Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Discussions => Topic started by: Icarus on October 21, 2022, 01:27:02 PM
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I want to focus on the topic of post-LL dating in this thread. For most of us considering leg lengthening, height neurosis encompasses far far more than dating, but attractiveness to women appears to be one of the most immediately noticeable benefits of growing taller, and I’m wondering if those of you who had the procedure might shed some light on how growing taller has affected your dating life and how women view you.
Despite my height at 5’6, I am lucky enough to have an attractive face, athletic body, high social skills, and a full life, and I have never had a problem finding women to hookup with. I am very outgoing and when I notice that a woman is attracted to me at a bar, party, in a social group, or elsewhere, I am effective at turning those moments into dating opportunities.
However, I have also found that I have not been attracted to most women who are interested in me, and the women I do find attractive rarely find me attractive, and when I get dates with them due to my personality/social status/social skills I often face a lot of ambivalence, I tend to get strung along until they break things off, and I find myself in a situation where I am regularly tested and treated like a backup until I break it off or they do. My longest relationship with a woman I found attractive was anxiety ridden since I felt I had to play it perfectly to get her off the fence—almost to a manipulative level, where I never shared my emotions, needs, and concealed my high interest level, bolstered my options/feeling of abundance by playing the field in the early phase of dating, and even then it felt like she held all the cards in the relationship, which is not something I’d like to have to repeat every time I catch the eye of a really attractive woman.
I’m wondering whether any of you have seen improvements in that aspect of dating post-LL, whether growing taller has opened doors as far as options, and helped you find less ambivalence and testing behaviors among the most attractive women you’re talking to.
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There is no question you're going to have more luck with women. 5 foot 7 and down (my height) is where the stark dropoff of women willing to date you occurs. 5'8 and above and you can generally make it work if you put effort in. Of course life gets easier the taller you are. I feel like 5'10 is the magic number where almost no women will consider your height/presence as an issue. Rarely do you see men complain about being 5'10 in the dating world. But you see it occasionally from 5'9 men (really not a big deal though), 5'8 to a larger extent, and 5'7 and down to a very high extent. Ill add that your location changes all these numbers. Im talking from the standpoint where the average man is 5 foot 9.5 in the US. Probably more meaningful for those that actually had the procedure speak to this, but I've been on this site for a few months and read nearly everything and this is what I've gathered from others.
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Being taller will increase the quantity of women who would consider to date you but not the quality. You will have a larger dating pool though thus will more likely have more quality women. Just to be more clear, if now 100 women find you attractive but only 10% are good looking, by being lets say 5'9 500 women will find you attractive but still only 10% of them you will find attractive (10vs50 women you find attractive)
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By the way you dont even need to ask people on here. Go on a dating app and spend a few days at different heights (change your height). See what happens. That will be your answer. I changed mine from 5'7 to 5'10 and the difference was hilarious.
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Being taller will increase the quantity of women who would consider to date you but not the quality. You will have a larger dating pool though thus will more likely have more quality women. Just to be more clear, if now 100 women find you attractive but only 10% are good looking, by being lets say 5'9 500 women will find you attractive but still only 10% of them you will find attractive (10vs50 women you find attractive)
What makes you believe that quality is not also improved?
By the way you dont even need to ask people on here. Go on a dating app and spend a few days at different heights (change your height). See what happens. That will be your answer. I changed mine from 5'7 to 5'10 and the difference was hilarious.
Yes I've done the same experiment in the past, I'm just curious on post-LL patient's take on how the experience changed for them. My assumption is that women are more likely to approach them, are less likely to play games and be ambivalent when dating them, and will give them more leeway in terms of other traits when considering them as a partner. But I'd like to hear some more anecdotes confirming the theory and some more in depth experiences from men who have seen their dating lives improve beyond the surface of "yes, being taller will help with dating". I'd like to hear specific accounts of how they've perceived their dating lives improve, and details about their before/after experiences with women.
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Because I see both tall and short guys with either super hot women or either ugly women. I myself am dating according to people I know a 7/7.5 even though I am a 5'7 which should mean according to this forum or other shor men forums, that it should be impossible. I never dated a woman below a 6
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My last gf was a legitimate 9 or 10. Its not internet talk, if I showed anyone pics they would nod their head. And not in some fake hot way, like girl next door way. I'm good looking for a short guy and pretty well off (self made). Thats how that happened. But you realize its just not enough for girls like that. Maybe for girls who are 7's or 8's no problem. I know this sounds picky and egotistical.
