Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Patients Experiences => Topic started by: vetpat on December 31, 2015, 11:40:10 AM
-
Good night guys,
Soon it'll be NYE and I guess many of you think about improving your lives doing a limb lengthening surgery next year.
I did surgery ˜5 years ago and I must say it was a great decision. Guess some of you might have some questions/doubts about Mitkovic's method and I'll be happy to answer and discuss.
Happy new year guys!
-
Hi
1.How much did you lengthen? Before/after height?
2.What about your scars?
3.Do you think you recovered absolutely %100 or having any minor issues?
4.How is your runing speed right now?
5.And some info about your proportions would be great. Thanks!
-
1. I did 5.5cm. I'm 5'7 right now.
2. None of my friends noticed. Maybe because they don't stare at my legs or maybe it is because my legs are a little hairy. I might post pictures in the future.
3. I do think I recovered 99%. Nothing noticeable to complain.
4. I can run and do squats at the gym with heavy weights (˜200lbs)
5. I didn't stretch much so I guess my proportions are okay.
-
Hi there,
How about misalignment? Have you experienced any?
When did you start walking? Can you wear the device under your pants?
Speaking about proportions, what do you mean you didn't stretch much?
Happy New Year!
-
How did your quality of life in terms of job situation/women/social activities change after adding the 2 inches ?
-
Hi there,
How about misalignment? Have you experienced any?
When did you start walking? Can you wear the device under your pants?
Speaking about proportions, what do you mean you didn't stretch much?
Happy New Year!
No misalignment in my case. I guess it is more likely for heavy weight patients.
You can wear the device under your pants but it is visible. Not as much as the Illizarov method of course.
4 months after surgery I was walking in crutches. Took me 6 months to walk without crutches. You lose a lot of muscle in your legs so it can take a couple months more. Can't remember how long it took me for feeling confident about walking, climbing stairs, etc but I would guess a year to return to normal life (but not sports).
Most patients try to stretch as much as possible. They usually aim for 7.5cm. I recommend something between 5cm to 6cm for maintaining proportions and physical abilities. Not to say faster recovery and less risk of complications.
-
How did your quality of life in terms of job situation/women/social activities change after adding the 2 inches ?
Interesting question.
It really improves your life. Staying "hidden" for a year is not easy but adding 2 inches to your height makes a lot of difference. I continue to be short at 5'7 but taller than most women around the world and not much below average. It all depends of your environment. If you live in Netherlands, 5'7 will be quite below average height. If you go to Vietnam, you'll feel above average.
Still feel short but can't describe how better I feel. A single word to describe is improvement. 1 year procedure to improve your life for a...lifetime. I highly recommend limb lengthening.
Dr. Mitkovic's is an experienced doctor and if you plan to do tibias I would say his method is much better than the Illizarov since pins doesn't go through muscle and the external device is much smaller. As for femurs, I would say look for internal method with another doctor like Betz or Guichet. I've seen two patients having a bad time. Maybe because they did both tibias and femurs at the same time. Having pins cutting through your muscles is painful and will leave you with nasty scars.
-
That´s nice to hear! Some pictures of your current proportions would be very helpful.
How long did you have to wear the monorails?
Edit:
May I ask for your age?
-
Here's a pic:
(https://i.imgur.com/qdpCEQ9.jpg)
This pic is a few years old so the scars are a little less visible.
Can't remember exactly how long I used the monorails but it was something like 7 months.
I am on my mid 30'.
-
Hi vetpat,
Thanks for the AMA.
1. How's Nis or Serbia in general?
2. How's the quality of the hospital?
Thanks,
Tiny
-
Here's a pic:
(https://i.imgur.com/qdpCEQ9.jpg)
This pic is a few years old so the scars are a little less visible.
Can't remember exactly how long I used the monorails but it was something like 7 months.
I am on my mid 30'.
Your proportions look OK but I think it was the right call to stop at a 2 inch gain.
-
Your tibias look a bit long imo, but not to a point where it is noticable to someone who doesn´t know about LL. I have to say that you look a lot taller than 5´7, If I didn´t know I´d estimate your height to be around 6´1.
-
Dr. Mitkovic is a good option for me personally. I am from Sofia, Bulgaria, which is only around 100 miles away from Nis, meaning I don't have to rent an apartment and hire people to take care of me. Moreover, Bulgarian is really close to Serbian so I would have no problems communicating with Dr. and with his staff. I wish he offered internal femurs...I am looking to gain at least 6 cm, preferably 7.5 , and doing 6-7.5 tibs makes little sense apart from the financial perspective.
-
I don't think anything is wrong with your proportions, actually looks pretty normal to me. But ya you do look much taller in the pic. like Alittletooshort said you look like 6'1.
-
You seriously look MUCH taller than 5'7 in this picture.And great proportions! Im glad you dont regret this and having a better life :)
Btw some people say femurs are better for proportions.I mean you can always hide them with clothes.But for tibias when you wear a short it may be noticeable.What do you think about this and what do you recommend for future LL'ers?
