Limb Lengthening Forum
Community Hangout => Off Topic => Topic started by: MoveUp on March 20, 2018, 01:35:26 PM
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I am a Googler addict... I often Google celebrities and their spouses and notice that many male athletes, musicians, and celbs who are of average height or tall go for tall women (5' 8" and up).
If height implies protection, attractiveness, and manliness to a woman, why shouldn't short and petite imply femininity to a man? It is bizarre to me that many men don't care about height and even prefer tall girls in many cases, when you would think that sexual dichotomy would be desirable on both ends...
I prefer the petite type btw. Just wondering if anyone has a theory about this or gave it any though.
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Most men don't prefer tall girls, most men want their partner to be shorter than themselves. It's true that women care more about height than men when it comes to choosing a partner. However, it's not true that most men don't care about height or prefer taller women.
This study (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/alison-denisco/dating-women-men-whos-taller_b_1527117.html) showed that only 4% of women could accept being with a shorter guy while 24% of men could accept being with a taller women. So 76% of men also care about height when it comes to partners.
Still, women seem to care more. Why is that? Perhaps there are biological reasons, and female sxxuality is less diverse than men's. Perhaps there are cultural reasons, perhaps both factors play a role. Perhaps men care more about a woman's body shape than her height (hips, breasts, ass). We don't know for sure.
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Most of this thread is going to be anecdotal evidence, anecdotal discussion and shoddy studies.
What is true is that men generally prefer partners who are shorter, even if just a little bit, and that men also care less if women are taller than them. A good chunk does prefer taller/tall women, while the opposite is not very true with women and men shorter than themselves. Which is not say there are no women who wouldn't date or marry shorter guys. I personally know 3 examples in my life of stable relationships where the man is shorter.
In any case, life is easier if you think of people as the individuals they are instead of assuming anecdotes about large swathes of people to be invariably true in their statistics.
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^ That's why I posted an actual study that is not just anecdotal evidence.
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^ That's why I posted an actual study that is not just anecdotal evidence.
There are many of those types of studies. This one has a low sample size and paints one of grimmest pictures I've seen by any of them. I'm all for facing a harsh reality of life head-on, but this one doesn't reflect what I see. Then again, it could be that American women are that much of size queens. The American friends here would have to tell me.
Even the studies I've seen that relied on bots extracting data from thousands of online dating profiles (where people can be pickier) provided a cheerier picture:
(https://i.imgur.com/ms3hEfv.png)
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Lol who likes tall women? Their skulls and upper bodies look manly AF... after 5’5 women start looking a bit weird IMO, and they’re usually way less estrogenic, but maybe I’d feel differently if I was taller.
I think it’s the same for men, to be fair. Below 5’5 and their shoulders are too small and skulls are not long enough to appear that dimorphic.
I think men go for women who are the most dimorphic and feminine, so small pretty faces, thin body, wide hips/small waist, etc...
I’ve never heard any guys talk about liking taller women, more common is guys who like the estrogenic bombshell girls who are like 5’1 5’2 with curvy features.
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that's bs, I see a lot of couples where the girl is slighty taller than her boyfriend. But rarely more than 5 cm
Modelling influenced a lot height perception since most models are about 5'9+
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There is indeed a prominent tall preference for both se xes, but there isn't one for short men. There is a dwarf fetish, but we're too tall for that!
And indeed, women want taller men more than men want shorter women (https://www.researchgate.net/publication/236116728_Women_want_taller_men_more_than_men_want_shorter_women), and the desired height difference is much higher for women. The preference (not saying requirement) is strong.
Logically we know that height means less now, that our bank account and confidence are what protect us from harm in the new reality. But it's hard to shake centuries of conditioning, not to mention we respect and revere tall authoritative figures starting at a young age. That association is hard to shake.
Also, perhaps it's just bias (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belief_bias) on your part. You have a belief, and therefore you start to see a pattern (we're all victims of this). Lastly, don't forget that many celebrity couple photos are at events, and therefore the women are wearing stiletto heels.
Just saw the chart as I was about to post. Honestly those numbers look discouraging from my point of view, this is definitely how it felt using online dating: less than 10% chance of interaction (because they have to be interested in your other qualities too, and distance is a big factor). It makes sense that people of above-average height will compromise and consider shorter people, since selection pool is smaller. It's like a short man looking to date a shorter woman, it's a very small group to pick from (at least it was at my height, which is coincidentally the average for an American woman). I too had to raise my height preference since I ran out of people to look through.
What's tough is that there's a lot of competition at my height, so you have to make it up with a great profile. Swiping apps like Tinder were useless for me. I've had a handful of dates in the past year, mostly non-white Americans ranging 5'1" to 5'3", so it's totally doable. Just a bit tougher!
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that's bs, I see a lot of couples where the girl is slighty taller than her boyfriend. But rarely more than 5 cm
Modelling influenced a lot height perception since most models are about 5'9+
My cousin is 5'9 and married to a 6 feet woman, and not in a country where she didn't have the option of taller men.
Different types of people are different. His wife is someone who does not place the most weight on appearance. She was also already older when they married. A lot of these studies would look differently if they interviewed enough 30yo+ women.
As for myself, I have my preferences in appearance, just like anyone else, but I'd never reject someone based solely on their height. I prefer shorter than myself, but I wouldn't reject taller - no matter how tall.
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Western women have a lot of contradictory criteria. But finally their criteria become more realistic. They realize that 6'5 men are rarely beautiful, but 6'1 stay the most sides
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My cousin is 5'9 and married to a 6 feet woman, and not in a country where she didn't have the option of taller men.
Different types of people are different. His wife is someone who does not place the most weight on appearance. She was also already older when they married. A lot of these studies would look differently if they interviewed enough 30yo+ women.
