Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Discussions => Topic started by: Microbe on March 19, 2018, 01:34:18 AM
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I'm scheduled to remove my bilateral PRECICE 2 rods in the next several weeks. I won't disclose my doctor, country,age and height.
Frankly I feel absolutely fkn terrified, more so than the initial LL surgery. I guess the reason for this was that I was looking forward to the increase in height and I didn't really mind having the additional surgery to remove the rods, kinda dismissed it. Now the additional surgery/trauma to remove the rods feels nerve racking and making me quite depressed to have this procedure in the first place. Funny how views change over time. Pre-op I felt suicidal over my height and preoccupied with height and now height doesn't really bother me but this whole fukn additional trauma seems like a burden. My atheletic ability has decreased, get pain in my left leg after workouts, long walks or standing. I can't exactly pinpoint where the pain starts but it would gradually increase in intensity after feeling of tightness, despite me being quite flexible to begin with. The pain would affect my whole left leg (including the lower leg and left hip). My surgery went well with slightly moderate lengthening, but I'm assuming it could be symptoms of arthritis which I accepted as a possible consequence pre-op. Although I must admit having possible arthritis within the 20-30 age range is fukn devastating. I'll be getting this confirmed when I have an examination with the doctor. I'd like to make people aware to really think hard about getting this surgery, ideal candidate would be a person who absolutely occupied with height and feels there's no way to continue living, with only two options: LL or suicide. That was the situation with me and I basically risked everything for get those few centimetres. Hence why I didn't really think about the additional nail removal at that time. Anything could happen with this surgery so plan for the worst case scenario. Don't blindly accept that everything will go alright with LL, I had this operation with a well reputed LL surgeon.
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Congrats on making it this far. Around when did you have your first operation? Hopefully your pain subsides over time.
My two cents: I agree that you have to be tough to go through this elective surgery, but you don't have to be suicidal to be an ideal patient; some doctors might turn you away for that, since you'd be a liability (i.e. you'd find something to be upset about after it's all said and done). Perhaps it was hyperbole, but I doubt ideal patients with length discrepancies or even deformities are suicidal; it's case by case. That being said, I'm glad that height is no longer an issue for you.
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Congrats on making it this far. Around when did you have your first operation? Hopefully your pain subsides over time.
My two cents: I agree that you have to be tough to go through this elective surgery, but you don't have to be suicidal to be an ideal patient; some doctors might turn you away for that, since you'd be a liability (i.e. you'd find something to be upset about after it's all said and done). Perhaps it was hyperbole, but I doubt ideal patients with length discrepancies or even deformities are suicidal; it's case by case. That being said, I'm glad that height is no longer an issue for you.
Android, thanks for the well wishes, really appreciate it. What I meant to say on the whole suicidal issue is purely based on height (height neurosis) and no other factors influencing it. But I agree that if other factors are involved in being suicidal =, then perhaps LL may not be the answer and doctors refusing the surgery. Hence why prospective patients should really ask themselves whether CLL will really resolve their insecurity, otherwise time and resources can be bwtter spent on other things. I also agree that LL relating discrepencies and deformaties that affect proper functions are medical conditions that need to be addressed. My post above relates to CLL.
I'll keep you guys updated on my overall experience with the nail removal and what the doctor thinks I may have that is causig pain in my left leg.
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Hey, man. I hope things get better for you, and I'm glad at least your height neurosis is out of the way now.
You mentioned you didn't want to disclose your height, but could you please disclose the amount you lengthened? You described it as slightly moderate lengthening. I think it'd be important for all of us to know that many issues can still occur even if you lengthen sensibly, in case you feel comfortable sharing that information. CLL is no joke.
Thank you, and well wishes.
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Appreciate the clarification, Microbe. If everything else in your life is going well but your height has got you down, CLL is definitely an option.
Like Dr. Paley once said, "it's one of the few psychologic-psychiatric disorders that you can actually cure with the knife."
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Hey, man. I hope things get better for you, and I'm glad at least your height neurosis is out of the way now.
You mentioned you didn't want to disclose your height, but could you please disclose the amount you lengthened? You described it as slightly moderate lengthening. I think it'd be important for all of us to know that many issues can still occur even if you lengthen sensibly, in case you feel comfortable sharing that information. CLL is no joke.
Thank you, and well wishes.
Thanks for the wishes loginacct!
I lengthened around 6cm. on both legs.
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Thanks for the wishes loginacct!
I lengthened around 6cm. on both legs.
Was there a point where you felt everything became harder during the lengthening, like above a certain centimeter?
I may lower my lengthening goals after seeing so many of the problems people have here.
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I hate the fact that a lot of past LL'ers leave the forum and never return... In the diaries you see after the surgery they talk about losing a lot of athletic ability and feeling some form of leg pain, but then they leave and never come back to tell you if it was resolved. I've yet to hear one glowing, positive review of this whole thing.. Yeah there was Virtruvian man or whatever but he honestly seemed way too friendly with Paley...
There is always a negative, and it seems like there always will be, no matter internal, external, top doctor, low doctor, etc... You just can't mess with the biomechanics of the legs so harshly and expect to be fine.
I'm going into it fully expecting the worse, I expect to move like a damn grandpa-young Forrest Gump (when he had to wear those braces) for the rest of my life and probably will be incapable of walking more than 10 miles a day without feeling pain, that's probably going to be the reality. As long as I don't feel constant knee pain at all times (even without walking, just resting), that's fine. That's my biggest concert.
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I know what you mean Cap. I think it's a case of out of sight, out of mind. Like many say near the end, they no longer think about height anymore. The world will move on even without updating the diary, and there's no incentive to do so. There's plenty of negativity and conspiracy here, so I don't blame them if they don't find it fun to visit. At least a few come back and update us once in a while.
I recommend looking through research papers on CLL, since at least those have surveys a few years after consolidation. We don't get the closure of our own community members, but there's value in their objectivity.
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I hate the fact that a lot of past LL'ers leave the forum and never return... In the diaries you see after the surgery they talk about losing a lot of athletic ability and feeling some form of leg pain, but then they leave and never come back to tell you if it was resolved. I've yet to hear one glowing, positive review of this whole thing.. Yeah there was Virtruvian man or whatever but he honestly seemed way too friendly with Paley...
There is always a negative, and it seems like there always will be, no matter internal, external, top doctor, low doctor, etc... You just can't mess with the biomechanics of the legs so harshly and expect to be fine.
I'm going into it fully expecting the worse, I expect to move like a damn grandpa-young Forrest Gump (when he had to wear those braces) for the rest of my life and probably will be incapable of walking more than 10 miles a day without feeling pain, that's probably going to be the reality. As long as I don't feel constant knee pain at all times (even without walking, just resting), that's fine. That's my biggest concert.
they leave because u accuse ppl u never met of mental illness. And i accuse u now of attacking my husband and me because our language is not perfect. Dont ever attack me or my hubbie again. I do stand up for myself. I attack no one if they dont harm me or my family. So i dont like u i dont need u to like me' never ever talk to me or my husband this way, have a dull day . Pissbeer.
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I'm scheduled to remove my bilateral PRECICE 2 rods in the next several weeks. I won't disclose my doctor, country,age and height.
Frankly I feel absolutely fkn terrified, more so than the initial LL surgery. I guess the reason for this was that I was looking forward to the increase in height and I didn't really mind having the additional surgery to remove the rods, kinda dismissed it. Now the additional surgery/trauma to remove the rods feels nerve racking and making me quite depressed to have this procedure in the first place. Funny how views change over time. Pre-op I felt suicidal over my height and preoccupied with height and now height doesn't really bother me but this whole fukn additional trauma seems like a burden. My atheletic ability has decreased, get pain in my left leg after workouts, long walks or standing. I can't exactly pinpoint where the pain starts but it would gradually increase in intensity after feeling of tightness, despite me being quite flexible to begin with. The pain would affect my whole left leg (including the lower leg and left hip). My surgery went well with slightly moderate lengthening, but I'm assuming it could be symptoms of arthritis which I accepted as a possible consequence pre-op. Although I must admit having possible arthritis within the 20-30 age range is fukn devastating. I'll be getting this confirmed when I have an examination with the doctor. I'd like to make people aware to really think hard about getting this surgery, ideal candidate would be a person who absolutely occupied with height and feels there's no way to continue living, with only two options: LL or suicide. That was the situation with me and I basically risked everything for get those few centimetres. Hence why I didn't really think about the additional nail removal at that time. Anything could happen with this surgery so plan for the worst case scenario. Don't blindly accept that everything will go alright with LL, I had this operation with a well reputed LL surgeon.
I can't understamd why you are so pessimistic.
Nail removal is not a hard surgery and yes it will be painful for a few days but after about a months you'll be completely painless and better than you are now.
And finally, if your bone alignment is good and taken in mind that you havent lengthened too much, oremature arthritis is not very possible, but yes, we risk a bigger danger than a normal person who never did LL.
But I think you should become more optimist. Never thinking about height again and never suffer from social drawbacks that short men face (which are small to huge the shorter you are) is more important for me than risking premature arthritis some time which still can be fixed in a major degree.
I hope your surgery will be successful and move on thinking more positive..
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Was there a point where you felt everything became harder during the lengthening, like above a certain centimeter?
I may lower my lengthening goals after seeing so many of the problems people have here.
0-2 cm = Extremely painful (required medication routinely)
2-5 cm = Relatively easier but still painful
5-6 = Thigh muscles started getting tighter, especially quads. Physio involving quads was a complete torture.
So overall the "middle" phase of the LL process was relatively easier. Low lengthening goals is a smart choice.