-
Hi vetpat,
Thanks for the AMA.
1. How's Nis or Serbia in general?
2. How's the quality of the hospital?
Thanks,
Tiny
Nis is a small, calm and affordable city. I used to get on my wheelchair and go to a nearest park to meet with other patients to have some drinks. It was nice to hangout with them. Would be better without a wheelchair though.
Don't know how to describe Serbia. Maybe it is like most of the Eastern European countries. They're behind the west economically speaking but the population is quite polite, respectful and sometimes a little serious if they know you're american. Everyone stopped what they were doing to help me out (when they saw me in the wheelchair).
About the hospital... It was okay, nothing to complain. Some patients complained about food but it was...hospital food. Same for hospital staff. If you don't look arrogant nor disrespectful, they're going to be nice.
-
Your proportions look OK but I think it was the right call to stop at a 2 inch gain.
Your tibias look a bit long imo, but not to a point where it is noticable to someone who doesn´t know about LL. I have to say that you look a lot taller than 5´7, If I didn´t know I´d estimate your height to be around 6´1.
I don't think anything is wrong with your proportions, actually looks pretty normal to me. But ya you do look much taller in the pic. like Alittletooshort said you look like 6'1.
I was wearing a small shirt who makes my torso look shorter. I think my proportions look better now than it was before-op. Proportionally speaking, I do look taller than 5'7 but it doesn't matter when I stand next to somebody. A good way to determine if someone is tall, is to look at their arms and head (proportionally to the body). Being slim helps too.
You seriously look MUCH taller than 5'7 in this picture.And great proportions! Im glad you dont regret this and having a better life :)
Btw some people say femurs are better for proportions.I mean you can always hide them with clothes.But for tibias when you wear a short it may be noticeable.What do you think about this and what do you recommend for future LL'ers?
I recommend to start with tibias. It does look much better IMO. Short guys have quite short tibias. Sit next to somebody and compare your knee height so you can have an idea. Mine is normal for somebody from 5'7 to 5'9.
As for scars, for men in general, don't bother. Even in beach/pool only once or twice somebody asked me about it. Since I am fit, one guy asked me if I did martial arts. I told him yes. People can be curious but they'll be weary of asking personal questions.
When my girlfriend ask me about it I just told her it is a long and sad story. That's it. [Sad because I had to do surgery to "fix" my height.]
The best advice I can give to future patients is to not exaggerate. Go to a reasonable target. Don't expect to go from 5'2 to 6'ft. Most guys want to go from extremely short to tall. I know it's not easy since you'll think "oh, I can do a few extra turns and get an extra inch".
-
Dr. Mitkovic is a good option for me personally. I am from Sofia, Bulgaria, which is only around 100 miles away from Nis, meaning I don't have to rent an apartment and hire people to take care of me. Moreover, Bulgarian is really close to Serbian so I would have no problems communicating with Dr. and with his staff. I wish he offered internal femurs...I am looking to gain at least 6 cm, preferably 7.5 , and doing 6-7.5 tibs makes little sense apart from the financial perspective.
I made a friend from Bulgaria while in Serbia. Cool guy!
Aim for 6.5 cm. That's enough. Get a few books and step on it so you get the feel. It does make a difference. If you choose Dr. Mitkovic, go for tibias only.
-
Nice ! was he also doing LL or you just met him randomly in the town ?
-
Nice ! was he also doing LL or you just met him randomly in the town ?
He was also a patient. During your staying, you meet many patients which gives you more confidence about the procedure. They come from all continents, literally. I spoke with many before doing surgery and it is nice to hang out with them during your stay.
-
Hi, thanks for answering all our questions.
What was your weight at the time of surgery?
You said you recovered 99%. But how about you ability to jump, swim, play sports like basketball, football, tennis?
How do you find this method for doing 3 cm only? (I'm trying to avoid any complication and I'm also limited by the proportions)
Any knee problems? Permanent pain?
-
Hi, thanks for answering all our questions.
What was your weight at the time of surgery?
You said you recovered 99%. But how about you ability to jump, swim, play sports like basketball, football, tennis?
How do you find this method for doing 3 cm only? (I'm trying to avoid any complication and I'm also limited by the proportions)
Any knee problems? Permanent pain?
My weight is and was around 150 lbs. I can jump, swim, play any kind sport, lift heavy weights... Even martial arts. When I say 99%, I mean things that I notice but you eventually forget.
-When you crouch, your ankles touch your butt. Not after surgery.
-When you're standing and raise your feet to tie your shoe laces. You have to raise it more.
That's nothing compared to the benefits of getting taller. I can only imagine going from average height to tall.
The device doesn't touch your knee so no problem in that area. I had pain while running but it was because my leg was quite skinny. When I recovered muscle, everything became fine.
Even 1 cm is worth it IMO. If it is your first surgery, aim at 5 cm.
-
It really sucks that Dr Mitkovic doesn't do internals. I mean, as an orthopedic doctor he must have used nails for fractures hundreds of times in addition to his work on limb lengthening.