This got fked up not long ago and I lost her probably because of how insecure I am as a reaction to others. But my actions/reactions are not misplaced. Guys dont act defensive for no reason. It really changed when I was around her family without shoes on for the first time. I thought I was confident enough and truly in my head didnt care. Her friends and family members immediately asked things like "did you lose weight" and other comments (which we know is just code for wow you are really small). In fact 2 of her family members asked that exact question. Im pretty built/muscular with a good body for my height, around 155 pounds and lean. So you know what its a reference to. That moment of internal awkwardness is real. And thats when you realize its not "your mentality" as people like to suggest. Its out of your control no matter your mentality because others do judge you and you do react. Fast forward and all sorts of excuses to break up happened, obviously she avoided mentioning height but completely random things that dont make any sense. Thats how it goes, on repeat. Ready for that to end.
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Yeah from my own experience it feels like I have to be absolutely perfect when I do date a really attractive woman. Perfect personality, perfect career, high social status, great in bed, always well groomed and dressed well, and always on my game when it comes to planning great dates. Almost like I’m treated like I have to make up for my body, while my taller friends seem to get away with a lot more and have the same type of women chasing them when they have a lot less going on. It’s exhausting, frankly.
I remember hearing Nikki Glaser joke about how women should date short guys because it’s like getting a hot guy at a discount, and it mirrors my experience: I feel like I naturally end up dating women who are less attractive than me while they still hold all the cards in the relationship, and that’s frustrating as hell. In some ways I wish I didn’t care about stuff like looks, but it’s not really my choice who I’m attracted to or not, and I think it’s the same way for women. I’ve dated a number of women who seem to have been hesitant because they wished they were more attracted to me because of all the other stuff I had going on, but ultimately ended things because they couldn’t get over the physical attraction stuff. And I can’t lie, I probably would have done the same if I met the perfect woman but she was fat or just not physically attractive.
I used to think the LL was a bit crazy because the agonizing and long recovery, the chances of complications or lifelong pain, but even taking away all the other height neurosis fixing benefits and social benefits, it feels like the better dating prospects alone justify why men like myself want to do it. I’d kill to be tall enough where it wasn’t a problem lol.
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I know exactly what you mean about needing to be perfect. Ready to fix the situation because the advise many give online that you just need to "change your mentality and get some confidence" is complete BS and shorter men who say this are just coping. "Im 5'3 and pull girls all day because of my confidence" - no, you do not. And theres a big difference between being used as a tool and locking a girl down. Many of these men dont understand this until they hit their 30's.
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I know exactly what you mean about needing to be perfect. Ready to fix the situation because the advise many give online that you just need to "change your mentality and get some confidence" is complete BS and shorter men who say this are just coping. "Im 5'3 and pull girls all day because of my confidence" - no, you do not. And theres a big difference between being used as a tool and locking a girl down. Many of these men dont understand this until they hit their 30's.
But you are not 5'3. You are 5'7 which is a completely different reality dating wise. I agree with you about very short men coping but again, you are not a very short man
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For dating, I still see a small problem. I am just sort of thinking let's say someone gets internals for femurs and tibias and then gets tattoos on them to conceal them and then goes on a date
The problem is that some of the scars will be somewhat raised (I have some small linear scars that sort of like have a small raised bump under them) and someone on a date could feel that bump
What would you say if someone felt that bump under the scar/tattoo?
Frankly, I don't think anything short of being noticeably crippled/deformed or having cartoonish/uncanny-valley level of proportions would come close to offsetting the advantages of being taller in terms of attractiveness. Physical attraction is not a choice, and if a woman would not have been physically attracted to you pre-CLL, but is attracted to taller post-CLL you, her finding out that you got life altering surgery to fix an insecurity and having a lowered opinion of you for it is just the cost of doing business. If you literally weren't in the game before, but are after CLL, you're still be better off no matter how disgusted she might be by your choices/insecurities. If you're getting serious with a woman post-CLL, and she starts asking questions, the better choice is to just be honest about it and take the hit, since dishonesty/deception is far less attractive than the stigma of admitting you got CLL.
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Good points
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For dating, I still see a small problem. I am just sort of thinking let's say someone gets internals for femurs and tibias and then gets tattoos on them to conceal them and then goes on a date
The problem is that some of the scars will be somewhat raised (I have some small linear scars that sort of like have a small raised bump under them) and someone on a date could feel that bump
What would you say if someone felt that bump under the scar/tattoo?
You're basically asking what to say if you're scars are noticed for a bump or whatever reason even if you're trying to use tattoos to hide them. Most women won't ask unless an ltr. You don't want to tell them LL or you wouldn't have bothered with the tattoos. Perhaps, bow leg correction or some other corrective surgery or car accident or some sort of trauma.