I hate the fact that a lot of past LL'ers leave the forum and never return... In the diaries you see after the surgery they talk about losing a lot of athletic ability and feeling some form of leg pain, but then they leave and never come back to tell you if it was resolved. I've yet to hear one glowing, positive review of this whole thing.. Yeah there was Virtruvian man or whatever but he honestly seemed way too friendly with Paley...
There is always a negative, and it seems like there always will be, no matter internal, external, top doctor, low doctor, etc... You just can't mess with the biomechanics of the legs so harshly and expect to be fine.
I'm going into it fully expecting the worse, I expect to move like a damn grandpa-young Forrest Gump (when he had to wear those braces) for the rest of my life and probably will be incapable of walking more than 10 miles a day without feeling pain, that's probably going to be the reality. As long as I don't feel constant knee pain at all times (even without walking, just resting), that's fine. That's my biggest concert.
I think alot of them just move on with their lives and don't like to think about height and LL in general. I'll be honest but I do think that being in LL forums will further fuel height neurosis, even after successful CLL surgeries. I, for example, would be considered average on the global height scale, yet reading some of the topics will bring back insecurities. So yeah most LL veterans just move on and don't look back at where they started from. However I do understand your point of prospective CLL patients being frustrated of never hearing from the veterans, I was in that exact same situation as you. Some veterans may also choose not to continue posting on forums due to negative outcomes and fear of repercussions from doctors and members.
For me, I have mixed emotions with the CLL outcome so far. That 6cm has boost my confidence tremendously, despite still being below average in my country. A boost in self esteem has made me feel and appear better. No longer wearing those uncomfortable shoe inserts and walking barefeet is now possible without too much thoughts into height. However the negative consequence so far is the pain that is associated with the left leg and the possibility of being arthritis or some other chronic condition that maybe due to CLL itself. Medication does settle the pain so I do see a bit of positive there, but risk of the pain increasing over time and requiring stronger medication dose or medication no longer working is extremely disconcerting.
I can't understamd why you are so pessimistic.
Nail removal is not a hard surgery and yes it will be painful for a few days but after about a months you'll be completely painless and better than you are now.
And finally, if your bone alignment is good and taken in mind that you havent lengthened too much, oremature arthritis is not very possible, but yes, we risk a bigger danger than a normal person who never did LL.
But I think you should become more optimist. Never thinking about height again and never suffer from social drawbacks that short men face (which are small to huge the shorter you are) is more important for me than risking premature arthritis some time which still can be fixed in a major degree.
I hope your surgery will be successful and move on thinking more positive..
Thanks Bodybuilder for the encouraging post and the well wishes! Yeah I try to be positive and I'm hoping that the nail removal itself would decrease or remove the pain altogether. But I'll admit that news of some underlying chronic condition like arthritis is what's getting me upset, and perhaps assuming that it's arthritis is making me prepared for the worst case scenario. Otherwise I'm really happy for my new height and the boost in esteem.
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I can understand CLL forums fueling height neurosis. Discussions about ideal height is common, and you see plenty of guys going through CLL with a starting height that's higher than yours. Sometimes you have to log out and count your blessings. Take /r/short, you'd think it's a subreddit about short people supporting each other, but it's mostly a miserable pity party (there's a reason /r/averageheight doesn't exist -- nothing to talk about).
I agree with Body Builder too, nail removal is no big deal compared to what you've gone through. You'll be walking unassisted in a day, even if a little sore.
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Ideal height is 6'3, the average in the Philippines nowadays. If you're shorter than that, women won't even look at you, and you'll never get raises or promotions, much less a job.
Sarcasm aside, yeah. If you have or ever had height neurosis, stay away from places full of incels and incel-types who like to post stupid stories and memes about it. I know personally it's hard, but your height doesn't have to be everything in your life.
I posted this image in another thread, and I'll post it again here:
(http://assets.gcstatic.com/u/apps/asset_manager/uploaded/2013/17/composer-heights-infographic-1367588579.jpeg)
Grieg was significantly under the average for his location, familial wealth and ancestry (Norway), but that did not stop him from anything. With some types we have on the internet today, some people would have told him nasty things ("kill yourself") about himself due to his height.
Never stopped him from anything.
Him and his wife (guess who was taller). (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b3/Edvard_%26_Nina_Grieg_portrait_%285427115845%29.jpg)
0-2 cm = Extremely painful (required medication routinely)
2-5 cm = Relatively easier but still painful
5-6 = Thigh muscles started getting tighter, especially quads. Physio involving quads was a complete torture.
So overall the "middle" phase of the LL process was relatively easier. Low lengthening goals is a smart choice.
Thank you, Microbe. I will keep 5cm as the most I'd do, and I will try to be content with less than that.
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Ideal height is 6'3, the average in the Philippines nowadays. If you're shorter than that, women won't even look at you, and you'll never get raises or promotions, much less a job.
Sarcasm aside, yeah. If you have or ever had height neurosis, stay away from places full of incels and incel-types who like to post stupid stories and memes about it. I know personally it's hard, but your height doesn't have to be everything in your life.
I posted this image in another thread, and I'll post it again here:
(http://assets.gcstatic.com/u/apps/asset_manager/uploaded/2013/17/composer-heights-infographic-1367588579.jpeg)
Grieg was significantly under the average for his location, familial wealth and ancestry (Norway), but that did not stop him from anything. With some types we have on the internet today, some people would have told him nasty things ("kill yourself") about himself due to his height.
Never stopped him from anything.
Him and his wife (guess who was taller). (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b3/Edvard_%26_Nina_Grieg_portrait_%285427115845%29.jpg)
Thank you, Microbe. I will keep 5cm as the most I'd do, and I will try to be content with less than that.
I can understand CLL forums fueling height neurosis. Discussions about ideal height is common, and you see plenty of guys going through CLL with a starting height that's higher than yours. Sometimes you have to log out and count your blessings. Take /r/short, you'd think it's a subreddit about short people supporting each other, but it's mostly a miserable pity party (there's a reason /r/averageheight doesn't exist -- nothing to talk about).
I agree with Body Builder too, nail removal is no big deal compared to what you've gone through. You'll be walking unassisted in a day, even if a little sore.
My social life was nearly non-existent prior CLL. I was too preoccupied with height and how people would negatively view me as a person. This constant perception of myself and few remarks of my height from people led me to live a life as an almost recluse, "modern day hermit" or the term "hikikomori". I would hardly go out of the house, lost touch with many friends and the only time I left my house was to get food, grocery shopping, university etc... One of the strongest factors for getting CLL in the first place is to attract the opposite sxx, mainly true with males. Lurking in these forums, alongside with reddit and so called "scientific websites" etc...I was conditioned to believe that a male must be over "so and so" height to attract females...However after my post-CLL, I was extremely (and I mean EXTREMELY!) surprised at how people shorter than me were dating very beautiful women. In fact, some of the women were slightly taller than the men (note:I live in one of the top 5 tallest countries for males). This made me question the "shiit " that people read on these sites. Yes I do believe that being taller will make life more comfortable and easy, however one should not go into thinking "X height is required/mandatory into getting a perfect partner, job" whatever these sites make you believe. My advice is not to lurk around the social aspects on this forum and stay away short people reddit. Majority of them are filled with depressed people or just trolls that get a temporary boost by feeding on the insecurities of short people. Purely concentrate on the medical aspect of CLL and keep on asking yourself whether those few cm's will truly change your life. Reflecting back, I wish I had stayed away from these short reddits, forums and the off topic section from these LL forums and enjoyed life during my younger days since many short people that I've known after my CLL have proven my former thoughts wrong. Android and myloginacct I wish you all the best on your journey to becoming more happy.
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Ha, yes! I am totally inside my apartment all the time if I don't get invited by friends to do anything.
I don't attribute this to my height of course; I had an upbringing in which I kept moving around and losing friends, so I learned to entertain myself. I'm also quite frugal, so that also plays a role too. Leaving the house feels like a chore after a while; the internet has made my hikikomori lifestyle much more convenient.
But I do actually have a great time once I leave the house. Got plans this weekend, so pretty pumped about that. Hopefully I can be more outgoing in the near future.
To wrap up, if I'm going to be a hermit, I'd rather be a taller hermit.
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My social life was nearly non-existent prior CLL. I was too preoccupied with height and how people would negatively view me as a person. This constant perception of myself and few remarks of my height from people led me to live a life as an almost recluse, "modern day hermit" or the term "hikikomori". I would hardly go out of the house, lost touch with many friends and the only time I left my house was to get food, grocery shopping, university etc... One of the strongest factors for getting CLL in the first place is to attract the opposite sxx, mainly true with males. Lurking in these forums, alongside with reddit and so called "scientific websites" etc...I was conditioned to believe that a male must be over "so and so" height to attract females...However after my post-CLL, I was extremely (and I mean EXTREMELY!) surprised at how people shorter than me were dating very beautiful women. In fact, some of the women were slightly taller than the men (note:I live in one of the top 5 tallest countries for males). This made me question the "shiit " that people read on these sites. Yes I do believe that being taller will make life more comfortable and easy, however one should not go into thinking "X height is required/mandatory into getting a perfect partner, job" whatever these sites make you believe. My advice is not to lurk around the social aspects on this forum and stay away short people reddit. Majority of them are filled with depressed people or just trolls that get a temporary boost by feeding on the insecurities of short people. Purely concentrate on the medical aspect of CLL and keep on asking yourself whether those few cm's will truly change your life. Reflecting back, I wish I had stayed away from these short reddits, forums and the off topic section from these LL forums and enjoyed life during my younger days since many short people that I've known after my CLL have proven my former thoughts wrong. Android and myloginacct I wish you all the best on your journey to becoming more happy.
I've told this story here before, but my most successful friend with women is around 166cm. His friends are all over 180cm.