He has experience on the two skills needed for internal lengthening.
Do you know why he doesn't use a nail like Precice? Do you think, from your personal experience with him, that it may be possible to convince him?
-
I heard that the only machine in Serbia that has the proper equipment for internals is the Vojna Bolnica in Nis, a hospital he's no longer affiliated with.
-
It really sucks that Dr Mitkovic doesn't do internals. I mean, as an orthopedic doctor he must have used nails for fractures hundreds of times in addition to his work on limb lengthening.
He has experience on the two skills needed for internal lengthening.
Do you know why he doesn't use a nail like Precice? Do you think, from your personal experience with him, that it may be possible to convince him?
I guess he doesn't do internals due to:
- Cost: Nails aren't cheap. Extra surgery to remove them. I removed his external device by myself at home.
- Complications: If you get one, externals are much easier to treat.
- Experience: Even his device went thru refinements during the years. His device is SOLID.
My advice is don't bother about Mitkovic's internal device. Even if he appeared with one TODAY, I would advise to use the external since it was successfully tested hundreds of times. This is MEDICAL procedure and you should AVOID ANY RISK you can.
-
Hey again,
I wanted to ask you, since I am thinking right now about going to Dr. Mitkovic next year around this time to gain 5 cm, how much time after you made the initial contact he could operate you. Was there a wait list or sth like that ? Since you do around 5 cm, how much time after the surgery you could work (from the hospital bed on your laptop, for example)
-
What did he charge?
What is the method?
What was the intial, 0,5cm?
-
What do you think of people talking about Mitkovic because of misalignments and poor aftercare?
-
What do you think of people talking crap about Mitkovic because of misalignments and poor aftercare?
Where did you learn about his poor aftercare?
-
Hey again,
I wanted to ask you, since I am thinking right now about going to Dr. Mitkovic next year around this time to gain 5 cm, how much time after you made the initial contact he could operate you. Was there a wait list or sth like that ? Since you do around 5 cm, how much time after the surgery you could work (from the hospital bed on your laptop, for example)
Hey,
Can't remember how long it was. Email him and tell him you plan to travel there to meet him in person AND if you decide to do the procedure, how long it will take to start. I lost a few weeks since I was having problem wiring the money (my bank had problems filling the instructions and the transfer was cancelled 3 times due to currency conversion).
I'm guessing if you're already there, he might get you a schedule in less than 2 weeks but I'm just guessing.
I stayed in hospital for a week. First three days are more critical due to trauma. It took me a month to sleep okay. If you work on your laptop, that's how long I would guess. You might double that just in case. You might feel discomfort during the stretching (mine took 45 days). Then it's much easier since your muscles get more relaxed.
-
What did he charge?
What is the method?
What was the intial, 0,5cm?
Was something like 7 thousand euro at the time.
Method? I did external tibias.
Initial stretch I guess? Don't know but not much since I felt pain when putting the feet on the floor. I guess the bone was touching. I was stretching few mm 6X a day, stopping like 3 or 4 times due to pain. Taking a day without stretching helps to ease the pain.
-
Hey Vetpat,
I have some more obscure general questions:
How did you find about LL? Was it through a community? (I.E: The old forum) How did you find this one and what made you want to share your story?
I'm just curious is all, I don't mean to impose.
-
What do you think of people talking crap about Mitkovic because of misalignments and poor aftercare?
Tough question.
My procedure went fine. Same for many patients I've met. The ones who had more serious problems were:
- One was at home using crutches and had an accident. He fell putting too much pressure in one leg during the fall. It set him back for a few more weeks (or maybe a month) and doctor kept visiting him often, helping to re-align.
- Two patients traveled there to fix problems they've had with an Indian doctor. They were quite bad to start with and decided to fix tibias and do femurs!
Probably there was more complications I'm not aware. Don't take my word for it. If you plan to do the procedure, read all stories, diaries and meet patients in person before going to the operation room.
I'm guessing some misalignment might be due to your legs being a little misaligned to start with. If you look yourself in the mirror, you'll see your tibias aren't perfectly aligned. Stretching might increase that imperfection.
As for the aftercare, don't know what to say. Some patients expect doctor to visit them EVERYDAY for the whole procedure (many months). Doctor is there to do the surgery and give you instructions on how to proceed after. You might call him if you have something serious. Since I had contact with many other patients, they could answer me better. Most were about pains, how to take shower, where to buy a wheelchair, positions to sleep... things like that.
People have different opinions. Like all reviews, pay attention and make your mind. See what makes sense. I could be some Indian hired to post fake reviews praising doctor. Best advice I can give is for you to meet as many patients as possible and see with your own eyes.
-
Hey Vetpat,
I have some more obscure general questions:
How did you find about LL? Was it through a community? (I.E: The old forum) How did you find this one and what made you want to share your story?
I'm just curious is all, I don't mean to impose.
Can't remember exactly to be honest. Maybe a website called shortpeoplesupport. The old forum was useful so I could read the experience directly from patients.
