Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Patients Experiences => Topic started by: programdude on July 02, 2014, 04:13:26 PM
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So, just got back from West Palm Beach(home of the overairconditioned airport and incomprehensible taxi drivers) and had a consult with Dr. Paley who seemed confident I could lengthen 3 and a quarter inches.
Not officially scheduled as I type this, but likely locking it in on the 29th of this month!
I'm a male, 23 years old, good health.
I am currently 5 8(well, just shy of 5 8 according to Paleys office, just over it according to my one at home) so I will end at 5 11.
The surgery will cost 85k after IT band releases. Basically taking a no cutting corners approach, although I will try and live very conservatively once I'm out there.
I still need to decided exactly how I am going to tackle transportation. On one hand I would like my car there so I can drive around, but transporting it is just another expense and I do plan on traveling back a few times and wouldn't want to be carless.
Pretty crazy that I've actually moved forward this, still remember stumbling across this site a couple months ago. Any support is welcome, its gonna be a long/lonely/boring 3-4 months.
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Good for you! I wish you a nice LL under the Florida sunshine!
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Cool! Good luck to you with your LL (although I'm sure you won't need it, going with a doctor like Paley.)
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Awesome man. I kind of want to have a consultation with Dr Paley even though I can't afford him just so I can meet the guy. Wish you all the best.
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Haha, well he is a cool guy but I wouldn't say that would be a good investment!
So, interestingly enough the date I wanted was snatched up, but the good news is one even sooner- the 22nd- was freed up! So I am locked in for that. Crazy to think in a months time I'll be taller.
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I've made my deposit at this point so I'm totally locked in. Right now I mainly need to decide if I am having my car shipped down.
On one hand it would be nice to be able to get around if I wanted to see a movie/eat out etc etc. On the other hand a lot of my time will be spent just exercising at the hotel and they have a grocery service/buffet so I don't know how useful it would actually be seeing as it would be 1400 or so minimum for shipping both ways and I wouldn't have access to it when I came back home for brief visits, so I am currently leaning towards not having it.
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Ok, had a pretty awful time confirming they received my down payment, but now that they confirmed its received I've paid the full amount. Damn, 85k just like that!
I am going to fly in on the 16th to get used to the place and stock up on things for the room.
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Ok, had a pretty awful time confirming they received my down payment, but now that they confirmed its received I've paid the full amount. Damn, 85k just like that!
I am going to fly in on the 16th to get used to the place and stock up on things for the room.
did they tell you when you could book an appointment or did they say you had to wait until after your consultation? I called yesterday to see how far out i would have to book my surgery after my consultation and the lady said she didn't know until after my consultation. I need to know so I can plan things. Makes it difficult
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I emailed with Paley initially. A consult is mandatory, however, he said it would be possible to arrange them both within a similar time frame so you wouldn't need to make multiple trips.
However, my advice is to be sure you get their medical clearance forms taken care of before hand to avoid any frustrations.
This is all a very tricky thing to juggle with so many components, so just make sure you have all your bases covered.
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So, interestingly enough the date I wanted was snatched up, but the good news is one even sooner- the 22nd- was freed up! So I am locked in for that. Crazy to think in a months time I'll be taller.
Good luck!
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I hope your journey goes extremely smooth Program. :) You sound very realistic and I'm sure you'll do very well. With Paley, you really can't go wrong, so just keep that in mind. There could be setbacks, but you'll always come out of it well.
I'm still lengthening at home but I'm flying back every 2 weeks. I'll probably see you at the Homewood Suites when I'm visiting all the lengtheners! Also, I'm planning on using my unused PT visits when I'm done lengthening, and might even live in Florida then (sometime around the end of August). PT after lengthening is just as important as PT during, and I have about 43 PT visits remaining (so I'll stay there at least a month!)
Remember- caregiver, caregiver, caregiver! You cannot do this alone the first 2 weeks, you need someone. Maybe, just maybe, the 4 days in the hospital you can be alone, but calling the nurses for every tiny thing is a hassle when they take a long time to come (emptying your pee container, grabbing you a drink, bringing your laptop to bed, etc.) I have a few phone numbers and agencies I can give you if you want me to PM them to you.
Also, reach out to Cooper on the forums. He's staying at the Homewood Suites and he'll be glad to meet you, help you out and introduce you to everyone. He's my closest lengthener friend :) He's doing very well right now and has a diary here too.
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Thanks a lot big D. You were actually the one who pushed me into definitively going with Paley in one of my earlier topics. Information about caregivers would be great. I will need one, unless I can convince a girl to come and give me a hand.
Def look forward to meeting you cooper and all. Movies and books will only go so far.
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Alright, after flying through a lightning storm I'm officially in West Palm and likely not leaving till I'm 3 and a quarter inches taller. Pretty sure I already saw a patient or two.
Less than a week and I will be in surgery, pretty surreal stuff! Figured I'd get here early to be all settled in and get to know the layout of whats gonna be my home for a quarter to a third of a year before I'm crippled.
Still haven't figured out about the caretaker but I'm assuming Paley can nudge me in the right direction there.
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Programdude, my daughter is a current patient of Paley and I've seen some lengtheners with caretakers/helpers when I take her in for PT. You could ask them for suggestions.
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Bilateral sent me over a caretakers number, so I will use them if they are available.
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Bilateral sent me over a caretakers number, so I will use them if they are available.
I'm glad you've got some leads. Bilateral is a great source of information.
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Alright, after flying through a lightning storm I'm officially in West Palm and likely not leaving till I'm 3 and a quarter inches taller. Pretty sure I already saw a patient or two.
Less than a week and I will be in surgery, pretty surreal stuff! Figured I'd get here early to be all settled in and get to know the layout of whats gonna be my home for a quarter to a third of a year before I'm crippled.
Still haven't figured out about the caretaker but I'm assuming Paley can nudge me in the right direction there.
Programdude, just wanted to wish you the best of luck! My surgery with Rozbruch is a month from tomorrow, so I'm right behind ya!
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Thanks a lot man. I am having a great last few days as a non cripple, but definitely ready to get this process going.
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12 Hours to go and I should be post op and 1mm taller.
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12 Hours to go and I should be post op and 1mm taller.
Go get em bro! ;D
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Yeah baby!
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Go get 'em tiger!
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Hey everyone! So its said and done! Since this is a diary I'll summarize the events so new people interested in CLL can get an idea of what to expect
I arrived at 5 30 as I had been instructed I've been walking everywhere I need to, but of course wasn't going to walk to my surgery in this neighborhood at 5 AM(getting shot or mugged would not have enhanced the experience).
After a short wait I was called in, my vitals and clothes, and bag of personal items all taken. And I was prepped with my IV etc.
The nurse and anasthesiologist paid me a visit and went over the process, explaining how the epidural would be going in and all that. The wait wasn't really all that bad, especially compared to waiting in Paley's lobby, though any moment waiting felt like a crawl.
Eventually they injected me with "happy juice" and wheeled me off to the operating room as they bustled about.
Then I was nauseous and shivering uncontrollably, with my only thought being me wishing they'd put me under already so I wouldn't feel so sick. Eventually they found a way of subduing it, when I noticed we were in another room, so I managed a "what room is this". And she said "recovery" only then did I realize my surgery was long since done.
I passed in and out a few times, was brought up to my room where I passed out a few more time, but food and my stuff was brought to me. And here I am=] Forgive the typing, I'm still not all there, but just wanted to report that at least this initial part wasn't bad at all.
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Still doing great, I was able to get into a wheelchair and everyone is surprised by how well I'm doing.
Worst part so far has been them giving me gravy when I didn't ask for it :p.
You seriously have a whole team working on you throughout your stay. Someone is always coming in the room to check on you, and they answer immediately when you buzz for them. They are checking your vitals, keeping you hydrated, changing your pee bag, and the gentleman who helped me into the wheelchair provided a tour and some company.
Everyone was saying I could be discharged early but Paley just visited my room and said because I'm here alone and already paid for four nights that I should use them all, which could actually save me a lot of money since the assistants are expensive. Contrary to what some have said, you absolutely won't need an assistant during the hospital stay as you are being waited on hand and foot. A planner will be appointed to you who will help you square away home aids, medication, and transportation.
At least at this stage sleep comes easy, although it is regularly interrupted, but it hasn't bothered me. For the most part I feel normal but will occasionally get super tired.
Paley also indicated that due to my age I could begin clicking tomorrow so thats exciting!
Once the epidural comes out tomorrow I can move around but will likely experience a bit of pain, so I'll be sure to report on that.
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Living the dream! :)
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So far yeah, still just the very beginning of my journey, but I've got a good feeling.
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legs are slowly coming back, with great effort I can raise the right one and straighten it.
