of work myself to ensure that my legs are lengthening without having bad Mis alignments .. If I had have just sat back and not stressed about anything I don't know how bad my legs would be right now.. I've had to work out how many degrees my legs can afford to be bent back during lengthening from what they originally were before the operation, to ensure I have normal functionality at the end.. I've had to do geometry on my x rays and compare them to geometry of my x rays from before the operation just to ensure my legs are staying within those certain degrees.. I've also had to tweak the device a little bit to prevent the pins from causing these mis alignments.. These are things that I didn't think I'd have to be doing.. Once my lengthening phase has been finished (1 more week) and my legs are how I want them then I'll be much more relaxed.
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Friday 22nd May - According to my lengthening chart, I should have gained my desired amount of 4cm. I went and got a full Xray and had it measured on the computer using there highly accurate system. Just under 4.1cm. Such a relief that i had now finished the lengthening phase. As alignments go my right leg was about 1-2 degrees which is no problem. My right leg was about 4 degrees. The doctor came saw the Xray and and said he will come back tomorrow and put the correction bar on.
Saturday 23rd May - The doctor came and installed the bar. It will be slowly corrected over the next few days by tightening some bolts which he will perform daily until fully corrected(probably until Monday.)
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Congrats on overcoming ur distraction phase. Post some pictures , itd b great.
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are you going home for consolodation, and if not, why not?
when you mention about getting a hospital to clean your pin sites, would it not make sense to get doctors to come to your residential home, or would you say I should go to the hospital weekly to get this done.
also about the patients that left after 6 months, why did they not leave after 4 months, did they stay for the first month or so of consolodation and got bored, or is it safer to stay for the first month or two of consolodation for another reason.
also about removal of the device, it reads on the page 'After that time external devices are removed without new surgery' so if that is easily done could you maybe get that done in your local hospital, and is this something special that may make this a better option than external.
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You wanna stay at least the first 2-3 months incase something goes wrong.. I'm staying here the entire time.. It's cheaper and easier.. It's boring as but this is a once in a lifetime sacrifice and when ur not walking u can't do much anyway.. The guy that left after 9 months was completely healed and had the devices removed.. There was another guy here for 4 months and he had to return home for personal reason and is planning on returning later to have devices removed etc.
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Sunday 24th may.. Doctor came and put correction device on my left leg to correct the alignment.. The top segment of my tibia was creating a bump that you could see on the front of my shin..the correction device Did absolutely nothing to be honest.. I knew as soon as he put it on that it wasn't goin to work.. I asked him if my leg stayed like this would It effect my functionality at all.. He told me 100% that it won't and that the correction was purely just aesthetics so I didn't have a bump on my shin... He also told me that eventually over the next few years the bump would go away.. I thought screw it just leave it.. I can live with a bump for a few years.. And only I'll ever notice it..
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is their no pain in the consolodation phase?
do you know of any cases where people returned home and got the device removed at home.
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You can go home during consolidation.. Just need to make sure you have a good setup for being able to go to the toilet, have a shower etc. and u have to make sure u do do all ur stretching and walk a little bit with the walker everyday.. The consolidation phase is pretty much 5-6 months of physio to regain muscle ad flexibility to your new legs..
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The pain is low during consolidation but walking is exhausting.. And the process is slow, so you have to be patient. The best way to deal with it is to film yourself walking each week so u can see the improvement. It's a battle of mental strength and seeing progress gives you a whole lot of determination. The way I see it is each week is going to be easier than the next.. If you don't slack off and make sure that every single day u do the appropriate stretching and walking than the closer u will be back to normal functionality once your bones are strong enough to have the frames off.. Frames can be taken off by yourself..
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wow you can take the frames off yourself, as in just you, not even a doctor, so does that mean the device is entirely removed, no need to go back to serbia.
doens't he want the device back?
is this a special feature exclusive to his device, for example if i were to do externals with barinov,bagirov or solomin would i have to fly back to russia for them to remove the device?
also during consolodation, would you say it is likely you would be in wheelchair and you would need to driven to the hospital for the nurses to clean the pin sites, or would it not make more sense for the nurses to come to your home to clean the pin sites,
i spoke to my GP and she said the doctors would not clean the pin sites, only nurses, i told her that they need to be able to look for infections, she said she wans't sure, i will be seeing an orthopedic surgeon for in a few weeks anyway, sinec my referal process has begun.
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Yeah if u tell the doctor before leaving he will show u how u have to remove it and he will give u money so u can post the device back to him.. He done that with a previous patient..any nurse will know what to look for with infections.. U will need a wheelchair probably up until 4 months post operation.. So better if nurse can come to u.. Ur mobility will be very poor for the first 4-5 months
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okay so say in the situation of 5cm.
after 10 weeks of lengthening I go home.
nurses come into my home everyweek to clean pin sites & check for infections.
I need to re-dress the bandages every other day.
but what about if there is an infection, would i then need to go to the hospital to get work done by the doctor, or would i need to fly to serbia for mitkovic to do something that only he can do?
can mitkovic also do femur with this device, and if that does get done, is the recovery much faster, what would be advantages and disadvantages of femur lengthening over tibia.
can I double check that this way of removing the device itself at home cannot be done with externals offered by barinov, bagirov and solomin.
im glad he will pay me to send the device back, that's really cool of him.
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Don't be too optimistic about the lengthening period.. If u read my diary u can see the troubles I had only doing 4cm.. It depends on each patient.. But I'd say after 10 weeks ud be finished lengthening but allow for more just in case..u don't need to change ur bandages every day.. Only weekly..When nurses check your pins they remove the bandages, clean around the pin sites than do the bandages for u. I've had 2 minor infections and it's no big deal, they just clean it.. Major infections are extremely rare as long as u wear track pants to protect the device from dirt.. I dont know about any other doctors devices. But this device just requires an adjustable spanner.. Taking the pins out requires you to turn them out with the spanner.. Apparently it's a bit painful.
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oh right I will see if i can do the same thing with externals, pretty sure it requires another surgery to remove the device on those ones, which will require another flight back which i really don't want to do.
when you left the hospital, did mitkovic keep good contact with you.
during lengthening did nurses change bandages weekly in your hotel, or was it doctor.
for painkillers, is there not a special painkiller that you need that requires an injection, so in that case don't you need a nurse to administer it to you.
I understand that the hotel is £350 a month, how much per month is food, and are you paying a maid to bring in food that is pre-made, like room service in a way, or is it microwave meals, and if so does the hotel have things like microwaves or ovens, most hotels I have been in don't have microwaves etc.
and is it a common service for maids to bring in food, is it something they do well, and they will understand your situation.
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did u mean do the same thing with internals? because mine was externals. dr mitkovic comes visits you when ever u ask for his assistance. weekly you go back to where u had the surgery and the nurses change and clean ur bandages. u just get cabs and it just around the corner from the hotel very cheap cab fair. something like 1 pound each way. he can give u a prescription for pain killer tablets. you wont need too many painkillers. pain is bearable and only last for a couple of weeks from surgery. i pay for my breakfast in advance when i pay for my room. cost me an extra 40 pounds a month.. i get them to boil me 6 eggs every morning and i have that with a few bowls of cereal that i get from across the road.. just before lunch time i call down to reception and i get them to order me food from a place across the road that cooks meat and stuff. one of the staff will come up to collect the money for the food and at which time ill give him a list of other groceries such as milk, cereal, fruit etc. and they go get it for you. the hotel takes a service charge of about 2 euros. rent will cost you 390 pounds a month if u include breakfast. and food for the week including all service charges will cost you no more than 50 pounds a week. i pretty much have 4 meals a day, breakfast -cereal with 6 boiled eggs,
brunch- spaghetti that i get from the corner shop(they cook it for me when they boil my eggs in the morning) and 2 bananas
lunch 200 grams of chicken in a bread roll and 2 oranges,
dinner - 200 grams of chicken and low fat yoghurt
it probably costs me a total of 40 to 50 pounds a week on food. im very anal about maintaining as much muscle mass as possible so you might not spend as much on food as what i do. everything is cheap here.
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thank you for that much fuller description on how the food is brought to you, it paints a much better picture of what I would have to do.
if i understand you correctly we are taking about £600 a month to live in the hotel with food brought up to you etc,
i have to say £200 a month on food is expensive, did you not mean to say £100 a month on food?, anyway it does not matter much.
and i see you travel to the hospital weekly, I understand now, I guess I will have to do something similar to that when I'm at home during consolodation.
some other diary said you have to change bandages every other day, but you say its okay to just do it each week, and it gets all done for you by nurses.
for devices no i meant exteral ilazarov, i don't know if you need surgery to remove that device, or if you can just do it yourself at home.
also do you know about the femurs, does mitkovic allow for femurs and how much faster is recovery compared to tibia.
what would you say advantages and disadvantages are for femurs over tibia using mitkovics device.
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no i meant 200 pounds a month. but thats maximim.. i dont think i spend that im just saying allow that... i probably spend closer to 180 pounds a month but ud rather allow more. the reason u even spend that much is because of the service charge each day, but considering the situation its a small price to pay, i eat more than than most people aswell.. so im not sure on ur diet but u might spend even less again. remember when u r lying around all day u wont get as hungry as ud usually get.. i probably only eat 70% of what id normally eat when im more active. to be honest i think 180 to 200 pounds a month is cheap anyway.. i use to spend twice that where i came from. i dont know anything about the lizarov device to be honest.. all i know that lizarov is much more painful than the device mitkovic uses. u can imagine all the muscle that the pins go through on the lizarov.. with mitkovic device you just have 6 pins on the front of the shin which dont penetrate any muscle. yes they do femurs here..
femurs advantages - lengthen faster (1mm a day)
- faster consolidation. Because there is so much muscle surrounding the femur it heals much faster.
- scars wont be seen unless ur in underwear
femur disadvantages - more pain (pins penetrate muscle)
-more extensive physio. stretching would be full on as you need to do stretches for the hips and the knees. with tibias the stretches are very basic.
-dr mitkovic has much more experience doin tibias.. i dont knwo of anyone that has done femurs with his device.
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Oh so its less painful using mitkovic’s device, that’s good news.
Lengthening faster : so that would be 7 week to lengthen 5cm?, instead of the 9 weeks in tibia?
faster consolidation. would you say 6 moths post op. you would get frame removal, instead of 8 month using tibia.
For more pain in femurs, maybe the pain is stlii less than tibia using ilazarov?
some people would prefer more pain but less time, so 7 weeks of pain instead of 9 weeks of lesser pain, who knows, it’s a trade off.
dr mitkovic on femurs:here are two diaries on old forum
http://www. /index.php/topic,1571.0.html
http://www. /index.php/topic,1313.0.html
they say ‘internal’ though, I thought his device was external regardless of tibia or femur?
to qoute the diary
you don't want to go external on femur, Not only the pain will be horrible, but you won't be able to move your legs for several weeks, that means you will be laying on a bed for weeks. You can't even sleep on your side, because of the device. I don't even know if you can go to the toilet by yourself in the first two weeks.
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Oh so its less painful using mitkovic’s device, that’s good news.
Lengthening faster : so that would be 7 week to lengthen 5cm?, instead of the 9 weeks in tibia?
faster consolidation. would you say 6 moths post op. you would get frame removal, instead of 8 month using tibia.
For more pain in femurs, maybe the pain is stlii less than tibia using ilazarov?
some people would prefer more pain but less time, so 7 weeks of pain instead of 9 weeks of lesser pain, who knows, it’s a trade off.
dr mitkovic on femurs:here are two diaries on old forum
http://www. /index.php/topic,1571.0.html
http://www. /index.php/topic,1313.0.html
they say ‘internal’ though, I thought his device was external regardless of tibia or femur?
to qoute the diary
you don't want to go external on femur, Not only the pain will be horrible, but you won't be able to move your legs for several weeks, that means you will be laying on a bed for weeks. You can't even sleep on your side, because of the device. I don't even know if you can go to the toilet by yourself in the first two weeks.
I have heard that he used to have an internal nail but he is not using it anymore. He doesn't accept a lot patients in general.
Microman, internals is probably your only option to get your femurs lengthened, everything else doesn't seem to be a smart idea. What about going to a bank and get a credit for 10 000-15 000£? Or go for tibial lengthening but there are some disadavantages which are not avoidable.
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my budget will always be about £10K.
interestingly the doctors page still says he does femur, i guess it's external only, which may mean that it's a bad idea, but if its not recomended, then why allow it?
I think maybe his device may be different to the ilazarov so maybe his external is quite decent, that diary may have been from the past where he offered a different device for femurs.
but it will be my proportions that will decide, will be getting x-rays soon.
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Can you imagine of being in these huge frames for 6 months? Also think about all the damage that is done to the soft tissue that gets pierced by the huge pins of an external femur device.
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Greetings Descreteuser :) Hope you're doing well now , can I see some pics of your Frames ? To be frank am a Huge fan for Monolateral frames lol 8)
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(http://i.imgur.com/OtFBmM6.png) (http://imgur.com/OtFBmM6)
theres my frame
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(http://i.imgur.com/hqA53se.png) (http://imgur.com/hqA53se)
theres my mis alignment in my left leg after 4cm finished lengthening
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as u can see the bottom part of the top segment is what is causing the bump on my shin.. doctor tells me it will not effect my functionality or consolidation at all
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mono fixators are weaker than regular fixators
I must say though,
What is with these Drs lately?? It seems that almost every patient has misalignment,etc which requires additional surgery
and with all due respect to your dr, i would not take what he says as gospel
Every Dr I've been to has told me dont worry, regardless of the issue
If your leg isnt normal compared to before, there will be issues down the line. but mono fixators arent good at correction, that is why hes saying this. what's acceptable to him is not equivalent to what is acceptable by you
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(http://i.imgur.com/qViRLJ1.png) (http://imgur.com/qViRLJ1)
theres my right leg..