First I knew about procedure. I searched for forums to find more information. Email doctor. Then I traveled to meet him and see patients for myself. If I didn't felt the procedure was safe, I would back off.
A friend of mine told me he still frequents the forum and asked me if I did the same. I told him It was years without visiting. I saw a new one emerged and decided to contribute. This procedure can improve your life and if you have the money, time and will to do it, go for it.
I'll continue to answer questions for all January. Then I'll continue with my life. You forget about LL when the procedure ends and you start enjoying your new height.
-
I'll continue to answer questions for all January. Then I'll continue with my life. You forget about LL when the procedure ends and you start enjoying your new height.
That's maybe the best thing I've heard in this forum in a long time lol. (especially great since I'm also aiming for around 5'7). I'm glad you're at least enjoying life now that's really reassuring.
Has anyone ever told you look leggy or anything like that or any other comments? (I have better questions but it's somewhat late and I'm tired so I'll ask them another day ;D ::)
-
Has anyone ever told you look leggy or anything like that or any other comments? (I have better questions but it's somewhat late and I'm tired so I'll ask them another day ;D ::)
Not really. I got a lot of attention when I was walking in shorts using the device (without crutches). I don't recommend that.
Apart from that, only people curious about the scars. Maybe 5 occasions total.
1 was my girlfriend. Always the same answer "It's a long and sad story".
2 friends of mine (not at the same time); when sitting with my leg crossed with my tibia facing them. - What's that scar? Same reply "It's a long and sad story". That's it. Period.
1 waiter in a club's pool. He asked me if I practiced martial arts.
As for being leggy or something similar, nope. Never. In the old forum, there was an interesting reply to that question.
It is better to look a "little strange" to few people than "very short" to everyone.
I'm not concerned about my proportions because I've seen people my (new) height with the same tibia size. After surgery I used to pay attention when sitting next to people. Later you forget about that.
-
Since you lengthened 5.5 cm, at what point did you feel that the pain started to become really unbearable and did you, for example, at 4 or 4.5 thought that is good enough ? Or alternatively, did you think you could go to 6 or beyond ?
Another thing: In order to minimize loss of muscle when they are inactice, doctors usually suggest the use of quality food supplements, for example protein bars, BCAA amino acids, glutamine, creatine. Have you used any of these ?
-
Back on the leggy comment, do you personally feel like you could lengthen more if you wanted too and if so how much?
-
Since you lengthened 5.5 cm, at what point did you feel that the pain started to become really unbearable and did you, for example, at 4 or 4.5 thought that is good enough ? Or alternatively, did you think you could go to 6 or beyond ?
Another thing: In order to minimize loss of muscle when they are inactice, doctors usually suggest the use of quality food supplements, for example protein bars, BCAA amino acids, glutamine, creatine. Have you used any of these ?
I wouldn't say unbearable but I had problem sleeping during the first month. I'm not used to sleep on my back. Many times during the first month I woke up at night with some pain. I had to sit, wait something like 20min before going back to sleep. Many patients take medication but I advise you against.
After certain mark (can't remember) you feel pain since your muscles are constantly stretched. When you do stretching (ie. in the GYM), you stretch for a minute and stop. The muscle returns to normal to recover. In LL the muscle does not rest. I had to stop twice or thrice due to pain. You stop for a day and return stretching normally the next.
So... You stretch for 45 days (more or less). if you feel pain, stop for a day before continuing. You might get ballerina foot since your muscles are constantly stretched. When you stop lengthening, the pain goes away and everything gets easier since any pain goes away.
For exercise, I recommend you to simply stand up few times a day. I used to pee and wash the dishes while standing. Get a walker and use it at home.
As for target mark, hard to say. Your legs are going to lose a lot of muscle for not exercising so it doesn't matter how good your diet is. Luckily Serbia has a very good diet. Plenty of meat (protein), yogurt (protein and calcium), etc... As for vitamins, I bought only calcium tablets.
Even if you stretch 1cm, you'll think that's enough (proportions wise) because your legs are going to look skinny. I didn't want to push too much and you can always do a second op if you're not happy. Better to do 5+5 than 7+3 or 7+5 proportion/mobility-wise.
-
Back on the leggy comment, do you personally feel like you could lengthen more if you wanted too and if so how much?
As I explained in my previous post.
Most patients stretch to the 7cm mark. But they were already 5'7 to 5'9. I don't regret doing "only" 5.5cm. If I feel like a need more, I'll do a second operation.
Not related, here's a pic from my tibia.
(http://i.imgur.com/OOu3UK1.jpg)
-
You have realy bulky leg. Do you maybe have picture after surgery becuse everyone after surgery lose muscle,mean everyone after surgery have slim legs. Thank you :)
-
My calf got bigger after the procedure and I love it.
CORRECTION:
It took me 90 days to stretch 5.5cm and not 45 as I mentioned in another post. Sorry for the mistake.
-
Do you remember how much wheight you gained from the 5.5cm lengthening? After you've built up your muscles back up to a point that was similar to your pre op level?