Btw anyone who gets this surgery should be glued to their breathing device- every time I sleep I wake up with 100-102 fever, but doing that brings it down to about 98. And I only sleep for two hours tops so you will get seriously sick if you are lazy with this.
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Today has been rough, nothings really worked out well. Early on they had me stand up, which cause me to feel extremely off balance and made me throw up.
Later, the epidural came out, which is painless itself, but pretty quickly the pain was bad. Shortly thereafter I had to have a bowel movement but the nurse just would not come. Called three times until finally someone came and very slowly set up the beside commode. I don't know how she didn't realize how urgent it was as she went through the motions of explaining things. With extreme difficulty I was able to get on it and have a successful and very long bowel movement, which wasn't pleasant but also wasn't terrible. Was really light headed and felt terrible.
I had only taken one percocet so when moving from the commode to the bed I was literally screaming as the nurse and PT helped me. Then they took the catheter out which was pretty unpleasant. They gave me another percocet, and I requested some IV pain relief but again things are taking forever and I still don't have this. I don't know what, but something was done to my left tibia which is causing a lot of pain.
Really not my day.
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Had to make a second bowel movement which I was dreading after the previous time. It was still ungodly awful but better overall. Trying to stay strong since I know this part only lasts so long.
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Stay strong buddy! This is by far the worst part and it only gets easier after the hospital.
You're already doing great, I couldn't even walk to or sit on the commode that early! Just take it easy and know there's a light at the end of the tunnel. :)
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Yikes, that sounds rough programdude. Hang in there, I'm sure things can only go up from the day you had today. You're in the thick of it now, but once you leave the hospital, it will get better.
I must admit, this has me kinda scared. I'm aiming to get out of the hospital after 2 nights. Dr. Rozbruch said it's possible, and I know several Dr. M patients get out after only 2 nights...but I guess I'm gonna have to work for that! I'm actually going to ask if they can get me Oxycontin before they move me around without the epidural, as I know that's stronger than Percocet.
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They've said I'm doing the best any Paley's patients have done and am way more than on par. But it certainly doesn't feel that way when I'm yelling every time I need to go to the bathroom.
My advice to everyone is to ask for the IV pain medication before standing once the epidural is out. The percocet alone just doesn't cut it. The IV one also helps you sleep even with the pain.
The consensus seems to be that things should improve a good bit from this point so thats encouraging. The organizer has already arranged the transportation back to the hotel for me as well as a home aid, who I will have 24 hours a day at least for the first few days.
Apologies if this was incoherent, I'm drugged to the point of my eyes closing,
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They've said I'm doing the best any Paley's patients have done and am way more than on par. But it certainly doesn't feel that way when I'm yelling every time I need to go to the bathroom.
My advice to everyone is to ask for the IV pain medication before standing once the epidural is out. The percocet alone just doesn't cut it. The IV one also helps you sleep even with the pain.
The consensus seems to be that things should improve a good bit from this point so thats encouraging. The organizer has already arranged the transportation back to the hotel for me as well as a home aid, who I will have 24 hours a day at least for the first few days.
Apologies if this was incoherent, I'm drugged to the point of my eyes closing,
This was perfectly coherent my friend! I actually figured you'd be doing well, since you're a fitness buff as it is.
I'm hoping my being in pretty good physical shape for my age (lean, fairly muscular, pretty flexible, healthy eater, great at cardio) will allow me to recover fairly quickly as you seem to be doing. And yeah, I will be asking for the IV pain meds or at least oxycontin before they attempt to move me.
And per Cooper's advice - we need to drink hot water if we're having the Rtaller alien poop issue lol
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Yikes, that sounds rough programdude. Hang in there, I'm sure things can only go up from the day you had today. You're in the thick of it now, but once you leave the hospital, it will get better.
I must admit, this has me kinda scared. I'm aiming to get out of the hospital after 2 nights. Dr. Rozbruch said it's possible, and I know several Dr. M patients get out after only 2 nights...but I guess I'm gonna have to work for that! I'm actually going to ask if they can get me Oxycontin before they move me around without the epidural, as I know that's stronger than Percocet.
Two nights sounds impossible to me, but then again I had an epidural. However if tomorrow is even close to as bad as today I'd raise an eyebrow at getting in and out in 2 days.
Also, don't let me scare you- Even standing a second time got easier so theres a chance it could be a night and day difference, Remember this is the worst part, hands down from the whole experience.
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And yes my upper body strength has been absolutely invaluable. I probably wouldn't have gotten up yet without it
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Two nights sounds impossible to me, but then again I had an epidural. However if tomorrow is even close to as bad as today I'd raise an eyebrow at getting in and out in 2 days.
Also, don't let me scare you- Even standing a second time got easier so theres a chance it could be a night and day difference, Remember this is the worst part, hands down from the whole experience.
I agree with you. Two nights does sound like it will be tough to pull off...but Dr. Rozbruch said it's possible, as has Dr. M. There are a few diaries I think from Dr. M patients (on "other sites") where they've gotten out in 3 days/2 nights. I'm just trying to hedge my bets and save money however I can. I'm gonna be staying with my family for the first 2 weeks anyway.
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sorry, double post
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Having family would absolutely make me feel safer about it all. The pain is just so depilating at 2 days its hard to image anything short of a team making you function. But going back to the hotel with family is a lot more comforting than a total stranger,
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Btw, huge coincidence. I'm from an average sized town and one of the PA's went to the high school I did. But beyond that TWO other recent patients are from there as well.
The reason I think they're saying I'm doing the best a patients done boils down to arm strength IMO. It helps for everything and it would be nearly impossible to maneuver with it, pulling yourself up for when they shift your legs or need to check your back, and most important of all, hoisting yourself up for the long transition or when... they are wiping you down. I advise ensuring you are strong up there.
My current state, and the state I've been in for the past 5 hours is good. My nurse has been making sure I am medicated and i've been doing the exercises with my lungs and feet I need to. I think by my discharge on sat I will be good enough to get by without the IV medications. Actually right now I'm not even on it.
Meeting with my home aid tomorrow here and going to actually begin lengthening(they decided not to today because of how my day had been).
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Pain today is under control so far, though I have yet needed to stand which is always the brutal part. Richard and I will get too that after I get some IV pain relief.
In some post on one of these sites, someone was talking about receiving no aftercare from Paley which simply isn't true. I emailed him about my hurt tibia and despite being out of the country he immediately emailed me back saying he was sending his primary PA up who investigated thoroughly and positioned my leg better than the nurses. Turns out that my operation was abnormally long due to having extremely hard bones and he believe at some point in the surgery someone had my leg pressed against something which caused pressure damage. Sucks, since it actually hurts as much as my straight up broken femurs, if not a bit more for some reason but after reviewing the picture his PA sent him he said it should recover shortly. Again this is proof that even with the best things can go wrong, fortunately this seems to be minor in the grand scheme of things.
Insurance is definitively paying for all but potentially one of my medications, which is still pending but I am really happy about. Be sure to talk to your planner about this, she is very proactive about getting things done the best and cheapest way for you. If your insurance isn't good be SURE to calculate these costs into your budget, they can be substantial.
Even though it will be expensive, from noon tomorrow until sunday night I will have a home aid the whole time. Not taking chances and need to evaluate just how messed up I'll be from the tibia issue but hope to drastically drop the number of hours needed and replace them with my less professional but welcome company before too long.
The bad news for me is that this is what is that tibia injury is making standing really really hard, since basically one of my tibias is in the same condition as the femurs, the good news for all of you is that this probably won't happen unless an accident occurs during your surgery which isn't likely since the PA made it sound like my bones were very uncommonly tough and they had never seen it happen before. In other words your experience standing should be less painful.
Tony came up today and we did a full 1mm lengthening in one sitting. No pain at all and the device couldn't be easier to use. In the future this will be broken up into four sessions- However these need to be done before midnight without fail.
In retrospect about yesterday, now that I am less drugged and not in a pain induced daze, the main things to take away to enhance your experience is to:
1. Be sure you are heavily medicated by the time the epidural has worn off.
2. Ask for assistance with going to the bathroom well in advance, not much is worse than being in severe pain on the verge of exploding in your wheelchair while knowing you need to fight against your legs to sit in an uncomfortable chair that is probably poorly adjusted which will leave your legs painfully high. Seriously don't do this to yourself.
3. Ask about IV medication asap, this made me go from literally shaking and heaving from pain to able to sleep comfortably. The nurses may not recommend it so ask yourself. I was very poorly allowed to take only one percocet after the epi, where the more logical management would have saved me lots of agony and enabled me to begin lengthening yesterday.