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what issues are you talking about.. and what evidence is there to back up your claim?
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my evidence is your leg
it looks really bad, to be honest. your osteotomy looks bad, and your bone is bending outward
that's not normal. if you think all will be okay, that's your choice. I don't know what else to say. It wouldn't be acceptable to me.
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you say the evidence is my leg? but are you experienced in knowing if it is a problem or not? what im trying to say is , yes to any normal person who doesnt know much about medicine it looks like a serious problem. 2 doctors ive spoken to have said its only a problem if you cant get full extension in your knee, which i can. i understand what u r sying but your reaction was like mine. but the truth is that people like me and you arent trained or experienced to know if it is a problem or not. telling someone their leg looks really bad can be mis leading unless you know what you are talking about
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wow that looks like a major complication no? what are the chances of that with only 4cm of lenghtening.
but that device looks way cooler than external ilazarov, would you say the process is better using that device over the ilazarov, i think you mentioned less pain and it being much smaller.
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It's a minor complication.. But it doesn't effect functionality unless it restricts the movement of the knee joint.. The movement in my left leg is fine and when I put weights on my legs it straightens out completely which means by the time I have the frames off my legs will be normal.. I just have to deal with the fact that I'm going to have a bump on my leg.. I can ask the doctor to loosen the device and push the bone in but by doing that can cause other functional complications.. So I might just leave it.. No ones ever going to notice the bump on my shin..
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so now you have a permanent bump on your shin due to the surgery?
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Yep. . The last patient had the same problem but he ended up having to put clamps and thingscan on the device to push the pins back down which in turn pushed the bone back in.. He said the doctor tried to correct it but didn't get it do he took matters into his own hands..He had to deal with a lot of stress to get his legs where he wanted. He only did 5cm so u imagine the problems u would have if u lengthened more with this device.. I'm not happy that I have a bump there but if I try to correct the bump than it could cause me a lot more stress than I've already been through..
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At the end of the day if I'm told that my functionality will be completely back to normal than I can live with a bump there.. But honestly the stress Im going through has really pushed me to limit..
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can the bump not be corrected with cosmetic surgery in your own country.
how large is the bump, maybe you can show a picture of some kind.
is this bump an issue that cannot happen using the ilazarov device?
because if it cannot happen with ilazarov, i will be going to russia instead, i don't want a bump on my leg.
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my doctor told me the bump will eventually disappear over time.it can be corrected once lengthening is finished but you have to be careful.. in my case because i dont care about the bump so much and am told it wont effect my functionality whatsoever than im not gonna bother as it can be a hassle. lizarov frame is bulkier which is good for keeping your leg in good alignment.. but theres other problems with lizarov you have to worry about such as damaging nerves and stuff as it penetrates alot of muscle.. the other thing is if you have bowed legs or x leg monolateral is good for correct that at the same time as lengthening.. so not only you get longer legs you get straighter legs.
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oh so it will disappear over time, well that's different then.
let's hope he is telling the truth, can you not describe the size of the bump, and its placement, so i can gauge how it would look on me.
is mitkovics device really less painful than ilazarov? this is an important aspect as i need to have the mental will to do 5cm.
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my evidence is your leg
it looks really bad, to be honest. your osteotomy looks bad, and your bone is bending outward
that's not normal. if you think all will be okay, that's your choice. I don't know what else to say. It wouldn't be acceptable to me.
I agree with this^ Its not just a simple bump that you have to live with. I would be surprised if this won't affect your walking. I would try to get this fixed before consolidation.
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I agree with this^ Its not just a simple bump that you have to live with. I would be surprised if this won't affect your walking. I would try to get this fixed before consolidation.
i thought the same thing.. but after speaking to 2 doctors they told me if my knee joint can be completely straightened than it wont effect my walking.. im going to have my doctor visit me on monday or tuesday at which point i may have him push it back in a little it to have some piece of mind..
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how are you seeing other doctors in serbia?
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how are you seeing other doctors in serbia?
I'll try take a photo for you later and see it to u in a private message
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how are you seeing other doctors in serbia?
Speaking to another doctor on this site
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on this site, oh okay you said 'im going to have my doctor visit me' which implies in person.
yeah a picture would be good, at least i can know the risks involved with mitkovic.
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Yeah dr mitkovic is coming to see me next week
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at what point during lengthening did this occur?
If this does occur, can you still lengthen?
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Varies from patient to patient.. Mine began at about 2.5 to 3cm..
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Oh jeez, so this is a common occurrence?
well anyway I have stairs in my home so I would like to know what my mobility will be like when I go home during consolidation, will i be able to walk up a flight of stairs, or will i have to remain downstairs for about 2 months at which point I will be able to walk a little better and so go upstairs.
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getting uop and downstairs is extremely dangerous.. youd have to sit down and work your way up or down.. its doable but it would be very annoying
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ah of course i never thought of that.
so say in the first month of consolodation, i return home and just sit on the first step, then drag myself up a step, its 15 steps in total, i will only be doing this once, I just need to get upstairs to my room whese my bathroom is also very close as well.
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Yeah just think of it as a workout.. Remember u can still use your legs to push urself up.. The devices are 50% weight bearing
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lol yeah so it is safe then? I was worried dragging my legs up the stairs may cause an issue with the device.
but no I will only do this once to get upstairs, I wont be doing that a lot for exercise or anything.
is the ilazarov weight bearing, and does weight bearing genernally mean you can walk around with it on.
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fk man! that osteotomy looks really bad, you did well not going for more than 4cm , if you have gone for more i think that your tibia should end with a big misalignament
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fk man! that osteotomy looks really bad, you did well not going for more than 4cm , if you have gone for more i think that your tibia should end with a big misalignament
Not so bad. I've seen worse
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is it a problem with the device , or with the doctor.
I think i may have to go with another device due to fear of a complication that is similar to this.
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This really makes me re consider this Dr. Simply because I've had such a thing happen to another one of my bones when I broke it and the bump bothers me to this day. Plus at his price I wouldn't expect this to be a common occurrence either
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I think it's a problem with the device rather than the doctor. Monorails aren't as good at preventing/fixing misalignments.
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would this problem not happen with dr barinov?
sorry for the newbie questions, I just had no idea this stuff could happen, it really sholud be posted somewhere under 'complications' that you can have bump in knees with this device.
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Sorry to anyone who's done it already but no one should be getting monorails at all in this day/age. The design of these devices makes no sense as they allow minimal control over angulation/alignment. Anyone getting a monorail is putting themselves at risk for misalignment.
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my evidence is your leg
it looks really bad, to be honest. your osteotomy looks bad, and your bone is bending outward
that's not normal. if you think all will be okay, that's your choice. I don't know what else to say. It wouldn't be acceptable to me.
Agreed. The same problem has happened to bluebarbie as a result of her monorail lengthening - major misalignment of the proximal and distal bone fragments.
OP, I'm going to give you the same advice I gave to her. She hasn't taken the advice and I am certain she will live to regret it. Hopefully for your sake you are smarter.
Get the monorail exchanged for a proper external frame like a hexapod or TSF which will allow realignment of your bones before they fully consolidate. If you don't, I can promise you that you will be "recovering" for the rest of your life. People that leave these surgeries with major misalignments do not do well in the long term.
Both of your tibias have become grossly misaligned. It is probably still fixable now but it won't be for long.
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christ lord, thankfully I found out about this now.
i am now crossing serbia off my list, i hope you get well Descreteuser.
looks like it's barinov or dhawan for me, but so little is known of dhawan.
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Personally I have a hard time considering any surgeon who offers monorails reputable. Why on earth would you offer a patient monorails, where you have pretty much no capacity to control the alignment, when you can just as easily use a hexapod or TSF? Yes, with a full external frame you have more pin sites. But at least you can keep the alignment straight. That should be the number one priority for all leg lengthening cases. Who cares if you have fewer pins with a monorail but end up deformed by it?
I think you should look more at the devices the surgeon offers and their track record with those devices than just what country they are from.
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ye i just said serbia as a shorthand, seems a lot of people here do that, what i meant is i will cross mitkovik off my list.
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Agreed. The same problem has happened to bluebarbie as a result of her monorail lengthening - major misalignment of the proximal and distal bone fragments.
OP, I'm going to give you the same advice I gave to her. She hasn't taken the advice and I am certain she will live to regret it. Hopefully for your sake you are smarter.
Get the monorail exchanged for a proper external frame like a hexapod or TSF which will allow realignment of your bones before they fully consolidate. If you don't, I can promise you that you will be "recovering" for the rest of your life. People that leave these surgeries with major misalignments do not do well in the long term.
Both of your tibias have become grossly misaligned. It is probably still fixable now but it won't be for long.
Bluebarbie will be fine. She's getting LATN, so the misalignment can be corrected on the operating table during her nailing surgery.
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Bluebarbie will be fine. She's getting LATN, so the misalignment can be corrected on the operating table during her nailing surgery.
There's a chance they'll get it close enough to straight during the nailing process that she won't be disabled. But "fixing" the alignment during nailing is a poor idea. When you fix alignment with TSF/Hexapod you can control the exact position gradually down to the mm. No such precision exists during realignment when nailing.
Monorails are a bad idea all around. Whether nailing after or not.
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you guys are pretty much saying ill be disabled if my leg stays like this.. this forum shows that people on here done know what they are talking about.. your saying you need to get another frame put on.. god ive heard it all.. previous patient before me had worse mis alignments then me and he got them corrected here.. he is walking completely normal. hes even doing light jogging and its only 10 months post op.. he said his flexibility is better than it was before the surgery.. you guys are throwing false information out there saying that if u have mis alignments with this device that your are going to be crippled.. dont say things that you dont know about.. people on this site think they know alot more than they do.. i agree that this device isnt good for alignments but dont say that someone will be deformed or disabled from it.. BECAUSE ITS NOT TRUE.. i can already stand up completely straight.. my walking is improving daily.. i might have the bump on my left leg pushed in just for aesthetics sake.. it seems as tho people have done a bit of reading and now think they are doctors..
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you guys are pretty much saying ill be disabled if my leg stays like this.. this forum shows that people on here done know what they are talking about.. your saying you need to get another frame put on.. god ive heard it all.. previous patient before me had worse mis alignments then me and he got them corrected here..
I'm curious how they correct the misalignment with a monorail device. As I understand it monorails only function along one axis (hence the name "mono") and thus cannot correct misalignments in 3 dimensions (as you have).
i might have the bump on my left leg pushed in just for aesthetics sake.. it seems as tho people have done a bit of reading and now think they are doctors..
I don't think the aesthetics of the bump are what you should be concerned about. It's that the bump is there because the two bone fragments have become misaligned. If your surgeons have some way of accurately fixing this without a 3 dimensional frame like the TSF/Hexapod, I would sincerely love to hear about it.
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it's not the aesthetics
i can tell you from experience. my left leg is not aligned at all,its bad. getting it fixed very soon. only been a few months and im in no pain, because i purposely hardly walk
but the forward bending, which i have, will definitely impacxt your walking. you will just not be able tyo walk normally, it will feel like an effort. the more you walk, the worse it will be
you have 2 options, nailing or or a frame. either one is much better than your current situation
ive heard some say the tsf is better than ailing, but im not sure. rozbruch thinks nailing is as effective, paley too. catagni does not
either way, both options will fix you, and youll be much better off than your current situation.
That malalignment will take a toll. ive been doing nothing because of my left leg. theres no way you 'll be okay walking, especially in a few years.
i would not accept my dr telling me its okay, when it is not normal.
and mitkovic has had complaints before on the old forum.. this is not the first time, he got off the boards because of complaints. i know this may surprise some people that think of him as being perfect
just look at mdow's story. it's not about mitkovic's surgical technique, but still, the guy stopped responding, and mdow was in serbia!
I agree with maximize, and others that discourage monorails.. you can always get leg corrected after surgery, but its a pain in the ass, and more money
youll be fine if you eventually get it corrected, but I wouldn't accept that alignment.
i dont get the fascination wth monorails, the only positive i hear is that they are cosmetically better, but i dont even think thats true. the scars from monorails can be gnarly, and they are still big metal devices protruding from your leg. it's not as if they arent noticeable
don't be mad at us because we are saying things you dont wanna hear. the bone is not aligned. if it becomes aligned, then great. I would not count it though
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Thank You for posting your experience Descreteuser given Im possibly going to do same thing in 2016 with aim of 5-7cm.
Information was that by sometime in 2016 reasonably priced rental apartments were going to be available close to the hospital specifically for LL patients. Do you have any info on this? In any case there are very nice furnished apartments in central Nis for 180-300 Euros per month. Your hotel accomodation is a bit overpriced for my budget.
What type of visa if any do you have? EU citizens I believe do not need a visa to enter and stay 3 months beyond which permission can be extended once or twice more for another 3-6 months. Permission to stay up to 1 year I believe can be given provided you supply evidence of surgery, doctor etc.
Did you take out any health insurance? The Serbian Embassy websites say this is necessary not sure it applies to folks who already have a doctor ie Mr Mitkovic.
Have you managed to find long pants which fit over the monorails?
Have previously had Ilizarov fixators free of charge in a western public hospital to correct genu varum ie bow legs. 4 months with huge heavy clunky Ilizarovs was more than enough. I was given the option of keeping them on for lengthening free of charge but declined. They were just too impractical to wear for long periods. Couldnt wait to get them off which is why Im going with monorails this time.