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You're basically asking what to say if you're scars are noticed for a bump or whatever reason even if you're trying to use tattoos to hide them. Most women won't ask unless an ltr. You don't want to tell them LL or you wouldn't have bothered with the tattoos. Perhaps, bow leg correction or some other corrective surgery or car accident or some sort of trauma.
I would agree that a short-term partner doesn't need to know that you got LL, but IMO it would be a mistake to lie to a woman in a LTR about something so significant. Either she'll eventually find out, or you'll be hiding it for the rest of your life. Women are so used to being lied to by men trying to impress them that being branded a liar could poke permanent holes in the foundation of the relationship, so its probably better to simply avoid the question and just say it was from surgery and you don't want to talk about it until you're ready to tell them. It'd be far worse for her to find out after marrying you and realizing down the line that your kids probably won't be as tall as you lol.
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Do any of you post-LL guys have anecdotes of specific ways you've noticed your new height help you with women? I think we all know that an increase height has an obvious positive impact, but I'm sure it'd be reassuring for those of us considering it to hear specific accounts of how you've noticed the way women treat you before/after.
I think its clear that growing taller won't necessarily help you if you have poor game as it is, but for someone like myself who is 5'6 and has moderate success with attractive women, it'd be nice to hear about ways you've noticed women treat you before vs. after, particularly if your post-LL height puts you in the average to tall range where we'd expect to see the most significant improvements.
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I agree with you on being transparent.
One thing Ill say though is if your wife is close to your old height your kids will actually be close to your new height unless you lengthened an incredible amount. For instance Im 5'7 and after the procedure will be around 5'9-5'10. Kids with a 5'7 woman and 5'7 man means your sons would be 5'10 per the predictive calculators. Obviously its a range, but your kids are not going to be shockingly short to your partner just because you had this procedure. So just dont have kids with a short woman and it wont be an issue (how the tables turn).
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Do any of you post-LL guys have anecdotes of specific ways you've noticed your new height help you with women? I think we all know that an increase height has an obvious positive impact, but I'm sure it'd be reassuring for those of us considering it to hear specific accounts of how you've noticed the way women treat you before/after.
I think its clear that growing taller won't necessarily help you if you have poor game as it is, but for someone like myself who is 5'6 and has moderate success with attractive women, it'd be nice to hear about ways you've noticed women treat you before vs. after, particularly if your post-LL height puts you in the average to tall range where we'd expect to see the most significant improvements.
I think if you’re not attractive through other qualities like your face, body, personality, status or money, then adding three inches will have a marginal effect. adding 3 inches to anyone would not automatically make them a chick magnet, you need to have other things going for you especially the face. But the shorter you are the more of a positive effect this surgery would have on you, the closer you are to average height or taller the more other things start to matter.
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I think if you’re not attractive through other qualities like your face, body, personality, status or money, then adding three inches will have a marginal effect. adding 3 inches to anyone would not automatically make them a chick magnet, you need to have other things going for you especially the face. But the shorter you are the more of a positive effect this surgery would have on you, the closer you are to average height or taller the more other things start to matter.
Again, I think most conscientious people understand that being taller will not suddenly turn them into Brad Pitt. If they weren’t a social butterfly before, and had little going for them in other areas, height won’t make a big difference. I have plenty of taller friends who are unsuccessful with women, and their height does not make a difference. At the same time, there is no question though that height matters a LOT in terms of whether attractive women will even be receptive to you to begin with.
What I’m speaking to is those men who feel that height was the biggest thing limiting them in relationships, and feel that the increased height has enhanced their lives in that area. In my case, I have a good face, I’m athletic, have good social skills, high social status amongst my peers, a great career, and am effective at attracting women who are receptive to me. I have, however, felt like I've reached a point of diminishing returns, finding that my height is precluding me from having as many options with women, and believe I would only see modest gains from broadening my social appeal, making a bit more money, or improving my fitness. Short of becoming famous, wildly successful, or taller, I don’t think there is much more I can do to improve in that department to improve my results. I have had many courtships in my life end due to women telling me that I am not tall enough for them, and many more where the woman was ambivalent and going back and forth because they enjoyed our time together, but weren't physically attracted enough to me to continue long-term.
I’d like to hear from men who had similar experiences and underwent LL. Do you notice more women looking at you in public settings? Do women approach you more? Do they string you along less? Do you feel like you have more wiggle room for mistakes in dating? Do you get more 2nd and 3rd dates, and get ghosted less often? etc.