-
90 days for 5.5 cm. What about 5 cm ? Is it true that after the 5th cm, it starts getting really slowly ?
-
When you say your calf got bugger after the operation, do you mean it got bigger after you finished distraction or after you finished consolidation. Do you know why it got buligger? Did you exercise them or it just happened?
-
Do you remember how much wheight you gained from the 5.5cm lengthening? After you've built up your muscles back up to a point that was similar to your pre op level?
Doubt the extra weight is significant. Any extra weight could be extra gut in your belly for staying in your wheelchair for months.
-
90 days for 5.5 cm. What about 5 cm ? Is it true that after the 5th cm, it starts getting really slowly ?
If you mean timing, not really. Patients stretch up to 7cm without stopping often. I stopped 2 or 3 times. But going from 5 to 7cm is 40% more distance/time/recovery.
When you say your calf got bugger after the operation, do you mean it got bigger after you finished distraction or after you finished consolidation. Do you know why it got buligger? Did you exercise them or it just happened?
After I finished consolidation (walking without crutches) they became big. It is good since your legs look better. If they were skinny, it'll look disproportionate.
-
You mentioned that you were able to walk at month 5 after surgery. However, you never said how much time after surgery did you have you frames removed ? When you still had the frames, could you keep them below the pants/jeans and walk outside without people noticing ?
-
The frames are too big to not be noticed, I don´ t think that usual pants can be worn above the frames. Usually people wear pants that are quit loose as long as they are in frames.
The Salameh fix can be worn under your pants though.
1,5-2 months is the usual timespan you for every cm lengthened. I´d like to hear Vetpat´s reply too.
-
I am fine wearing some loose paints as long as it still maes sense. I mean it would be obvious but I can always tell I had an accident and need to wear this to help me heal my bones from the break which is technically absolutely true :D
-
I kept the device for 7 months. I was scared to remove the device and have any problem being away from doctor but it was okay since I was walking for many months. And doing the steps to remove the device. It's like the Man in The Iron Mask removing the helmet. A great sensation.
The pins were a little painful (first unscrews). Doing it very slowly was the key. I filmed but lost due to formatting my computer.
I could use the device under jeans (to travel) but clearly noticeable. Same for any pants. You can't hide it.
-
Do you need to somehow lock this device after lengthening?
-
^^
Yes. Otherwise your body weight goes only in the pins. When you lock the device, it gives you an extra point of safety. It's just an extra screw. It's the same one you close to "reset" the device. If you're not familiar, the pin stretch something like 2cm, 3cm max. Then you lock the device, move some part close so you can move the pin to the beginning so you have another 2cm, 3cm to turn. Hard to explain.
There's a process. I lengthen for 3 months and the other 4 was for consolidation. In the last two weeks (aprox.), you unscrew the pin the same way you used to increase height. You lose a few mm from compression. When you see there is no more compression, it mean your bone is strong enough to hold your weight. I was quite scared. I removed the pins and kept the device acting like a fork holding a suspension (suspension=bone). Maybe it wasn't necessary but I was 15hs plane from Serbia and didn't want to take risks.
-
I am leaning towards doing 4 cm. Do you think it is realistic to have the device removed after month 5 ? Or more so after month 6 ?
I decided that since in 3-4 years when I save more money I would do a 2nd surgery, internal femurs, in the longer run there is hardly a difference between doing 4 or 5 now so I decided to go for the lesser evil :)
btw, after the frames were removed, did you experience slight difference lets say 1-2 mm between the two legs and did you also experience some sort of slight contraction, a few mm, things that some Mitkovic patients report to have experienced.
-
^^
You shouldn't count on doing under certain time. If you're athletic, recover fast (I never got an injury going to the gym in my +14 years), have a good diet, doesn't smoke, etc... You might be able BUT, even if you could I would keep the device for as long as possible JUST IN CASE.
If you have 178cm, you might do 5cm, even 6cm without messing your proportions. I don't think you'll gain a lot of benefits going from 6ft to 6'2 IMO. The eventual risks/complications/cost does not compensate an extra surgery. Maybe you live in Netherlands were 6ft is average, then I could be wrong.
I experienced compression (losing a few mm) during the process of removing the device. You don't remove the device at once. As I said in a previous post, you unscrew to release the pin so your bone compresses the callus (consolidation). It's the same process as stretching but the opposite direction. I lost maybe 5mm max. When you unscrew and you notice it doesn't compress further, you know your bone is strong enough to hold your weight. It's a good measure, specially for those patients who push the 7cm to 8cm mark.
About the mm difference in my legs, no, I haven't noticed. I heard you won't notice difference if it is below certain distance. I was concerned about misalignment but it was in my head since people's legs aren't 100% symmetrical. Just look at the mirror. Ask any friend or relative to put his feet together and raise the shorts.
-
Can you give us a brief timeline? If i chose to stay in Serbia for the whole process including removal how long donuou think it would take for 6 cms? Are accomodations and getting a nurse expensive?