All the people who think "you need to be X height to 'get' women" tend to think of women as objects, and not people, so they do tend to do rather poorly in that aspect of life. Which is not to say height is not important (we are here after all; we've read some studies), but there's always two sides to a coin.
Pains from CLL aside, I hope you're living a happier life now, Microbe. Considering you've mentioned you live in one of the tallest countries in the world, you were probably not that short to begin with. Enjoy being tall or above average now when you travel outside of Europe and North America!
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I've told this story here before, but my most successful friend with women is around 166cm. His friends are all over 180cm.
Haha this guys sounds exactly like a friend of mine. Similar height, great down to earth personality and very humble, yet he manages to attract women that are taller than him. Just an overall charismatic person.
All the people who think "you need to be X height to 'get' women" tend to think of women as objects, and not people, so they do tend to do rather poorly in that aspect of life. Which is not to say height is not important (we are here after all; we've read some studies), but there's always two sides to a coin.
I guess the same can be said for women that say a men has to be of "X" height.
Pains from CLL aside, I hope you're living a happier life now, Microbe. Considering you've mentioned you live in one of the tallest countries in the world, you were probably not that short to begin with. Enjoy being tall or above average now when you travel outside of Europe and North America!
I'm in the 5'7-5'8 range in a country where the average is around 5'11 lol. Even though the difference may appear large, I don't feel too short at all and I've never been called short after my CLL. It is common to see people around the same height as me or slightly taller and I could blend into crowds without appearing too short.
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Haha this guys sounds exactly like a friend of mine. Similar height, great down to earth personality and very humble, yet he manages to attract women that are taller than him. Just an overall charismatic person.
Charisma, intelligence and empathy go a reaaaally long way if you're looking for relationships and not just trying to "score" nightclub girls.
I'm in the 5'7-5'8 range in a country where the average is around 5'11 lol. Even though the difference may appear large, I don't feel too short at all and I've never been called short after my CLL. It is common to see people around the same height as me or slightly taller and I could blend into crowds without appearing too short.
That's awesome. Keep up that positivity. 171cm was among the tallest average heights in the world a century ago, so definitely don't feel short. It's just that people in those tallest countries reached their genetic potential.
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As long as I don't feel constant knee pain at all times (even without walking, just resting), that's fine. That's my biggest concert.
Sweden complains about small aches, and the risk of early hip/knee arthritis is extremely real.
You need to take that into account too.
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That's awesome. Keep up that positivity. 171cm was among the tallest average heights in the world a century ago, so definitely don't feel short.
Although I agree that 171cm is not socially short, your reason for why he should feel good, is one of the stupidiest things I have heard
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Although I agree that 171cm is not socially short, your reason for why he should feel good, is one of the stupidiest things I have heard
Uh, where did I mention that he should feel good?
Thank you for your contribution, I guess. I'll be sure to be more mindful so as to not make the "stupidiest" posts someone on a CLL forum has ever read.
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That's awesome. Keep up that positivity. 171cm was among the tallest average heights in the world a century ago, so definitely don't feel short. It's just that people in those tallest countries reached their genetic potential.
Although I agree that 171cm is not socially short
For me I'm happy to be around the global average height and being around 171cm I actually don't feel short at all. I could have gone for tibia LL but decided against it. I don't want to put myself into further stress and trauma. Personally I feel that the risks outweigh the benefit of doing another LL surgery at this height. I've already fked up my legs enough already lol. I reckon I've traded my atheletic ability for the several cm's. I'm not too happy about it but this is something that I had accepted and willing to trade for a boost in self esteem. Running and jogging feels very unnatural and I can't continoulsly jog as I did before without taking a break in between, around 100m on average. Long distance walking seems fine, but then my knees start feeling tight and gradually my left leg starts becoming painful. I don't know if it's the rods that is causing this or some underlying condition due to CLL. I'm hoping the doctor will be able to figure it out.
Sweden complains about small aches, and the risk of early hip/knee arthritis is extremely real.
You need to take that into account too.
This is absolutely correct. I rmember reading Sweden's experience during his CLL and post-CLL and I remember him mentioning about his aches. I kinda dismissed this due to him having surgery with Dr.Sarin and thinking if I go to a well experienced doctor I would avoid such problems. Unfortunately this is not the case for me.
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I think things may get better a couple years after the rods have already been removed. Gotta consult with the best doctors and be optimistic.
And I'm glad you feel satisfied with your new height.
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Ideal height is 6'3, the average in the Philippines nowadays. If you're shorter than that, women won't even look at you, and you'll never get raises or promotions, much less a job.
Sarcasm aside, yeah. If you have or ever had height neurosis, stay away from places full of incels and incel-types who like to post stupid stories and memes about it. I know personally it's hard, but your height doesn't have to be everything in your life.
I posted this image in another thread, and I'll post it again here:
(http://assets.gcstatic.com/u/apps/asset_manager/uploaded/2013/17/composer-heights-infographic-1367588579.jpeg)
Grieg was significantly under the average for his location, familial wealth and ancestry (Norway), but that did not stop him from anything. With some types we have on the internet today, some people would have told him nasty things ("kill yourself") about himself due to his height.
Never stopped him from anything.
Him and his wife (guess who was taller). (https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/b/b3/Edvard_%26_Nina_Grieg_portrait_%285427115845%29.jpg)
Thank you, Microbe. I will keep 5cm as the most I'd do, and I will try to be content with less than that.
classic fm are really doing that kind of things ... that's ... pitiful
whatever you will do in your life people will always rank yourself according to your height, they are giving so much to that (anglo-saxon societies)
and looking at pictures I would never have guess that Rachmaninov was 6'6 http://www.oocities.org/vienna/strasse/6145/rach13.jpg https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/61224648/tatyana-sergeyevna-conus#view-photo=35267790
he looks about the same than Jacques Tati who was 187 cm according to an interview with Jacques Chancel
by the way the best looking musician was Alban Berg and he was quite tall
https://www.pinterest.fr/pin/356628864217148382/
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I find Liszt the best looking of them all, but I might be biased.
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lets go back to the time before you did, now that you have gone through LL with all the experience. Would you have done it?
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lets go back to the time before you did, now that you have gone through LL with all the experience. Would you have done it?
At this current moment when I'm not in pain, yes, I think the extra cm has boosted my self esteem. But there are times when I do question whether it was really worth it, especially when I'm in pain and thinking whether the underlying condition maybe premature arthritis. I also fear that the additional trauma from the rod removal may exacerbate the condition. So yeah my honest opinion is that there are times when I'm pleased with the result and there are those times when I'm not.
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At this current moment when I'm not in pain, yes, I think the extra cm has boosted my self esteem. But there are times when I do question whether it was really worth it, especially when I'm in pain and thinking whether the underlying condition maybe premature arthritis. I also fear that the additional trauma from the rod removal may exacerbate the condition. So yeah my honest opinion is that there are times when I'm pleased with the result and there are those times when I'm not.
Hey Microbe, I realize this is a... tall request, but could you maybe come back in a year or two and make a thread like this again, after you already had your nails removed? I'd be curious if there was any change in the oscillation of your thoughts as to whether CLL was or wasn't worth it. It's also completely understandable if you don't, and just want to forget about all this.
Thank you for still reporting back even once.
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Hey Microbe, I realize this is a... tall request, but could you maybe come back in a year or two and make a thread like this again, after you already had your nails removed? I'd be curious if there was any change in the oscillation of your thoughts as to whether CLL was or wasn't worth it. It's also completely understandable if you don't, and just want to forget about all this.
Thank you for still reporting back even once.
Yes I'll keep you guys updated.
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-Had a appointment with the doctor
-No signs of premature arthritis, however mechanical alignment of femur/tibia suggest future risk of arthritis, common consequence of CLL
-Slight bow legs of tibia, solution would be the use of external fixation which I'm absolutely hesitant. I may look into this in the future.
-Doctor believes pain is not likely cause of nail and nail removal will no resolve the pain
-Most likely cause of pain is due to loss of muscle mass, especially quads, which has caused "imbalance" and loss of endurance
-Will see a physio therapist tomorrow to prescribe strengthening exercises and see whether the pain improves
-Doctor does not really see the necessity in removing PRECICE2 rods since the x-rays show no issue with the nail itself. he believes there are two sides of nail removal. The advantage of removing the nail is that in case of future accidental trauma, there is a risk of breaking the bone below the nail and in that case nail removal would be quite a challenge. Secondly, in the future if there is a need of removing the nail, with the current pace of evolving technologies, it maybe hard to obtain outdated instruments to remove the old rods. I asked about the motorised nail and he said they look all fine and doesn't see any issue in staying there. He also pointed out the disadvantage of removing the nail, which is that it's an invasive surgery and there is always an risk of additional trauma.
-So doctor has currently prescribed intensive physio, along with orthotics since my left leg is 1.5 cm shorter. I was surprised since I thought it was around 1cm shorter. This may also be the reason for my left leg being more painful.
-Overall I'm happy that it's currently not premature arthritis, however the shift in the mechanical axis with the load going through the medial section of the knee joint is a bit of a concern. I will start physio and orthotics tomorrow and hopefully that will decrease or even better get rid of my pain. If that does not resolve the pain then the doctor will do another re-evaluation and possible nail removal.
-Doctor has confirmed I lengthened around 6.5 cm
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Thanks for the info Microbe. Really helpful stuff, especially since we have plenty of people in the community lengthening with internal nails right now.