As for myself, I have my preferences in appearance, just like anyone else, but I'd never reject someone based solely on their height. I prefer shorter than myself, but I wouldn't reject taller - no matter how tall.
6ft for a woman starts to be a bit too much. The few 6ft women I have seen were closer to the rhinoceros than to a model
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From my personal experience taller woman are more open-minded towards dating shorter man. That's why it's not unusual to see 5'11" woman to date 5'8"-5'10" guy or 5'8" girl even shorter man. Shorter girls desire taller guys, because subconsciously they seek taller offspring. I have a 5'9"cousin and her bf is noticeably shorter.
The main reason why so many famous men are dating taller women is because they are confident. When they are rich and famous height is only a minor flaw.
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Sorry, double post :(
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Just saw the chart as I was about to post. Honestly those numbers look discouraging from my point of view, this is definitely how it felt using online dating: less than 10% chance of interaction (because they have to be interested in your other qualities too, and distance is a big factor). It makes sense that people of above-average height will compromise and consider shorter people, since selection pool is smaller. It's like a short man looking to date a shorter woman, it's a very small group to pick from (at least it was at my height, which is coincidentally the average for an American woman). I too had to raise my height preference since I ran out of people to look through.
What's tough is that there's a lot of competition at my height, so you have to make it up with a great profile. Swiping apps like Tinder were useless for me. I've had a handful of dates in the past year, mostly non-white Americans ranging 5'1" to 5'3", so it's totally doable. Just a bit tougher!
You have to realize that chart is from online dating and a lot of young women with very unrealistic standards.
The numbers there are still better than:
But a whopping 89 percent of women said the shortest person they would date would still have to be taller than them. Only seven percent would accept someone who was their height, and just four percent would allow for a shorter guy.
As in the first study posted. Those are ridiculous numbers.
Also, don't think I didn't notice the way you worked around those censors/word filters. You're one sly mofo.
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From my personal experience taller woman are more open-minded towards dating shorter man. That's why it's not unusual to see 5'11" woman to date 5'8"-5'10" guy or 5'8" girl even shorter man. Shorter girls desire taller guys, because subconsciously they seek taller offspring. I have a 5'9"cousin and her bf is noticeably shorter.
The main reason why so many famous men are dating taller women is because they are confident. When they are rich and famous height is only a minor flaw.
This is why I think some of the very short guys here should try going for the tallest women they can find. I know the fear of ridicule and rejection is a strong one, but it'd even balance out the height in their children!
They could maybe even find someone like my cousin did. He's not rich or good-looking by any means (quite the contrary), so I also don't want to hear from other people here that she was settling down for him due to things like that.
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Phew, what's with the hate for tall women? Reminds me of spiteful women on Twitter saying that short men shouldn't exist.
Realistic anecdotes by myloginacct and ivan, I've observed similar; confidence is key. And yes, age makes a huge contribution as well; the older we get, the more importance we place on companionship above physical attraction. Men are quite notorious for their youth preference (https://theblog.okcupid.com/the-case-for-an-older-woman-99d8cabacdf5) too (which I'm guilty of):
The median 31 year-old guy, for example, sets his allowable match age range from 22 to 35 — nine years younger, but only four years older, than himself. This skewed mindset worsens with age; the median 42 year-old will accept a woman up to fifteen years younger, but no more than three years older.
On the flip side, women in their early 20s want nothing to do with a younger guy. There are just so many factors.
I agree myloginacct, guess we just need more data. Hopefully Justin Bieber has helped to lower height requirements! And yep, I'm very sneaky.
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Phew, what's with the hate for tall women? Reminds me of spiteful women on Twitter saying that short men shouldn't exist.
Realistic anecdotes by myloginacct and ivan, I've observed similar; confidence is key. And yes, age makes a huge contribution as well; the older we get, the more importance we place on companionship above physical attraction. Men are quite notorious for their youth preference (https://theblog.okcupid.com/the-case-for-an-older-woman-99d8cabacdf5) too (which I'm guilty of):
On the flip side, women in their early 20s want nothing to do with a younger guy. There are just so many factors.
I agree myloginacct, guess we just need more data. Hopefully Justin Bieber has helped to lower height requirements!
Yes, there is a lot of hypocrisy here. Many talk about women as objects to be had, want only the best looking ones, greatly prefer only the petite ones... You know, literally all of the things that get a lot here hurt and indignant when they hear it being done in reverse: the women who prefer only the tall guys, only want anything to do with the good looking ones, and think of men as their cash banks.
As for your other point, even in the chart I posted 45% of American women would choose equal or smaller at 5'9 (52% for non-American). And I'm assuming a 5'9 male is not a problem for the heights under that. So you could even call that the Justin Bieber threshold if you want. Jk.
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Okay, so you are getting limb lengthening surgery to be a nice friendly, "confident" guy and date a fat 30+ year old mom? Lmao good move. This is the real world. People have preferences. There is no tall woman hate. If a tall woman asked me on a date I'd give her a chance, but she wouldn't be my first choice. If a short man asked for a date, you'd see this:
(https://i.imgur.com/aheGfwu.png)
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Okay, so you are getting limb lengthening surgery to be a nice friendly, "confident" guy and date a fat 30+ year old mom? Lmao good move. This is the real world. People have preferences. There is no tall woman hate. If a tall woman asked me on a date I'd give her a chance, but she wouldn't be my first choice. If a short man asked for a date, you'd see this:
(https://i.imgur.com/aheGfwu.png)
Biased sample of one.
Not everyone in this world is a shxthead, no matter the gender.