Thanks for doing this, I like the way his externals look compared to others?
Oh and how would you rate serbian chicks?
-
Oh and how would you rate serbian chicks?
I can answer to that as well because I live next to Serbia and visited the country many times.
Serbian girls are very hot but I doubt they would be interested in half crippled guys in a wheelchair :D
Further, they dress really nicely and often wear heels for no obvious reason, like when going for groceries :)
With that being said, you can always use tinder and start a chat, telling a girl that you are a tourist in Nis and you had an accident and had to have ur legs taken care of. Btw Nis is a student town with over 10 000 students and most are girls. In Eastern Europe, because of the WW II, generally the male:female rations tends to be around 47:53 and in some countries like Russia/Ukraine that took the biggest hit, as high as high 42:58
-
Let me start with the chicks question:
I guess you can find better answers in anold forum but I can say they look like the typical ex yugo/soviet countries. Decent height (from 5'5 to 5'7 mostly), white, decent breasts size, good ratio for us men (more women than men), friendly and approachable and more importantly, you don't see fatties as you see in US (thank god). Skin not that smooth and many smoke. Above average worldwide speaking. If you come from US you'll love it.
Some patients dated local girls. Being a foreigner is a plus (in 90% of the world anyways). You can pick up girls even in your wheelchair but if you have "game" I advise you to go there a month before operation so you can find a girlfriend who's willing to stay with you during the procedure. Don't be cheap and the relationship should be good for BOTH. Rent a place, pay for everything (groceries, going out, taxi, etc). She'll be dating a cripple for Christ sake.
I've heard funny stories about being in a wheelchair. Car accident, plane accident (LOL), "correction", skydiving (that's my favorite), you name it. The impression I had is that ANYONE knew about it. All the cab drivers knew, people at supermarket (when people help me out to reach something they asked me how my recovery was), waitresses (don't have to be a genius when you see plenty of foreigners all the time normally and then in a wheelchair)... To your new girlfriend you should explain. She'll try to advise you against and think you're an idiot for doing it (they can't understand how a healthy person do it since they don't see height as a problem like us westerners). For everyone just do as me, say it's a long and sad story. People won't bother.
Can't say how prices are since it's been +5 years. I paid 200 euro (+100 euro for expenses like heating, internet, tv, etc) for a 3 bedroom apartment. I spent around a $1000 dollars monthly going out everyday practically. Including bandage changing at hospital many times, cab once or twice a week, etc.
Dollar strengthened against all currencies so I GUESS you might be able to live with a $1000 dollars these days. I recommend you to ask some patient who's there right now to give you updated prices.
As for hospital, you don't need more than a week. RENT AN APARTMENT BEFORE YOU DO OPERATION. You don't want to start looking for places in a wheelchair.
Don't know if you're asking about the device but they're okay. In the beginning they're more visible wearing pants since the bars are way above your knees. Then it's less noticeable. They're heavy but you just notice it when you remove them. I used to keep the device as a memory but threw it away (no point in keeping it). It's great compared to others since there is no pins in your muscles.
For 6 cm I guess you're going to keep the device for the same time as me. 7 months aprox.
-
Thanks for the response man, I'm just joking about the girls. I hate the feeling of someone feeling sorry for me so I wouldn't want a girl friend while I'm in a wheel chair. I would actually rather hire a nurse or caretaker then a Gf. I might hire one of the those university students to teach me a language though.
Now after 7 months were you able to walk or is there a few months of consolidation after getting those removed? Because 7 months sounds reasonable, I've heard around 11 months for ex fix.
-
Would you ever be willing to post a video of sorts showing your recovery or anymore pictures? If not then that's understandable.
Anyways, how was it getting used to having longer legs then what you'd naturally been used to? I.E: any sort of movements or actions that are now ackward or difficult to do. I'm talking about both exercise and day to day life.
When you are laying down do you ever look at your legs and think about whether they are too long?
I'm assuming your Tibia are either equal length to your femurs or possibly greater, how does that dynamic work?
And lastly, do you personally feel, now that you have done 5 CM, that you (getting 3 cm extra in the femurs) or someone else doing 8 CM (say either in one segment or spreading it out into the two) would be too much?
-
Thanks for the response man, I'm just joking about the girls. I hate the feeling of someone feeling sorry for me so I wouldn't want a girl friend while I'm in a wheel chair. I would actually rather hire a nurse or caretaker then a Gf. I might hire one of the those university students to teach me a language though.
Now after 7 months were you able to walk or is there a few months of consolidation after getting those removed? Because 7 months sounds reasonable, I've heard around 11 months for ex fix.
Unfortunately not everyone knows you're going to recover so you see people on the streets feeling sorry for you. I remember going to Merkator (a local shopping) and taking the elevator. When you reach the 2nd floor (I think) there's a cafe and all clients looks at you. I don't know if it is because they know you've done the procedure but It was embarrassing in the beginning. Maybe it was all in my mind since later It was all fine and I used to buy groceries there too. Just carry a backpack in your wheelchair.