Re Ilizarov or similar versus Monorail comparison. Im no expert. Can only say Ilizarovs I had were very solid and stable but totally impractical. Was forever banging them together while walking. Sleeping was uncomfortable given legs were in metal cages. Ive seen pics of various Ilizarov external variations including some which only extend halfway round the leg. Perhaps these are more practical than full blown Ilizarovs. Dont know why and when these slimmed down Ilizarovs are used can only say the full blown traditional Ilizarovs were totally impractical for me.
Ill finish by saying the pain in my legs for several hours immediately post op Ilizarov surgery was the worst Ive ever experienced. Pain meds had no effect at all. IT FELT LIKE MY BONES WERE BEING CRUSHED IN A VICE. Was finally given large dose of sedative to put me to sleep to stop my complaining. Thankfully woke up with much less pain several hours later. Dont know if this is normal or not. Im not a big reader of this or old forums just browse occasionally for anything relevant to my own situation which is why I posted here. Sorry if I hijacked the post.
Re Mitkovic, Serbia etc. Surgeon speaks fluent English which is a plus in my book. Has worked in western hospitals another plus. Serbia has produced the likes of Nicola Tesla who was Thomas Edisons equal it has been argued. All countries have pluses and minuses. Having had Ilizarov surgery free of charge in a large public hospital in an advanced western country I can say it wasnt all pluses. Nursing care for my 9 days in a private room was minimal basically just taking vital signs. Noone ever bothered to ask me in 9 days if I wanted a wash or to brush my teeth for example. Surgeon came in very occasionally to see me. Again sorry to have hijacked thread. Good Luck will be reading.
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Re comments that Mitkovic monorail is no good for correcting misalignments I just noticed his website with supporting pics says its used to correct various angular deformities such as varus valgus etc.
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he has a device which attaches to the other device which pushes the pins down to correct the alignments..im getting one put on tomorrow.. im taking a break for a while from the site as it causes me too much unecessary stress.. i will be back on once im recovered and in better spirits.. wish everyone all the best with their journeys.. ill probably be back on in a few months for an update.. good luck to everyone. peace
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Hi Descreteuser,
Sorry if I have sounded too negative on the monorail and your misalignment. It's difficult sometimes posting on a forum like this. You have to try to balance telling what you think to be true with the fact that people going through this surgery are very vulnerable, and that none of us really know what the future will hold for anyone.
It is true there is some capacity for a monorail to realign this misalignment. But monorails by their nature of being one dimensional and only having a few pinsites into the bone are not exactly ideal for this. I sincerely hope your surgeon is able to realign it adequately. What I would suggest to you is that if you are continuing with his work, do not be satisfied with it until it is perfectly aligned.
Almost all of the people who end up with chronic problems from leg lengthening get them due to misalignments that weren't fixed before consolidation. A large percent of those tend to be from monorail users. The remaining large proportion tend to be people who had their frames off too early or their internal nails bend.
Getting the alignment fixed is crucial to your future health. However that is done, just do your best to make sure it does get done. I hope you will have the best outcome possible. I'm sure we all on the forum do. I hope you will please continue to share your progress here. We all benefit from it. Try to understand that we are just concerned.
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• Monday 25th to Saturday 30th May – Probably the most stressful week since being in the hospital 2 ½ months ago. Ive found that the hardest part of this process is mental stress more than physical stress. All week I had that bloody bump on my mind. I made the decision that I was going to have it fixed even though it could cause other complications.
• Sunday 31st May – After 2 sleepless nights of trying to make a decision I decided to have the doctor use his other technique to try and push the bone back in. He came around and attached another bar to my device which would be attached to the top pins, and lever them down to push the bone back in. This method made much more sense and I was more hopeful that it would work. He had to push down on the bump at the same time and I could feel it being moved back in. I was asked to tighten a bolt while he got it in the right position. Unfortunately the pins weren’t long enough to get enough leverage which meant the bump returned to where it was. The solution was to add extensions to the pins to provide more leverage. The doctor told me I would have to wait a few days for it to be made up. The bump on my leg was temporarily worse than before which caused more stress. Also after he left I noticed a clicking sound in my leg which made me worry.
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• Monday 1st June – The clicking sound kept me up all night wondering what it was. Every time I moved my leg I felt clicking. It wasn’t painful but I worried that it might be something serious. I rang the doctor about it as I couldn’t get it off my bloody mind. He came visited me and told me that it was nothing to worry about. It turned out to be coming from the device and not my leg. While the doctor was there he said there was another way to fix my alignment manually. As the sight of the bump was driving me crazy I thought, stuff it lets do it. The doctor ensured me that as long as I stay still and relaxed everything will be fine. I put my leg on a pillow and he loosened the device from the pin and readjusted the device. He tightened the device to the top pins and pushed the bar down. In turn the top fragment of my tibia was pushed down and pushed back into alignment and tightened to the bottom pins. The bump was now gone. As I lost a few mm of length during the correction he immediately lengthened it back to match my right leg. It was big sense of relief.
• Tuesday 2nd June – Now that I had my legs where I wanted them, I felt I could concentrate purely on my recovery. I decided to start using the stationary bike which I had purchased earlier from the previous patient. The bike is a great way to strengthen the legs and improve movement in the joints. Strengthening your legs will make walking much easier. At this stage I decided to do 15 minutes a day. I continued to stretch approx 30 minutes a day to improve flexibility in my knee joints, ankles and hamstrings as well as strengthening my calves with calf raises. Walking with walker in hotel room approx 15 minutes a day at this stage.
• Wednesday 3rd June – Walking today with walker was better than ever. For the first time it wasn’t exhausting. My legs were feeling stronger already and gave me confidence that I was on my way to a speedy recovery.
• Saturday 6th June – I decided to go for a walk with the walker outside for the first time. Very hot day. Was good to get out and get fresh air. I walked to a park about 500m away and sat there for a while and enjoyed getting some vitamin c from the sun. I had to cross a few roads on the way, which I was nervous about, and was quite slow but cars were understanding and were patient. Very rarely had I enjoyed sunshine for the past 4 months. It kind of made me feel normal again rather than just being locked inside my hotel room all day. I decided at this stage just to walk outside once or twice a week as it is a bit dangerous.
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Hello Descreteuser,
It's really good to hear that you were able to get your misalignment corrected with relative ease. The last few posts before this made the Mitkovic monorail seem a little too risky or just off-putting for CLL purposes to say the least.
After following your journey this past month, I've been strongly considering doing tibia LL and go with Dr Mitkovic if at all possible. I'm just a little concerned that 5-6 cm on the monorail may be asking for trouble.
I couldn't seem to find any reference as to your starting height before LL.
I understand that Dr Mitkovic is a really busy guy who mostly deals with non CLL patients, but I'm curious to know just how long it took you to secure an appointment with him? How long does it typically take to secure an appointment once you have expressed an interest to go through with the surgery?
Please keep us posted on your progress:D
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Hello Descreteuser,
It's really good to hear that you were able to get your misalignment corrected with relative ease. The last few posts before this made the Mitkovic monorail seem a little too risky or just off-putting for CLL purposes to say the least.
After following your journey this past month, I've been strongly considering doing tibia LL and go with Dr Mitkovic if at all possible. I'm just a little concerned that 5-6 cm on the monorail may be asking for trouble.
I couldn't seem to find any reference as to your starting height before LL.
I understand that Dr Mitkovic is a really busy guy who mostly deals with non CLL patients, but I'm curious to know just how long it took you to secure an appointment with him? How long does it typically take to secure an appointment once you have expressed an interest to go through with the surgery?
Please keep us posted on your progress:D
6cm is the absolute max that id suggest anyone do with this device.. if i could do it all over again with what i know now things would have been alot smoother. i was 181cm before and am now 185cm. i first contacted him in 2011 but i kept delaying it due to financial situations.. i contacted him on and off for the next few years but i kept backing out and kind of forgot about it for a while. i contacted him again half way through 2014 and this time i had my financial situation completely sorted and was definite on following through this time.. i booked and began my journey on february 14th.. once u talk with him and he knows ur goals are reasonable and that u r serious then he accepts you and you can organise a date pretty soon.
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kind of hard to decide between mitkovic or barinov using ilazarov
what would you think Descreteuser, would you say the risk of misalingment isn't worth it and to stick with barinov, or is there some reason to choose mitkovic over barinov.
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Thank you very much for clearing that up. So it sounds like we're looking at a 6 month time-frame.
I had no idea you were so tall to begin with. It's very positive to hear that you're 4 cm taller than me, and Dr Mitkovic had no reservations about taking you on as a patient.
Until I read your posts, I didn't feel that LL would be financially viable for me for at least another year or two, but seeing your positive posts on this very affordable doctor has forced me to confront whether or not I really want to go through with this. It's quite a lot to take on board.
To me, getting a minimum of 6 cm feels like it's hard-wired into my mind. I understand that allot of those who wish to undergo two surgeries for maximal gain rarely ever go through with the second LL op. So I think it's important that I do get to 183 cm (6 ft) tall with my initial surgery.
At an above average starting height of 181 cm, I'd like to know what made you finally decide to got through with the surgery? Also, do you mind if I ask your age?
I do apologize for hijacking your thread. You've been unbelievably helpful. Thanks!
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kind of hard to decide between mitkovic or barinov using ilazarov
what would you think Descreteuser, would you say the risk of misalingment isn't worth it and to stick with barinov, or is there some reason to choose mitkovic over barinov.
For me, the Mitkovic monorail seems to be much less invasive and much easier to manage. The thought of having to wear a large clunky Ilizarov frame for an extended period of time would be quite unpleasant in comparison. If that wasn't enough, Dr Mitkovic is based in Europe, so if you're European (like me) not having to worry about a visa is a major advantage when planning your stay :)
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kind of hard to decide between mitkovic or barinov using ilazarov
what would you think Descreteuser, would you say the risk of misalingment isn't worth it and to stick with barinov, or is there some reason to choose mitkovic over barinov.
i dont know anything about barinov.. all i can say is if you are doing less than 6cm than you will be fine with this device. you will probably get mis alignments but they are easily fixed and the doctor will make sure you are satisfied.. you may go through some stress along the way but the thing is you will be better off then i was as you will have more information handed down to you. ive always got alot of satisfaction helping and teaching people so if you did do it with him i would be more than happy to guide you through as i feel i know this device and process like the back of my hand.
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hmmm, but wasn't there some arguments of sorts between you and mitkovic about the misalingments, didn't he say he said it would be okay, but then you said you wanted to go down a more complicated process to fix it for good?
am i right in saying that bump has entirely gone now?
I think i would prefer to stay in hospital or a clinic for lengthening with barinov instead of a hotel as you would with mitkovic, but I will keep him in my list of possiblities.
I think the ilazarov device does look very large and such but then you wont get misalingments, overall im not sure how much it would bother me to have frames that large, i guess it would be bad during consolodation while at home because i would have to try and move in cruthes with those things on.
visa wise i am happy with either, its not a big deal for me to fill in a few forms or travel to london for my fingerprints, i'd rather base my decision on more important things like aftercare and device type, after looking on visa websites, it appears i don't need one at all for 90 days stay, looking at extending that it appears you need to visit a police station before hand, how exactly would you do this, would mitkovic go with you as I don't speak serbian.
If you wish to extend your stay in Serbia you will need to apply for temporary residence status at least 30 days before the 90 day period expires at the police station where you are registered
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Thank you very much for clearing that up. So it sounds like we're looking at a 6 month time-frame.
I had no idea you were so tall to begin with. It's very positive to hear that you're 4 cm taller than me, and Dr Mitkovic had no reservations about taking you on as a patient.
Until I read your posts, I didn't feel that LL would be financially viable for me for at least another year or two, but seeing your positive posts on this very affordable doctor has forced me to confront whether or not I really want to go through with this. It's quite a lot to take on board.
To me, getting a minimum of 6 cm feels like it's hard-wired into my mind. I understand that allot of those who wish to undergo two surgeries for maximal gain rarely ever go through with the second LL op. So I think it's important that I do get to 183 cm (6 ft) tall with my initial surgery.
At an above average starting height of 181 cm, I'd like to know what made you finally decide to got through with the surgery? Also, do you mind if I ask your age?
I do apologize for hijacking your thread. You've been unbelievably helpful. Thanks!
its important that you weigh up the fact whether being 183 compared to 182 is going to mean alot more to you. after 5cm every half centimetre is a big hassle. Another user from this forum did 6cm with this device and im probably almost ahead of him progress wise even tho he started 4 months before me. i stopped at 4cm because it was alot safer, and it would take me to a height that i am very satisfied with. so i believe i was smart for not being greedy.. i could have easily done another half centimetre to be exactly 6'1 but the thing is i didnt need to.. no one would ever question me if i said i was 6'1 same as noone would every question you if you were 182 and said you were 6 foot. if i was you and chose this device. i would do 5cm and no more. but if getting to 183 means that much to you, than just be willing to add another couple of months to your recovery.. at the end of the day 2 months more isnt much if its going to make you 100% satisfied with your height. remember a few years down the track this process will be all but a distant memory.
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I know im 164.5 but I am only planning 5cm to 169.5, I am happy to wear a little lift to get ouf of the short zone (which is 170cm and under), and i have no intention of a 2nd height surgery.
I guess another downside is if resurgery is required you have to pay for it, with barinov he will not charge extra.
do you know if the mitkovic device is less painful than ilazarov, I have also heard that the first night the pain is very bad with ilazarov, can mitkovic knock you out if the pain gets very bad on the first night.