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Okay, so you are getting limb lengthening surgery to be a nice guy and date a fat 30+ year old mom? Lol good move. This is the real world. People have preferences. There is no tall woman hate. If a tall woman asked me on a date I'd give her a chance, but she wouldn't be my first choice. If a short man asked for a date, you'd see this:
You sound somewhat reasonable this time around (at least imaginary tall girl's getting a chance, much like how short guys get a chance); I guess it was hyperbole before. Night and day over "who likes tall women" (suggesting all men feel this way), so that's good to hear. And yes, we have preferences and that's fine (like you said, it may even change once you're taller); the language just seemed a bit restrictive before.
The Twitter screenshot, yes, exact aggregator account I was referencing. Your earlier comment reminded me of it.
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Okay, so you are getting limb lengthening surgery to be a nice friendly, "confident" guy and date a fat 30+ year old mom? Lmao good move. This is the real world. People have preferences. There is no tall woman hate. If a tall woman asked me on a date I'd give her a chance, but she wouldn't be my first choice. If a short man asked for a date, you'd see this:
(https://i.imgur.com/aheGfwu.png)
that's really the kind of women you want ? that's typically a Saxon behaviour
you could find the same tweets about short / tall women
going to that kind of twitter profils ("exposing heightism") is like sadomasochism, you have to be stupid to do that while IRL people are clearly different
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Biased sample of one.
Not everyone in this world is a shxthead, no matter the gender.
Wake up and smell the coffee man. There are thousands of tweets like this, and this is how society in general views short men. These minority opinions aren't minority opinions, everyone has them underlying but only a few women are vocal and cray enough to voice them. There is no other reason why shorter men are paid less, why they commit suicide twice as much, oh wait I know you probably don't accept those statistics because those short guys weren't "confident and charismatic." I've said it before and I've said it again, people view short men as Danny Devitos/jokes basically and that's why we're here getting LL, I don't care about being tall, I'd just like to be seen NORMALLY.
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Wake up and smell the coffee man. There are thousands of tweets like this, and this is how society in general views short men. These minority opinions aren't minority opinions, everyone has them underlying but only a few women are vocal and cray enough to voice them. There is no other reason why shorter men are paid less, why they commit suicide twice as much, oh wait I know you probably don't accept those statistics because those short guys weren't "confident and charismatic." I've said it before and I've said it again, people view short men as Danny Devitos/jokes basically and that's why we're here getting LL, I don't care about being tall, I'd just like to be seen NORMALLY.
"twitter"
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that's really the kind of women you want ? that's typically a Saxon behaviour
you could find the same tweets about short / tall women
going to that kind of twitter profils ("exposing heightism") is like sadomasochism, you have to be stupid to do that while IRL people are clearly different
It's not 1400, there is no "Saxon" behavior, this is how modern privileged women with no restrictions or limits on their life behave in the first world. It just so happens unfortunately that they also usually happen to be the most attractive.
Also, no, people in real life are not different. It's just like racism, sxxism, every other -ism. They all still exist in great quantities, but people are afraid to talk about them now because they don't want to lose their jobs. What people feel, say, and tell each other behind closed doors is different than what they portray to the world.
Mostly because these are biological problems. You can change what someone says, but you will never, EVER, EVER change what they biologically feel. Women will never find short men attractive, men will never be interested in trannies, people of different races will never see each other the same or experience as much empathy as they naturally do for same race individuals, it's just reality. You can not fight biology with "being nice" kum ba ya propaganda. Biology will override the pleasantries eventually, and someone will get hurt.
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Wow, wasn't expecting so many comments. Nice points raised, seems like I'm not crazy that tall women are less attractive, and someone made a point about the pictures being taken at events often have the women in 4" heels.
Still, I feel that many famous men date tall women, but this is probably for vanity that there is something about a tall woman, maybe even more than a tall man that sticks out, even though the general population of men prefer short or at least shorter and petite women with small waist, narrow shoulders, gentile voice...
Anyway, I think what women say and do are often different and most won't follow the requirement chart posted in real life interactions.
I have also googled for short men fetish or sites for women looking for short men, but these don't exist. For some odd reason, there might be an exception for dwarf men.
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It's not 1400, there is no "Saxon" behavior, this is how modern privileged women with no restrictions or limits on their life behave in the first world. It just so happens unfortunately that they also usually happen to be the most attractive.
Also, no, people in real life are not different. It's just like racism, sxxism, every other -ism. They all still exist in great quantities, but people are afraid to talk about them now because they don't want to lose their jobs. What people feel, say, and tell each other behind closed doors is different than what they portray to the world.
Mostly because these are biological problems. You can change what someone says, but you will never, EVER, EVER change what they biologically feel. Women will never find short men attractive, men will never be interested in trannies, people of different races will never see each other the same or experience as much empathy as they naturally do for same race individuals, it's just reality. You can not fight biology with "being nice" kum ba ya propaganda. Biology will override the pleasantries eventually, and someone will get hurt.
where you from ?
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Wow, wasn't expecting so many comments. Nice points raised, seems like I'm not crazy that tall women are less attractive, and someone made a point about the pictures being taken at events often have the women in 4" heels.
Still, I feel that many famous men date tall women, but this is probably for vanity that there is something about a tall woman, maybe even more than a tall man that sticks out, even though the general population of men prefer short or at least shorter and petite women with small waist, narrow shoulders, gentile voice...
Anyway, I think what women say and do are often different and most won't follow the requirement chart posted in real life interactions.
I have also googled for short men fetish or sites for women looking for short men, but these don't exist. For some odd reason, there might be an exception for dwarf men.
what you consider tall is about 5-7/5-11 ? because after 6ft it's not really the case
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Cap: there's the fact that younger people say more stupid things to get attention, so there's that. We tend to be harsher toward people we don't understand as well, and usually it's from insecurity; maybe she's using short men as an excuse for not attracting the right kind of men.