IMPORTANT:
You can use Google Translator CROATIAN X YOUR LANGUAGE. If you use SERBIAN, you'll see only Cyrillic. If I knew that I would've learned a lot more.
Ask some nurse if it is possible for her to change your bandages at home. I think you should change it weekly. No funny business. Just to save $.
I was able to walk after 4 months with crutches. I had some ballerina foot so I had to use sneakers to walk. My muscles adapted after without problems so it's just a matter of time. Most patients take a little longer to walk. I used the walker at home everyday (going to the bathroom, washing dishes, etc).
3 months to stretch.
4th month to walk.
7th month to remove the device.
Four months was enough for ME to consolidate. If you lengthen more, do less exercise, have a poorer diet, etc, you might take longer. If in doubt, you can take an X-RAY to see how it goes.
From Alu:
Would you ever be willing to post a video of sorts showing your recovery or anymore pictures? If not then that's understandable.
Anyways, how was it getting used to having longer legs then what you'd naturally been used to? I.E: any sort of movements or actions that are now awkward or difficult to do. I'm talking about both exercise and day to day life.
When you are laying down do you ever look at your legs and think about whether they are too long?
I'm assuming your Tibia are either equal length to your femurs or possibly greater, how does that dynamic work?
And lastly, do you personally feel, now that you have done 5 CM, that you (getting 3 cm extra in the femurs) or someone else doing 8 CM (say either in one segment or spreading it out into the two) would be too much?
I wouldn't mind if I knew how to cover my face in the video.
In the beginning you'll get more conscious about your legs, proportions, etc. I knew I had surgery and I kept a close eye. When you recover muscles it's less noticeable so you won't think about it after. Just came here because a friend told me about it and I thought I could post something to help future patients. Not only for Mitkovic's but for any LL patient.
As I said in a previous post, no loss in movement but when you crouch, you notice your ankles doesn't touch your buttocks anymore. Unless you crouch "differently" (staying in your toes). Anyways, it is bad for your knees so when I have to crouch, I do it like babies (the correct way), with your ankles touching the floor. Same movement when you do squats in the gym (correctly).
At 5'7, I would love to do another 3cm (maybe 4cm) in my femurs if I had the time and patience. I just don't know if it's worth the hassle. When you remove the device after 7 months, you just want to enjoy your new height.
Do I regret not doing more? Not for a second.
Don't know your height but I advise ANYONE to do 2 inches (5cm) in tibia first. If you still feel short, do an extra surgery in the future.
-
Im really glad that your friend told you about this forum.You are very helpful. :)
And it would be awesome if yu can post that video.You can use a mask.If you dont have it maybe use a program to cover your face or my last option is just use sunglasses,hat and a scarf so you will be covered %100
-
Hmm well two options are available: use an editing software that creates blurs (I think Iamready used it at one point before saying fk it). Or the more practical way just get a mask and a hoodie to cover your face (if you go to the gym that might be weird though lol).
Last question: Considering you've already done it, what do you personally feel (again if a person could just simply increase all 4 segments, and not just 2 like most do) is the max one could lengthen without looking to weird? Another way of putting it specifically for you; how much do you think you can lengthen total before your body becomes noticeably weird?
-
Guys if somone want to know how fast is recovery i could sent to him videos that Descreteuser send to me. He send me his consolidation phase for 7 weeks. So if someone want video send me a message :)
-
Hey vetpat, regarding your compression of 5mm. Most recent studies have shown there should be no compression after lengthening and previous studies showing compression were due to error in measurement by the method the researcher used.
For a lengthening of 5.5cm 4 months is incredibly fast for frame removal (I'm surprised your compression was on 5mm considering time frame).
Why did the frame come off so soon?
-
Hey Vetpat you're a saint for answering all these questions. So was it 7 months total and you took them off or an additional 7 after the lengthening?
Also I have heard of rumours of east europeans not liking darker skinned or middle eastern looking ppl. Do you think that would be a problem? Im seriously considering India or South Africa for that reason. I dont know if Serbians are like that but I do know Russians and Ukrainians can be. Did you have any experience with other foreign non white patients?
Thanks man
-
I only have one video doing exercise and It doesn't show my legs properly. I might post one doing squats (with a lot of weight) in the future. Below you can see my calfs aren't that huge.
(http://i.imgur.com/nYvwfE5.jpg) (http://i.imgur.com/urm7NC9.jpg)
From Alu:
Last question: Considering you've already done it, what do you personally feel (again if a person could just simply increase all 4 segments, and not just 2 like most do) is the max one could lengthen without looking to weird? Another way of putting it specifically for you; how much do you think you can lengthen total before your body becomes noticeably weird?
Realistically speaking, most people don't want to go thru a second surgery since the recovery takes too long. Most cosmetic surgeries take a month MAX. I took my device after 7 months. Probably took me a whole year so I felt confident I could run, exercise legs in the gym, etc. When you go back to your life you want to enjoy your new height and recover the time lost (making money for example, going out..).