4. Similar to point 2, be sure to ask for medication as needed. The timing is just a recommendation as nurses will note, their job is to stay ahead of the pain and not chase it. The first nurses I had didn't give me this impression but the later ones have been very explicit about this.
5. Ask for your PT(in my case richard) to help you move. My desperate move onto the commode for the first time was urgent so I had no time to ask for richard and she was not much of a help at all. The nurses dont always have a gauge on how ridiculous a request of theirs is, so when she wanted me to move from the commode to the bed I asked for Richard who hoisted me up with a rope. Later when Richard wasn't around for trip number 2 the nurse wanted me to stand but I told her to bring in another nurse which made the process a lot easier.
6. The nurses may try and give you stool softener after your first movement. I highly advise against this and (most) of the nurses will agree because after you get it out the first time, you do not want to have diarrhea or even regular bowel movements. Using the commode even twice a day will wear on you- even sitting on the commode when you're already there gets extremely painful after awhile however some nurses won't take this into consideration, or realize you had a movement, or will ask you, and if you are drugged you may lightheadedly accept assuming its good since a nurse is offering. Fortunately I thought better of this despite my mind set.
7. To summarize, the nurses really don't always know best and sometimes you do need to instruct them as per your needs, which can be hard when you aren't feeling so hot, but be wiling to abuse the call button when the going gets rough.
Hopefully these posts are helping inform some of you guys considering, or heading into LL.
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Update- Insurance is covering all my medicine! So definitely be sure to talk to the organizer lady who has been a godsend in arranging all of this.
As far as home aids be sure to speak to the manager of the agency and get someone who has worked with Paley patients, at least for the first weekend back since they know what to expect and how to help you out best. They are all the same price. After this weekend I will be scaling back the hours and may or may not use a different aid. Shortly thereafter I should have a girl move into the hotel for a bit, but I'll be playing that all by ear.
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This is very helpful stuff PD, thank you! Also, very glad to hear that your insurance is taking care of the meds. I already told them that I want a prescription for oxycontin right off the bat and want to skip over Percocet. I want the first hellish week to be as numb as possible lol
Also, it's pretty pimp that you'll have some girls "taking care" of you while you're there. That's definitely one thing I will miss during those 3-4 months. I'll have my family and friends, but having a love life would be nice. I'm not comfortable meeting a new woman while crippled. I have a few that I could call up, but I'm not really interested in them anymore hehe
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Percocet might do the trick out of the hospital but NOT in any way shape or form after the epi is out. It was honestly irresponsible of her to give me so little. I told the anesthesiologist about it and his eyes bugged out of his head. The shock from going from epi to nothing is downright insane. I've never had so little control over my vocalizations. Now however I am pretty good even on minimal medication. I recommend keeping your feet moving to keep circulation going and to stretch and bend your knees often. It hurts but gets easier. The day after the epi comes out, a challenge I did was to rotate and get my legs over the side of the bed by myself(this is much harder than it sounds pre op my friend) and grab the bar above you and stand as straight as possible. I did that a few times and have been stretching my legs as much as possible. I honestly am really bummed out about the tibia since it is really the main thing holding me back right now and I think I would barely need help in a couple days without that limitation. I was however very pleased with Dr. Paleys prompt concern and that he treated it as a serious potentially grave issue in his response(within five minutes of reading my email his top PA was in the room). Its funny, at least three people here have likened him to jesus.
As far as the girls, honestly just sign up to some dating sites or tinder. I am shocked at how many are lining up to either visit or live in/take care of me lol. Getting a little something something(even though my performance will be at an all time rock bottom) will be very nice. Heck even just having a few different ones to cuddle up with and keep the romantic game somewhat alive is more than welcome.
Debi with United Nursing Services came by and made me feel very good about the whole home aid process, giving me her personal cell number if I need anything. Heck she even offered me a complimentary dinner date over sushi when I am feeling a bit better. I'll be sure to let everyone knows how this part goes.
As of now my pain meds are basically not in my system and I actually don't feel awful, even during my standing exercises which yesterday would have had me screaming and passing out. I will be taking basic percocets and seeing if that can sustain me for today. If so I am in very good shape for my discharge tomorrow. Regardless I know the worst has passed, and once my tibia is healed I will be eagerly forcing myself to be mobile.
You will feel like stiff hell, but force yourself to move and you will be thankful for it guys.
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Yeah I've had very good luck with dating sites in the past despite my height (luckily I at least got solid facial aesthetics). Tinder I tend to shy away from. I got a LOT of mutual hits, but I've always called Tinder a "height lottery." And being 5'6", many women in their heels would be taller than me. On other sites where I had to list my height (and knew the woman's height), I was was more comfortable with the attention I got because the girls already knew I was short. Online dating (OKC, Match, eHarm) was quite good to me...many guys don't get any hits at all (online dating is heavily biased in favor of women, I have many stories proving this)...yet my height was still an issue in the back of my mind.
Although I just may try what you're doing. Would be nice to have some female company while I go through this. Are you telling these girls you're temporarily crippled from the get go?
Sounds like you're doing really well despite the tibia issue. Keep it up.
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Yeah great news is I am actually managing off just percs right now. People may have been scared by yesterdays post but it may prove to just be an inevitable few hours of hell, in which case its really not so bad if its all the hell you have to endure, you might have been able to tell from my posts I was horrified the next two weeks would be that, non stop. I don't really see how things could get back to that bad from where I am at right now.
And yes not only have I told every tinder, pof, etc. girl that I am here as a cripple in surgery, and even that it is to get taller. Now admittedly I do say my starting height is 5 10, mainly because I don't think girls know what heights actually equal and think anything below 5 10 is dwarf status, but considering I will be in a wheelchair or hunched over a walker it doesn't matter anyways. Not that I can have sex for awhile(when I do it will be pretty lame I bet), but I can certainly receive *ahem* favors.
Hilariously one girl who read my profile asked if I was one of Paleys patients and when I said yes, informed me she works in the PT dept, so I may even see her haha.
Not to derail this topic into my sex life, but it was ironic that even though I wasn't wearing lifts or anything, the girl I hooked up with the night before my surgery kept calling me tall. Made the concept of heading into an outrageous surgery to get taller seem pretty silly in the moment.
Anyways, feel free to ask questions anyone. Staying busy on the computer has helped distract from what discomfort I do have.
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Not to derail this topic into my sex life, but it was ironic that even though I wasn't wearing lifts or anything, the girl I hooked up with the night before my surgery kept calling me tall. Made the concept of heading into an outrageous surgery to get taller seem pretty silly in the moment.
That's because 5'8" ain't really that short, especially if you're somewhat built and lean (which I believe you said you are, I think you said you do fitness modeling). I feel like if you're built and lean at 5'8", you can look kinda "tall." But then again, your chick may have been very short? I was with a cougar last year who was 5'1" and insisted I was 5'10". That made me feel so damn good! :)
I was with my best friend tonight who knows I'm doing the surgery. I'm a shade under 5'6", and he's around 5'8" and he looks a nice amount taller than me, and he's not even in that great shape. He thinks I don't need it and insists that I'm not short...I just lol'd on the inside. In fact, I even thought what I'm about to do is outrageous, as he wasn't that much taller than me (and I was barefoot in his living room).
Good luck with your discharge!
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And per Cooper's advice - we need to drink hot water if we're having the Rtaller alien poop issue lol
Why not take some laxatives? I know natural is better, but why struggle drinking hot water? Especially when you're already doing something difficult. I still don't understand why RTaller didn't realize he could've taken some laxatives before all that.
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Why not take some laxatives? I know natural is better, but why struggle drinking hot water? Especially when you're already doing something difficult. I still don't understand why RTaller didn't realize he could've taken some laxatives before all that.
This is something big to watch out for. Going to the bathroom isn't pleasant at all, but needing to go regularly is WAY scarier stuff since it will be after the epidurals out. My advice is to take out the epidural early in the morning while having had a stool softener the night before, or take out the epi at noon and the still softener in the morning. Now granted I am biased because my nurse grossly undersold what I was in for and gave me the one percocet after the epi was out and the pain was out of this world- but the actual pooping part is a breeze, its getting there and up that destroys you. So do not take anything too close to epi coming out and remember- flat out refuse if they try and give it afterwards unless you actually are having a REALLY hard time.
If I had been properly medicated, using the commode really wouldn't have been bad,,, Reading diaries is the smartest thing to do before hand since you want to know at least as much as the nurses, as in two cases they made a bas call. One which I caught and one I did not.
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First PT session today. Ironically most of the motions I'd been doing subconsciously on my own because they felt good on the muscle anyways. I did excellent with it all with almost no pain, even on my damaged leg. She was awestruck I was achieving a 120 degree bend in the knee when she usually seeks 90.