Here's another risk of non-removal of Precice nails according to Dr. Paley (http://paleyinstitute.org/centers-of-excellence/stature-lengthening/the-paley-method/nail-removal/), emphasis mine:
All of the nails should be removed. Removal timing is not critical but is most often done one or two years after the original surgery. The reason to remove the nails is that they are made of titanium and since they have moving parts they generate metal ions over the course of many years. While they are inert and there is no urgency to remove them, it is recommended to remove them one or two years after insertion. The PRECICE also has a rare earth magnet inside. This is sealed from the body inside a waterproof chamber. It is possible that after years this seal could leak and the rare earth magnet would be exposed to body fluids. As such, it is preferable to remove the device before this could happen.
And hey, maybe your a little bit of your pain might go away according to this paper (https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5767899/), emphasis mine:
The most common complication of intramedullary nailing is anterior knee pain; but other rare complications such as nonunion, malunion, joint stiffness, and infection were also reported.
The outcome of implant removal also depends on both the implant type and its anatomic location, and around 70% of patients had an improvement in their symptoms after implant removal.
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All of the nails should be removed. Removal timing is not critical but is most often done one or two years after the original surgery. The reason to remove the nails is that they are made of titanium and since they have moving parts they generate metal ions over the course of many years. While they are inert and there is no urgency to remove them, it is recommended to remove them one or two years after insertion. The PRECICE also has a rare earth magnet inside. This is sealed from the body inside a waterproof chamber. It is possible that after years this seal could leak and the rare earth magnet would be exposed to body fluids. As such, it is preferable to remove the device before this could happen.
Yes I'll bring that up with the doctor dagain
http://paleyinstitute.org/centers-of-excellence/stature-lengthening/the-paley-method/nail-removal/
Nevertheless, 12% complained of new onset anterior knee pain [7]. In series of 71 patients, Karladani et al. reported that nail removal has limited pain-decreasing effect [28].
This is what scares me, especially when the study states that titanium nails inherently have more risks associated compared to stainless steel
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-Had a appointment with the doctor
-No signs of premature arthritis, however mechanical alignment of femur/tibia suggest future risk of arthritis, common consequence of CLL
-Slight bow legs of tibia, solution would be the use of external fixation which I'm absolutely hesitant. I may look into this in the future.
-Doctor believes pain is not likely cause of nail and nail removal will no resolve the pain
-Most likely cause of pain is due to loss of muscle mass, especially quads, which has caused "imbalance" and loss of endurance
-Will see a physio therapist tomorrow to prescribe strengthening exercises and see whether the pain improves
-Doctor does not really see the necessity in removing PRECICE2 rods since the x-rays show no issue with the nail itself. he believes there are two sides of nail removal. The advantage of removing the nail is that in case of future accidental trauma, there is a risk of breaking the bone below the nail and in that case nail removal would be quite a challenge. Secondly, in the future if there is a need of removing the nail, with the current pace of evolving technologies, it maybe hard to obtain outdated instruments to remove the old rods. I asked about the motorised nail and he said they look all fine and doesn't see any issue in staying there. He also pointed out the disadvantage of removing the nail, which is that it's an invasive surgery and there is always an risk of additional trauma.
-So doctor has currently prescribed intensive physio, along with orthotics since my left leg is 1.5 cm shorter. I was surprised since I thought it was around 1cm shorter. This may also be the reason for my left leg being more painful.
-Overall I'm happy that it's currently not premature arthritis, however the shift in the mechanical axis with the load going through the medial section of the knee joint is a bit of a concern. I will start physio and orthotics tomorrow and hopefully that will decrease or even better get rid of my pain. If that does not resolve the pain then the doctor will do another re-evaluation and possible nail removal.
-Doctor has confirmed I lengthened around 6.5 cm
Hi again, Microbe. I hope the physio and orthotics help, hopefully get rid of your pain!
Can you talk a bit more about that pain? In a scale of 1 to 10, how bad is the pain? Is it worse during certain times of the day, or in certain positions? Is it constant, ever-present, only varying in the scale of 1~10? And maybe in a more complex question: how bad is it on you, psychologically?
By the way, I believe premature arthritis is one of the greatest real consequences of CLL, but it doesn't need to necessarily happen. I'm hoping all ends the best in your case.
Thanks again, Microbe.
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Hi again, Microbe. I hope the physio and orthotics help, hopefully get rid of your pain!
Can you talk a bit more about that pain? In a scale of 1 to 10, how bad is the pain? Is it worse during certain times of the day, or in certain positions? Is it constant, ever-present, only varying in the scale of 1~10? And maybe in a more complex question: how bad is it on you, psychologically?
By the way, I believe premature arthritis is one of the greatest real consequences of CLL, but it doesn't need to necessarily happen. I'm hoping all ends the best in your case.
Thanks again, Microbe.
Thanks loginacc for your well wishes!
The pain has increased in frequency over the years and is mainly associated with long distance walking, prolonged standing or even resistance training at the gym. It would start off with stiff feeling on both knees and then it would gradually progess to being painful on my left thigh. I cannot exactly pinpoint where the pain originates but it could be felt on the left buttocks, to the nail insertion site at the hips, throughout my thigh, knees and down towards the lower leg and up to my ankle. Pain could range from just annoying 3/10 to an intense 8/10 (point when I start limping). This pain is however not present when I am sedentary and relaxed all day. I must also point out that there are some days, when I'm fortunate, I don't get pain at all, despite the long distance walking, prolonged standing and gym workout all together, but this is quite rare. Psychological impact depends on the severity of the pain, with low pain involving less negative mental state to severe mental breakdown with intense pain. I won't lie but pre-op I didn't really mind about the higher risk of getting arthritis due to CLL and had just accepted it to trade it with the extra few cm. However now I feel rather devasted seeing the medial side of my knees getting unequal load with the high chance of getting arthritis.
I would also like to add that the doctor took an xray of my spine and has ruled out possibility of herniated disk, which has symptoms similar to what I'm experiencing.
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Thanks loginacc for your well wishes!
The pain has increased in frequency over the years and is mainly associated with long distance walking, prolonged standing or even resistance training at the gym. It would start off with stiff feeling on both knees and then it would gradually progess to being painful on my left thigh. I cannot exactly pinpoint where the pain originates but it could be felt on the left buttocks, to the nail insertion site at the hips, throughout my thigh, knees and down towards the lower leg and up to my ankle. Pain could range from just annoying 3/10 to an intense 8/10 (point when I start limping). This pain is however not present when I am sedentary and relaxed all day. I must also point out that there are some days, when I'm fortunate, I don't get pain at all, despite the long distance walking, prolonged standing and gym workout all together, but this is quite rare. Psychological impact depends on the severity of the pain, with low pain involving less negative mental state to severe mental breakdown with intense pain. I won't lie but pre-op I didn't really mind about the higher risk of getting arthritis due to CLL and had just accepted it to trade it with the extra few cm. However now I feel rather devasted seeing the medial side of my knees getting unequal load with the high chance of getting arthritis.
I would also like to add that the doctor took an xray of my spine and has ruled out possibility of herniated disk, which has symptoms similar to what I'm experiencing.
Thanks for the detailed reply.
I can see how it can lead to breakdowns if it goes as high as 8/10. But hang in there, it can only get better from the point you start doing everything that you can against it. Regenerative medicine will only get better with time too.
Is the doctor you're seeing now the same one who performed LL on you? If not, have you thought about maybe scheduling an appointment with a doctor who's also experienced in CLL, like Rozbruch, Birkholtz, Catagni or Paley, and explaining all of your issues? Maybe they could help you a little better. EDIT: Even if your current doctor performs CLL and is one of the good ones, maybe getting more opinions won't hurt, if they're not out of your budget. Well, in my current, ignorant view as someone who is yet to do his own CLL, anyway.
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-Had a appointment with the doctor
-No signs of premature arthritis, however mechanical alignment of femur/tibia suggest future risk of arthritis, common consequence of CLL
-Slight bow legs of tibia, solution would be the use of external fixation which I'm absolutely hesitant. I may look into this in the future.
-Doctor believes pain is not likely cause of nail and nail removal will no resolve the pain
-Most likely cause of pain is due to loss of muscle mass, especially quads, which has caused "imbalance" and loss of endurance
-Will see a physio therapist tomorrow to prescribe strengthening exercises and see whether the pain improves
-Doctor does not really see the necessity in removing PRECICE2 rods since the x-rays show no issue with the nail itself. he believes there are two sides of nail removal. The advantage of removing the nail is that in case of future accidental trauma, there is a risk of breaking the bone below the nail and in that case nail removal would be quite a challenge. Secondly, in the future if there is a need of removing the nail, with the current pace of evolving technologies, it maybe hard to obtain outdated instruments to remove the old rods. I asked about the motorised nail and he said they look all fine and doesn't see any issue in staying there. He also pointed out the disadvantage of removing the nail, which is that it's an invasive surgery and there is always an risk of additional trauma.
-So doctor has currently prescribed intensive physio, along with orthotics since my left leg is 1.5 cm shorter. I was surprised since I thought it was around 1cm shorter. This may also be the reason for my left leg being more painful.
-Overall I'm happy that it's currently not premature arthritis, however the shift in the mechanical axis with the load going through the medial section of the knee joint is a bit of a concern. I will start physio and orthotics tomorrow and hopefully that will decrease or even better get rid of my pain. If that does not resolve the pain then the doctor will do another re-evaluation and possible nail removal.
-Doctor has confirmed I lengthened around 6.5 cm
Hey Microbe,
As someone who is currently consolidating after 6+ cm of lengthening, I find your case a bit concerning but insightful.
You mention your left leg was 1.5 cm shorter, how did this occur? Is one tib/fib shorter than the other or a result of your lengthening? I feel like your doctor should have corrected this during your lengthening.
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Hey Microbe,
As someone who is currently consolidating after 6+ cm of lengthening, I find your case a bit concerning but insightful.