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Again, I think most conscientious people understand that being taller will not suddenly turn them into Brad Pitt. If they weren’t a social butterfly before, and had little going for them in other areas, height won’t make a big difference. I have plenty of taller friends who are unsuccessful with women, and their height does not make a difference. At the same time, there is no question though that height matters a LOT in terms of whether attractive women will even be receptive to you to begin with.
What I’m speaking to is those men who feel that height was the biggest thing limiting them in relationships, and feel that the increased height has enhanced their lives in that area. In my case, I have a good face, I’m athletic, have good social skills, high social status amongst my peers, a great career, and am effective at attracting women who are receptive to me. I have, however, felt like I've reached a point of diminishing returns, finding that my height is precluding me from having as many options with women, and believe I would only see modest gains from broadening my social appeal, making a bit more money, or improving my fitness. Short of becoming famous, wildly successful, or taller, I don’t think there is much more I can do to improve in that department to improve my results. I have had many courtships in my life end due to women telling me that I am not tall enough for them, and many more where the woman was ambivalent and going back and forth because they enjoyed our time together, but weren't physically attracted enough to me to continue long-term.
I’d like to hear from men who had similar experiences and underwent LL. Do you notice more women looking at you in public settings? Do women approach you more? Do they string you along less? Do you feel like you have more wiggle room for mistakes in dating? Do you get more 2nd and 3rd dates, and get ghosted less often? etc.
I agree with you 100%. A lot of people who do LL say height is what’s usually holding them back or still on their minds even if they got their life together. I remember reading through people’s diaries a few years ago and most said they did have a good boost in confidence, being treated normally or better, and having better luck with women.
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As long as you're tall, women will overlook any other bad trait. A man can be unemployed, out of shape, unkept, etc, etc. As long as he is tall, she'll chase him. Height is literally the ticket to get in. If you're short, your money, looks , personality, jester-maxing, and "status" won't matter. Sure it will help, but at the end of the day she's always going to say..."but he's short."
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As long as you're tall, women will overlook any other bad trait. A man can be unemployed, out of shape, unkept, etc, etc. As long as he is tall, she'll chase him. Height is literally the ticket to get in. If you're short, your money, looks , personality, jester-maxing, and "status" won't matter. Sure it will help, but at the end of the day she's always going to say..."but he's short."
Well that depends on your definition of tall. 6’0 is almost considered the bare minimum for many women. I think 6’3 is the number where your height can outweigh any other failos you have. Guy on this forum are usually around the shorter end and rarely do you see guys above 6’0 getting this. I don’t think anyone will achieve a height here that makes women completely overlook their other traits. Remember 6’0 is the bare minimum for a lot of women in 2022. I have to do jestermaxxing, gymmaxxing and lifts at 5’8 to have a chance
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Well that depends on your definition of tall. 6’0 is almost considered the bare minimum for many women. I think 6’3 is the number where your height can outweigh any other failos you have. Guy on this forum are usually around the shorter end and rarely do you see guys above 6’0 getting this. I don’t think anyone will achieve a height here that makes women completely overlook their other traits. Remember 6’0 is the bare minimum for a lot of women in 2022. I have to do jestermaxxing, gymmaxxing and lifts at 5’8 to have a chance
How did your dating life go though? It's better than being 5'5 though.
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How did your dating life go though? It's better than being 5'5 though.
I highly advise you to not take that user or the one above seriously. The toxicity is astounding. As a 5'7 guy I can tell you that at my height dating is fine. I might not get every girl I want (but who does really) but I am not being discarded automatically for being too short by the vast majority of girls and I only rarely got "you are too short" type of comments.
Some users here are either fake or completely lost mentally and only using this forum to vent so you should't take what they say to heart
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It's better than being 5'5 though.
You say this as a 5'2 guy?
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You say this as a 5'2 guy?
Stop trolling or I will call Leon Edwards for you 🤣
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6'0 is absolutely not the bare minimum for women no matter what they say or their filters on dating apps. Its a stupid app trend thats not going to last. Why? Because its physically impossible for them to all be with men over 6 feet tall. Theres very few men over that height. So either they cave on that "requirement" or they will literally all be single their entire lives.
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Dating apps are 60-90% men so women on them can be extremely picky.
Want to meet a nice girl? Do it in person.