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Hi Descreteuser, I m happy for u that the alignment is fixed and it's off ur mind. :D :)
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hmmm, but wasn't there some arguments of sorts between you and mitkovic about the misalingments, didn't he say he said it would be okay, but then you said you wanted to go down a more complicated process to fix it for good?
am i right in saying that bump has entirely gone now?
I think i would prefer to stay in hospital or a clinic for lengthening with barinov instead of a hotel as you would with mitkovic, but I will keep him in my list of possiblities.
I think the ilazarov device does look very large and such but then you wont get misalingments, overall im not sure how much it would bother me to have frames that large, i guess it would be bad during consolodation while at home because i would have to try and move in cruthes with those things on.
visa wise i am happy with either, its not a big deal for me to fill in a few forms or travel to london for my fingerprints, i'd rather base my decision on more important things like aftercare and device type, after looking on visa websites, it appears i don't need one at all for 90 days stay?
what happened with me is the doctor was saying hed fix it but i didnt want any more stress put on me thats why i was trying to get away without fixing as long as it had no impact on my functionality. but after thinking about it i thought id be stupid not to have it fixed so thats when he came back in and fixed it properly.
visa wise, my hotel owner provides a free service where he drives you to the border to get you passport stamped. you just do that every 3 months and thats solves any visa problems. you just have to pay for the petrol which is like 30 euro.
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I know im 164.5 but I am only planning 5cm to 169.5, I am happy to wear a little lift to get ouf of the short zone (which is 170cm and under), and i have no intention of a 2nd height surgery.
I guess another downside is if resurgery is required you have to pay for it, with barinov he will not charge extra.
do you know if the mitkovic device is less painful than ilazarov, I have also heard that the first night the pain is very bad with ilazarov, can mitkovic knock you out if the pain gets very bad on the first night.
mitkovic device isnt that painful at all. the first week is a bit tender but because your in hospital then they provide you with pain killers whenever you need. lizarov fram would be much more painful as pins penetrate the muscle. but dont worry about physical pain.. mental stress is the worst part.
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Hi Descreteuser, I m happy for u that the alignment is fixed and it's off ur mind. :D :)
thankyou
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okay that's good to hear it is less painful, does mitkovic offer to knock you out during the surgery or are you awake? do you need blood tests as well, just tryign to get all the information i need.
is serbia wall sockets the same as UK, or do you need adapter,what about wifi for changing flight times, do you get that free in hotel or do you buy a stick.
for misalingment you kind of implied that the doctor was saying it wasn't a problem, and you were saying it was...anyway.
is there any pictures of the device in broad daylight, from your point of view on looking down on it.
similar to this picture, which is with barinov.
(http://s15.postimg.org/wmkjs4obf/day_of_surgery.jpg)
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its important that you weigh up the fact whether being 183 compared to 182 is going to mean alot more to you. after 5cm every half centimetre is a big hassle. Another user from this forum did 6cm with this device and im probably almost ahead of him progress wise even tho he started 4 months before me. i stopped at 4cm because it was alot safer, and it would take me to a height that i am very satisfied with. so i believe i was smart for not being greedy.. i could have easily done another half centimetre to be exactly 6'1 but the thing is i didnt need to.. no one would ever question me if i said i was 6'1 same as noone would every question you if you were 182 and said you were 6 foot. if i was you and chose this device. i would do 5cm and no more. but if getting to 183 means that much to you, than just be willing to add another couple of months to your recovery.. at the end of the day 2 months more isnt much if its going to make you 100% satisfied with your height. remember a few years down the track this process will be all but a distant memory.
I have to agree with you that there is very little difference between 182 cm and 183 cm, but it's peace of mind, and I just don't feel I could be satisfied if I invested the best part of a year into this and didn't hit that seemingly magical 6'0 milestone ;)
I have no commitments and time really isn't a factor to me, and I think the whole experience would give me some time to get away and clear my mind. My only real concern is having good internet access while I'm away so that I can continue to work. Gym access would be great, but that may be a little too ambitious.
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for some bizzare reason I can't seem to see any flights that go to NIS, only belgrade, but i think NIS has it's own airport, what exactly is the procedure here, do you get picked up in belgrade instead?
also you diary mentioned 'extreme pain' at the start, yet recently you said his device 'isn't that painful at all', are you maybe forgetting the extreme pain yuo had at the start?
is his distration rate 0.66m/day or can it be 1.00m/day.
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okay that's good to hear it is less painful, does mitkovic offer to knock you out during the surgery or are you awake? do you need blood tests as well, just tryign to get all the information i need.
is serbia wall sockets the same as UK, or do you need adapter,what about wifi for changing flight times, do you get that free in hotel or do you buy a stick.
for misalingment you kind of implied that the doctor was saying it wasn't a problem, and you were saying it was...anyway.
is there any pictures of the device in broad daylight, from your point of view on looking down on it.
similar to this picture, which is with barinov.
(http://s15.postimg.org/wmkjs4obf/day_of_surgery.jpg)
yes your asleep. you have a blood test and phsych evaluation few days before surgery. sockets are european so u need an adaptor. wifi is free. misalignments are a problem when you are unsure that he can fix it. i always assume the worse. but now that its fixed its obviously not a problem.
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I have to agree with you that there is very little difference between 182 cm and 183 cm, but it's peace of mind, and I just don't feel I could be satisfied if I invested the best part of a year into this and didn't hit that seemingly magical 6'0 milestone ;)
I have no commitments and time really isn't a factor to me, and I think the whole experience would give me some time to get away and clear my mind. My only real concern is having good internet access while I'm away so that I can continue to work. Gym access would be great, but that may be a little too ambitious.
you have good internet access in the hotel. very rarely does it not work. going to the gym when you cant walk would be a real hassle.. i purchased a bench press and 2 dumbells and a stationery bike. i can perform most upper body excercises.. when i can walk without walker ill start going to the gym just down the road and be looking to sell my equipment.
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for some bizzare reason I can't seem to see any flights that go to NIS, only belgrade, but i think NIS has it's own airport, what exactly is the procedure here, do you get picked up in belgrade instead?
also you diary mentioned 'extreme pain' at the start, yet recently you said his device 'isn't that painful at all', are you maybe forgetting the extreme pain yuo had at the start?
is his distration rate 0.66m/day or can it be 1.00m/day.
you fly to belgrade.. you can either organise to get a bus to nis or have drivers pick you up and take you straight to the hotel, about 2 hour drive and cost 120 euros. at the start i found myself moving too much to trying and get comfortable in my sleep and i refused to take painkillers which caused extreme pain.. but the second legi had done i took painkillers while i was in the hospital and by the time i left there wasnt too much pain. the normal distraction rate is 0.66mm per day. he will inform you judged on your x rays whether to speed up or slow down.. but to start with it is 0.66mm a day
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oh right, for hiring drivers, how would you do that without understanding the serbian language, and for getting back home for consolodation do the drivers have a big van so a wheelchair person can fit himself in?
and i go straight to hotel and book my hotel room even before the surgery? that's a good idea as i can setup my stuff in my room, di you say there was fridge and microwave in hotel room?
why would you refuse painkillers, now it's hard to gauge the pain level for myself, do you get injection type painkillers, or can you easily self administer them with tablets whenever you want.
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Would you recommend to stay in the hospital the whole time for lengthening, perhaps it would be easier to see the doctor in the hospital.
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oh right, for hiring drivers, how would you do that without understanding the serbian language, and for getting back home for consolodation do the drivers have a big van so a wheelchair person can fit himself in?
and i go straight to hotel and book my hotel room even before the surgery? that's a good idea as i can setup my stuff in my room, di you say there was fridge and microwave in hotel room?
why would you refuse painkillers, now it's hard to gauge the pain level for myself, do you get injection type painkillers, or can you easily self administer them with tablets whenever you want.
mitkovic organises the driver for u.. u just have to tell him what flight ur on and when it lands, and they will be holding your name on a piece of paper.. they speak english and take you to the hotel in nis. the wheelchair folds up so u just sit on the seat in the car and wheelchair would be put in the back. u get set up in ur hotel room before surgery then u get the surgery done, spend 7-10 days in hospital then return to ur room. theres a fridge but no microwave.. i refused painkillers because the pain was only caused when i moved so i just tried remaining still. in hospital they give u unjections whenever u want.. once u leave tho ur on ur own but the doctor can prescribe them for u..
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Would you recommend to stay in the hospital the whole time for lengthening, perhaps it would be easier to see the doctor in the hospital.
no because dr mitkovic is very rarely there so theres no point.. the hospital is expensive to stay, the food is and it is extremely boring.. honestly the hotel is the best way to go.. wheelchair access, staff are helpful, any prolems and u can contact the doctor from reception and he will come see u
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I was thinking of buying a self proper wheelchair and taking it with me, and pretending I need a wheelchair on the way there on airports, as this would simiulate how I will be returning back.
I think it's a good idea, since I will need to buy a wheelchair anyway.
I have e-mailed mitkovic but after reading many posts on this forum people have said after 4 weeks they hear no reply from him, not sure what to do if that happens to me.
for the painkillers on barinovs diaries people have said that nurses inject you each night, so don't you need stronger painkillers that require injection each day?
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I was thinking of buying a self proper wheelchair and taking it with me, and pretending I need a wheelchair on the way there on airports, as this would simiulate how I will be returning back.
I think it's a good idea, since I will need to buy a wheelchair anyway.
I have e-mailed mitkovic but after reading many posts on this forum people have said after 4 weeks they hear no reply from him, not sure what to do if that happens to me.
for the painkillers on barinovs diaries people have said that nurses inject you each night, so don't you need stronger painkillers that require injection each day?
nurses will injext you whenever you want here too.. if mitkovic doesnt replyjust keep resending until he does.. thats what i did
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ah yes but what about when you are in the hotel, no one will inject you?
I guess I should send him an E-mail every week until he replies? I don't want to seem soo pushy.
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ah yes but what about when you are in the hotel, no one will inject you?
I guess I should send him an E-mail every week until he replies? I don't want to seem soo pushy.
by the time your out of the hospital you wont need injections.. the pain isnt bad at all after the first week.
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During the first week of consolidation, am I able to stand for a short time, in order to transfer from wheelchair into the car seat that my parents will be driving when taking me home.
does mitkovics drivers have anything against picking me up at the airport at late times, say midnight for example?
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During the first week of consolidation, am I able to stand for a short time, in order to transfer from wheelchair into the car seat that my parents will be driving when taking me home.
does mitkovics drivers have anything against picking me up at the airport at late times, say midnight for example?
yeah you can walk with walker even when your lengthening. i waited 3 weeks after surgery and did a bit of walking every day from then on.. i was picked up at midnight so no its fine
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ok great, in the other diary for barinov it was said that getting knocked out with general anethesia for the operation caused a big headache, and it was recomended to not be knocked out during the operation but instaed to listen to loud music with headphones, would you recomend something similar?
can you let mitkovic know 'microman' sent an E-mail today for a LL op. maybe a good word would put me at an advantage.
I know mitkovic only does a few patients a year, let's hope he will allow another one quickly.
let me remind you i am 164.5, so my need is very high, i know you put this op. on and off for some time, but for me its big emergency im 13cm below the average need help fast!
there is nothing stopping me going to serbia soon, unlike intivation leter or visa, so maybe i will meet you there soon, how long do you have left?
a question about air travel, i can arrive in london at either 4:30pm or 7:10pm, but the serbian flight is at 8pm in the same airport, would arriving at 7:10pm be okay or is it risky. the whole journey ends up being quite long so I would like to not have to wait 3.5 hours if I don't have to.
actually the 7:10pm one is on thursday, and 4:30 one on tuesday, do you know if mitkovic does surgery on weekends, im just worried if he books friday then delays until monday how annoying that would be.
am I to understand that mitkovics device is 'fully weight-bearing' and that the ilazarov is not weight bearing?
for going home for consolodation can I use crutches instead of a wheelchair? this assumes I leave as soon as lengthening is done, i'd love to not have to use a wheelchair while going home on airport.
I am trying to asses my mobility when i leave for home, do you think it would be possible for me to leave the airport from home and get on a train to my town and doing this all in crutches/walker?
I am having a hard time understanding differences between walker and crutches.
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another question, there are many but im planning to go so...
can mitkovic knock you out after the surgery again if the pain gets too high, I just don't see the benefit of being awake during this time as you are not lengthening.
also how does calling home say to UK from serbia work, do you use your personal mobile phone, can it be done, how much more does it cost, maybe you use something better to call home, any special tips.
for the adapter is this the correct item, just want to make sure.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Go-Travel-Adaptor-into-Adapter-Wei%C3%9F/dp/B000MVDD2E
also what do you do about clothes and baths while there, i was thinking maybe you use a bed bath type solution, but im not sure about cloths and underwear.
and do i need to bring any forks, knifes or plate with me at all.
also in the case of having to do a re-surgery, what is the cost of that, and what are the chances of that happening percentage wise.
and about money, along wipth paying hotel and taxis, how do you get serbian money out, did you get a certain amount out before leaving for serbia?
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Are you expecting to make a full athletic recovery at this point? Do most of Dr. Mitkovic's patients who lengthen 4-5CM make a full athletic recovery?
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ok great, in the other diary for barinov it was said that getting knocked out with general anethesia for the operation caused a big headache, and it was recomended to not be knocked out during the operation but instaed to listen to loud music with headphones, would you recomend something similar?
can you let mitkovic know 'microman' sent an E-mail today for a LL op. maybe a good word would put me at an advantage.