Most patients prefer to lengthen 7cm and be done with it. Unless you continue short (and not average) I think most will crave a second operation. Losing another year (almost) is not for everyone.
To understand how much you can lengthen, take into account your race and height.
Average speaking:
Whites: short legs
Asians: short limbs.
Blacks: Short torso
If you're male, white or Asian and have 5'9 to start, it's easier for you to lengthen 3 inches without looking disproportionate. Can't say the same for a black man who start with 5'1.
I did 2 inches. I know I'll never be 6ft. Unfortunately some think they can lengthen 6 inches.
It all depends on your initial height and proportions. I think my proportions are better than before operation. Don't know If I would say the same doing a second surgery.
From theuprising:
Hey vetpat, regarding your compression of 5mm. Most recent studies have shown there should be no compression after lengthening and previous studies showing compression were due to error in measurement by the method the researcher used.
For a lengthening of 5.5cm 4 months is incredibly fast for frame removal (I'm surprised your compression was on 5mm considering time frame).
Why did the frame come off so soon?
When I unscrew the lengthening pin, before removing the device (during many days) I noticed compression. I was unscrewing slowly (slower than lengthening) for many days till I noticed the bone was holding my weight. For sure I had compression. Can't say how much but it is something like 3mm. Maybe more. I can't remember exactly.
A theory I have (I could be way wrong): I've heard that compressing increases the recovery even during lengthening. When I walked, the metal bar, being a little flexible, could be creating constant micro compressions during the whole procedure. Maybe my recovery was fast since I walked everyday at home (using the walker) and with crutches after the 4th month.
From kian222:
Hey Vetpat you're a saint for answering all these questions. So was it 7 months total and you took them off or an additional 7 after the lengthening?
Also I have heard of rumours of east europeans not liking darker skinned or middle eastern looking ppl. Do you think that would be a problem? Im seriously considering India or South Africa for that reason. I dont know if Serbians are like that but I do know Russians and Ukrainians can be. Did you have any experience with other foreign non white patients?
Thanks man
7 months total.
I've seen two patients from India and one NY (black). I didn't notice any kind of racism. One of the Indians stayed there for more than a year because he liked it there. I used to hang out with the New Yorker and I haven't noticed racism from locals.
That was way before the "refugee" crisis. Doubt you're going to have problems though.
-
Thanks for the awesome job Vetpat. Its really awesome how you are done with LL, don't have any permanent side effects, and can basically move on with you life as if you never had the procedure. This is like the dream of all prospective LL patients. Its not the money or the long recovery but more the permanent damage that people are afraid of. Do you keep in touch with the two patients you mentioned, did they recover fully as you did ?
-
^^
I still have contact with 3 previous patients thru email (have one on facebook). We never talked about the procedure since e left Nis. But I know they're fine. One is partying a lot recently.
From Facebook pictures, he looks quite fine. Not going to bother them asking though.
-
What's the best way to reach these guys. I haven't got any responses from my emails
-
What's the best way to reach these guys. I haven't got any responses from my emails
What do you mean responses from your emails? Who are you sending emails to?
Most patients don't return to the forum after the procedure since they're just fine but busy. If there is any serious issue, they'll share it here (or the old forum).
-
So considering that it's the end of January, and you did promise to leave by the end of it, I am wondering if you are going to post some exercise vids or more proportions pics. Like I said before, it's fine if you don't want to.
The only reason I'm writing now is to simply thank you for time on the forums and the insight you gave us. I wish you well mate!
-
Sorry for not posting a video doing exercise.
Just came here to say good bye and advise short people to do LL. It was the best decision I made. If you can, don't think twice, DO IT. Be it with Mitkovic or any other reputable doctor. There is plenty of good options these days.
I am passing the torch. I know many future patients will share diaries and stories.
Wish you guys the best!
-
Respect!
-
Sorry for not posting a video doing exercise.
Just came here to say good bye and advise short people to do LL. It was the best decision I made. If you can, don't think twice, DO IT. Be it with Mitkovic or any other reputable doctor. There is plenty of good options these days.
I am passing the torch. I know many future patients will share diaries and stories.
Wish you guys the best!
Thank you :)
-
Wait this doesn't make sense about WWII. The male has an XY chromosome and the female has an XX chromosome. One each is donated to the baby. So even if 90% of the males were killed in WWII the next generation would have a 50% sex ratio. Unless you count 80 year old women into the equation...
I can answer to that as well because I live next to Serbia and visited the country many times.
Serbian girls are very hot but I doubt they would be interested in half crippled guys in a wheelchair :D
Further, they dress really nicely and often wear heels for no obvious reason, like when going for groceries :)
With that being said, you can always use tinder and start a chat, telling a girl that you are a tourist in Nis and you had an accident and had to have ur legs taken care of. Btw Nis is a student town with over 10 000 students and most are girls. In Eastern Europe, because of the WW II, generally the male:female rations tends to be around 47:53 and in some countries like Russia/Ukraine that took the biggest hit, as high as high 42:58