I do believe that most people are sensible, and that people like the girl in the tweet are just a loud minority (still echoing today...). For instance women may turn down a short guy because she prefers a taller guy, but most won't resent short guys. I'm sure that men who prefer prettier and skinnier women don't necessarily hate unattractive or overweight women. It's just "no thanks, not my type" and move on.
MoveUp: no kidding, it's getting warm in here!
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what you consider tall is about 5-7/5-11 ? because after 6ft it's not really the case
Exactly, 6ft is very rare and that's entering freakishly tall
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Cap: there's the fact that younger people say more stupid things to get attention, so there's that. We tend to be harsher toward people we don't understand as well, and usually it's from insecurity; maybe she's using short men as an excuse for not attracting the right kind of men.
I do believe that most people are sensible, and that people like the girl in the tweet are just a loud minority (still echoing today...). For instance women may turn down a short guy because she prefers a taller guy, but most won't resent short guys. I'm sure that men who prefer prettier and skinnier women don't necessarily hate unattractive or overweight women. It's just "no thanks, not my type" and move on.
MoveUp: no kidding, it's getting warm in here!
IMO, women are irritated by the existence and presence of short men in the same way men are irritated by fat women. It’s not only indifference but resentment and annoyance.
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IMO, women are irritated by the existence and presence of short men in the same way men are irritated by fat women. It’s not only indifference but resentment and annoyance.
definitively stupid
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IMO, women are irritated by the existence and presence of short men in the same way men are irritated by fat women. It’s not only indifference but resentment and annoyance.
I don't buy it. The comparison has "some" validity but it is pretty universal that almost all men don't find fat women attractive, but the other is definitely not true. And anyone who thinks a 5' 6" good looking guy (Jose Altuve?) is in the same class as a fat woman is seeing through distorted lenses
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IMO, women are irritated by the existence and presence of short men in the same way men are irritated by fat women. It’s not only indifference but resentment and annoyance.
Utter nonsense!
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Utter nonsense!
Obviously, it's mental.
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IMO, women are irritated by the existence and presence of short men in the same way men are irritated by fat women. It’s not only indifference but resentment and annoyance.
This could be because men are expected to make the first move, so women on the receiving end are more inclined to complain. Being bombarded by a type of person that you're not attracted to would brew resentment (because some will blow up and ask why, why, why); you'd notice a pattern and maybe even construct stereotypes.
I wonder if that means that those who don't use online dating, or social media for that matter, are more forgiving on average.
Phew, I'm tired. Have fun.
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IMO, women are irritated by the existence and presence of short men in the same way men are irritated by fat women. It’s not only indifference but resentment and annoyance.
You are so sad
How long it will take for u to acknowledge that human attraction isn't in binary system. It's more complicated than you think.
Tbh readin some of the stuff here im aint surprised some of u can't score lmao
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This is why I think some of the very short guys here should try going for the tallest women they can find. I know the fear of ridicule and rejection is a strong one, but it'd even balance out the height in their children!
They could maybe even find someone like my cousin did. He's not rich or good-looking by any means (quite the contrary), so I also don't want to hear from other people here that she was settling down for him due to things like that.
This is by far the stupidest and most irresponsible cope I've heard uttered either by short men or by others toward short men. Reproducing with a tall woman doesn't guarantee having tall children. There are people on this forum whose parents are taller than them, for fk's sake.
There's no way you could spin this plan to make it sound like it isn't a massive and potentially damaging (toward the offspring) cope. Eugenically selecting a tall woman for "tall offspring" won't solve your problems. You will still be short, people will still humiliate and demean you, (possibly even more now that you have a woman who dwarfs you in size), nothing in your life will change. If you get incredibly lucky and your offspring inherit the woman's genes, then THEY will have a great life, but that's none of YOUR business and you don't have the right to feel good or proud about that because it has nothing to do with YOU. Claims to the contrary essentially boil down to living vicariously through your child, which I doubt even the worst virtue-signallers on this forum or outside it would try to pass off as "moral".
The one and only solution for men who are short is getting taller.
"twitter"
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Don't see what the problem is? Social media is a solid means of ascertaining people's beliefs or attitudes. This is another stupid cope by positivity cultists on "hugbox"/"mental support" forums (which this section is rapidly becoming). Being on the internet, whether anonymously or not, doesn't fundamentally "change" a person. This idiotic fantasy that gets parroted as the GIFT ("Greater Internet F*ckwad Theory") that became a meme in the early 2000's is nothing but that, a fantasy. Posting on the internet doesn't "make you say bad things :((((", it removes your inhibitions so you say what you really believe.
In fact, the more anonymous the media (forums like this one where all you have is a username and maybe e-mail connecting to your identity), the more accurately a person's statements reflect their true beliefs and attitudes, because unlike in real life, people on the internet don't have to sugarcoat, mince words, misrepresent the truth, or otherwise LIE or VIRTUE SIGNAL in order to preserve the politically-correct status quo or otherwise save face.
This could be because men are expected to make the first move, so women on the receiving end are more inclined to complain. Being bombarded by a type of person that you're not attracted to would brew resentment (because some will blow up and ask why, why, why); you'd notice a pattern and maybe even construct stereotypes.
I wonder if that means that those who don't use online dating, or social media for that matter, are more forgiving on average.
Phew, I'm tired. Have fun.
Women who don't use online dating or social media are "more forgiving on average" precisely because they don't have access online dating or social media, which are the tools that women use in the modern day that grant them easy access to the most desirable men within a [X] mile radius.