You mention your left leg was 1.5 cm shorter, how did this occur? Is one tib/fib shorter than the other or a result of your lengthening? I feel like your doctor should have corrected this during your lengthening.
Hello Bigdream
Yes it was brought up during my initial consultation that my left tibia is 1cm shorter. At that point in time, I was thinking of undergoing tibial LL too and thus the doctor and I both agreed to get that sorted out during my tibial LL. As for that 0.5cm femur discrepancy, I do not know how that happened since the x-rays were showing similar length. Anyway, I'm not too concerned with this since I'll correct this with insoles for my left leg. I honestly cannot tell the difference when I walk with the discrepancy.
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Hello Bigdream
Yes it was brought up during my initial consultation that my left tibia is 1cm shorter. At that point in time, I was thinking of undergoing tibial LL too and thus the doctor and I both agreed to get that sorted out during my tibial LL. As for that 0.5cm femur discrepancy, I do not know how that happened since the x-rays were showing similar length. Anyway, I'm not too concerned with this since I'll correct this with insoles for my left leg. I honestly cannot tell the difference when I walk with the discrepancy.
I've heard that 0.0-0.5 cm discrepancy between legs is common and xray measurements are estimates that can be off by +/- 0.3 cm. Like you said, 1.5 cm isn't a massive difference, so I really hope the insole and PT help resolve your pain issue!
My left leg is my weaker leg too and when i walk with the walker or crutches (I haven't been cleared to fully weightbear yet) I have a little pain in my left leg and hip but its not too bad. I'm just hoping it resolve itself with time and more walking and doesn't get worse.
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I've heard that 0.0-0.5 cm discrepancy between legs is common and xray measurements are estimates that can be off by +/- 0.3 cm. Like you said, 1.5 cm isn't a massive difference, so I really hope the insole and PT help resolve your pain issue!
My left leg is my weaker leg too and when i walk with the walker or crutches (I haven't been cleared to fully weightbear yet) I have a little pain in my left leg and hip but its not too bad. I'm just hoping it resolve itself with time and more walking and doesn't get worse.
Several doctors have given an accepted range from 0 - 1.5cm as the maximum borderline for discrepancy, with obviously the lower the better. I'll see the orthotist on Monday and will try and ask him if he could make a custom insoles for my flat feet along the extra 1.5 height for my left leg.
My left leg too felt significantly weaker during my LL and consolidation phase, and unfortunately it still does after all these years. The best thing to do is just carry on with physio (strength and stretch). There could be a possibility for your leg to improve. I started my physio training for a day and will continue under supervision for a whole month to see whether the pain improves. And then I will decide to have my rods taken out.
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I'll be getting my rods removed tomorrow. Feeling quite nervous, frankly more than my prior nail insertion surgery. Soon to be nil by mouth. Will keep you guys updated on how it goes. FML lol....
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Best of luck Microbe, better now than when you're older. You'll be back to your routine in no time.
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I'll be getting my rods removed tomorrow. Feeling quite nervous, frankly more than my prior nail insertion surgery. Soon to be nil by mouth. Will keep you guys updated on how it goes. FML lol....
Don't worry - you'll nail it!
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Thnks android and myloginacc for the well wishes.
Im 4 hours post surgery. Acute pain is is quite bad. I was awake throughout the surgery with spinal epidural. Legs were totally paralyzed, and post surgery had a cramp like feeling, somewhat similar to pins and needles. Anaeasthia has worn off and my god the pain. Flexing and extending is difficult with legs feeling very heavy and painful. I was surprised to see that the nail removal is not done smoothly as I imagined it to be. There was a lot of hammering and pulling with great effort. Don’t take this surgery lightly!
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Hi Microbe,
Sorry to hear you are in so much pain. I hope it passes quickly for you so you can finally get back to life with no foreign objects in your body and start to heal properly.
Can I ask you how long you had the rods in for? Supposedly the longer you leave them in the harder they are to take out as soft tissue grows tightly around them. I was just wondering if yours had been left in for a longer time then normal, hence the intense pain. The information might help other LL decide when best to get their rods removed.
Thanks
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Just over couple of years. I was conservative and chose not to remove it a year, fearing of refractrure. I’m not sure about the growth of soft tissues though. I think it’s normal to feel this pain with all the incisions, hammering , pulling , accumulation of all these procedures and trauma. Plus the spinal epidural makes it even worse.
People with more muscles may feel more pain, not sure , but I currently have a bony ass so not much soft tissues there atm.
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2 years is pretty standard and not that much over the recommended period. Thanks for the answer and hope you feel better soon. Are you feeling any better since your last post?
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Yes my doctor pretty much said that timing is not really crucial. He mentioned the downsides of keeping the nail are risk of fracture below the nail, complications arising from these fractures, and also the inability to have mri with the nails inside. This along with paleys recommendation of having magnets exposed to body fluids made me decide to heave the rods out. I’m feeling much better right now and interacting with the staff has helped my pain tremendously, along with the use of painkillers. So yes I’m happy to have the nail removed. I can have a peace of mind walking through some airports without having the nails detected.
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Κeep strong Microbe.
How many days your doctor told you to wait till walking without any support?
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Κeep strong Microbe.
How many days your doctor told you to wait till walking without any support?
Thanks bodybuilder!
My doctor recommended me to stay in bed for the entire day, and then he along with the physiotherapist will see if I can partially walk tomorrow, depending on the pain. I’ll start exercises tomorrow.
Plus urinating in bed, brings back unpleasant memories .
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Sorry to hear about the pain and the bad experiences. But you're past the worst now. You did LL, and have already had your rods removed.
Take your own time; you deserve it.
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Sorry to hear about the pain and the bad experiences. But you're past the worst now. You did LL, and have already had your rods removed.
Take your own time; you deserve it.
Thanks for the inspiring words login. Really need it at this very moment. I can’t believe how fast time flies, and looking back I can still vividly remember the days leading up to my LL surgery and my lengthening phase. Now having this rods removed I do feel it will all be over very soon when I recover. After going through all this, I can’t see myself doing anymore elective surgeries. Unfortunately the lengthening has predisposed me to some mechanical alignment issues and chances of arthritis is higher compared to the average population. The doctor had suggested that the best way of addressing this would be to get standard ilizarov to align the mechanical stress...but in my mind I’m thinking there’s no way I’m undergoing this s*** again.
Also the physio I received did improve the pain, and perhaps it may resolve the chronic pain I feel daily. I’m hoping....
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Pros:
1) tremendous boost in self esteem (x infinite times)
2) I never have to wear insoles for pure height increase. Although I’m planning on going to a professional orthotist to get insoles for my flat foot and the leg length discrepancies. I now have the chance of putting insoles for pure medical and comfort.
3) can dress however I want to. Hell I even wear flip flops or barefoot when the average height is 9 cm above me.
4)possibility of making some rare individuals function better with deformities
Cons:
1) The process itself involving exposure to a lot of radiation, being inactive, drug and possible addiction, multiple surgeries and acumalated trauma
2) Extremely long and tedious procedure which could lead to psychological issues (years)
3) fking price and the opportunity cost of resources , time and health
4)toll on the atheletic ability, perhaps due to biomenchqnical change or stretched muscles/nerves/skin and/or blood vessels. Combination of all?
5) many things could go wrong , you just be aware of these by going through the forum and take my previous for example, some life threatening too
6) weird proportion like femur:tibia, upper body:lower body, or even the height just not overall suiting the body
7) Pain,Pain,pain
8)changes in axial alignment for the worse
9) permanent scars
End of the day, be realistic on why you want CLL!
(P.s m pretty sure these have been menti9ned before but Im too bloody bored atm so I thought I’d write this from my Experience. I think I’ll finally make a move on downloading pubg and see the hype surrounding it)
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Thanks for the writeup, good to hear your overall perspective. Like you said, it's finally over, time to recover!
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Yes my doctor pretty much said that timing is not really crucial. He mentioned the downsides of keeping the nail are risk of fracture below the nail, complications arising from these fractures, and also the inability to have mri with the nails inside. This along with paleys recommendation of having magnets exposed to body fluids made me decide to heave the rods out. I’m feeling much better right now and interacting with the staff has helped my pain tremendously, along with the use of painkillers. So yes I’m happy to have the nail removed. I can have a peace of mind walking through some airports without having the nails detected.
Hi Microbe, I hope you are doing well after rod removals. I would like to know how the implants were detected. Some says preciese 2 are not detected since they are non ferrus.
Please share your experience.
Thank you
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Hi Microbe, I hope you are doing well after rod removals. I would like to know how the implants were detected. Some says preciese 2 are not detected since they are non ferrus.
Please share your experience.
Thank you
Hey Mariobro
Thanks , atm I’m struggling with body movements on the bed, sore back and when I try to sit up there is N immense uncomfortable pressure on my bum and incision sites.
My experience with certain airports have been interesting. In my home country which I traveled on multiple occasions had detected my nail with the sensor the first time I left that airport with my rods. However after that ocaasion it never detected the rods again. Rather strange?
Couple of airports I regularly travel to always detect my rods. The rest of the airports don’t detect. In the u.s I always opt for a person to physically screen me.
Edit: I’m talking about those handheld metal detectors that are able to detect the nails.
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hi microbe
been following your thread. please try and remember that without the surgery you would not have introspected these things. self loathing for decades of your life can also have an accumulated effect on every aspect of your life which can't even fathom looking ahead. but looking back you can see how much of your life was wasted away with self loathing thoughts.
maybe this surgery finally stopped you from self loathing? i would call that a win if you are reasonably physically functional to live a fulfilling life.
i firmly believe this operation should not be sought after for anything tangible (like girls, jobs, etc.) this operation is basically an extremely strong therapy to stop hating yourself.
i wish i had the opportunity and sense to undergo real psychotherapy at a young age instead of this. if anyone reading this is very young, please stop bombarding yourself with LL information to the point where you cannot imagine a life without getting LL. instead spend some time getting psychotherapy to improve body image. if it does not work, LL is always there.