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While I think having a defeatist attitude is not helpful at all, I do think that height is a tremendous hurdle to overcome in dating, and even some of us tend to underestimate it. I remember watching a special on ABC where a panel of women were asked to pick the man they’d most like to date out of a lineup of guys of various heights. They were told that the 5’11-6’2 guys had mediocre jobs, and that the 5’0-5’6 guys were surgeons, venture capitalists, chiefs of staff at a hospital, while on the side publishing best sellers, were champion skiers, and also gourmet chefs who were great with children. Despite that, nearly all of the women always chose the taller guys as the one they’d want to date. Even after piling on these insane credentials, none of them picked the 5’0 guy (in fact, they basically just mocked him), only one picked the 5’3 guy, the 5’6 guy was picked by half the women. But even when they thought he was a millionaire surgeon with tons of accomplishments, some women STILL chose the 6 foot plus gym teacher over him. When asked what it would take to make the 5’0 guy attractive to them, the women literally answered that the only way they’d choose him was if the rest of the lineup were murderers and rapists. It was messed up lol.
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You say this as a 5'2 guy?
Yes. 5'5 is better than being 5'2. Not sure what you want from me lol
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I agree that height matters, I'm just saying that theres not a 6'0 cutoff like all guys online seem to be saying. Thats actually impossible. No women would have boyfriends. There is however a cutoff at much shorter heights.
Being over 6'0 is like a girl with great tits. Most women dont have great tits and well date them without them but its a bonus if they do have them.
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I agree that height matters, I'm just saying that theres not a 6'0 cutoff like all guys online seem to be saying. Thats actually impossible. No women would have boyfriends. There is however a cutoff at much shorter heights.
Being over 6'0 is like a girl with great tits. Most women dont have great tits and well date them without them but its a bonus if they do have them.
To be honest, being short is more of a negative than being tall is a positive. This is why LL going from short to average has much better responses.
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I think the biggest impact CLL could have in terms of dating options would be the jump from 5’2-5’4 to 5’5-5’7, since it would more than double the amount of women shorter than you, and anecdotally I’ve found that 5’3-5’5 women are a lot less picky about height than 4’11-5’2 women. I think the stigma of being really short hurts men tremendously, and I feel I would not have nearly the same dating success if I were 2 inches shorter than I am.
Jumping from 5’5-5’7 to 5’8-5’10 is where I’d assume you’d see the largest jump in terms of options among attractive women. I’ve found that most attractive women with options have an internalized minimum height for a guy to be taller than them in heels, and I imagine being closer to average height really makes a massive difference.
Hitting that 5’11-6’1 mark IMO would be the point where your height suddenly becomes a pretty big plus, and 90%+ of women will be attracted to your height alone. Of course, if you’re unattractive in other ways, and don’t know how to talk to women, it won’t matter in the least, but being tall is enough to make women look past some minor flaws. I’ve heard a phrase before that every inch above 6 feet is a free red flag a guy can get away with, and I think there’s some truth in that.
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While I think having a defeatist attitude is not helpful at all, I do think that height is a tremendous hurdle to overcome in dating, and even some of us tend to underestimate it. I remember watching a special on ABC where a panel of women were asked to pick the man they’d most like to date out of a lineup of guys of various heights. They were told that the 5’11-6’2 guys had mediocre jobs, and that the 5’0-5’6 guys were surgeons, venture capitalists, chiefs of staff at a hospital, while on the side publishing best sellers, were champion skiers, and also gourmet chefs who were great with children. Despite that, nearly all of the women always chose the taller guys as the one they’d want to date. Even after piling on these insane credentials, none of them picked the 5’0 guy (in fact, they basically just mocked him), only one picked the 5’3 guy, the 5’6 guy was picked by half the women. But even when they thought he was a millionaire surgeon with tons of accomplishments, some women STILL chose the 6 foot plus gym teacher over him. When asked what it would take to make the 5’0 guy attractive to them, the women literally answered that the only way they’d choose him was if the rest of the lineup were murderers and rapists. It was messed up lol.
Listen, these women are morons.. Imagine if this was done on women.. I would put women who are fat, ugly, no hair and last but not the least short etc..It would have been considered outrageous to even do such an experiment..
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Exactly
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Frankly, it doesn’t matter where you rank women. Men put out the invitation, and women are ultimately the ones who decide whether they go out with you and decide whether sex is on the table. The choice you are left with is deciding which of these women you commit to.
Women aren’t stupid for aiming for the most attractive partner they can find, it just means they have to wait longer and slowly lower their standards until they hit a match. Most women prefer tall guys, but scarcity means most women can’t lock down a tall guy, and will eventually have to settle. Try setting your dating app preferences to older women, and you’ll find that they are typically way less picky when it comes to height, presumably for this reason.
The real question is, do you want to wait until an attractive women settles for you? I don’t know about y’all, but I don’t want to be with someone who feels like they could’ve done better.
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Frankly, it doesn’t matter where you rank women. Men put out the invitation, and women are ultimately the ones who decide whether they go out with you and decide whether sxx is on the table. The choice you are left with is deciding which of these women you commit to.