I know mitkovic only does a few patients a year, let's hope he will allow another one quickly.
let me remind you i am 164.5, so my need is very high, i know you put this op. on and off for some time, but for me its big emergency im 13cm below the average need help fast!
there is nothing stopping me going to serbia soon, unlike intivation leter or visa, so maybe i will meet you there soon, how long do you have left?
a question about air travel, i can arrive in london at either 4:30pm or 7:10pm, but the serbian flight is at 8pm in the same airport, would arriving at 7:10pm be okay or is it risky. the whole journey ends up being quite long so I would like to not have to wait 3.5 hours if I don't have to.
actually the 7:10pm one is on thursday, and 4:30 one on tuesday, do you know if mitkovic does surgery on weekends, im just worried if he books friday then delays until monday how annoying that would be.
am I to understand that mitkovics device is 'fully weight-bearing' and that the ilazarov is not weight bearing?
for going home for consolodation can I use crutches instead of a wheelchair? this assumes I leave as soon as lengthening is done, i'd love to not have to use a wheelchair while going home on airport.
I am trying to asses my mobility when i leave for home, do you think it would be possible for me to leave the airport from home and get on a train to my town and doing this all in crutches/walker?
I am having a hard time understanding differences between walker and crutches.
no just get knocked out you wont have a headache. ill speak to him and let him know you sent him an email. i have about 4 to 5 months left. arriving at 7:10pm would be fine youd have enough time to get the 8pm flight. waiting another few days for surgery wont hurt you.. he does operate on weekends but its normally a week after you arrive. this device is full weight bearing although you dont fully weight bear until about 4 to 5 months after surgery. after lengthening period you should be able to get around with walker but its slow. stairs are also a problem. walker is much safer than crutches as it provides more support.
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another question, there are many but im planning to go so...
can mitkovic knock you out after the surgery again if the pain gets too high, I just don't see the benefit of being awake during this time as you are not lengthening.
also how does calling home say to UK from serbia work, do you use your personal mobile phone, can it be done, how much more does it cost, maybe you use something better to call home, any special tips.
for the adapter is this the correct item, just want to make sure.
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Go-Travel-Adaptor-into-Adapter-Wei%C3%9F/dp/B000MVDD2E
also what do you do about clothes and baths while there, i was thinking maybe you use a bed bath type solution, but im not sure about cloths and underwear.
and do i need to bring any forks, knifes or plate with me at all.
also in the case of having to do a re-surgery, what is the cost of that, and what are the chances of that happening percentage wise.
and about money, along wipth paying hotel and taxis, how do you get serbian money out, did you get a certain amount out before leaving for serbia?
being knocked out isnt as simple as flicking a switch.. it requires an anesthesiologist who costs money so painkillers and sleeping pills are the way to go if the pain gets too much.. but honestly dont worry about the pain its not that bad.. calling home would be best using skype.. setup a skype account when you get here.. yes thats the right adaptor.. i have showers..have my legs sticking out of the tray which are covered by my pants and a towel to protect the device.. than just wash myself. clothes can be washed by hotel staff whenever you need. no need to bring knives or forks its all here lol.. most common resurgery is recutting the fibula which is about 1200 euros.. but if your only doing 5cm and dont stuff around at the start like i did chances of you have to have that are about 5 %. i just had euros and had them transfered across the street from the hotel to serbian dinars.
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Are you expecting to make a full athletic recovery at this point? Do most of Dr. Mitkovic's patients who lengthen 4-5CM make a full athletic recovery?
yeah i only did 4cm.. the doctor told me 100% recovery athletically.. it will take about a year and a half post op to be athletically normal.. but as i dont play any sport it wont matter.. as long as i can walk completely normal after 7-9 months im happy.
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Hey D. any clue how many cosmetic LL patients Dr Mitkovic takes per year?
how long prior to surgery he likes to schedule?
Additionally how is payment handled?
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Hey D. any clue how many cosmetic LL patients Dr Mitkovic takes per year?
how long prior to surgery he likes to schedule?
Additionally how is payment handled?
about 5-6.. im the only one who has surgery this year so far.. he said there is 2 coming at the end of this month and 3 others havent got back to him.. you can normally tell him when you want to have it.. its normally up to you. pay by card or cash
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okay so i pay for the operation by a standard UK card?
as far as cash in hand is concerned, you said you had euros, does that mean you got our money converet into euros before you left UK/US, and then with those euros you can exchange them for dinars next to the hotel, if that is true how much euros in cash/hand should i have before leaving.
I had a word with my GP and hospital, they said they would only clean pin sites via a nurse in local doctors office, they wouldn't have to admit me into hospital for that, as far as x-rays go they would need a referal from a doctor to do the x-ray, and that would be private, they wont do an x-ray without a doctor referal, does all this sound okay.
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Got it Thanks. Do you have to pay in advance of once you get there?
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okay so i pay for the operation by a standard UK card?
as far as cash in hand is concerned, you said you had euros, does that mean you got our money converet into euros before you left UK/US, and then with those euros you can exchange them for dinars next to the hotel, if that is true how much euros in cash/hand should i have before leaving.
I had a word with my GP and hospital, they said they would only clean pin sites via a nurse in local doctors office, they wouldn't have to admit me into hospital for that, as far as x-rays go they would need a referal from a doctor to do the x-ray, and that would be private, they wont do an x-ray without a doctor referal, does all this sound okay.
yeah standard uk card is fine.. if i were you i would just get your money transferred to serbian dinars before getting on your flight to come here. id say if you had 40,000 dinars which is about 250 british pounds that would be enough to get you going for a while. your money goes along way here. for gettin money in the future, the owner of the hotel will go get money out from the atm whenever you need and bring you your money to your hotel room. hes very trustworthy and helpful. over here you dont need any referrals to get x rays.
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Got it Thanks. Do you have to pay in advance of once you get there?
na you just go visit the surgery place a few days before the surgery and pay.
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okay i wil get some dinars ready, i take it you pay the hotel via card as well, and dinar cash is for mitkovic drivers at the airport, food for hotel and taxi.
maybe i may take out 80,000 just in case as i need to pay the drivers of course.
for x ray i meant when i go home for consolodation, at home the only way to get an x-ray is with referal.
also how hard wolud it be to clean my own pin sites and change bandages each week, my doctor told me I would be able to spot nifections myself very easily anyway, maybe i should only go to the doctor if I see an infection.
for the plugs does the hotel room have more than 2 sockets, just don't want to make sure I can have laptop permanently on while playing/charging 3DS and make sure the phone mitkovic gives me is charged enough in case of emergency, I know it's a small thing but i'd like to be sure and buy an extension if necessary beforehand in the UK.
also you have only briefly mentioned physio, can you give a more in depth explanation of what you do, how long for, what kind of stretching etc.
should I bring shaving cream and razor to shave my legs before surgery, or is that not necessary with this device?
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okay i wil get some dinars ready, i take it you pay the hotel via card as well, and dinar cash is for mitkovic drivers at the airport, food for hotel and taxi.
maybe i may take out 80,000 just in case as i need to pay the drivers of course.
for x ray i meant when i go home for consolodation, at home the only way to get an x-ray is with referal.
also how hard wolud it be to clean my own pin sites and change bandages each week, my doctor told me I would be able to spot nifections myself very easily anyway, maybe i should only go to the doctor if I see an infection.
for the plugs does the hotel room have more than 2 sockets, just don't want to make sure I can have laptop permanently on while playing/charging 3DS and make sure the phone mitkovic gives me is charged enough in case of emergency, I know it's a small thing but i'd like to be sure and buy an extension if necessary beforehand in the UK.
also you have only briefly mentioned physio, can you give a more in depth explanation of what you do, how long for, what kind of stretching etc.
should I bring shaving cream and razor to shave my legs before surgery, or is that not necessary with this device?
yeah u should be fine cleaning it urself. yeah theres more than 2 sockets in the room.. physio you do yourself i could show u when u r here. shaving cream would be handy as they dont have any.. i had to use soap it took me ages. they suply you with the razor.
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Wow, good I remembered about the shaving cream.
good news i can clean the pin sites myself during consolodation, as long as i know what an infection looks like I guess at that point I will need to see the local doctor as soon as that happens?
you mentioned changing bandages, can you recommend what type of bandages I should get, it is so when I go home I have 5 months of weekly bandages ready for me.
what is the best pair of trousers to wear during consolodation, that may help in making sure I don't get an infection, you mentiond track pants once, maybe i should get it modded at the tailor so it has a side zip?
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Wow, good I remembered about the shaving cream.
good news i can clean the pin sites myself during consolodation, as long as i know what an infection looks like I guess at that point I will need to see the local doctor as soon as that happens?
you mentioned changing bandages, can you recommend what type of bandages I should get, it is so when I go home I have 5 months of weekly bandages ready for me.
what is the best pair of trousers to wear during consolodation, that may help in making sure I don't get an infection, you mentiond track pants once, maybe i should get it modded at the tailor so it has a side zip?
the nurses here can tell u what type of bandages.. track pants are fine you an just pull them up no need for a zip
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I have asked mitkovic about femur, maybe things can go faster for me :D
does mitkovic offer to purchase the wheelchair, as if i need to have one going home I will need to buy it.
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Does Mitkovic provide good aftercare?
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• Friday 12th June – I thought after having my daily walk inside my hotel room that id try walking without the support of the walker for the first time. I let go of the walker and tried walking forward. To my surprise I was able to do it. I spent the next 10 minutes placing the walker in front of me and walking towards it without holding it. It had only been 3 months since the operation on my left leg and nearly 4 months since my right leg. My legs were now strong enough to 100% weight bear. This is a great result as it means I am well on track to be walking fully unaided in the next month to month and a half. The knee extension and equines on my right leg is still a bit behind. Hoping to have it completely stretched out within the next month or 2. Im currently using 10 kilos on my right leg and 5 kilos on my left when stretching. The equines and knee extension on my left leg is almost at 100%.
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I have asked mitkovic about femur, maybe things can go faster for me :D
does mitkovic offer to purchase the wheelchair, as if i need to have one going home I will need to buy it.
im not sure
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Does Mitkovic provide good aftercare?
he visits you where you are staying if you have any questions or problems
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Hi Descreteuser,
Could you tell me approximately, how much do you weigh? I currently weigh around 94kg and am a little worried I need to continue to lose a bit more weight before considering this device.
P.S., please see the last PM I sent you, thanks!
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Hi Descreteuser,
Could you tell me approximately, how much do you weigh? I currently weigh around 94kg and am a little worried I need to continue to lose a bit more weight before considering this device.
P.S., please see the last PM I sent you, thanks!
i was about 80 to 85kg. I have chicken legs tho so if you have bigger legs chances are you will lose alot more weight in your legs after you are not using them.. id try and get as lean and fit as possible before the surgery it will make it easier when eventually trying to walk.. if you are a bit overweight now maybe try and drop to 85kg before the surgery because trying to lose it after the surgery will be impossible.
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Awesome. That's not too far off my weight. I'm naturally quite muscular but I could stand to lose more weight beforehand for sure :)
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Awesome. That's not too far off my weight. I'm naturally quite muscular but I could stand to lose more weight beforehand for sure :)
i wouldnt worry.. you only have to worry about the weight that your legs are holding not the actual weight in your legs.. you could easily have 10kg more in your legs than me so id say ud be fine at 94kg
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i wouldnt worry.. you only have to worry about the weight that your legs are holding not the actual weight in your legs.. you could easily have 10kg more in your legs than me so id say ud be fine at 94kg
Good to hear that. I have good upper body strength which should come in handy. I'm going to upload some mock-up images later on today hopefully, and get some opinions on my proposed lengthening amount.
Thanks.
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does dr mitkovic treats you as equal as you're taller than most patients ?
i'm 182.5 cm, so i feel very concerned by that, i'm not considering mitkovic but i just would like to know how doctors treats patients who are 180 cm+
I guess i would have no problem with paley or guichet but i'm not considering then btw, i'am looking at russian doctors
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na it didnt bother him at all. just told him a good reason why i wanted to do it
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can you give us some knowledge on how exactly you shower yourself, and how often it is required.
and how many clothes should i bring, for example;
5x pair of socks
5x pair of boxers
2x track pants? (i take it you only use this when going outside to avoid infections?)
5x shorts (i assume you wear shorts all the time while inside so device can be seen)
how do you wash your clothes, do you hand it to someone.
also what is your typical stance througout the day, can you spend most of the day sitting on a chair with a laptop on your desk, or must you be in bed? and if so is there some bed desk you can have so your laptop can sit on it nicely.
do you pay for the operation in dinars, and if so how much is it exactly.
I have also been looking at other diaries on anold forum, is much of what is said there applies here, for example is it the same 'military hosppital', they also mention something about a guesthouse, and they had a ball for exercise and some machine to give your legs some muscle, check George61's diary for more information, seems that is not available anymore?
I read on another diary that you must ensure that the hospital has applied on your behalf for a 'temporary resident' visa within 3 days of your arrival, I don't know if you did that, but I thought i should mention as you may get a fine or be held up and the airport upon leaving.
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can you give us some knowledge on how exactly you shower yourself, and how often it is required.
and how many clothes should i bring, for example;
5x pair of socks
5x pair of boxers
2x track pants? (i take it you only use this when going outside to avoid infections?)
5x shorts (i assume you wear shorts all the time while inside so device can be seen)
how do you wash your clothes, do you hand it to someone.
also what is your typical stance througout the day, can you spend most of the day sitting on a chair with a laptop on your desk, or must you be in bed? and if so is there some bed desk you can have so your laptop can sit on it nicely.
do you pay for the operation in dinars, and if so how much is it exactly.
I have also been looking at other diaries on anold forum, is much of what is said there applies here, for example is it the same 'military hosppital', they also mention something about a guesthouse, and they had a ball for exercise and some machine to give your legs some muscle, check George61's diary for more information, seems that is not available anymore?