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hi microbe
been following your thread. please try and remember that without the surgery you would not have introspected these things. self loathing for decades of your life can also have an accumulated effect on every aspect of your life which can't even fathom looking ahead. but looking back you can see how much of your life was wasted away with self loathing thoughts.
maybe this surgery finally stopped you from self loathing? i would call that a win if you are reasonably physically functional to live a fulfilling life.
i firmly believe this operation should not be sought after for anything tangible (like girls, jobs, etc.) this operation is basically an extremely strong therapy to stop hating yourself.
i wish i had the opportunity and sense to undergo real psychotherapy at a young age instead of this. if anyone reading this is very young, please stop bombarding yourself with LL information to the point where you cannot imagine a life without getting LL. instead spend some time getting psychotherapy to improve body image. if it does not work, LL is always there.
Fokid thanks for the comment I do agree on trying alternative options before dwelling and undergoing LL surgery. Perhaps it could’ve worked for me if I did try psychotherapy, honestly I did consider this but felt uncomfortable talking to someone about the insecurities of my height. This feeling had prevented me from seeking external help from others. it doesn’t really help when you have a feeling that you’re objectively short. The more I dwelled into this issue I basically barred my thoughts of trying alternate options and just dwelled majority of my time on LL. Growing up being called short names does extremely damage self esteem and for me it was one of the two biggest obstacles in life so far, with the other being the death of a family member at a young age. I reckon being mocked for being objectively short from the general population may justify the reason, perhaps to recover from the past abuse and breaking free from this obstacle. But then as I had mentioned in one of my previous posts, I’ve seen objectively short people living life to the fullest. Good post from you Fokid!
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keep strong man.
the pessimist you are, you are now underplaying how bad it was for you before the surgery. you say you felt so bad that you would have been ok with some arthritis possibility. that means something.
also there is no snapping out of the possibility of doing LL once you hear about it and slowly get used to the gory details. so you would have effectively lived a major portion of your life in a 'suspended' mode if you hadn't done it. 'i might do LL next year so i will not pursue X'
this was the only way out (unless something magically good happened in your life).
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keep strong man.
the pessimist you are, you are now underplaying how bad it was for you before the surgery. you say you felt so bad that you would have been ok with some arthritis possibility. that means something.
also there is no snapping out of the possibility of doing LL once you hear about it and slowly get used to the gory details. so you would have effectively lived a major portion of your life in a 'suspended' mode if you hadn't done it. 'i might do LL next year so i will not pursue X'
this was the only way out (unless something magically good happened in your life).
Yes Funny how the mind works, One can accept the consequences prior LL, not having a clue of what it would really feel like, due to being clouded by height dysphoria. Then when the person really has to live with the negative consequence years after LL, this could most likely affect their views on their decision, even after deeming it necessary to reach goal “X” to live a fulfilling life. Dilemma for many LLers with a possibility of a never ending cycle of varying emotions, pessimism and optimism.
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Recently had my first physio post removal session. Movements are really difficult due to pain from the incisions, mainly the incisions near the knee. Needed major suppport from the physiotherapist. After finishing the excercises on the bed, I progressed to sitting up on the edge of the bed with knee extension. Then we progressed to the hardest of them all, walking with a walker. Felt extremely light headed and I swear I was going to faint. Just took few steps around the room and sat back on the bed.
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(http://i66.tinypic.com/2mo8qoi.jpg)
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did you go back to your original surgeon for nail removal?
if you can, get a ct scan of your legs. have the radiologist check for the exact misalignment and length discrepancy. if the radiologist writes that your bowing is not abnormal and your discrepancy is not abnormal you will be very relieved.
if it is an alignment issue, why didn't your doctor notice it during lengthening?
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Malalignment is usually inevitable with internal femurs, something that cannot fix the mechanical axis. I think dr. Franz birkhotlz did mention about this on his thread, and some study someone posted a while ago about a 1cm causing 1 mm medial shift, can’t recall but it’s here somewhere. I have slight varus tibias too, which the doctor spotted during the initial consultation and also the 1 cm discrepancy between the tibias. At that point in time I was totally fixated on getting external tibias LL and getting the discrepancy sorted out with that. Now I’ll just get insoles.
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i remember reading that study. but it's not a widely accepted hypothesis. i would recommend getting a scan to verify this. sometimes pain can be mental. if you have it in your head that your bones have misalignment then you would never feel normal even if it is not true. you might actually have a problem, in which case you can take precautions (like swimming for exercise and less jogging).
i have a feeling you wouldn't be in this mindset if you had broken both your femurs in an accident and had similar symptoms.
any case update here as you go! trust me it gets better.
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Is a CT scan really needed? Wouldn't plain x-rays suffice?
People should avoid getting CT scans whenever it is not medically needed.
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fair enough. x-rays might paint an equally accurate picture.
microbe, are you comfortable sharing x-rays here?
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Yes I'd be quite hesitant on getting a CT scan. I've had plenty of longleg x-rays that show the malalignment which the doctor used a programme to calculate the axis.
Update: I started walking with a walker around the room and reception area. My legs are feeling much better. However this wasn't the case earlier during the day as the incision sites would reach upto 8/10 on the pain scale, especially the distal incisions near the knees. Laying down in one position would make all incision sites worse, I did not have much energy to do physio and walking.
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It won't be clear since I've only got the physical copy. I'll post it soon using a camera soon.
fair enough. x-rays might paint an equally accurate picture.
microbe, are you comfortable sharing x-rays here?
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Glad to hear you're doing better Microbe.
Did your doctor give you a timetable for recovery? Probably ideal to take it easy for a few weeks.
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Glad to hear you're doing better Microbe.
Did your doctor give you a timetable for recovery? Probably ideal to take it easy for a few weeks.
Thanks bigdreams!
Doctor told me that I should be fully recovered around a three-four weeks.
I'm feeling much better now and the incision sites are not as painful, I think I may recover faster when the stitches come off in two weeks.
I walked alot with the aid of a walker last night and woke up feeling pretty good, with only slight stiffness and some difficulty flexing my knees.
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One thing i've noticed during both my LL and nail removal surgery is that my dominant, more muscular right leg is more resistant and painful compared to my less muscular left leg, which moves more freely with less pain. Knee flexing is the most problematic so far. I can walk without a walker but with little endurance along with a waddling gait. Hip region gets stiff and painful. My physio has recommended me to still use a walker.
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Post 1 week nail removal-
Pretty much waddling around my room during the day and go out to eat in the vicinity of my hotel, by foot. Walking is very slow with very obvious abnormal hip and back movement. I still have the dressing and the stitches on. Legs do become quite tight after walking for too long. My left less muscular leg feels more stable compared to my more muscular right leg, hence why I prefer using my left foot first when going up and down the stairs. My left leg is also more flexible and lighter while I cannot fully flex my right leg. My current medication routine contains antibiotics, painkillers, some tablets for gastro protection, prescribed probiotics and multivitamin. Mentally I feel exhausted, it's been an extremely long week.
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Almost over! Hope that the second week treats you better.
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Post 1 week nail removal-
Pretty much waddling around my room during the day and go out to eat in the vicinity of my hotel, by foot. Walking is very slow with very obvious abnormal hip and back movement. I still have the dressing and the stitches on. Legs do become quite tight after walking for too long. My left less muscular leg feels more stable compared to my more muscular right leg, hence why I prefer using my left foot first when going up and down the stairs. My left leg is also more flexible and lighter while I cannot fully flex my right leg. My current medication routine contains antibiotics, painkillers, some tablets for gastro protection, prescribed probiotics and multivitamin. Mentally I feel exhausted, it's been an extremely long week.
This isn't from a positive thread, but I thought you might find this specific (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=3069.msg46882#msg46882) post more positive. Read it and close the tab/thread.
No kidding about the mental exhaustion. I can't even imagine what it must be like at the moment. However, it will pass. Again, you deserve all of your own time.
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Thanks android and login for your support, these words really do encourage me to look forward and do my best to gain recovery! I read MDOW post about him recovering to around 90% in a year, which sounds reassuring, even despite the long post-removal time frame. I can also somehow sense that my legs feel better and lighter without the rods. It's just a matter of time, probably few weeks, few months, when I'll be able to tell whether the rod removal along with physio will improve the chronic left pain I faced post LL/pre removal. I will keep you guys updated.
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This is a current picture of my dressing on the left hip. There was some slight blood/plasma bleeding that I only noticed yesterday. The doctor will have it changed tomorrow. Plus you may notice some bruising/discoloration around the wound
(https://thumb.ibb.co/bunaeS/Image.jpg) (https://ibb.co/bunaeS)
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Thanks android and login for your support, these words really do encourage me to look forward and do my best to gain recovery! I read MDOW post about him recovering to around 90% in a year, which sounds reassuring, even despite the long post-removal time frame. I can also somehow sense that my legs feel better and lighter without the rods. It's just a matter of time, probably few weeks, few months, when I'll be able to tell whether the rod removal along with physio will improve the chronic left pain I faced post LL/pre removal. I will keep you guys updated.
Hey, man, Phineas Gage (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phineas_Gage) recovered and kept on living, and more amazingly, still being able to reason and live a socially normal life, after having had an iron rod shot straight through his skull. The human body is amazing if you give it some time. We wouldn't have lasted this long in this hostile-to-life-universe and planet without some serious potential (including the one you used for CLL - you grew your bones back from nothing to fill a big gap!).