Most importantly standing was pretty easy, and walking, while still strange, was not excruciating at all. heck I think my triceps were the sorest part for overcompensating for my legs needlessly.
I have my lengthening machine and my sheets of PT and all my appointments set up. I do feel slightly tired because my body is recuperating and movement is surprisingly difficult, but things are looking good again.
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Question for you PD. I think you said you have/had pretty muscular legs. I personally have very naturally muscular legs. Does this work with or against us throughout LL? I've heard mixed things. I've heard from some that having muscular legs can somewhat mask the pain in the first few weeks, while others have said it makes lengthening more difficult (unless you get the ITB release, which I'm getting). It's probably too early for you to tell, but just wondering your thoughts on this so far. I'm leaning towards muscular legs making the whole thing more difficult...
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I got a release so I can't give a comment without it. However with it, it mentally it feels as if my legs are an encumbrance, being big pain filled masses that I can barely move. However, given that many have said I am doing the best/at least very well and that I am succeeding in PT with flying colors despite their muscularity, I find it hard to believe that this is anything more than a mental illusion. Furthermore, once this post op nonstop pain stops/slows and I can actually make use of the muscle, life will get a lot easier I believe.
In other news I am not too thrilled about my caretaker. Despite my concerns expressed to the manager, this woman speaks english with a thick accent I struggle to understand and worse, sometimes she struggles to understand what it is I am saying sometimes in somewhat urgent situations(although when in pain, drugged, and crippled you will be more irritable so it bothers you regardless.). The fiasco with the transportation got me so stiff that walking became a forlorn fantasy when I got back to the hotel so I had to crawl my way onto the bed to stretch and lengthen.
I have texted the manager my displeasure and have been stretching non stop after a short nap. The manager said I wouldn't be seeing her again.
This is a pretty negative post, but note I am not too worried because I know this all gets better. Not even a week post op yet and life could be worse. Oh an one big plus is that shifting to a commode from the hotel bed is a world easier than it was in the hospital, heavy duty meds or no.
Just did my 3rd click. Incase people are wondering why you need to do them before midnight, it is because the machine resets itself then meaning you LOSE those clicks. Yes it is possible at the end of lengthening to get them back, but the machine is not designed to permit you to exceed 1MM a day in 4 sessions(though yes they can change this hence my 1mm in a sitting lengthening yesterday). Despite the setbacks, actually growing finally is amazing.
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My second caretaker is a lot better, and I am also feeling a lot better after forcing myself to do extensive PT to reverse the effects of being stuck in that wheelchair so long. Gonna PT like crazy these next few days to keep myself on track. About to do 4th clicks.. Officially 3mm taller my friends.
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stay ahead of the pain... don't chase it.
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Lol, don't even remember typing that. I was in a rough place then.
Anyways I met a LL'er from hong kong this morning in the breakfast area, very nice guy who looked 30 but ended up being 50! He was encouraging with a great attitude and wanted to do exercises with me when I was more pain free. I think he was a week or two ahead of me which is a great sign.
Extremely good news is I realized my insurance will cover 80% of my home aid costs, as well as all my PT costs for when I want help and I don't have a home aid.
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I had some requests for pictures: (http://s14.postimg.org/ix3vnhtb1/Leg1.jpg)
(http://s14.postimg.org/ehlgi8gwt/leg2.jpg)
For those wondering- The dark black line is where you line up the top of the heavy duty magnet with, then you just click start and it does its magic.
As far as the side shot you can see one of the dressings came off and had given me a blister not a really annoying complication like the tibia injury(which is finally scabbed and not an issue.)
Off to PT for the first time and really looking forward to it. I know these legs just have a bit further to go before my circumstances improve drastically because of the condition of my friend from Hong Kong who is only a week ahead.Already I can pretty much maneuver all around the bed, get onto the commode/wheelchair from it, and do great with the original PT assigned to me.
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Even with them "going hard" on me, since I said I'd been doing stretches I did excellent with my PT. A lot of the "new things they showed me in regards to stretches I'd already done and mastered while recovering.
The team working with me was very impressed and in some cases I achieved the best fresh out of surgery stretches they had ever seen. They enthusiastically said at this point achieving 8 cm doesn't even seem like a question!!
I've also finally managed walking and can walk to the bathroom and use it and leave without issue. Technically I think I am actually self sufficient just less than a week post op. That being said I will be using a care giver because my insurance covered the vast majority of the costs, until a girl I am talking to moves in with me who wanted to be my fwb/mom haha.
Things looking very good once again(this has been such a roller coaster), very much looking forward to meeting with Paley at the 2 week mark to make sure I am properly lengthening. If I am I think I am in for a good ride!
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Sounds like you're doing really well man. I'm just a few weeks behind you!
Just wondering, what kind of overall shape were you in before you had your surgery? I feel like I'm fairly flexible (I can reach down and touch the floor with my palms, just about, with some effort), I can run 5-7 miles no problem, and I have a pretty strong upper body (arms and chest). I've never been an athlete, but have more or less always been in pretty good shape throughout my 30 years. So I'm hoping I breeze through this like you seem to be doing now!
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I'm not quite a bodybuilder, but very muscled, particularly in my arms, strong chest, very strong back. I do fitness modeling so thats the look I am basically. Strong triceps and big biceps blah blah. My legs I didn't train much because I knew they would waste away, though I could still press 4-5 plates for reps. I did do some running casually and a good deal of stretches though nothing serious- probably similar level of flexibility as you.
Stretches i did:
Wearing shoes fingers touching ground
barefoot, attempt palm to floor
put one leg stretched behind you, take the other and bend it sideways facing inwards, then lie flat and hold this. Alternate and do this with other side as well.
Get on a hardish surface, kneeling with feet out to the side. Lean back all the way, your hamstrings will get an intense stretch. Hold until failure.
Among others.
A big tip is to stretch constantly post op, even in your horribly drugged hospital state. I was doing nonstop ankle pumps, and as my legs un numbed did heel slides(one of the most important, and where I excel most evidently tight now.). Even just raising your legs is good, as if doing a leg extension, although these are rough post op. One place where I fell short was with walking, since my initial traumatic experiences really scarred me from trying it much more. Doing it today in PT I realized if I had been properly pushed in the hospital I'd have been in a much better spot.
Anyways my official assessment is you need care for approx 6 days post OP, which includes days in the doctors office. However by all reports I am recovering at an exceptional rate so the actual number of days is probably closer to pal yes estimated 2.
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Thanks bro! I think we have a very similar build...I'm not a bodybuilder per se, but I've got muscular arms, naturally muscular legs, and a pretty decent chest and back. And since I eat really well and take care of myself, I'm pretty lean (I'd estimate maybe 12% total body fat, which I suppose is decent). I am going to be staying with my family for the first 2 weeks, and I'll have a caretaker after that. My apartment unfortunately has stairs, but Dr. Rozbruch said I can do the stairs on my butt when I need to. I'll have my caretaker to do my food shopping and laundry, so not worried about that, but the relative isolation will suck (but I have some girls and friends lined up to come visit me).
Another question for you...I've got less than 3 weeks until my big day gets here. What do you think I should I focus my workouts on? Upper body strength, cardio, legs...or should I just focus on stretching?
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I have had a very successful start so let me tell you exactly what I did in the hopes it will help you:
1. Eat well, but a lot. This may seem counterintuitive since you don't want to break the nails, but you also want to be strong and will lose a ton of strength and mass fast in the hospital if you aren't careful.
2. Walk a lot and do mild jogs. You don't want to EXHAUST your legs, just stimulate them. And don't weight train with them at all IMO. The bulky muscle my legs have sort of threw me for a loop when I realized they were big useless lumps post op.
3. Train triceps, this is the most important suggestion. These will be what you use to support yourself on the walker. Everyone who has worked with me has noted that my excellent triceps will make this a breeze for me. They help with walker, transferring from walker to anything, from bed to anything, scooting around your bed(I know this sounds silly but your first week this will be HARD- way more than you expect).
4. Keep biceps in check but don't focus too much. I did casual curling sessions leading up since the only thing they helped with really was using the pulley above my hospital bed to lift myself up.
5. Stretches- The important thing here is what Paley said to me during our consultation and has rung true. Fact is- the actual stretches you do leading up to LL are almost totally pointless. Where they excel is getting you in the state of mind to push yourself. For example, the stretch where you sit on your heel basically and lean allll the way back hurts a lot, right? So do it. Why? Because the most important LL exercises are this painful. In the hospital, I did a lot of heel slides, deep ones at that. This got me way ahead in PT.
Some of this might sound intimidating to people, but they expect much less from people at first, I actually had to tell them to push the limit and push the again for me.