Women aren’t stupid for aiming for the most attractive partner they can find, it just means they have to wait longer and slowly lower their standards until they hit a match. Most women prefer tall guys, but scarcity means most women can’t lock down a tall guy, and will eventually have to settle. Try setting your dating app preferences to older women, and you’ll find that they are typically way less picky when it comes to height, presumably for this reason.
The real question is, do you want to wait until an attractive women settles for you? I don’t know about y’all, but I don’t want to be with someone who feels like they could’ve done better.
You make a fair point..The younger the woman, the more superficial she is
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I meet girls in person and have plenty of options @ 5'8. Did not have much success with good looking girls online.
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How did your dating life go though? It's better than being 5'5 though.
My dating life is much better now compared to before. But it’s not just the height I have to have a low body fat so that my face looks better and have a good physique. 5’8 won’t destroy you if you have other things to save you. Although if I were 6’0 I’d have an exponentially easier time.
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I highly advise you to not take that user or the one above seriously. The toxicity is astounding. As a 5'7 guy I can tell you that at my height dating is fine. I might not get every girl I want (but who does really) but I am not being discarded automatically for being too short by the vast majority of girls and I only rarely got "you are too short" type of comments.
Some users here are either fake or completely lost mentally and only using this forum to vent so you should't take what they say to heart
Ok bro but how old are you? When you’re in your early 20s like me women have an abundance of options and no real reason to settle with someone who doesn’t meet every criteria they have. Again I’m talking about conventionally attractive women. Once they get older they will lower their standards as they could not find the guy who met all their specifics. At 21 I find that even at 5’8 I still have to work really hard to compete with the tall guys. And if I do get dates it’s because I was able to compensate for being short where the tall guy just has to not hinder his already set “attractiveness”
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Is there really any question? Numerous journals have shown that height in male is correlated with dating success and attractiveness, perhaps up to an absurd height, otherwise its always better to be taller. 5'5 to 5'7 is a huge difference. You go from being taller than perhaps half to taller than most women. That is pretty significant.
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Height matters until you get to 5'9/5'10. Then the benefits diminish extremely fast. Taller beyond that becomes a bonus rather than a qualifier and other attributes you have start to matter more.
Example (all else being equal):
A woman might take a man with average salary at a height of 5'9 over a rich man with a height of 5'5.
But theres a good chance a woman would take a rich 5'9 man over an average wage 6'1 guy.
Both are 4 inch differences but the scenarios play out differently.
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Most girls don’t want to date someone shorter than themselves. At the same time, facial features, lower body fat, success, personality, chemistry, style and many other things matter.
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** I made this a post on its own as well:
I'll just put my 2 cents in (more like 20 cents). I have been to bars and clubs quite often, also at on college campus parties. I had no trouble finding women and was known as the guy who slept around the most. (I'm 5'8 3/4, not quite 5'9). Here's the thing though. Most of the girls I slept with were actually very hard to get in my opinion, and the only reason I slept around was because I didn't find any quality ones to stay with me. I always considered myself to have a very good personality, very funny, and had a lot of "game" (good vibes, etc) to bring them home, which in many cases still didn't work out even after bringing them home. IMO your "vibe" as a short man is everything. As soon as that "vibe" is off it's like you jog their memory to the real problem. OP you talked about feeling manipulative, it's because you are constantly changing scene, changing this and that to keep her entertained to avoid the truth of your height. It's NOT in your head. It's in your head as in when the memory gets jogged and when the knowledge of your height becomes known to both of you intuitively when things are slow, is when she'll break it off or you will knowing its over anyways. Do yourself and the world a favor by getting the surgery because being manipulative sucks and screws everyone over, and LOTS of short guys with both women and work making short men very hard to be around.
More useful info. Many short men that comment on getting tons of girls are actually talking about their youth prior to university where personality and looks was more important than height or are just lying in general. Confidence and height weigh heavier than looks and personality after high school. Confidence weighs over personality, and height weighs over looks. I see confidence without personality being the result of height taking priority over other things. Confidence with personality would be like Vera from Mr. Robot for reference or Homelander (The boys), or Ragnar from Vikings. Height without personality would be like Chris Evans, and lots of other "basic" men who are just there for looks/height. Doesn't mean personality and looks aren't important but are lessened in their degree. My highschool girlfriend was hot even with me being super insecure in general and I had tons of girls low key like me who could have been (a couple would have if they had the money) been supermodels. I was more shy than anything, it didn't have anything to do with height at the time we broke up (Which was in first year university). University I had a couple dates where the girls were very attractive, and probably could have kept them if I wasn't so stressed out and anxiety ridden from low sleep, and low social activity from university (had a very technical degree, not something like business). I see this every once in awhile where short guys have very good looking, good women, that are supportive, feminine, etc, but the guys have a bit of a chip on their shoulder and have a strong "center" that is difficult to penetrate due to the fact that they've learned to do this. If the girl eventually leaves it is hard to swallow for the guy because there is no improvement that can be made on his part.