A report of Gage's physical and mental condition shortly before his death implies that his most serious mental changes were temporary, so that in later life he was far more functional, and socially far better adapted, than in the years immediately following his accident.
Never lose hope. We never go down without a fight, have we ever have to rely on our body, or on what our minds can achieve (https://www.sciencealert.com/stem-cell-therapy-reverses-macular-degeneration-british-patients).
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2 Week Post Surgery-
Legs are feeling better and endurance is getting better day by day. However I'm still waddling with abnormal back movement. Pain from the wounds are still there at times, mainly arising from the feeling of stiffness or sudden movements. I'll be getting my dressing and stitches removed today and then I can have a proper shower. I struggle with climbing stairs with my right leg, so I prefer to use my left leg when going up the stairs. I have started to lay on my belly to do some flexion exercises, and it's my right leg that's giving me the most pain. The physio exercises are done without too much issues. So the highlight is that I've gained endurance and some speed while walking, however the waddling gait is still present and the wounds are still painful and stiff.
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One of the biggest affected regions with nail removal (along with nail insertion) is the hip region and unfortunately the abductor muscles are perhaps the most badly affected. The trauma and wound prevents proper hip abductor exercises, the best one being laying on the side and lifting the top leg. Laying on the side is still quite painful around the incision regions, and this causes the abductors to atrophy, leading to the waddling gait.
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One of the biggest affected regions with nail removal (along with nail insertion) is the hip region and unfortunately the abductor muscles are perhaps the most badly affected. The trauma and wound prevents proper hip abductor exercises, the best one being laying on the side and lifting the top leg. Laying on the side is still quite painful around the incision regions, and this causes the abductors to atrophy, leading to the waddling gait.
Couldn't agree more. I'm walking now without crutches now, about 4.5 months post-surgery, but waddling mostly because of weak abductor muscles. Been trying to strengthen them, but seems to take some time to rebuild the strength there. Microbe, do you remember how long it took you to regain most of your gait?
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Couldn't agree more. I'm walking now without crutches now, about 4.5 months post-surgery, but waddling mostly because of weak abductor muscles. Been trying to strengthen them, but seems to take some time to rebuild the strength there. Microbe, do you remember how long it took you to regain most of your gait?
Post initial LL surgery, it took me around 6 months to regain most of my gait, but I would struggle after walking long distances. Post nail removal (2.5 weeks) I'm still waddling.
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Thanks for the continued updates, despite the pains.
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Thanks for the continued updates, despite the pains.
No worries! I've been walking for couple kilometres for the past few days and I'm really happy to see my endurance increase. Waddling has decreased but still apparent. My pain from the incision has decreased except when I accidentally put pressure on it. Another thing I've noticed so far is that my left leg has not experienced the chronic pain I experienced before. I still think it's still quite early to conclude whether the nail removal and/or physio has actually helped. But I'll keep you updated on this matter in the upcoming months when it'll be reasonable to conclude whether the pain has settled or not.
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Hope that your chronic leg pain stays away, thanks for the updates!
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By the way, this is a quick summary (from 2011) of the much mentioned Alsberg (in this forum) and his research:
http://www.futurepundit.com/archives/008408.html
A lab discovery is a step toward implantable replacement cartilage, holding promise for knees, shoulders, ears and noses damaged by osteoarthritis, sports injuries and accidents.
Self-assembling sheets of mesenchymal stem cells permeated with tiny beads filled with growth factor formed thicker, stiffer cartilage than previous tissue engineering methods, researchers at Case Western Reserve University have found. A description of the research is published in the Journal of Controlled Release.
"We think that the capacity to drive cartilage formation using the patient's own stem cells and the potential to use this approach without lengthy culture time prior to implantation makes this technology attractive," said Eben Alsberg, associate professor in the departments of Biomedical Engineering and Orthopaedic Surgery, and senior author of the paper.
He's been at it for longer than 6 years since this article.
The future of his research, and stem-cell derived therapies in general, will be of greatly help for LLers in the future.
There was also much talk of the recent Israeli treatment. We need to see how that one goes.
http://thenationonlineng.net/doctors-implant-lab-grown/
I think your body will take care of the rest for you now that nails are removed, but science will keep trying no matter if you are doing totally fine in a year. :)
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Hi. If you don't mind, could you tell us your age at the time you did the surgery?
Or at least the range of age (like mid 20s, late 20s...something like a rough range)?
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Hi. If you don't mind, could you tell us your age at the time you did the surgery?
Or at least the range of age (like mid 20s, late 20s...something like a rough range)?
In my 20s
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I've finally managed to lay on my side with slight discomfort from the incision sites. As previously mentioned, my abductor muscles have become extremely weak and cannot raise each leg for than 15cm while laying on the side. My physio told me to first bend both legs while laying on the side and then lift the top leg while bent, resembling a shell fish. And then progress to straight leg raises.
After doing these exercises, my gait improves quite alot. However if I stay sedentary for too long then I regain my waddling gait.
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Post 3 weeks nail removal
-Regained around 80% of normal walking gait
-Sitting, staying in one position or walking for prolonged periods makes my legs sore and stiff, leading to abnormal gait
-Haven't experiencd the chronic pain in my left leg, however strangely, I'm experiencing similar pain in my right leg atm (most likely due to muscle atrophy, especially the abductor muscles)
-still have scabs on my wounds with new scars, and area is quite sensitive, problematic for sleeping on sides and doing abductor exercises.
-positive on making full recovery in couple of weeks, however this whole experience is mentally and physically exhausting, more so than my lengthening phase when I looked forward to growing taller. I know it sounds weird but yes this removal surgery has drained me. I never ever want to be under the knife again.
-went to see an orthotist and prescribed me a custom insoles for flat feet and descrepancy between legs
-I'll keep you guys updated
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I agree with you. These surgeries drain you. Many patients agree. Thanks for your input Microbe
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positive on making full recovery in couple of weeks, however this whole experience is mentally and physically exhausting, more so than my lengthening phase when I looked forward to growing taller.
Good point about not having something to look forward to compared to lengthening. Definitely heard similar sentiments before about removal surgery ("is this required?"). Hopefully in a few weeks your leg pain will subside for good, making this worth the effort.
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(http://i63.tinypic.com/dpk1sp.jpg)
Here is my last X-ray before the nail removal. It’s not very clear since I’ve only got a physical copy.
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Microbe, some anecdotal evidence: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=8915.0
Hope you've been doing good.
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Based on what the x-ray looks like, this wasn't Paley's work. That makes me breathe with a sign of relief.
I very briefly talked with a Paley patient (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=5547.0) who had his rods removed that morning. He was walking without assistance after the surgery.
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Microbe, some anecdotal evidence: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=8915.0
Hope you've been doing good.
Thanks Myloginacc.
Yes I'm doing much better and so far I haven't experienced the chronic pain that I experienced when I had the nails inside. I've been going to the gym and slowly working out my legs, something that I avoided, and most likely the reason for my chronic pain due to muscle atrophy. Feeling positive and much better. Thanks for all your support during this really tough time.
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Excellent news, Microbe. Keep it up!
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Excellent news, Microbe. Keep it up!
Thanks Android! You and Myloginacc were both really supportive and one of the main reasons why I kept on logging back to this account to give updates. Really appreciate the support.
This past few months have been extremely tough that left me severely depressed, reflected by some of my negative and pessimistic posts.
Now that I have nearly fully recovered from the nail removal, with no chronic pain, there has been a boost in positivity and improved mental state. I've lived my past 15 years, occupied by the thought of quickly ending it all, but now I feel I have to move on and look at the brighter things in life.
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remember, an unhappy mind only remembers a bad past
a happy mind can forgive everything and looks forward to life ;)
please continue to give updates.
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remember, an unhappy mind only remembers a bad past
a happy mind can forgive everything and looks forward to life ;)
please continue to give updates.
Really motivating quote, thanks Fokid! I will keep continue with the updates once every month, unless if something major related to LL or my legs happen.
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Man I'll be honest, you've scared me. I was ready for my first surgery 2 years ago, and mentally prepared for the removal, but a month long recovery process again.... of using a walker again. Those f*cked up abductors, waddling around again. Hell no
:-\ I'm just going to keep delaying my nail removal
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Man I'll be honest, you've scared me. I was ready for my first surgery 2 years ago, and mentally prepared for the removal, but a month long recovery process again.... of using a walker again. Those f*cked up abductors, waddling around again. Hell no
:-\ I'm just going to keep delaying my nail removal
Yes this was my personal experience, maybe it may be faster for you since individual recovery does vary. Perhaps my depression may have affected my recovery. But this wasn’t an easy process as I imagined it to be when I got my initial LL. I reckon people should allow at least two weeks for this removal. I was able to walk without aid a day after surgery (only used the walker for a half a day, immediately after surgery), however my gait and endurance gradually returned with each week. Abductors exercises were really hard to perform due to the incision sites, and this in my opinion was the major muscle affected. Gait was a major giveaway, an obvious sign of surgery, despite regaining my endurance, normal gait was affected with prolonged sitting, standing or walking, even after two weeks of surgery. Now I don’t have waddling gait, but it only occurs for a few seconds after sitting for prolonged periods
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Yes this was my personal experience, maybe it may be faster for you since individual recovery does vary. Perhaps my depression may have affected my recovery. But this wasn’t an easy process as I imagined it to be when I got my initial LL. I reckon people should allow at least two weeks for this removal. I was able to walk without aid a day after surgery (only used the walker for a half a day, immediately after surgery), however my gait and endurance gradually returned with each week. Abductors exercises were really hard to perform due to the incision sites, and this in my opinion was the major muscle affected. Gait was a major giveaway, an obvious sign of surgery, despite regaining my endurance, normal gait was affected with prolonged sitting, standing or walking, even after two weeks of surgery. Now I don’t have waddling gait, but it only occurs for a few seconds after sitting for prolonged periods
Have you ever had any pain/implications/trouble/health issues due to the surgery in these2 years? Would you recommend it to others? Femur vs tibia which is better according to you?