I'd say the even more important thing is to ready yourself mentally. You will have at least one HELL day. Accept that, but know it will END. Know you will be weak but that you can't afford to just sit around. Do ankle pumps constantly, do your breathing exercises, do heel slides and let your hands help the motion go deep until it hurts. Feel like crap when PT comes to get you up? Force yourself, even if you fall right down and vomit. These days suck, but you set yourself up for success a lot faster.
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I think your post sums it up really nicely. Thank you PD!
I know personally when I workout, I try to do it until it freaking hurts. Part of that is to get me ready for LL, because I know I will have at least one day where I feel like I'm in hell (probably right after the epidural comes out). I'm ready for that. But I'm also keeping my eye on the prize.
I fully expect that LL will kick my ass in the early days...but I'm going to fight this with all that I've got, knowing that I will achieve something I've wanted since I was 15 years old.
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And thats exactly the attitude you need. To know you will go from a shivering weak mess to a tall, strong man. There will be small instances of weakness in yourself for sure- maybe five minutes you regret it ALL, but there will be a LIFETIME where you will be so thankful for enduring what, proportionately, is nothing.
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Seems like a great start to your lengthening so far.
Having a strong upper body definitely helps and it's been a lifesaver so far when I've had to maneuver out of bed to the toilet. Part of me wishes I was one of those gym guys that worked all upper body and had scrawny chicken legs though. I paid special attention to go heavy on the leg workouts before the surgery because I was told that having more muscle would help with recovery due to increased blood flow to the area. Unfortunately I didn't realize that having thick legs would make the lengthening a hell of a lot more painful. :-\
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I had pretty big legs but totally put a stop on exercising them with anything but cardio and stretches for that reason. My friend from Hong Kong has the fortune of being able to fully weight bear due to his weight. Me personally I grossly overcompensate and walking turns into a tricep exercise.
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I weigh about 165 ish pounds, so I won't be fully weight bearing either. Bummer. But I've known this since January :)
The general consensus seems to be that the worst pain occurs when trying to walk right after the surgery. The worst pain I've ever felt so far was when I had my broken ankle set while I was wide awake when I was 8 years old. And I guess a concussion that I got from a car accident when I was in my early 20s. Those both hurt like a mo'fo. 10/10 pain. Is walking post-op 10/10 pain? It sounds like it is. And just to clarify, you said the best way to maybe circumvent or lessen this pain would be IV pain meds before they make you walk?
Also PD, did you get the ITB release on both legs? I know I will be.
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I thought so but the PT mentioned something about only one. All I know is that hurt. lol. Still I always tell the PT "harder" "harder". She says she never hears that one lol.
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So if you are 135 pounds, you dont have to use a walker? You are allowed to full weight bear? Im 135 :)
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So if you are 135 pounds, you dont have to use a walker? You are allowed to full weight bear? Im 135 :)
In theory, if you did Precice 2 and got the bigger version of the rods (depending on how big your canals are), you would be able to weight bear. But I'd still be a little weary about it. But I'm nowhere near being able to weight bear, so I know I'll definitely be using a walker.
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Since I've fired my personal care I'm torn right now- Go from lows of really wishing I had someone to grab me food, medicine, empty my urinal and help with PT, and being totally fine, even preferring solace.
During the day I have my LL friends and PT to keep me occupied anyways so I really don't need them around then regardless. What do you all think the best hours for them are? I'm leaning towards an overnight shift ending in the morn(often when my PT is).
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Since I've fired my personal care I'm torn right now- Go from lows of really wishing I had someone to grab me food, medicine, empty my urinal and help with PT, and being totally fine, even preferring solace.
During the day I have my LL friends and PT to keep me occupied anyways so I really don't need them around then regardless. What do you all think the best hours for them are? I'm leaning towards an overnight shift ending in the morn(often when my PT is).
I have the same question. I'm about to hire a caretaker, and wondering what hours I'm going to need her. I'm thinking during the day when my roommate is at work, since she'll be around to help me shower and use the bathroom and stuff.
And I feel like after the first 2 or so weeks, I won't need her more than a few days a week to do my laundry and food shopping. But I guess we'll see.
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The way I see it based off myself and my asian friend(nicest guy ever btw, I hope you link up with someone like this it will help the process).
First few days, hell in hospital.
First week, need pretty perpetual care.
second week, probably still need care most of the time. I've been a tough guy, but eh, not really worth it. Does your insurance cover aid?
I had one of those girls I was talking to come over and she pretty much immediately was *ahem* administering fellatio. Wasn't bad , but ultimately the idea of someone I wasn't paying lingering around and cleaning out my pee etc. was too weird so I ended up having her leave and would rather just pay since then I'm not obligated to conversation etc.
This pain really needs to beat it. The pain where they smashed my hips/ass makes scooting and shifting really unpleasant. This is the single thing I most wish was fixed, maneuvering would be a dream, and I sure wouldn't need an aid since wriggling over to my walker and a wheelchair would be no problem. The other thing is the front of my quads. My two week post op asian friend says he has no pain and is just tired there, so thats a good sign. Two weeks really does seem to be the magic time frame.
I am actually flip flopping on my decision again. I called the agency but now am considering winging it or having the girl come be my maid after laying down the ground rules. I am close to this being a breeze I think. I can handle BRUTAL PT elements after all, and am very good at doing the exercises alone. I may even copy my asian friends decision and buy the extra PT days each week, which while expensive, could be worthwhile.
My biggest fear for you not lengthening with Paley is not having access to his facilities.
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Haha that's pretty awesome. I almost wish I was doing it with Paley now so you could send some of those chicks my way :)
My insurance will cover the meds and a PT that does home visits, and they pre-cleared me for the surgery/hospital, so I'm hoping that gets taken care of too. My main motivation for doing it with Dr. Rozbruch is that I'll have my family and friends nearby, and have a good chance of getting insurance coverage, since he's in-network with my plan. I also really like Dr. Rozbruch a lot, and have already established a good rapport with him.
I'm a strong and determined guy like you. I'll have no problem doing the PT on my own. I'll have about 5 weeks to focus solely on LL (I'm taking temporary disability at work), and then after that, I'll have to work from home from around 8:30am to 5pm every day (but I'm sure I'll be able to take breaks and do my lengthening/stretching).
I know you said you do about one hour of PT everyday. Do you do one solid hour at one time and then additional stretching throughout the day? That's kind of what I plan to do. Granted, my goal is mainly 6.5cm, which shouldn't be too tough. Anything over 6.5cm is just gravy for me.
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I do one hr PT at the facility but around 2+ at home- I go above and beyond the requirements here, because of the feedback of how great I'm doing and I want to stay on point to hit my lofty goal. Also keeping your legs straight all day is in and of itself part of PT. You will feel possessed to bend them for comfort, but don't.
As far as the chicks go, honestly their are a lot more hot ones than I expected willing to hook up with and/or take care of a cripple. But then I had the epiphany, after my week- long abstinence fueled deposit was made in her- That now is not really the time for women, even ideal ones.
ALSO GUYS I MADE AN ANONYMOUS SKYPE: program.dude
I urge any and everyone add me here who wants support, or has questions etc. in a private venue.
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Well I will definitely re-join Tinder when I'm crippled...if only to flirt with chicks. I do have a few that I think would be willing to come "take care" of me. But I'm staying with my family for the first two weeks, so I won't be able to until I've moved back into my place. Dreading having to do those stairs on my butt...but no pain, no gain! Plus I'm only really going to be leaving my place like once a week to get a change of scenery. And my caretaker said she'd help me get down the stairs so I could at least sit on the front porch and get some fresh air.
You have the right attitude with PT. I'm even getting an exercise bike so I can cycle in the comfort of my own home while watching TV. I'm going to have a professional PT come visit me a few times a week to keep me in check, but I'm discliplined enough to stick with it on my own.
I'll probably hit you up on Skype at some point before my big day. You're doing great, stay strong!
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We will see- If things steadily improve pain wise i'm golden. I continue to thrive in PT- today she had me get on my stomach and I said "this is new" she gave me a worried look and was surprised it was my first time saying "then I'll be the nurse you hate: So I think "this is it. This is where things get rough. And yet... even easier than the previous stretches, even with my insisting she really lay into me.
But the post surgical pain lingers both in my femurs and where they busted my hips open. It usually sounds like by the two week mark things magically dissipate so at this point I'm going from waiting to hoping.... This will be what determines if this is a fun cake walk or an elongated hell.
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Pretty bad morning, ran out of my pain meds and the whole morning was in agony while simultaneously trying to get more(had begun the process last night).
I am feeling better now that I have some but truly hope this post op pain goes away soon. With it out of the way I will be thinking clear 24 7 and able to enjoy my down time.
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Cant believe how close i am already to my 2 week post op check up. Hoping hoping hoping all is good. Pretty mud just counting the hours until then.