Confidence will always trump everything else after high school, for a time, but imo it is height and other things maintain the confidence, and confidence without the others will end up weighing higher on the manipulative side. When my confidence is really high I get the same looks as a 6'2 guy, but like I said before this is difficult and can become almost manipulative to maintain. I spend most of my time inside away from women now (burned out from clubs, friends aren't in the area anymore, not getting good results, etc), and have had very attractive women even in higher 20's give strong messages to come and talk to them (in situations outside of clubs), even one who said she likes 6' guys prior to trying to get my attention (i'm still pretty shy/low confidence so I can't follow through on these situations), but the more charisma you have being short the harder the blow when you get turned down for a 6' Chris Evans (I don't really know Chris Evans but he seems like a plug from the couple of quick interview portions I have seen).
Where height really comes in is in high competition situations, where society is heading right now. Never, ever, regardless of confidence, will you be able to go on something like the Bachelorette, or compete in high class bars, go to high class work suppers (I'm talking Google, Apple, etc, not commonplace work suppers), without being at least 5'10.5. If you even do manage to sway these situations in your favor you will become an idol or icon for all other short men and people in general, and held to an even higher status to lead with and will be seen less human and more godly, where people will "use" you for your amazing vibes, thinking a god must not have human qualities so it's okay that your desires aren't taken into account. This is why I said short men are manipulative and have to change scenes often to avoid these situations.
Lastly, I have seen the charts where men say, "if you are on inch shorter on this graph you will have half the opportunities with women, so sad, poor men!" No you will have 1/10 the opportunities each inch you go down, and the fact that women have to settle eventually gives you the "half" number that they came up with. It's way worse than they initially tried to make it sound. The chart makes it sound like if you were to go on a Bachelorette where there was equal men and women you have a 50% lower chance of getting the hottest woman on the show than the guy an inch taller taller than you. No you will never get the hottest one. Put yourself on the same type of show 50 times and you will never get the hottest one, but you will still end up with one as that's the way things have to go. Add to the fact that the one you ended up with you already saw trying to bang the other men and probably disrespected you to your face 50 times before she ended up with you and you are left with a relationship that was broken from the start, and she may still cheat on you still. The communication in the relationship will be horrible with your thoughts not taken into account because she if she took them into account she will have to admit that you were her last choice, and she will grow to ignore your feelings to avoid having to talk about the truth. So, just get leg lengthening. Unless you are a person who say's "LOL $100,000! That could have paid for a lot of therapy!" then you deserve a better life, especially at 5'6 where your situation is much worse than mine. If you are a person that says that then you're too stupid to even begin to rationalize with, and everything you get is more than you deserve so be happy with what you have.
I am 5'8.5. This height is not called short on the internet but it is short in real life, just look around you. End of high school I was 5'6, but had a growth spurt in university. A lot of this information is for guys below my height realistically, but I still have dealt with these aspects to a smaller scale than many of you, which is still enough to want the surgery.
More points for getting Leg Lengthening:
- Height is measurable and obvious, if a girl has struck out on love and is just looking to avoid conflict instead of pursue true love anymore she will pick a 6' guy, as life has become more of a "checkbox" at this point in her life and your good personality is not measureable so what checkbox can she simply "check-off". You say you don't want this girl because she's not worth your time? Maybe she had bad times like you do and is settling now and could've been a good partner. Regardless however you struck out from height, and her personality is not utilized and neither is yours. Lose-Lose situation for both of you.
- When in a situation with lazy or "base" people, height will always be the obvious factor because it's measureable like I mentioned and takes no effort to notice. So if you are around low quality people and short it's actually 10x worse for you than being around high quality people. Now take the fact that most "high quality" people in society are considered tall. You are now in a bad cycle. You may, as a short man, decide to change your friend group to be around "lower quality" people as you don't fit in the with the "higher quality" types, but this actually 10 folded your initial problem.