Of course a woman who can't boot up Tinder and sift through thousands of men cherrypicking only the ones that meet their increasingly unrealistic expectations is "more forgiving" and therefore more likely to settle (note the word used here) for a man she isn't genuinely physically attracted to. That doesn't mean she's somehow "better" than the women who are on Tinder or other social media. It just means she's less well-equipped.
Wake up and smell the coffee man. There are thousands of tweets like this, and this is how society in general views short men. These minority opinions aren't minority opinions, everyone has them underlying but only a few women are vocal and cray enough to voice them. There is no other reason why shorter men are paid less, why they commit suicide twice as much, oh wait I know you probably don't accept those statistics because those short guys weren't "confident and charismatic." I've said it before and I've said it again, people view short men as Danny Devitos/jokes basically and that's why we're here getting LL, I don't care about being tall, I'd just like to be seen NORMALLY.
100% accurate and exactly what I've been saying on this forum from day one.
"Confidence", "charisma", "personality" are virtue-signalling fantasies of positivity cultists. These things do not exist, or if they do, they are IRRELEVANT when it comes to interpersonal interactions when compared to looks. In point of fact, numerous studies suggest that "confidence" and "personality" are in fact a function of your LOOKS, which includes your height:
https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/abs/10.1002/per.2087
Abstract
We evaluated five competing hypotheses about what predicts romantic interest. Through a half‐block quasi‐experimental design, a large sample of young adults (i.e. responders; n = 335) viewed videos of opposite‐sex persons (i.e. targets) talking about themselves, and responders rated the targets' traits and their romantic interest in the target. We tested whether similarity, dissimilarity or overall trait levels on mate value, physical attractiveness, life history strategy and the Big Five personality factors predicted romantic interest at zero acquaintance and whether sex acted as a moderator. We tested the responders' individual perception of the targets' traits, in addition to the targets' own self‐reported trait levels and a consensus rating of the targets made by the responders. We used polynomial regression with response surface analysis within multilevel modelling to test support for each of the hypotheses. Results suggest a large sex difference in trait perception; when women rated men, they agreed in their perception more often than when men rated women. However, as a predictor of romantic interest, there were no sex differences. Only the responders' perception of the targets' physical attractiveness predicted romantic interest; specifically, responders' who rated the targets' physical attractiveness as higher than themselves reported more romantic interest.
https://theblog.okcupid.com/we-experiment-on-human-beings-5dd9fe280cd5
Here’s some data I dug up from the backup tapes. Each dot here is a person. The two scores are within a half point of each other for 92% of the sample after just 25 votes (and that percentage approaches 100% as vote totals get higher).
(https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/0*S-8DsgmWHAqjAPoL.png)
In short, according to our users, “looks” and “personality” were the same thing, which of course makes perfect sense because, you know, this young female account holder, with a 99th percentile personality:
What you say/the way you talk ("GAME") doesn't matter:
After we got rid of the two scales, and replaced it with just one, we ran a direct experiment to confirm our hunch — that people just look at the picture. We took a small sample of users and half the time we showed them, we hid their profile text. That generated two independent sets of scores for each profile, one score for “the picture and the text together” and one for “the picture alone.” Here’s how they compare. Again, each dot is a user. Essentially, the text is less than 10% of what people think of you.
(https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/0*d_Nf--H9Y4aeLAYU.png)
So, your picture is worth that fabled thousand words, but your actual words are worth…almost nothing.
CONCLUSION: "Confidence", "personality", "game", "charisma", etc are all just codewords for being conventionally attractive - that means facially handsome, tall, etc.
The sooner everyoneone with a looks-related issue internalizes this, the sooner they'll start demanding actual solutions (i.e. more and better surgeries) to solve their problems rather than coping with a ton of bullsh*t that will NEVER, EVER come close to solving anything ("therapy", "working on your 'confidence'", etc)
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This is by far the stupidest and most irresponsible cope I've heard uttered either by short men or by others toward short men. Reproducing with a tall woman doesn't guarantee having tall children. There are people on this forum whose parents are taller than them, for fk's sake.
There's no way you could spin this plan to make it sound like it isn't a massive and potentially damaging (toward the offspring) cope. Eugenically selecting a tall woman for "tall offspring" won't solve your problems. You will still be short, people will still humiliate and demean you, (possibly even more now that you have a woman who dwarfs you in size), nothing in your life will change. If you get incredibly lucky and your offspring inherit the woman's genes, then THEY will have a great life, but that's none of YOUR business and you don't have the right to feel good or proud about that because it has nothing to do with YOU. Claims to the contrary essentially boil down to living vicariously through your child, which I doubt even the worst virtue-signallers on this forum or outside it would try to pass off as "moral".
The one and only solution for men who are short is getting taller.
But this is exactly what short women generally do. And I didn't say it was for "tall offspring". They tend to go for the taller males so they have average height offspring. I'm not suggesting to stay with a woman just because she is tall, but was suggesting to maybe to focus your attempts (if you are thick-skinned against ridicule and rejection) towards the taller women. The chances are low, but you could find someone you click with among the tall ones, and have most likely average height children.
And I've already mentioned I generally somewhat agree with your last point, but then what? Imagine you got as tall as you wanted to be. You still have short genes. If you want to have kids and not want to risk a short man existence for them, then you need to analyze your options. I see it as thinking of the kid's future, which I'm sure is what many short women do.
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But this is exactly what short women generally do.
The difference is short women don't do it so they can live vicariously through their offspring. They do it because they're attracted to tall men (just like the overwhelming majority of women who do not have some weird, disgusting fetish or another). Their short stature is tangential. They'd want a tall man no matter what their height, unless they've got a weird fetish.