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I wish you a smooth journey.
Maybe I missed it in your diary, but how much do you weigh, do you use walker, when will Dr. Paley let you use crutches?
I asked these questions from a different Precice patient, but I wanted to get your opinion as well.
Good luck.
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No word on exactly when I can use crutches, and yes I currently use a walker.
I weigh around 170.
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Honestly guys I hope everyone has a better time with their care than me. I haven't talked much about it, but its venting time- And education that things can go very awry here.
First night back from the hospital, feeling terrible. My one request was a coherent aide. Her accent was incredibly thick. She was also hard of hearing. Late into the night/early morning when I most need my sleep I hear a loud blaring phone alarm or something similar from the other room. "hello?" I croak "Hello???" before long I am practically screaming to get her attention- but nothing does the job until twenty minutes later when the next aide comes in which wakes her up.
Next incident. To replace the incoherent aide I get a delusional middle aged white one, who was nonstop shoving her phone app of a talking cat in my face even after saying I wasn't interested. She also took regular smoke breaks, fell asleep, and snored. Furthermore, one night as she was leaving I asked where my next aide was and she said I had none. I was still in rough shape then so I was confused and scrambling to get my clicks done and ready for the night. I get a call some forty minutes later that the aide is at the front desk. Apparently the delusional lady passed the other aide and said I wasn't scheduled for help so she wouldn't be able to get in, so the other aide turned around before calling the agency much later.
I canceled all services at this point, but ended up resuming them as I simply wasn't feeling up to maintaining myself just yet. Shortly thereafter I noticed that my mountain of protein bars I'd brought was growing thin so I moved them to my bedside drawer. Then tonight the aide comes over and goes into it and takes out two bars. I say "I'm not hungry" to which she replies "for me" all smiles. I inform her they are quest bars- very expensive and purchased for myself. Even then she doesn't put them back until I explicitly told her to do so. At that point I told her to leave and cancelled all services.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not that choked up over all this, just wanted to share. I'd suffer a million incompetent aides before I'd brave the hospital ever again.
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Attendants can be a blessing or a total pain in the ass. I was so thankful to have attendants at the beginning, but after I got an attendant that was constantly doing irritating things I just wanted to get out of the hospital already. It doesn't help either that you tend to get more irritable when you're practically crippled.
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Hey PD,
Stay strong, this seems to be quite annoying but this is temporary trouble.
Compared to being a mighty 5'11 in the end.. well!
You're gonna make it :)
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I hope my journal isn't giving the wrong impression- yes I had bad aides and yes the hospital is absolute hell, but overall my experience is great and very much on the right path- I am learning new lessons every day, becoming much stronger, surprising my PT's(todays actually went rapid fire through everything, attempting to find something I didn't excel at), meeting new people(there was an LL'er BBQ party by the pool yesterday where I met most of the crew here who are at all different phases of the process, and most who have very loving and supporting families with them). In other words it has been a great and growing experience, and I'm not even out of the phase where pain is gone.
If my X-rays on monday are good I will be on top of the world. Also can't wait to get into the pool!
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I am glad everything is going well for you. Keeping a positive outlook will benefit your overall healing.
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I am in a pretty positive place now, but if X rays are good tomorrow, positive will be an understatement!
Nights are somewhat hard for me(my Hong Kong LL'er friend has reported the same), as discomfort has me waking up every hour or two. Mornings are also somewhat tough because of this, being weak bodied and ill rested making it hard to find the motivation to get up and go downstairs. This is really all mental though, because although doing the morning click, emptying the glamorous urinal, downing the million supplements/medications, washing face and other hygienic endeavours is a chore, getting down to the food, and stretching your legs out while you enjoy it and your kindle etc. really does get you in the right mindset.
It is funny how differently I am viewed in a wheelchair. Usually people are a little intimidated because of my build/facial features but not everyone is going out of their way to introduce themselves, whether it be to socialize or offer help. One funny thing is how strange it is to explain to people the reason you're in a wheelchair. Some assume you are crippled or got in an accident/are way overly sympathetic, so usually I just say its temporary if theres a moment to, or try and explain the procedure, usually to much confusion. This gets tedious though so I've been making up random stories and rolling with them for fun.
Had a girl over, who obviously knew about my situation that I'd been talking to, and we had some fun, and she wanted to basically stay around/help me out and drive me when needed. But because of A. me feeling really uncomfortable about a good looking girl dumping out my pee B. Hadn't even been feeling mobile at the time(this was a few days ago) so the notion of just lying around seemed unappealing and C. The painkillers messing with me/me generally being uncomfortable and not myself all led to me telling her maybe in a week or two.
Lastly an observation I've had is that the average cosmetic LL'er is significantly more attractive and (Seemingly) happy than what I'd imagined based off these forums(no offense guys!).
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Upped my pain meds but my right knee and hip are really in bad shape tonight. Making that whole sleeping thing hard.
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Lastly an observation I've had is that the average cosmetic LL'er is significantly more attractive and (Seemingly) happy than what I'd imagined based off these forums(no offense guys!).
This has kind of been my experience too (I've met one guy off of these forums, and know what a few others look like). At just under 5'6", I was blessed with great facial aesthetics and so have still done pretty ok with women. But yet, I've always still felt insecure about my height. That will be changing very, very soon!!! (2 weeks!).
I think a lot of LL guys work really hard to compensate (the gym and general grooming, other things you can fix like teeth, etc.). I know I've been like that. But then we still feel we need the height to not have that overshadow everything.
Glad you seem like you're doing better. You're almost at the 2 week mark...I'm sure things will significantly turn around for you soon bro.
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Disclaimer- superficial post ahead:
Its more than just people who compensate though, these are happy and specifically in the cases of the females, genetically gifted. Of the people at my hotel theres two females doing CLL- One who is drop dead gorgeous and has a strong personality, always laughing, probably in her 30's and has a whole family here with her. Another is a very young girl(family is clearly very well off) who is probably the shyest of the people here but still seems very happy and is, again, very very good looking. One guy who came to only do an inch(which I think is crazy at this price tag and the hospital horror alone but hey) also looks good and is a happy as can be with the results. One guy is here with a great family and I believe his gf, probably the closest to a typical ll'er I'd envisioned in terms of how he looks but by no means ugly, and is a really cool guy with a great family.
Heck my Hong Kong friend looks absolutely amazing for being 50(35 tops), is married, has kids, isn't even short for an asian country(5 7), and is an extremely happy and friendly guy despite also being in the first 3 weeks post op.
Anyways, off for x rays!!!
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So really good news and some bad.
On the good side I'M TALLER! THE NAILS ARE WORKING!
The bad news is I am distracting slower on the left side so they did 2 mm in one sitting(which HURTS and still does) before taking more x rays which confirmed that every things good to go. Sounds like the muscle on my leg makes it harder for me than others. The thing is I think I'm to blame for this as it sounded/felt like the left side was lengthening when I was doing it alone and it was actually the right leg I was concerned with so I think I was pressing down less hard subconsciously(it worked right around half the days I did it).
Overall right now I am very very happy but in terrible, terrible pain. Its funny since last night and this morning, it was my right knee and side killing and keeping me up but my left legs current pain level literally makes the rest of my body feel totally painless and normal. What a world of difference from doing .25 mm at a time.
In other words, if you've got muscled legs push down HARD or regret it.
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Sorry to hear about your pain. It is a price to pay, in order to get taller.
Do you know why your left side was lengthening slower. Is it because of your muscles not letting the nail to lengthen? Or was it problems with the lengthening device?
What do you mean by " if you have muscles, push down hard or regret it". Do you mean, no weightlifting (legs) before the surgery?
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My muscles are among the thickest they have ever worked with- because of this mixed with the fact I was pressing down lighter on my left, I lengthened significantly less. I'm pretty bummed something totally preventable is A. causing me a ton of pain and B. Gonna set things back presumably.
Regardless I am still in a good place overall considering no serious issue.
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Had to use a lot of painkillers to get through yesterday but all good here now for the most part. Really can't believe how much worse doing 2 MM(even 1 MM wasn't fun, took a minute break between), but the last half of the second MM became insanely painful in a way I can't even explain which lasted that way for the next 12 hours or so.
I haven't been sleeping very well- mostly for an hour or so, usually waking up stiff, dry mouthed, and sometimes in a bit of a confusion. I blame the pain meds, but barring any more really excruciating lengthening sessions I think the worst of the pain is done and that I'll be able to scale those back. Water, getting up. moving around. and stretching for awhile gets me feeling like a new person within the hour- So I advise everyone to keep as active as possible if they are feeling like death, much like the hospital, but to a lesser extent.