Thanks in advance!
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Have you ever had any pain/implications/trouble/health issues due to the surgery in these2 years? Would you recommend it to others? Femur vs tibia which is better according to you?
Thanks in advance!
I'm not the one you asked, but I'd recommend 2 inches split tibias femurs, or 6cm femur + 5cm tibias or so. If you have the mental fortitude and the money, obviously. Proportions do matter(for practical and aesthetic reasons both) and staying within the safe limit would have boosted my recovery time, or so I think
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For example, doing situps is weird for me because of long femurs. If I do them wearing heeled boots to make my tibias proportionate, they get easier.
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@ Microbe so your gait is still waddly a few seconds after sitting, 1.5 months post removal? :(
Was it like that before the op or was it totally normal?
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@ Microbe so your gait is still waddly a few seconds after sitting, 1.5 months post removal? :(
Was it like that before the op or was it totally normal?
This few seconds is not that concerning, literally only a few steps, unless if I stretch before walking then I don’t get the waddling gait. Plus it doesn’t occur that frequently.
Probably this may have been normal before my LL and removal and something I did not notice. It’s that feeling of discomfort after sitting for prolonged periods.
@totallyrad I’ll get back to your question soon
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The few seconds may not be concerning by itself, but it shows how far back in muscle recovery one gets sent. For example, I had that till a year post op or so. Having it again would mean getting sent back 10 months. :( I'll quit sharing my fears now, this is your thread
On the bright side, you'll be better off eventually after doing nail removal. Do you think, for you, it's eventually gonna be like LL never happened?
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I'm not the one you asked, but I'd recommend 2 inches split tibias femurs, or 6cm femur + 5cm tibias or so. If you have the mental fortitude and the money, obviously. Proportions do matter(for practical and aesthetic reasons both) and staying within the safe limit would have boosted my recovery time, or so I think
I actually wanted to ask from Penguin sir only...just quoted the wrong quote.
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The few seconds may not be concerning by itself, but it shows how far back in muscle recovery one gets sent. For example, I had that till a year post op or so. Having it again would mean getting sent back 10 months. :( I'll quit sharing my fears now, this is your thread
On the bright side, you'll be better off eventually after doing nail removal. Do you think, for you, it's eventually gonna be like LL never happened?
Yes it does, it’s an invasive surgery after all and shouldn’t be taken lightly.
I’m hoping that it would feel like LL had never happened, however there will be scars to remind me of the procedure. Guess there is no running away from it.
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Have you ever had any pain/implications/trouble/health issues due to the surgery in these2 years? Would you recommend it to others? Femur vs tibia which is better according to you?
Thanks in advance!
Yes I did experience chronic pain after a year post LL. Fortunately this wasn’t due to premature arthritis but the doctor suspected it was due to muscle atrophy which in turn caused muscle fatigue. The nail may have also contributed to the pain too.
Now that the nail is removed and intense physio of the legs, I haven’t experienced the chronic pain.
According to me, the safest route would be to external tibias, something that I was planning to do after my femurs. The reason is that it’s the least invasive, no reaming, lower risk of embolism, ability to have full control with the fixators. However the duration of the frames, pinsite infections and the scars are problematic. I personally would avoid any nailing to the tibias.
Internal femurs would be more comfortable,but it’s way more invasive than externals, higher risk of embolism, deep infection. Nail failure, cost and nail removal surgery are also things to think about.
It depends on how much you want to lengthen. If it’s a reasonable amount then you could aim for either external tibias or internal femurs, otherwise if you want to lengthen extreme amount, split it, as penguin mentioned above.
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The few seconds may not be concerning by itself, but it shows how far back in muscle recovery one gets sent. For example, I had that till a year post op or so. Having it again would mean getting sent back 10 months. :( I'll quit sharing my fears now, this is your thread
On the bright side, you'll be better off eventually after doing nail removal. Do you think, for you, it's eventually gonna be like LL never happened?
Face the fire and get the nail removed ASAP. The faster you do it the faster it's over with and you'll get on with your life. You'll hate the decisions you make less when you do the things that you truly wish you did.
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According to me, the safest route would be to external tibias, something that I was planning to do after my femurs. The reason is that it’s the least invasive, no reaming, lower risk of embolism, ability to have full control with the fixators. However the duration of the frames, pinsite infections and the scars are problematic. I personally would avoid any nailing to the tibias.
Internal femurs would be more comfortable,but it’s way more invasive than externals, higher risk of embolism, deep infection. Nail failure, cost and nail removal surgery are also things to think about.
i don't know why almost all doctors prefer to do internals if money is not a problem. i think dr paley has even stopped doing externals altogether for CLL. externals are lighter on the bone, but harsher on soft tissues and muscles.
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i don't know why almost all doctors prefer to do internals if money is not a problem. i think dr paley has even stopped doing externals altogether for CLL. externals are lighter on the bone, but harsher on soft tissues and muscles.
I think it’s mainly due to better patient comfort, and internals being relatively easier to perform compared to externals.
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Face the fire and get the nail removed ASAP. The faster you do it the faster it's over with and you'll get on with your life. You'll hate the decisions you make less when you do the things that you truly wish you did.
It's not just fear. This will need a long vacation and I won't have that for a long time.
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-No chronic pain so far
-Did some jogging today and I couldn't believe how much better it feels without the nail inside
-So far I can say confidently that the nail removal has done wonders
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-No chronic pain so far
-Did some jogging today and I couldn't believe how much better it feels without the nail inside
-So far I can say confidently that the nail removal has done wonders
That's so awesome! You certainly deserve it after all this time dealing with the pain.
Very glad to hear it and hoping it never comes back.
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-No chronic pain so far
-Did some jogging today and I couldn't believe how much better it feels without the nail inside
-So far I can say confidently that the nail removal has done wonders
Awesome. Until now I thought removal would make barely any difference because well, the nails are inside your bones..
Did jogging make your legs tired much quicker than pre-LL, prior to removal? That's my case. If removal can cure that, that'd be great. I'll get it done next year.
Also do you think it's the screws that cause more problems than the nail while inside your body? I can't imagine how the nails cause problems.
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That's so awesome! You certainly deserve it after all this time dealing with the pain.
Very glad to hear it and hoping it never comes back.
Thanks myloginacc!
Awesome. Until now I thought removal would make barely any difference because well, the nails are inside your bones..
Did jogging make your legs tired much quicker than pre-LL, prior to removal? That's my case. If removal can cure that, that'd be great. I'll get it done next year.
Also do you think it's the screws that cause more problems than the nail while inside your body? I can't imagine how the nails cause problems.
Yes I too believed that removal won't do much difference, but my jogging felt noticeably alot better compared to when I had the nails inside my femurs. With the nails inside, my legs felt unusally tight and heavy when I jogged, and yes my legs would become tired much quicker than pre-LL. I suspect that it may be due to the weight of the nails, they're quite heavy and the legs may not be able to handle the extra weight properly. I also reckon that it could be due to the screws since it protrudes outside of the bone and the possible interference with the muscles, causing legs to feel awkward when jogging.
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Hey everyone!
Haven't updated in quite awhile...
Frankly there's nothing much for me to talk about except that I haven't experienced the pain that I experienced prior to nail removal.
Nail removal has worked wonders for me and I would highly suggest people to remove the rods if they are experincing chronic pain with nails inside.
Plus don't forget to workout your legs. The only thing that's really bothering me right now are the hyperpigmented scars. I hope they do fade but I have accepted that they will be permanent regardless of scar fading procedures out there.
For those people that had been following me since the beginning of this year would know about my mental issues I have been facing, fortunately in this current time, my depression and anxiety issues have gradually improved, although I'm still on antidepressants, which I don't think I'll ever give up, the side effects of giving them up are horrendous. The nail removal has over time improved my mental state, although I must admit that the first month after removal was absolutely chaotic!
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Were you antidepression medicines before your surgery also?
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Thanks for the update.
All the best with the anxiety and depression issues. Good news that the nail has improved your mental state. Hopefully there are other extrinsic factors that you can find and sort that will further improve your mental state
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I don't know but I see some gloominess in you even now. Is it true if yes why is it so?
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So you lengthened 6 cm on both Femurs or Tibias ?
and do you think your choice of either lead to more pain and side effects ?
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Hey everyone!
Haven't updated in quite awhile...
Frankly there's nothing much for me to talk about except that I haven't experienced the pain that I experienced prior to nail removal.
Nail removal has worked wonders for me and I would highly suggest people to remove the rods if they are experincing chronic pain with nails inside.
Plus don't forget to workout your legs. The only thing that's really bothering me right now are the hyperpigmented scars. I hope they do fade but I have accepted that they will be permanent regardless of scar fading procedures out there.
For those people that had been following me since the beginning of this year would know about my mental issues I have been facing, fortunately in this current time, my depression and anxiety issues have gradually improved, although I'm still on antidepressants, which I don't think I'll ever give up, the side effects of giving them up are horrendous. The nail removal has over time improved my mental state, although I must admit that the first month after removal was absolutely chaotic!
Glad to hear from you, Microbe.
After the big leap in terms of physical pain, I'm wishing you'll be achieve another in terms of your mental health! I'm sure it's also just a matter of time for this one, too.
Supra et ultra.