I read on another diary that you must ensure that the hospital has applied on your behalf for a 'temporary resident' visa within 3 days of your arrival, I don't know if you did that, but I thought i should mention as you may get a fine or be held up and the airport upon leaving.
yeah clothes what u mentioned is fine.. hotel staff can get ur clothes cleane for u downstairs. sitting up or lying downs fine.. theres desks in the rooms.. operation is payed genrally by card in dinards translated from 9300 euros. theresamilitary hospital but thats just for getting xrays.. but dont get there for x raysas theres a better place.. dunno bout the guest house.. visa wise u only have to go to the border every 3 months to get ur pssport stamped
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oh right so it's translated from 9,300.00 euros into say 1,120,585 dinars, which i then would pay in pounds sinc it's a UK bank card, which would cost £6,732.
so strange for it to be like that but okay.
yeah okay i should be able to fit all that in my rucksack, I plan to not have any baggage with me so it doens't get put on the plane, i prefer a single bag as hand luggage as that goes in overhead compartments
track pants are made with different material, so i want to check this is an okay one as i don't want to cause infection, can you confirm this is an okay trackpant
http://www.sportsdirect.com/adidas-samson-woven-tracksuit-bottoms-mens-493079
I think you said it was not needed, but i think i will go to the tailer and get him to add a full side zip to the track pants,or add the ability to remove the bottom of the trousers via a zip, kinda like a zip in the kneebone area, this will make it easier to take off with the device on,
also when do you use track pants, was I right in saying it is when you are outside, and inside it's shorts only, I only ask because i need to know if i can get away with just one track pants, which i think i can.
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oh right so it's translated from 9,300.00 euros into say 1,120,585 dinars, which i then would pay in pounds sinc it's a UK bank card, which would cost £6,732.
so strange for it to be like that but okay.
yeah okay i should be able to fit all that in my rucksack, I plan to not have any baggage with me so it doens't get put on the plane, i prefer a single bag as hand luggage as that goes in overhead compartments
track pants are made with different material, so i want to check this is an okay one as i don't want to cause infection, can you confirm this is an okay trackpant
http://www.sportsdirect.com/adidas-samson-woven-tracksuit-bottoms-mens-493079
I think you said it was not needed, but i think i will go to the tailer and get him to add a full side zip to the track pants,or add the ability to remove the bottom of the trousers via a zip, kinda like a zip in the kneebone area, this will make it easier to take off with the device on,
also when do you use track pants, was I right in saying it is when you are outside, and inside it's shorts only, I only ask because i need to know if i can get away with just one track pants, which i think i can.
i just wear trackpants all the time even when im in my room.. im pretty lazy with changing my pants i dont really care if they get abit grubby.. prob had the ones i have on now for the past 2 weeks.. i have 2 other pairs but hardly ever rotate them..
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okay that is noted, would it not be easier to wear shorts over trackpads, as each time you get to the device youd have to take them off no?
exactly how long do you have left before you leave?
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okay that is noted, would it not be easier to wear shorts over trackpads, as each time you get to the device youd have to take them off no?
exactly how long do you have left before you leave?
to get to your device you just ;pull the pants up
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okay that is noted, would it not be easier to wear shorts over trackpads, as each time you get to the device youd have to take them off no?
exactly how long do you have left before you leave?
another 4 to 5 months
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okay that is noted, would it not be easier to wear shorts over trackpads, as each time you get to the device youd have to take them off no?
exactly how long do you have left before you leave?
Hey Microman,
When are you leaving for Serbia?
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Hello Descreteuser,
I am keeping in touch with Dr Mitkovic. My goal is to stretch tibia and femur. He told me he needs a period of four months between the two surgeries. I would like to know your opinion about the surgery with the device in the femur, it is recommended to Mitkovic device, you know patients who lengthened the femur?
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Hello Descreteuser,
I am keeping in touch with Dr Mitkovic. My goal is to stretch tibia and femur. He told me he needs a period of four months between the two surgeries. I would like to know your opinion about the surgery with the device in the femur, it is recommended to Mitkovic device, you know patients who lengthened the femur?
i normal suggest to do tibias first then once you are fully recovered from tibias to then do femrs.. i dont know any patients that have done femurs here yet... but one of the patients here is recovering from 6cm on tibias and is going to do femurs once his tibias are strong
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Would you mind uploading some of your recent X-rays? I'm curious to see how you let looks with the bump you had fixed
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there are some other diaries on anold forum of femurs with mitkovic, i don't think they are using the mitkovic device though.
given my proportions I may have to do 2xLL, my legs are soo short that even 5cm on tibs will make me look like a heron.
(http://www.thunderbirdsky.com/tbs.com%20graphics/heron.jpg)
sadly I cant justify the expenses of internal femur with betz etc., so mitkovic will be my only option for femur.
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Would you mind uploading some of your recent X-rays? I'm curious to see how you let looks with the bump you had fixed
i have another x ray is just over a week so ill post them then.. i dont have a record of my last x ray
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Alright thanks. I noticed from your pictures (unless Im mistaken) that the fixator doesnt touch the fibula. Is it safe to simply leave it to it's own devices? I'd personally worry about it becoming deformed.
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Wednesday 17th June – A new patient arrived today. I shared my experience and told him everything I could so he knew what to expect. I showed him how the device worked and how it was fixed to the leg so he had an understanding before having the operation. His surgery is scheduled for the following Friday. I told him what things he should purchase to make things easier for when he returns from the hospital. It was kind of good another patient arrived, as I was starting to go a bit f*kin mental being by myself all the time.
Thursday 18th June – I decided today that my walking with the walker was good enough that I could start doing my own grocery shopping from now on. I took a back pack and went collected my food and other groceries I needed. The hotel charges 2 euros per day to collect my food so id be saving myself 14 euros a week getting it myself. It took me about half hour just to do a return trip of about 150m but its good exercise and gets me walking out in the fresh air. Plus I get to check out all the fit Serbian chicks walking around. And believe me they are everywhere.
Sunday 21st June – The sun was out and it was hot. I decided to go for a big walk to the closest park and have a bit of a sun bake. I found a bench and decided to take my shirt off and lie down to try and get a bit of color on my skin. Im starting to look like a ghost, so it was nice to get some rays. Got back to my hotel finally and my legs were absolutely throbbing. Probably took about an hour before the throbbing went away but I knew that this was good for my recovery so I didn’t mind it.
Monday 22nd June – Hung out with the new patient in his hotel room. We tried to figure out the best way to arrange his room for the most space. He probably changed the configuration of the room about 10 times. He went all out and bought a PS4 and a big flat screen TV and we played Call of Duty for a few hours. It kind of took my mind off my legs for a while which was good. Made me feel as though the worst is over, and all the stress I’ve been through has been worth it and will just be a thing of the past.
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Wednesday 17th June – A new patient arrived today. I shared my experience and told him everything I could so he knew what to expect. I showed him how the device worked and how it was fixed to the leg so he had an understanding before having the operation. His surgery is scheduled for the following Friday. I told him what things he should purchase to make things easier for when he returns from the hospital. It was kind of good another patient arrived, as I was starting to go a bit f*kin mental being by myself all the time.
Thursday 18th June – I decided today that my walking with the walker was good enough that I could start doing my own grocery shopping from now on. I took a back pack and went collected my food and other groceries I needed. The hotel charges 2 euros per day to collect my food so id be saving myself 14 euros a week getting it myself. It took me about half hour just to do a return trip of about 150m but its good exercise and gets me walking out in the fresh air. Plus I get to check out all the fit Serbian chicks walking around. And believe me they are everywhere.
Sunday 21st June – The sun was out and it was hot. I decided to go for a big walk to the closest park and have a bit of a sun bake. I found a bench and decided to take my shirt off and lie down to try and get a bit of color on my skin. Im starting to look like a ghost, so it was nice to get some rays. Got back to my hotel finally and my legs were absolutely throbbing. Probably took about an hour before the throbbing went away but I knew that this was good for my recovery so I didn’t mind it.
Monday 22nd June – Hung out with the new patient in his hotel room. We tried to figure out the best way to arrange his room for the most space. He probably changed the configuration of the room about 10 times. He went all out and bought a PS4 and a big flat screen TV and we played Call of Duty for a few hours. It kind of took my mind off my legs for a while which was good. Made me feel as though the worst is over, and all the stress I’ve been through has been worth it and will just be a thing of the past.
It sounds like you're doing really well. Good to know there's going to be a few fellow LL patients when I get there.
Be sure to let us know how the new guy's upcoming surgery goes.
Thanks.
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is it a simple procedure to remove the device at home by yourself when the consolidation period has finished.
does it take a lot of time, do you need assistand of someone else etc, or is it a 20 minute job if you will.
i know with external ilazarov you need to had resurgery to remove it.
also would someone buy me a wheelchair over there somehow, so i can go back home in that wheelchair, i don't think i would be able to go into any shop on my own, i guess this would be a common occurence.
also does this device have the same issues that ilazarov has when turning in that the actual turn isn't the true gain you get, people were saying that when you turn 0.66 it end up being 0.44.
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is it a simple procedure to remove the device at home by yourself when the consolidation period has finished.
does it take a lot of time, do you need assistand of someone else etc, or is it a 20 minute job if you will.
i know with external ilazarov you need to had resurgery to remove it.
also would someone buy me a wheelchair over there somehow, so i can go back home in that wheelchair, i don't think i would be able to go into any shop on my own, i guess this would be a common occurence.
also does this device have the same issues that ilazarov has when turning in that the actual turn isn't the true gain you get, people were saying that when you turn 0.66 it end up being 0.44.
its simple to remove.. you loosen bolts that are connected to the pins which removes the bar.. then its just a matter of using a small spanner to unwind the pins from the bone.. u would prefer a doctor to do it but u can do it yourself if your careful.. youll be able to purchase a wheelchair no problems. i used a combination of x rays and a chart to track my amount lengthened.. you will find that the device requires quite a number of turns at the start before the bone starts distracting.. its nothing to worry about i will be able to show you how to set your chart out and can even go to the x ray place with you to get an accurate measurement of ur distraction gap.. basically what i did is i used the chart to ensure i was doing equal amount of turns on each length so theyd be the same as each other.. after about 3 weeks from when i began lengthening, i had an x ray and had my distraction gap accurately measured.. once i knew what the gap was, i used the chart to determine how many turns would get me to my goal of 4cm..once i got to where i thought was 4cm i had an x ray to get the gap checked and it was exactly 4cm.. i ended up doing 1mm more just to be safe.. so dont worry i can show u everything i did to ensure you know how much you have done.. and its a very accurate system that measures it so dont worry bout that..
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that's good news, would be good to see a diagram or video of it being done, but i can't see anything going wrong when removing the device as essentially the bone has consolodated so it simply doesn't need the device anymore.
I think this feature should be added to the main FAQ when comparing ilazarov to monorail, its clearly a big bonus over the ilazarov, i had no clue this could be done before reading your diary, i don't think it was even mentioned in the other diaries.
and yeah i have been reading other mitkovic diaries apparently you need to turn 3mm in one go as the first 3 don't really do anything.
i understand about the chart thing, with that you can tell what the gain you got from the amount of turns you did, good idea.
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Do you know if you need your own footholder for dr. mitkovics device, i read in a barinov diary that someone said to get your own footholer, this would have been external ilazarov of course.
Are you taking multivitamin pills, would you recommend them, what does the doctor say about them, i read on a diary that you should bring and take.
1. Bone builder supplements - like calcium tablet and other mineral
2. Vitamin C - I find it helped me with curing itches and fight off infection from the open wound
3. Melatonin - it's natural sleep enhancer. Pop a pill when you find yourself having difficulty sleeping
take 500mg vitamin c and a multi vitamin pill everyday.
do you think that would be a good idea?
I just wanted to check that if i go home during the first month of the consolodation phase will i be returning home in a wheelchair or on crutches?
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Do you know if you need your own footholder for dr. mitkovics device, i read in a barinov diary that someone said to get your own footholer, this would have been external ilazarov of course.
Are you taking multivitamin pills, would you recommend them, what does the doctor say about them, i read on a diary that you should bring and take.
1. Bone builder supplements - like calcium tablet and other mineral
2. Vitamin C - I find it helped me with curing itches and fight off infection from the open wound
3. Melatonin - it's natural sleep enhancer. Pop a pill when you find yourself having difficulty sleeping
take 500mg vitamin c and a multi vitamin pill everyday.
do you think that would be a good idea?
I just wanted to check that if i go home during the first month of the consolodation phase will i be returning home in a wheelchair or on crutches?
theres some sleeping tablets i had that i dont use.. you can have them... i probably only used 5 tablets the whole time but i obviously dont need them anymore/. as of yesterday i started taking multi vitamin tablets to speed up my bone consolidation and vitamin e tablets but thats mainly for my skin... the first 3 weeks after lengthening my walking wasnt good enough to walk around outside.. but after 3 weeks i found i was able to 100% weight bear which meant my walking with walker was good enough to go get my own groceries.. i started using crutches a week which was 1 month after distraction phase.. once your legs are strong enough to use crutches you can get around quite easily even tho its pretty slow still.. but when ur in crutches you can get up and down stairs easily..
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oh right so i can go home in crutches then? i wont need the wheelchair? and i can go up and down stairs in my two story home with the crutches, its important to know if i can do that as i will need to get an x-ray each month at my local hosptial and my room and bathroom is upstairs.
if that's true i wont need to buy the wheelchair then, just the crutches, and yeah that makes things way better especially for getting on the plane, if i went with external ilazarov would I be walking with crutches going home or would i be in wheelchair? just want to know so I can undestand the pros and cons of monorail vs ilazarov, i like to know as much information as i can.
oh okay so you personally didn't take multivitamin tables while lenthening, but you are during consolodation, interesting to know that.
what about the foot holder, did you use one, should i buy one.