Somewhat dreading lengthening my left leg today but I am sure even pressing down hard as hell, that doing it in smaller increments won't come close to triggering an extended painful response.
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I took no pain meds today and already did Pt and honestly am not that very pained- lengthening(at least hopefully, though I'm pressing down with a good couple hundred pounds of force)my left side fortunately wasn't excruciating and I'm all recovered on my left from the 2mm. I'm noting more aches overall in my more lengthened right side, but nothing too bad.
Sleep schedule is very odd. Last night couldn't fall asleep till pretty late, slept for an hour, woke up, slept for two or so hours and woke up pretty close to PT/breakfast. Did those then came back and passed out for another hour or two.
Right now, oddly, the thing thats bothering me is feeling like I need to go to the bathroom a lot(both 1 and/or 2), I figure its either me coming off the pain meds or the other meds Im taking, but its just a very perpetual uncomfortable feeling.
Right now my hopes are that all issues that really eat up my focus dissipate so I can be comfortable and entertained, and that with me applying a ton of pressure that my left leg is now lengthening equally, which is certainly my biggest concern.
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Didn't sleep well as usual last night, but once I'm actually tackling the day I feel fine. Pt went well as usual and I ended up lapsing into sleep when I got back to the hotel.
Ended up hanging out with that girl again now that I'm more capable and feeling more human and we went shopping, with me resolving to use my walker as much as possible starting today. I got new shorts since my swollen hips had my others not fitting and an overpriced foam roller for PT.
Also got some heating pads to see if they help with the sleep, and took a valium as per my PT's recommendation.
Will see how tonight goes, and more importantly the x rays tomorrow morning.
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I do think the pads helped- I managed a solid 2 and a half or 3 hours of sleep, but awoke to the usual extreme discomfort. It is tolerable though and there is always the literal light at the end of the tunnel of morning, moving around, eating, being distracted by conversation/company(which really does help).
Weirdest thing is- I'm no longer really medicated but when I wake up its in a delirium, almost without fail- Which is not normal for me. Usually I think something is happening that isn't, like just now I woke and an entire scenario of people coming up to get me for PT played out in my mind and I was jostling around starting to get ready(more just jostling around but I'd convinced myself it was for the purpose of the latter), and it literally took around five or ten minutes to realize it was 2 30 am. Usually these bouts of confusion are shorter, and I think thats in part due to the fact my sleep tonight was deeper.
I'm not really complaining mind you, its just strange since its clearly correlated to the surgery- not just a change of scenery since the week I spent here pre op I slept like a baby and woke up totally normal.
So, I know although I seem like I've been a bit of a downer about things, I do usually compose them at night, when things don't seem so great. It does seem like things are getting better, I am certainly the most well rested from a single sleep than I have been in a long while. Also embracing the company was a good idea, it makes the days go faster and just talking to people. Spending a "normal" day out and about did seem to fix my troublesome bathroom issues too.
Its just a matter of hours until the big news about my left legs lengthening rate. I actually have a good feeling though since my left leg is certainly seemingly feeling stretched and having similar sensations as my right.
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So far so good besides "minor problems" keep it up bud!
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Fantastic news- My legs are lengthening beautifully and the discrepancy from before is negligible at this point. Beyond this, I have been given pool approval which I took full advantage of right after PT, with my friend from Hong Kong who showed me the ropes.
I've talked to my LL friends and they report similar sleeping issues. Hopefully this improves at least somewhat however- this is really my main complaint at the moment- but as bad as it is then, during the day it is like a distant memory. At this current rate I will have reached my goal by mid october or so, assuming I decide to lengthen the full amount.
Let this be a cautionary tale to muscular LL'ers to always press down HARD when using the magnet.
Today was packed with exercise- going everywhere on the walker really takes it out of you- plus the time spent in the pool. Heck I may actually sleep semi properly tonight due to exhaustion, which would be more than welcome!
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Good to hear that you are doing great.
Did you go shopping with your walker, how was that trip, was it exhausting?
If you don't sleep good at night, can you take naps during the day, or you don't want to do that?
In the pool, do you just walk or do you swim?
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Lots of good questions. I think a long shopping trip on the walker would by physically impossible- I walked from my room to the elevator, took it from 3 to 1, walked to the lobby, out front where my lady friend had brought her vehicle and got inside. We drove to the store and I got on one of those ridiculous scooter things for the actual shopping. After getting back I felt bold and told her just to park and I'd walk through the parking lot instead of being dropped off in front. That proved exhausting and more than I should have bit off for my first day using the walker seriously.
I do nap sometimes when truly exhausted but these are equally unfulfilling, although anything to chip away at time I consider a good thing. Its not the actual hour of day that makes sleeping difficult, just that sleeping in general is rough.
In the pool I do both, usually with a noodle because you will find balance to be surprisingly difficult to achieve. Kicking is much harder than I thought it would be but great exercise.
I had easily my best sleep last night, of around 4-5 hours and after breakfast, came back for several more. So it seems like exercise is gonna be the name of the game for me, which had been my original plan anyhow.
One new annoyance is my butt(or lack of it at this point) is starting to get sore from anything, even just lying down in bed.
Overall things are again, looking better. Hopefully the days start melting away now that I'm sleeping more. I googled trying to find an outcall PT since my insurance covers it, but had no success. Something like that would be phenomenal in terms of keeping me loose before bed/in general and passing the hours, especially on days like today where I have no PT at the center.
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You might want to google, Home health nursing company. Usually, home health nursing and physical therapy are all the same company and provide variety of services.
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(http://s30.postimg.org/rkmi17lu5/photo_1.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/rkmi17lu5/)(http://s30.postimg.org/jdui9mvrh/photo_2.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/jdui9mvrh/)
Wanted to do my part for the community and share these. Note that the first one was where there was a decent discrepancy between left and right- Right before I lengthened the 2 MM in one go. Now I believe there is only a 3 MM discrepancy.
The one of just my left leg is from yesterday when they confirmed it is lengthening normally.
Btw it is interesting to note- they allowed(insisted) me to stand fully weight bearing for the x ray yesterday. When I resisted, as my greatest paranoia is the rod being damaged, the x ray operator told me nothing he does is without paleys consent, which means that the rods are certainly a decent bit stronger than they make them seem.
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Hi Programdude
Thank you very much for writing your diary and sharing this valuable information with us. I have a few questions regarding the additional costs of LL.
1. How much is accommodation at where you are staying?
2. How many hours per week do you pay for your helper?
3. How much is all the medication? (I know your insurance pays for it but I am simply looking for a ball park figure)
4. Are there any other additional costs?
I am just generally looking for a ballpark figure on how much ll actually costs. Thank you very much if you can take the time to answer my questions.
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Hi Programdude
Thank you very much for writing your diary and sharing this valuable information with us. I have a few questions regarding the additional costs of LL.
1. How much is accommodation at where you are staying?
2. How many hours per week do you pay for your helper?
3. How much is all the medication? (I know your insurance pays for it but I am simply looking for a ball park figure)
4. Are there any other additional costs?
I am just generally looking for a ballpark figure on how much ll actually costs. Thank you very much if you can take the time to answer my questions.
I am here to help and inform people to make smart decisions- This is really serious stuff even with the best surgeon and I do not recommend anyone approach it the way I did. You really should have a game plan.
1. I am staying at homewood suites by hilton- with a long term stay and Paleys rate it is a very reasonable 63 dollars a night. This includes a breakfast buffet which is actually pretty delicious and changes up a bit every day, and dinner mon-thurs which also tends to be pretty good. The fitness center is not great but has one machine useful for LL'ers where you can sit and pedal. The pool is also an incredible feature since it is the best way to exercise post op.
2. I don't have a helper- I fired them around the sixth day, rehired them shortly after for two days and fired them again due to theft of my food and general lack of professionalism. Most will need them a lot for the first two weeks- you will not be in great shape then.
3. Be prepared for this- Without insurance this is extremely expensive due to the blood thinners costs- if you are looking to achieve around 8 cm this will cost you 1500-2000 approximately. My insurance is excellent so fortunately each month my medication costs only around 40 usd- but they did NOT inform me of this prior so I suspect many are unaware of it.
4. Not really, yet- transportation here is excellent and if for some reason the Paley vans can't get you to an appointment the hotel will free of charge. This is highly individual though. Some people may find they need help and have to pay for it- which without insurance is expensive, other may feel the need to have access to a vehicle etc etc.
You would be foolish to not have at least 100k prepared for this, and really it is always wiser to have around twice that, for life after, as well as any possible additional expenses.
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Gonna try and keep this journal more journal-ly
August 9th- Slept well again thanks to my new/good friend valium. I am getting more and more used to waking up in misery. No confusion now, and I usually immediately stretch- attempt to find a good position to get back to sleep in- fail- get up to take a shower- relish how damn good the hot water feels(it feels amazing). And then go to breakfast buffet, come back and pass out for a little bit longer.