-If you have a good personality and are around high competition where they are taller and not interesting, when they see your personality is superior they can all unconsciously change the topic to something more "base" so that all of you have equal weight because there is nothing to allow your personality to show in the first place. This will allow height to become a more prominent factor and the "winner" is a lame tall guy, who will then get the girl, respect, money, whatever, thereby increasing their confidence further, to the point where they may even develop a personality because they have so many options and situations to learn from. More options = more confidence. Like I said before confidence as you get older is more important than personality, which is why this tactic works SOO well for the tall guy. Note this is unconcious or subconcious behaviour so it's no use trying to call it out. The more success they gain doing this the more unconcious it becomes and you won't have the momentum from your own personal wins to stop this. Just get leg lengthening and they won't be able to do it.
- Take a look at severely stressed out and suicidal men. Are they usually tall? Or are they usually short? I have noticed a much larger trend on towards short. Even if they aren't suicidal they are usually very very hardworking for little pay and respect. Actors especially you can see this trend. Look at Mac Miller when Ariane Grande went for Pete Davidson, or Kanye in the same situation. Pete Davidson is probably cool in reality but both guys happened to be short. Both of these guys influenced a lot of people with their music and for what? Mac is gone, and Kanye is crying 24/7.
- Being short is the one "handicap" where life does not give you any pity. All other handicaps do, whether it be weight, depression, etc. Note also if you have weight or depression, if you combine that with being short, the short will trump the others leaving you pitiless. You may say "I don't want others pitying me!" Well when you have the host of problems aforementioned you may wish that you didn't have to work as hard and be given some slack. The only way you will get pity is if you legally are entitled to it, such as an accident, even then they may still resent having to give you money.
- Going through tough times makes you stronger, but only to a certain degree, after too much you will start to break down mentally as your strength did not yield results. IMO working to pay for your surgery and going through the pain of surgery, combined with previous pains in your life being short, means you deserve this break, take it for yourself, it's a gift from man to man to have this surgery available, don't be ungrateful or fall victim to the Stockholm syndrome of being short, which people engage by saying it's all in your head, love who you are, spend $100,000 on therapy so they can tell you that you should stay the same and changing means you are ungrateful, until you finally break, leading to further health problems. There was an experiment put on by the government (Simpletons leave now if you even made it this far) where they fed a person LSD in his water to see if they could eventually control him into doing whatever they say. As he started getting paranoid from the drugs he began asking them questions why he felt this way and they kept telling him there is nothing wrong with you it's all in your head. They continued feeding him the drug in his water until he felt hopeless and completely insane, and jumped out a window because he thought he was going insane. The solution to this problem was to remove the LSD from his drink, but the answer was not given to the patient for the fear of losing control of him, and because they really didn't care as they were focused on the experiment. This was the MK ultra experiment. A similar experiment could be done if the subject had been decreased and increased in height +/- 4 inches and forced to be confident in society. For the project to be successful in breaking the patient you would have to convince the short man through therapy sessions that the problem was all in his head. If he began to believe that height was the issue he would be less controllable and the experiment would be a failure. Of course the results wouldn't be as drastic but the point is that the solution is not more focus on your mind as this will compound the problem because it's not the true issue at hand. You also will not be given truthful information from others appearing to help in your LL journey. Even your own family may not support this regardless of the information you give them on the safety of the procedure because nobody likes a lack of control, even loved ones.
- In my experience as working in a high intelligence field of work. It's the extra 10% of benefits and hard work that result in successes. If you want to take away the 10% help you get go ahead, but you will become burned out and say to yourself "I could have done more". No you could not have. Like I said I worked with the top intelligences in university and we were all slightly smarter than the rest initially, where we had further successes in tests, eventually compounding to larger things allowing us to be more intelligent. If you do manage to avoid burnout in your quest to make it as a short man, go ahead, but make sure you've done your homework first.
- Women will always say it's not that they care about the height of the man, it's that the man cares. Women often say they don't even realize they do " tests" where they put the man in a position just to test him and see how he will respond. They often don't realize how they subtly react to a short man they are with, so they say it was all the man and they truly believe it. Just like they don't know they do tests. So because this is unconscious behaviour on their part don't both bringing attention to it when they stare at someone taller or laugh harder at their jokes are whatever when they are with you, they will always deny it, mainly because it's easier, which is fair but it's another reason for you to get LL.
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Being taller will increase the quantity of women who would consider to date you but not the quality.
I disagree with you. Quality for me is a mix of women's looks and personality. That’s awesome that you scored a really attractive girl, but in my experience very beautiful women are a lot more strict on requiring a tall man. I would agree you can find a lovely woman at your height but it’s probably not going to be more than a 7 (maybe 8). Of course this is just anecdote versus anecdote so…
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in this thread:
redpilled average looksmaxxers vs coping bluepillers
a match not made in heaven, as both sides will never see the other's point of view