In general, short women's lives are nowhere near as miserable as short men's are, and they do not face anywhere near the same amount of discrimination as short men do (I don't think anyone will contest this).
And I didn't say it was for "tall offspring". They tend to go for the taller males so they have average height offspring.
They tend to go for taller males because women are attracted to tall men. Women aren't consciously selecting tall men because they're thinking about the height of their offspring. Sexual dimorphism is attractive on a SUBCONSCIOUS level.
I'm not suggesting to stay with a woman just because she is tall, but was suggesting to maybe to focus your attempts (if you are thick-skinned against ridicule and rejection) towards the taller women. The chances are low, but you could find someone you click with among the tall ones, and have most likely average height children.
Do you seriously, sincerely, truly, believe that there's a single person on a site called "LIMB LENGTHENING FORUM" where people make plans to pay tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars to have their legs broken with a hammer and chisel, then slowly distracted over months of time, suffering massive amounts of pain, discomfort, inconvenience, and permanent loss of physical ability, all based on their negative experiences due to their stature, who is "thick skinned against ridicule and rejection"?
And I've already mentioned I generally somewhat agree with your last point, but then what? Imagine you got as tall as you wanted to be. You still have short genes. If you want to have kids and not want to risk a short man existence for them, then you need to analyze your options. I see it as thinking of the kid's future, which I'm sure is what many short women do.
This isn't a problem for me personally as I do not want kids or marriage, but it honestly won't be a problem for the majority of people today either.
By the time most young (late teens to 20's) short men today are ready to have children (say around their early 30's), new and superior methods to fix idiopathic short stature will either already have been developed or will be close enough to being released that by the time the child needs them (10-12 years later, when the child is just prepubertal or at the onset of puberty), they will be available.
Gen Z (I think that's right? children born in mid 2000's) is most likely the last generation that will have real problems with fixing their stature through their teen years and into adulthood (20's - 30's).
Either way, if you're really concerned about the child's future, the solution is not to have children, at least until you have a means to guarantee they will be tall. Eugenically selecting a tall woman to have children with does not in any way guarantee that your child will be tall or even average height. If you think so, you don't understand how genetic recombination works. There is a PERFECTLY GOOD chance your child will be your height or close to it.
Breeding with a tall woman is nothing more than lightly loading the dice you're using to play with an unborn child's life. And all of this most likely at the cost of an even more unpleasant life for you - going out in public with a woman who dwarfs you is sure to get you treated even worse than you usually are as a short man. Tall woman/short man relationships are NOTHING like interracial or homosexual relationships where people virtue-signal and remark how "beautiful" or "progressive" it is. You're going to get a lot of sh*t talking, put downs, general microaggressions, and it's going to get old VERY quick, for both parties (short man and tall woman).
That kind of "height mismatch" relationship is mostly a novelty and rarely lasts.
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Do you seriously, sincerely, truly, believe that there's a single person on a site called "LIMB LENGTHENING FORUM" where people make plans to pay tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars to have their legs broken with a hammer and chisel, then slowly distracted over months of time, suffering massive amounts of pain, discomfort, inconvenience, and permanent loss of physical ability, all based on their negative experiences due to their stature, who is "thick skinned against ridicule and rejection"?
There is. People come into this forum when they're desperate or young (or both) and then - believe it or not - some of them develop, progress and grow (no, not in a physical sense) and simply don't care about some stupid height jokes anymore. Some short(er) people have never experienced serious forms of discrimination. Some people simply don't like being short because they're shorter than their fathers or cousins or because they don't like how being short looks in comparison to taller people. Some of these people leave the forum while others stay, because surgery and scientific inventions that could make you taller still seem intriguing. This is a public forum as you said, there isn't a "you have to be this depressed and suicidal" test that users have to pass to enter. People have told you this several times, but you simply refuse to listen. It's so sad.
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There is. People come into this forum when they're desperate or young (or both) and then - believe it or not - some of them develop, progress and grow (no, not in a physical sense) and simply don't care about some stupid height jokes anymore. Some short(er) people have never experienced serious forms of discrimination. Some people simply don't like being short because they're shorter than their fathers or cousins or because they don't like how being short looks in comparison to taller people. Some of these people leave the forum while others stay, because surgery and scientific inventions that could make you taller still seem intriguing. This is a public forum as you said, there isn't a "you have to be this depressed and suicidal" test that users have to pass to enter. People have told you this several times, but you simply refuse to listen. It's so sad.
There is a reason a lot of people left this forum. Nobody wants to stay in this pitiful craphole
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They tend to go for taller males because women are attracted to tall men. Women aren't consciously selecting tall men because they're thinking about the height of their offspring. sxxual dimorphism is attractive on a SUBCONSCIOUS level.
Actually, sadly, that's not even always the case. I don't know if you find this better or worse (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=1984.msg33028#msg33028). The reasoning (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=1984.msg33071#msg33071).
To use my own argument against myself, though: biased sample of one.
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The difference is short women don't do it so they can live vicariously through their offspring. They do it because they're attracted to tall men (just like the overwhelming majority of women who do not have some weird, disgusting fetish or another). Their short stature is tangential. They'd want a tall man no matter what their height, unless they've got a weird fetish.
In general, short women's lives are nowhere near as miserable as short men's are, and they do not face anywhere near the same amount of discrimination as short men do (I don't think anyone will contest this).
They tend to go for taller males because women are attracted to tall men. Women aren't consciously selecting tall men because they're thinking about the height of their offspring. sxxual dimorphism is attractive on a SUBCONSCIOUS level.