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oh right so i can go home in crutches then? i wont need the wheelchair? and i can go up and down stairs in my two story home with the crutches, its important to know if i can do that as i will need to get an x-ray each month at my local hosptial and my room and bathroom is upstairs.
if that's true i wont need to buy the wheelchair then, just the crutches, and yeah that makes things way better especially for getting on the plane, if i went with external ilazarov would I be walking with crutches going home or would i be in wheelchair? just want to know so I can undestand the pros and cons of monorail vs ilazarov, i like to know as much information as i can.
oh okay so you personally didn't take multivitamin tables while lenthening, but you are during consolodation, interesting to know that.
what about the foot holder, did you use one, should i buy one.
if i were you id finish lengthening here and then dont go home until your legs are strong enough to use crutches.. for me i started using crutches 3.5 months after surgery.. but u have to remember everyone recoveries differently.. walking with the walker when ur legs are weak requires quite alot of upper body strength so the less physically fit you are the harder it will be to keep motivated.. i havent missed a day of walking no matter how hard it got.. i stretched every single day 4 or 5 times a day without fail, ive made sure ive done weight training 4 or 5 times a week without fail, and ive used the stationary bike every second day without fail for the past 1.5 months... some patients that do this get very lazy and dont walk for months and months after they finish lengthening.. so if you put alot of effort in and dont get lazy, the more chance you will have to be able to go home with crutches within the 4 months after surgery.. when you are unable to walk its very easy to fall into a trap of being lazy, which could lead you to requiring a wheelchair for 6 months or more..
i only started taking multi vitamins now cause i spoke to another patient who was 4 months ahead of me swore by them for speeding up consolidation.. i would have taken them the whole time but i never really thought about it,,
i never bothered about a foot holder.. but i guess it wouldnt hurt getting one but i didnt really feel the need
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oh i see so its more likely about 6 weeks into consolodation i would be able to use the crutches, otherwise it's the wheelchair.
I'd probably go home anyway in a wheelchair anyway but we'll see how it goes.
okay i will buy
multi vitamin tablets,
vitamine E tablets for skin
Melatonin
Vitamin C
Calcium tablets
if there are any other tablets or special brands you or any other LL you know recomend let me know.
and yeah i have no idea what a foot holder is, if you have a better description i can search for let me know as i can't seem to find it when searching online and not sure what to look for exactly, if you can't find one its okay, it may not be important for monorail fixator.
I should only need 1 pair of track pants right, then i can have about 5 pairs of shorts, seems like not an important question but the reason is my rucksack can only fit soo much in it and i don't want to use a luggage bag as i would have to try to find the luggage on the airport so it's a bit of a hassle, likely i would board the airport in the track pants.
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oh i see so its more likely about 6 weeks into consolodation i would be able to use the crutches, otherwise it's the wheelchair.
I'd probably go home anyway in a wheelchair anyway but we'll see how it goes.
okay i will buy
multi vitamin tablets,
vitamine E tablets for skin
Melatonin
Vitamin C
Calcium tablets
if there are any other tablets or special brands you or any other LL you know recomend let me know.
and yeah i have no idea what a foot holder is, if you have a better description i can search for let me know as i can't seem to find it when searching online and not sure what to look for exactly, if you can't find one its okay, it may not be important for monorail fixator.
I should only need 1 pair of track pants right, then i can have about 5 pairs of shorts, seems like not an important question but the reason is my rucksack can only fit soo much in it and i don't want to use a luggage bag as i would have to try to find the luggage on the airport so it's a bit of a hassle, likely i would board the airport in the track pants.
yeah you dont need much clothes to be honest.. have you booked your flight.. do u know what date u arrive yet
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just getting the money together as it's in a savings account so needs time to be 'liberated', then will confirm with mitkovic hopefully by tomorow, he offered me 10- 17th of july a few days back, hopefully that date is still available even when i get back to him on the 1st of July.
do you know if I can pay for the operation via bank wire transfer, I heard the exchange rates were better than by card, and can i check that you are charged in EUROs and not in serbian dinars, and if it's dinars do you know the rough amount, as if it is the exchange rate may give me a different amount.
also do you pay the rent of the hotel monthly or weekly, and can that be by card or do i get cash from an atm machine which will convert my money into dinars, i think i may have asked this before so sorry if i have.
I also read somewhere that my plane ticket might have to have a return date otherwise it might mess with my visa, is this true?
you don't need a visa to come here. As long as your plane ticket has a return date, you can stay here for up to one year I think. –cbick66 diary.
just want to make sure i don't need a return ticket, it will just be one way.
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do you know if the hospital has wifi, my parents would like to know so I can communicate with them if re surgery is required as I may need the extra money to transfer.
also if re-surgery is required, does it happen after a few days of operation, or can it happen about 20 days after operation.
do you have any pictures of the hospital, I tried typing in the address into google maps and didn't get much out of it.
do you know if I check into hotel after surgery or before, because if it is before I guess I could e mail parents before the operation which would be useful.
thanks
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do you know if the hospital has wifi, my parents would like to know so I can communicate with them if re surgery is required as I may need the extra money to transfer.
also if re-surgery is required, does it happen after a few days of operation, or can it happen about 20 days after operation.
do you have any pictures of the hospital, I tried typing in the address into google maps and didn't get much out of it.
do you know if I check into hotel after surgery or before, because if it is before I guess I could e mail parents before the operation which would be useful.
thanks
yes wifi in hospital.. additional surgery is only required if fibulas consolidate which if it happens wont happen until a month or so in.. but chances of you consolidating that quick is very rare..
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okay I just went to my tomas cook for money exchange, they said they don't do Serbia dinars, they also said that you don't want to use your bank card there as you will get charged a lot for using it.
they said to bring English notes with me, and I can exchange them for dinars at any hotel, does this sound right to you?
also if using your card is so bad there how did you get new money out for paying the rent, or did you bring a lot of English or american money with you in cash while there.
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okay I just went to my tomas cook for money exchange, they said they don't do Serbia dinars, they also said that you don't want to use your bank card there as you will get charged a lot for using it.
they said to bring English notes with me, and I can exchange them for dinars at any hotel, does this sound right to you?
also if using your card is so bad there how did you get new money out for paying the rent, or did you bring a lot of English or american money with you in cash while there.
theres an exchange place near the hotel
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okay and i can exchange english pounds for dinars?
but what happens when I need more money, do i go to the bank in serbia and ask for english pounds, then exchange those pounds for dinars at the exchange place.
the lady said if i pay for anythign direct with pounds i will be charged heavily.
are the mitkovic drivers okay with the fact that i wont be able to pay them instantly as i wont have any dinars, or am i meant to exchange pounds in cash for dinars as the airport.
thanks.
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okay and i can exchange english pounds for dinars?
but what happens when I need more money, do i go to the bank in serbia and ask for english pounds, then exchange those pounds for dinars at the exchange place.
the lady said if i pay for anythign direct with pounds i will be charged heavily.
are the mitkovic drivers okay with the fact that i wont be able to pay them instantly as i wont have any dinars, or am i meant to exchange pounds in cash for dinars as the airport.
thanks.
i get the hotel manager to get money out from atms...as for the driversim not sure.. they r pretty friendly so u wont have any problems..
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im glad they are frindly as i wont have any dinars to give to them at the end of the trip, maybe they will take it from mitkovic if i give it to them? is there english not too bad, as they friends with mitkovic or are they a special drivers service.
hmm okay, does mitkovic allow you to bank wire transer the surgery bill, as i hear you get charged badly for using your card directly.
also are you aloud beer while lengthening? that may help the process go a bit quicker.
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* Wednesday 1st July - Had to get an X-ray today to check how my callus was getting along. Had to get it done at the military hospital as the normal place i go to was closed for small renovations. No one really spoke english there so took me a while before they figured out what i wanted. I got the X rays and automatically turned into worry mode. My left leg was still just as mis-aligned as before he corrected it over a month ago. I Started worrying as the callus on my left leg had formed quite alot and thought if the alignment was a problem, it might not be able to be fixed. The doctor came visited me and guaranteed me it was completely fine. He explained very clearly this time and i finally understood why it wasnt a problem. He sent me information on acceptable alignments on anterior/posterior angulation as well as a picture of my x ray which showed what my degree of mis alignment was. Turns out mine was 1.7 degrees and there is acceptable alignment of up to 10 degrees. The Information along with a clear understanding made me sure everything was going to be ok with how my legs are. If only i understood all of this earlier it would have saved me a huge amount of stress.
* Saturday 4th July - Went for a long walk without my crutches. I had heavy hip swaying but it was good to be walking quite a long distance un-aided. It was extremely tiring but in a good way. Its strange looking back on it all not being able to walk all that time and all of a sudden feeling kinda close to being back to normal life.
* Tuesday 7th July - I felt i was able to get around well enough now to join a gym. I went down the road and signed up for a month package. I did a shoulder and tricep session and spent a bit of time on a cross trainer. I also did a very light leg workout trying to get some strength back in my legs. Ive decided ill do one leg workout after every workout from now on.
* Wednesday 8th July - I decided to get a physio to my hotel room for a session and ask him about my knee extension and what i can do to get this back as soon as possible. I told him the stretches ive been doing and he told me that stretching is only half the job, and only works the muscles at the back of your legs. He ran through a whole lot of other exercises that will not only target the muscles at the back, but also target the ones on the front. He said the exercises will build strength in all my leg muscles which in turn will correct my knee extension and eliminate my equines completely which i still had in both legs. He told me if i follow this routine strictly 3 times per day, i should be able to stand completely straight within 1 months time. He also mentioned i shouldnt do long walks without my crutches as it will harm my body from being hunched over. He suggested to only walk with crutches for the time being as they force you to have your back straight when walking, as well as waiting until i can stand completely straight before walking long distances without crutches. I also had him look at my x rays and he said side my alignments were completely fine and have nothing to do with my poor leg extension.
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who is this physio person, is this person associated with dr. mitkovic.
how much does he charge per session and would you recomend you use him instead of doing self physio?
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who is this physio person, is this person associated with dr. mitkovic.
how much does he charge per session and would you recomend you use him instead of doing self physio?
u only need to see him a couple of times.. i could pretty much just tell u what he told me.. save u money.. he just gives u a routine.. and u just have to stick to it..
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i still like the option of hiring someone to do the actual stretches with me, that might be a good idea, but i will see how i can cope with it on my own first.
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i still like the option of hiring someone to do the actual stretches with me, that might be a good idea, but i will see how i can cope with it on my own first.
the exercises dont require assistance.. so hed basically just watch u exercise.. not really worth paying him every day for nor reason.. ill show u the exercises anyway if ya want..
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okay sounds good.
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Can you record you when you walking?Is big difference betwen your walking now and before?
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could i clean my pin sites and change bandages weekly at home myself, provided i have the necessasy tools and knowledge.
also how long does the process take to change bandages and clean pin sites, is it a 20 minute job?
i only ask because i don't think my GP or private hospital will do such a job, they may do x ray though, but only with referal letter.
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Can you record you when you walking?Is big difference betwen your walking now and before?
ive recorded myself every sunday from when i finished lengthening.. if u want u can private message me ur email and i can send u them
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could i clean my pin sites and change bandages weekly at home myself, provided i have the necessasy tools and knowledge.
also how long does the process take to change bandages and clean pin sites, is it a 20 minute job?
i only ask because i don't think my GP or private hospital will do such a job, they may do x ray though, but only with referal letter.
yes and not a hard process.. probably takes 10 to 20 minutes..
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great, thanks a lot man, a big load of my mind.
hopefully dr. mitkovic will sell me a few months worth of the supplies needed to clean the pin sites as well as cahnge bandages, but we will see when it comes down to that.
obviously if a major infection happens or pin breaks I will have to get a plane back to serbia, but as you have said there is not much of a chance of that happening, but we will see.
also how necessary is the montly x-ray, can it not be maybe an x-ray every 2 months instead? i maen i don't see what the x-ray would show other than how far we are to being fully healed?, in which case can it be done in larger intervals.
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great, thanks a lot man, a big load of my mind.
hopefully dr. mitkovic will sell me a few months worth of the supplies needed to clean the pin sites as well as cahnge bandages, but we will see when it comes down to that.
obviously if a major infection happens or pin breaks I will have to get a plane back to serbia, but as you have said there is not much of a chance of that happening, but we will see.
also how necessary is the montly x-ray, can it not be maybe an x-ray every 2 months instead? i maen i don't see what the x-ray would show other than how far we are to being fully healed?, in which case can it be done in larger intervals.
during distraction phase id suggest 1 every 2 week.s but once uve finished lengthening, one ever 1.5 months would be fine.. just to check for consolidation
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great news getting one every 6 weeks would be easier, my private hospital isn't completly helpful, they are very hesitant about it for some reason but if dr. mitkovics writes a letter in english explanaing the situation it should hopefully be fine, at least they said it would.
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(http://s24.postimg.org/iwldhyrnp/scars.jpg)
is this how scarring will look on mitkovics device, because if so those scars look quite decent compared to the ilazarov scars, might not actually get scar revision surgery if they look like that, you could even cover some of them up with a simple plaster.
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those scars are much worse than normal ilizarov scars
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(http://s24.postimg.org/iwldhyrnp/scars.jpg)
is this how scarring will look on mitkovics device, because if so those scars look quite decent compared to the ilazarov scars, might not actually get scar revision surgery if they look like that, you could even cover some of them up with a simple plaster.
god no.. the scars from this device look much better than that..