Do you seriously, sincerely, truly, believe that there's a single person on a site called "LIMB LENGTHENING FORUM" where people make plans to pay tens or even hundreds of thousands of dollars to have their legs broken with a hammer and chisel, then slowly distracted over months of time, suffering massive amounts of pain, discomfort, inconvenience, and permanent loss of physical ability, all based on their negative experiences due to their stature, who is "thick skinned against ridicule and rejection"?
This isn't a problem for me personally as I do not want kids or marriage, but it honestly won't be a problem for the majority of people today either.
By the time most young (late teens to 20's) short men today are ready to have children (say around their early 30's), new and superior methods to fix idiopathic short stature will either already have been developed or will be close enough to being released that by the time the child needs them (10-12 years later, when the child is just prepubertal or at the onset of puberty), they will be available.
Gen Z (I think that's right? children born in mid 2000's) is most likely the last generation that will have real problems with fixing their stature through their teen years and into adulthood (20's - 30's).
Either way, if you're really concerned about the child's future, the solution is not to have children, at least until you have a means to guarantee they will be tall. Eugenically selecting a tall woman to have children with does not in any way guarantee that your child will be tall or even average height. If you think so, you don't understand how genetic recombination works. There is a PERFECTLY GOOD chance your child will be your height or close to it.
Breeding with a tall woman is nothing more than lightly loading the dice you're using to play with an unborn child's life. And all of this most likely at the cost of an even more unpleasant life for you - going out in public with a woman who dwarfs you is sure to get you treated even worse than you usually are as a short man. Tall woman/short man relationships are NOTHING like interracial or homosxxual relationships where people virtue-signal and remark how "beautiful" or "progressive" it is. You're going to get a lot of sh*t talking, put downs, general microaggressions, and it's going to get old VERY quick, for both parties (short man and tall woman).
That kind of "height mismatch" relationship is mostly a novelty and rarely lasts.
Also, the genetics of height is very complex (https://www.nature.com/articles/ng.3097).
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To use my own argument against myself, though: biased sample of one.
Here's one more! (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yK4jjbgduHY&t=335)
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There is. People come into this forum when they're desperate or young (or both) and then - believe it or not - some of them develop, progress and grow (no, not in a physical sense) and simply don't care about some stupid height jokes anymore.
People who have actually "developed, progressed and grown" and "don't care about their height" anymore don't stay here, they leave. We have an excellent case study in the form of actual limb lengthening veterans - people who have actually GOTTEN their surgery, the people who posted their diaries on here and makemetaller.
These people get their surgery, they finish, then they leave and never come back. THAT'S what people do when they "get over" their height. You don't "develop, progress and grow" by staying mired in a forum populated largely by chronic ruminators and neurotics.
Some short(er) people have never experienced serious forms of discrimination. Some people simply don't like being short because they're shorter than their fathers or cousins or because they don't like how being short looks in comparison to taller people.
If this is the case, they haven't "developed, progressed or grown"; by definition this sort of person has self-esteem/self-image issues and therefore does not fall into the category of people who would be "thick skinned against ridicule and rejection".
Some of these people leave the forum while others stay, because surgery and scientific inventions that could make you taller still seem intriguing. This is a public forum as you said, there isn't a "you have to be this depressed and suicidal" test that users have to pass to enter. People have told you this several times, but you simply refuse to listen. It's so sad.
Lmao. You say it as though this forum is like hair loss or penis enlargement forums where there's lively and regularly occurring discourse about novel techniques, research, etc related to their respective problems happening on the daily. As I type this, there's ONE (1) thread in the Limb Lengthening Discussions subforum about a novel surgical procedure that could potentially be related to limb lengthening.
The rest are a ton of threads about some guy who apparently got scammed by a Turkish doctor, a 5'3" girl wondering if limb lengthening will make her calves smaller (lmfao) and other questions or posts about how/where/when/etc to get distraction osteogenesis.
Off-topic section is full of BruceWayne's neurotic nonsense, miscellaneous idle chit-chat (or as it's called in certain old forums, sh*tposting - stuff like "when did you stop growing?", "imagine being this tall", "changes in height over the last 100 years") tangentially related to height that usually devolve into arguments (this thread is a good example of this), and posts about books/analyses on heightism and its ramifications in society (as if anyone here doesn't already know it exists).
Just lol, dude. Get real.
What's actually "so sad" is how you're trying to pass this place off as a place for rigorous intellectual discussion and scientific discovery rather than a cross between an emotional dumpster, a mental asylum, and a waiting room in a surgical hospital.
Actually, sadly, that's not even always the case. I don't know if you find this better or worse (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=1984.msg33028#msg33028). The reasoning (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=1984.msg33071#msg33071).
To use my own argument against myself, though: biased sample of one.
While it's fair to say that you've found an example that illustrates your point (there does in fact exist at least one woman who is selectively "breeding" with taller men purely for taller offspring), stingray is a mentally ill neurotic.
The same goes for any woman who pursues cosmetic limb lengthening, in the general case. Even short women who are discriminated in the workplace based on their height don't pursue limb lengthening in the general case. Most would rather sue or just quit and work somewhere else. Short stature isn't a death sentence for women the way it is for men. It's not even close.
When normal, non-neurotic women pursue taller men, it's primarily and overwhelmingly due to genuine physical attraction created subconsciously by sexual dimorphism. I concede that somewhere in the back of her mind she might be thinking about how it'd be nice that her children would be likely to be taller, but she isn't consciously practicing eugenic selection with the central goal of having taller kids. That's asinine and ridiculous.
Also, the genetics of height is very complex (https://www.nature.com/articles/ng.3097).
No need to point this out. I say this with zero intention of bragging or "showing off": I'm probably more well-read on the genetic, endocrine, and other factors governing human height than any of the posters on this board, at least those I've seen post about it. I am and have been a regular on several forums focused on endocrinology, human growth and development, performance enhancement compounds (DatBTrue forums, several anabolic androgenic steroid forums, etc), genetics and biology, etc since I first became aware of the monumental importance of height (in my case, that would've been my mid teens).
The thread you recently posted about the use of rHGH (the relevant compound is actually IGF-1, but whatever) and aromatase inhibitors is old news to me. I knew about these and various other more fringe/experimental compounds as far back as 2012 and did copious amounts of """research""" with them on a particularly eager """lab rat""" (if you understand my meaning) in an attempt to grow taller. It of course didn't work because my """lab rat""" was already done developing by the time I was able to actually get my hands on them.
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People who have actually "developed, progressed and grown" and "don't care about their height" anymore don't stay here, they leave. We have an excellent case study in the form of actual limb lengthening veterans - people who have actually GOTTEN their surgery, the people who posted their diaries on here and makemetaller.
If this is the case, they haven't "developed, progressed or grown"; by definition this sort of person has self-esteem/self-image issues and therefore does not fall into the category of people who would be "thick skinned against ridicule and rejection".
Your problem is that you're unable to think beyond extremes. You don't have to be able to "not care abut your height" for it to be an improvement. Let's say a guy is so troubled and unhappy with his height that it's occupying 80% of his free time. He barely can enjoy his life because height is almost always present on his mind. After some dedication to "development, progress and growth" (even though you obviously scoff at the idea of it) he's only bothered by his height in 30% of his free time. The problem is not completely gone and he still has self-image issues, but he now has more time in real contentment and is a happier human being overall. That's a big improvement. Do you understand that?
And yes, one can make massive improvements and still be insecure about his height and even visit LL forums. Humans are massively more complex than just "self-confident, happy guy" versus "insecure, ridiculed, rejected guy with self-esteem issues". The day has 24 hours and that's a lot of time for a lot of different mental states to be in. But I don't believe you want to understand.
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Your problem is that you're unable to think beyond extremes. You don't have to be able to "not care abut your height" for it to be an improvement. Let's say a guy is so troubled and unhappy with his height that it's occupying 80% of his free time. He barely can enjoy his life because height is almost always present on his mind. After some dedication to "development, progress and growth" (even though you obviously scoff at the idea of it) he's only bothered by his height in 30% of his free time. The problem is not completely gone and he still has self-image issues, but he now has more time in real contentment and is a happier human being overall. That's a big improvement. Do you understand that?
And the same person could be way more "content" and a much "happier human being overall" if they left the forum for good instead of staying here because the majority of people on this forum aren't delusional positivity-cultists like you. Instead, they're generally unhappy people planning to have surgery to try and address their problem. Do you understand that?
It's really annoying how you're so condescending and patronizing despite the fact that you're essentially a cultist trying to turn this site into a hugbox rather than what it is: a site for discussing LIMB LENGTHENING.
And yes, one can make massive improvements and still be insecure about his height and even visit LL forums. Humans are massively more complex than just "self-confident, happy guy" versus "insecure, ridiculed, rejected guy with self-esteem issues". The day has 24 hours and that's a lot of time for a lot of different mental states to be in. But I don't believe you want to understand.
And yes, you would make much more massive improvements by LEAVING forums like this, which are ostensibly full not of people like you (positivity cultists), but rather unhappy people. The matter isn't as complicated as you desperately want it to be. People are less unhappy when they spend less time in toxic environments, which is what this is, so if you want to cope and be a "more positive human being" or whatever garbage you believe in, the best course of action is to vanish from this site and all sites like it, stop thinking about your height, and immerse yourself in hobbies or whatever cope you need to live your life as a short man. But I don't believe you want to understand.
And that belief is pretty valid given the fact you chose to completely ignore my (accurate) points about the typical content posted on this site. It isn't a "friendly" discussion forum full of quirky, "snarky" imbeciles like Reddit. The neuroses of the posters here are more than clear, and it's pretty obvious no one is happy, because if they were they wouldn't be here.
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Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
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Only a Sith deals in absolutes.
Very true but sadly not something he will understand any time soon. What a sad, poor man.
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Is it so hard to get that bein short takes an impact on ur life but u still can live pretty damn good?
Doe i'm gonna agree on one thing. Leaving crap like /r/short or this forum helps with self acceptance.
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According to some users in this thread, unless you are 6ft+chiseled jaw+big dck+awsome body you are doomed to a life of solitude and women who will settle with you.
This forum has become R/short with both the incels and the "height means nothing" at both extremes flooding the place and bringing nothing of value (actual LL diary or some info regarding LL) to the place.. Shame... Though thanks to that flooding I was able to get out
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According to some users in this thread, unless you are 6ft+chiseled jaw+big dck+awsome body you are doomed to a life of solitude and women who will settle with you.
This forum has become R/short with both the incels and the "height means nothing" at both extremes flooding the place and bringing nothing of value (actual LL diary or some info regarding LL) to the place.. Shame... Though thanks to that flooding I was able to get out
that's exactly that
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According to some users in this thread, unless you are 6ft+chiseled jaw+big dck+awsome body you are doomed to a life of solitude and women who will settle with you.
This forum has become R/short with both the incels and the "height means nothing" at both extremes flooding the place and bringing nothing of value (actual LL diary or some info regarding LL) to the place.. Shame... Though thanks to that flooding I was able to get out
Your quote reminds me of a redpill video I watched saying a man needs:
-Facial symmetry
-6'+ height
-Norwood 1 hairline
-Defined jawline
-Wide shoulders
-Deep voice
-Large penis girth
-12% body fat
Etc...
I think that the video was really just trolling neurotics and insecure guys who spend 16 hrs a day on the computer
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6'4 or death