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oh really, it looks way better than that picture i saw of KiloKAHN's LON scars.
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Kilokahn had a lot of pins stuck into his leg because he's a big guy, so that's not necessarily what the Ilizarov scars are going to look like either. I was 135 lbs when I did the surgery and got away with only four pins per leg: two by the knee and two by the ankle.
Where did you find that photo?
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it's on the old forum, body builders diary, he got monorails with a dr. he prefered not to name, the device looked kind of cool though, much more minimalistic than mitkovics.
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DiscreteUser if my bones pre-consolidate, can I stop lengthening and go to the consolidation phase and not have to do the re-cutting operation, or must the re-cutting of fibula be done.
obviously the height i have gained to that point would be my final height.
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DiscreteUser if my bones pre-consolidate, can I stop lengthening and go to the consolidation phase and not have to do the re-cutting operation, or must the re-cutting of fibula be done.
obviously the height i have gained to that point would be my final height.
your tibias arent going to consolidate its just ur fibulas u have to worry bout.. but i doubt ur fibulas will consolidate that fast anyway.. if u havent reached ur goal and fibulas do consolidate u may need minor surgery to recut the fibula so u can continue lengthening.. but i doubt ull have to do that
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but it happened to you after about 3cm didn't it, why wouldn't it happen to me lol.
but yes if that does happen, i can call it quits on the whole thing then, as if that does happen at the 4cm mark it is likely i will do that, rather than another re surgery for another cm.
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but it happened to you after about 3cm didn't it, why wouldn't it happen to me lol.
but yes if that does happen, i can call it quits on the whole thing then, as if that does happen at the 4cm mark it is likely i will do that, rather than another re surgery for another cm.
if u read my diary it goes through what happened to me at the start.. where i changed my mind when i only had my right leg broken and decided i wasnt going to follow through. i didnt start lengthening the right leg until almost 3 weeks in,, because id been walkin on it, my early indecision to lengthen prevented my fibula from pulling apart quick enough and allowed it to consolidate..
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okay thanks for that explanation, I will just assume that wont happen with me then.
but yeah i did find it wierd he did only one leg for you first, apprently so it was more comfortable for you? i don't think i have ever come across that on any diary but i will ask him more details about that during consultation.
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Descreteuser how you feel now? Did you improve your walking since 10th july? Do you feel any pain?
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Descreteuser how you feel now? Did you improve your walking since 10th july? Do you feel any pain?
yes walking is slowly improving.. i dont notice it day by day but the videos show me how much im improving week per week.. comparing my video yesterday to a week ago is quite drastic.. walking is however still very tiring.. but im sure that over the next couple of months that it will return back to 100% normal and hopefully should have both my frames off by mid october..
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are you sure to avoid long life pain?
That's my biggest worry, even though i only consider 3.5 cm which is 10 times safer than 7.5 cm, i couldn't handle my life.
Also, i would you to know, if you don't mind
-how old are you, i remember you once said you're 40 years old.
-How it feels to be 185 cm , do you notice a big difference when you compare yourself to others?
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* Wednesday 22nd July - I got really bored sitting in my hotel room so i thought id go for a walk outside without taking my crutches. At first i thought i was just going to go for a short stroll. But i thought, you know what, i might make a bit of a night out of it. So i decided to walk to where me and the previous patient went when i first arrived here just over 5 months ago, about 1km from the hotel. I finally made it to the bar, walked in there, ordered myself a drink, and just enjoyed being back into what i consider normal life for me. Sitting down, having a drink, embracing the atmosphere of being in a bar again. I stayed there for an hour or so in which time i only had 3 drinks, and geez was i pissed. All that time off the alcohol made me an absolute lightweight. I decided id go for another walk down the strip where a number of other bars were. Wasnt really much happening so i pulled the pin and walked all the way back to the hotel. Im not sure if it was the booze, but the walk back was much easier. So basically id walked about 2km unaided, although tiring my walking looked pretty normal and i thought it was quite an achievement after only being having my left leg operated on 4 months earlier.
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are you sure to avoid long life pain?
That's my biggest worry, even though i only consider 3.5 cm which is 10 times safer than 7.5 cm, i couldn't handle my life.
Also, i would you to know, if you don't mind
-how old are you, i remember you once said you're 40 years old.
-How it feels to be 185 cm , do you notice a big difference when you compare yourself to others?
my pain now is pretty much non existent,my legs are just stiff when i first stand up to walk. walking is still pretty exhausting but its returning to normal.
im not 40. im in my 20s but dont wish to give my exact age. Yeah now that my walking is more upright, at 185 i find it rare to see guys taller than me to be honest. There is an enormous amount of guys that are just a bit shorter than me that would have had over an inch on me before.. i still do see a few guys on a daily basis that make me look short but im in a country known for having tall men. so until i leave i wont feel what the new height is really like. i can only imagine if i feel tallish here how im gonna feel back in my own country.. i also look alot taller now just from having longer legs.. jeans look better on me.. its great
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How do you feel now at 185 cm? Do you still comparing your height with other guys?Or you think less about height?
Does your family and friends know for surgery?
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How do you feel now at 185 cm? Do you still comparing your height with other guys?Or you think less about height?
Does your family and friends know for surgery?
now that ive gone from being on the verge of being tall to a height that is no question tall, i no longer obsess about my height as im completely 100% satisfied with it.. i let my height before stop me from being myself, and let it affect me in all aspects of life.. but now its just a thing of the past and when i see people that make me look small or short it doesnt bother me in the slightest bit as i know that no one could ever question me about being short... my next goal is to get myself into great shape, get back to normal life and earn money again, be confident with who i am and live a life without insecurities.. and no, noone knows ive done this..
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it is good to hear that you make your goal. I hope next year or max for 2 years we will be the same height :D What do you think how much time it will need to pass to run again?
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it is good to hear that you make your goal. I hope next year or max for 2 years we will be the same height :D What do you think how much time it will need to pass to run again?
1 to 1.5 years from operation to run i recon
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Tuesday 18th August - Went and got an Xray from the local hospital as the other x ray places machines were currently not operating. The doctor had to call ahead to ensure we were able to get it done there. Normally it was only for local patients. I had my X ray and the doctor came visited me. He told me my right leg callus was stronger than my left. Which was expected as the the right leg was operated on first. The doctor took the cd which would show my exact measurement of my distraction gap. Left leg was 3.9cm and right leg was 4.1cm.
Update on walking: I no longer use crutches, i am able to walk completely normal most the time, although it is still a bit tiring, especially when ive been walking for more than half an hour. I can walk up stairs pretty easily now. Going down stairs is still awkward. My ballerina is completely gone. I still have slight knee bending in my right leg, but it is much better, getting close to being flat. I still need to improve my dorsiflexion, which is gettin my ankle back past 90 degrees.. my left foot can get back about 15 degrees, my right probably 5-10. The physio told me a while ago that 30 degrees is when its back to normal.
Timeline: It has been 6 months since my right leg was operated on, and 5 1/4 months since my left leg.. ive been going to the gym, 3 to 4 times a week, ive been out and enjoyed myself, even went to a nightclub and danced. in a months time the doctor will loosen the fixator from 1 pin, top and bottom on both legs.. this will allow more weight bearing to my legs..Then a week later loosen from another pin top and bottom on both legs. A week from then the bar will be completely removed and the pins will remain in my leg for another week. This is incase my leg cant support my weight and the device can be easily put back on.. (very unlikely scenario).. then once my legs prove they can support me, the pins will be removed.. So by the time my frames are removed, im looking at 7 months post op from my left leg, and almost 8 months post op for my right leg..
Also to those amazing expert heroes out there that say 7-8 months is a 'bad score' for 4cm, my frames could have come off earlier, but im not a hero like you, and i believe its better to be safer than sorry. Id rather know my legs are completely healed, than thinking im awesome for getting them off earlier than running into problems later.. and having your bones heal and getting your frames off is only a fraction of the achievement. Being able to get your frames off than walk away, completely normal, thats what i believe is a real achievement..
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Thanks for the update, glad you're doing better. I started considering Mr Mitovic but im still researching his device. You mention about recent Xray, would you be able to post it here? Im trying to understand the fibula fixation on the top and bottom of the bone. Peace.
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Thanks for the update, glad you're doing better. I started considering Mr Mitovic but im still researching his device. You mention about recent Xray, would you be able to post it here? Im trying to understand the fibula fixation on the top and bottom of the bone. Peace.
its only fixed at the bottom not the top.. my x rays are the old school ones.. very hard to get a clear picture up on here..
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is there a reason for the 0.2cm difference between left and right leg with your lengthening gap
i have 0.1 atm, but i dont see why, but im turning extra to re aling the legs together.
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is there a reason for the 0.2cm difference between left and right leg with your lengthening gap
i have 0.1 atm, but i dont see why, but im turning extra to re aling the legs together.
it could be a number of things.. the doctor could have accidentally measured it wrong, as the cuts in the gap arent the easiest to see. ive measured myself standing on either leg at a time.. and i get the exact same measurement.. so thats all that matters.. the doctor had me lay down on my back and have my body completely staright and he checked the my legs and said there was a 1mm difference.. which is barely anything.. even if it was 2mm difference its no problems.. most people naturally have one legs slightly longer than the other...
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oh okay i have been adding more turns to the left leg, even though that makes no sense since the turns have been equal until now yet it read a 0.1cm difference in the x ray
i will ask him if i should go back to having equal turns in the legs, he is resetting my device today.
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oh okay i have been adding more turns to the left leg, even though that makes no sense since the turns have been equal until now yet it read a 0.1cm difference in the x ray
i will ask him if i should go back to having equal turns in the legs, he is resetting my device today.
dont stress about it too much.. its only 1mm..
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Hey guys. This afternoon I got my first xray done since my device was fitted on Tuesday. I think Dr. Mitkovic will be taking a look at them either later on today or tomorrow, but everything's looking a-ok to me.
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Thanks so much! How long did you have to spend in Kiev -total- before you could go home? How long since the date of surgeries could you walk ok on your own? Do you have to fly back to have device removed? If so, when and for how long? Thanks in advance!
RM
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What is the maximum length that can be safely lengthened using this device
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Thanks so much! How long did you have to spend in Kiev -total- before you could go home? How long since the date of surgeries could you walk ok on your own? Do you have to fly back to have device removed? If so, when and for how long? Thanks in advance!
RM
ive stayed here the whole time.. just over 6 months so far.. it took me just over 2 months to lengthen.. and then i think just shy of 3 months post op i took my first steps without the walker. after about 4.5 months i was walking full time unaided.. at 5 months my limp was gone..
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What is the maximum length that can be safely lengthened using this device
safely, i would say 5cm.. after that every cm is very hard.. 6cm is very achievable tho, but it will be difficult.. 7.5cm is possible but would be extremely challenging,and very likely to run into problems.. i personally would never do more than 6 with this device..
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Hello,
can you update your recovery now? How much precentage of function you got back? Can you run?
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(http://i.imgur.com/yrDnBwO.jpg)
Sunday 4th October - took the bars off myself today.. and did a small bit of walking in my hotel room.. i'll spend the next few days with just the pins in, then have them removed on the 8th, and have the wounds cleaned 1 more time on the 9th just before i leave..
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Hey,
How do you feel now with the pins out? How is your walking now? Is the duckasss gone?
Hope you’re good!
Cheers,
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Can you give an update? Thanks.
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Update please!
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He died of Cirrosis because the screws somehow held his liver tissue in a good state.. One of the dangers of LL
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No way dude. I saw him logged in a few weeks ago.
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No way dude. I saw him logged in a few weeks ago.
Must be his family trying to understand how he decided to go through LL
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Wtf. How did you know?
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He died of Cirrosis because the screws somehow held his liver tissue in a good state.. One of the dangers of LL
A bad joke?
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Seriously wtf?
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A bad joke?
Guess
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No. He did nt die of Cirrosis because Cirrosis has nothing to do with LL or legs in general. Common guys...
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Wtf man. You're joking about a person's life here. That's not very nice.
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Just like 99.9% of LLers, he went on with his life.
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no i am not dead lol.. carrying on with life as usual.. everything is normal.. i havent really tried to run yet.. i can jog but dont much.. go to the gym regurlarly... was gonna ask everyones oppinion on what height i should claim.. as i dont like to lie about my height and say i am taller than i am.. i wake up at 186cm, after a long day of work i can get down to 184, but if im just lounging around i measure 185, now as most people where im from dont go by cm they go by feet and inches do you think ican claim 6'1 with those numbers, ive normally just told people who have asked that i am just under 6'1 as i feel like that is more honest answer.
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no i am not dead lol.. carrying on with life as usual.. everything is normal.. i havent really tried to run yet.. i can jog but dont much.. go to the gym regurlarly... was gonna ask everyones oppinion on what height i should claim.. as i dont like to lie about my height and say i am taller than i am.. i wake up at 186cm, after a long day of work i can get down to 184, but if im just lounging around i measure 185, now as most people where im from dont go by cm they go by feet and inches do you think ican claim 6'1 with those numbers, ive normally just told people who have asked that i am just under 6'1 as i feel like that is more honest answer.
Just say you are 6'1", and say it casually..... The minute you fall for the trap of over-explaining or justifying your height (or anything else as a matter of fact), people instantly detect that this is something that bothers you in a way. Besides, no-one is going to pull out a measuring tape out of their rectum and try to prove you're wrong by a 1/4 of an inch ;)
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Hey can you update?
And do you know what happened to "ewf"?
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Where was the guy from?