I had PT, though they messed up my time and I ended up having to sit around getting stiff for an hour. Session went well as they all have- I am told I am ahead of the curve.
I went out to eat with one of the girls I got to know pre op- Sushi buffet, which is always my favorite. However going in a walker is a frustrating experience since she had to get me everything- and a buffet that isn't hands on just isn't the same.
Watched some TV/she gave me a thorough massage after I did my last clicks. She wanted to sleep over but I told her I'd rather go it alone since sleeping is still weird for me.
I ended up finishing a book that day too which got me through the first days of this month and is actually, in my opinion, perfect for LL'ers to read. It is essentially about students who have the theory that near death experiences can lead to developing superhuman powers, and of course decide to test this theory out. Somehow reading about the severe pain these people were inflicting upon themselves to transform/rebuild themselves felt very relatable and distracted from my own discomfort.
August 10th -
Slept well like before, although my ankles randomly were killing me as I went to bed.
No PT today(which is always unfortunate). I am slightly concerned since I've heard the same sound when lengthening my left leg a few times, which I had originally thought meant it was working, but later realized that hadn't been the case of course.
I am all too eager to strike days off the calendar and find myself welcoming anything that proves to be even a remote distraction to make the hours tick faster- since I am basically just waiting for time to slip by right now. I suspect this month will be the hardest- once it is gone, knowing there is only one FULL month where I am still distracting will almost assuredly light a fire/hunger in me.
I believe I'll be swimming again today, and look forward to the exercise tiring me out/somewhat filling in for PT.
My feeling right now is not particularly happy, miserable, stressed, or pained. Mostly I feel empty. Sort of like a shell mostly at the mercy of things like time and potentially, the effectiveness of the lengthening device which I don't like.
Next X ray day will hopefully be a good one- as it will be towards the end of the month, and if all goes well, get me a visual that reminds me of what I am here for.
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Those girls probably feel good about themselves when they help you. Don't worry, just let them help you.
So you are having trouble sleeping at night because of muscle stiffnes? or any other reason?
Do you go to Physical therapy everyday in the hotel van?
About feeling empty, how about a project, like learning a new language.
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As far as the girls- Yes they feel good and are interested etc. But it just doesn't sit right with me. Its something very hard to explain to someone who hasn't experienced LL. You just don't feel like yourself and aren't really interested in things like sex etc. Plus I don't know how it would be having someone sleep over when I am having difficulties sleeping already.
Muscle stiffness and aches are the cause for terrible sleep. Its crazy how it all kicks up the moment I get into bed to sleep. I have been having better luck staying asleep for a chunk of time which is good- but lately actually falling asleep is tough.
Pt is 5 days a week in the van and has been fine so far. Actually more than fine- as I am "ahead of the curve" and feel great after(I wish I had PT right before bed). This is I think, one of the strongest reasons to go with Paley- The free transport to PT and great staff make that part a breeze.
The problem with a project, or anything really, is that I have a constant discomfort that keeps me from being able to focus. Originally I was excited to get out there, have time away from it all, read a few books, and watch a few movies. But I was only able to read one book and watch one movie in whats closing in on a month- let alone being able to learn a language. You just aren't all there while there is this dull ache all throughout you.
The others here with help seem in a better place- maybe the fact they are here with familiar faces, or just much closer to their goals than I are helping them. Although- During the day when I am out and moving around and conversing it probably seems like I'm having a breeze myself, so what I see from them may not be accurate. One girl did explicitly say she was having no problems sleeping and slept about nine hours regularly. Another recommended benadryl to help fall back asleep when you wake up(which does tend to be impossible the times I sleep four hours or so).
Something to take away from my diary so far is that LL will test/strain you in ways you hadn't expected. And its hardly something you can prepare for. Really, the biggest roller coaster ever.
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As far as the girls- Yes they feel good and are interested etc. But it just doesn't sit right with me. Its something very hard to explain to someone who hasn't experienced LL. You just don't feel like yourself and aren't really interested in things like sex etc. Plus I don't know how it would be having someone sleep over when I am having difficulties sleeping already.
Muscle stiffness and aches are the cause for terrible sleep. Its crazy how it all kicks up the moment I get into bed to sleep. I have been having better luck staying asleep for a chunk of time which is good- but lately actually falling asleep is tough.
Pt is 5 days a week in the van and has been fine so far. Actually more than fine- as I am "ahead of the curve" and feel great after(I wish I had PT right before bed). This is I think, one of the strongest reasons to go with Paley- The free transport to PT and great staff make that part a breeze.
The problem with a project, or anything really, is that I have a constant discomfort that keeps me from being able to focus. Originally I was excited to get out there, have time away from it all, read a few books, and watch a few movies. But I was only able to read one book and watch one movie in whats closing in on a month- let alone being able to learn a language. You just aren't all there while there is this dull ache all throughout you.
The others here with help seem in a better place- maybe the fact they are here with familiar faces, or just much closer to their goals than I are helping them. Although- During the day when I am out and moving around and conversing it probably seems like I'm having a breeze myself, so what I see from them may not be accurate. One girl did explicitly say she was having no problems sleeping and slept about nine hours regularly. Another recommended benadryl to help fall back asleep when you wake up(which does tend to be impossible the times I sleep four hours or so).
Something to take away from my diary so far is that LL will test/strain you in ways you hadn't expected. And its hardly something you can prepare for. Really, the biggest roller coaster ever.
You should try going to sleep on your tummy. It is not as painful as sleeping on the back. I naturally go to sleep on my back but post op it is quite hard especially with the pain/stretch on the outer side of the thighs. If your sleeping gets worse then I'd suggest you get some sleeping tablets. I take it on some nights.
As for sex post op, this is the last thing on my mind and I think I have temporarily become asexual. I can't imagine one having sex while LL :o
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Yeah, asexual is the right term. I mean, I am still mildly interested, but the interactions I've had with girls since the operation have been much less exciting.
Lately its randomly been my ankles hurting, so lying on my stomach tends to do nothing unfortunately- plus I am just so not used to it.
If I knew of sleeping tablets that worked I'd use them in a heartbeat.
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Yeah sleeping tablets unfortunately haven't worked at all for me either. Best thing I've found is taking an Ultracet and it makes it easier to find a sleeping position that doesn't cause me to be uncomfortable.
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August 11- Good news and bad news. The bad news is- The pain begins. Really strange and out of nowhere, today my left IT band starting having serious pain- bad enough that I couldn't lie on that side(even though I could the prior night.). I did insist he still stretch them even though it hurt like crazy. My pulling movements are very strong- my weakness right now is keeping my knees extended which is frustrating since I spend every day with this on my mind, only to be told its not great(albeit not disastrous).
The sort of good news is I've lost 20 pounds and am now just below weight bearing limit- So I can actually stand if I want to/worry less when using the walker.
I am hoping this IT issue is just from something like pushing myself in the pool etc. and will go away/diminish.
But at the end of the day I can still walk/get through PT which is what matters, and will be trying to maintain staying off painkillers.
My sleep last night was around 4 hours so I may attempt to sleep shortly and hope I wake up in less pain.
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August 12- Having talked to others and given myself a good look in the mirror I don't think I'm going the full 8 cm on femurs at this point. At first I thought it was crazy to come here and do anything less than the absolute maximum after spending all that cash but a few factors have influenced me.
A. Now that I am beginning to see my elongated femurs, I think the full distraction may look ridiculous.
B. I talked to a few LL'ers at the end of their journey, who also cut things short- noting that they felt satisfied with where they were at and that more would ruin their proportions. One even mentioned a LL'er who recently left and regrets going 8 cm so much that he contacted Paley in regards to shortening.
C. As the rod expands it becomes weaker. Even a light girl here who did around 6 cm had a mild bend. By stopping earlier I minimize these chances.
D. Especially with the loss of so much weight I do want to re-enter normal life asap and get back to being some semblance of my normal self.
Depending on how this all plays out though I might be interested in tibias to even things out since I am not going the full distance- Although more likely I think I will just enjoy my life at my new height.
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Today the IT band pain is even more intense- affecting walking, smaller motions, and making PT incredibly painful. However my minds responded to this in a very interesting way. Where before this experience was basically a million annoyances bundled into one- now I have something distinct to fight, which has me strangely motivated. Now rather than "I want to get out of here" I feel "I want to conquer this IT band".
Strange, I know, but this real pain snapped my head back into the game.
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Today the IT band pain is even more intense- affecting walking, smaller motions, and making PT incredibly painful. However my minds responded to this in a very interesting way. Where before this experience was basically a million annoyances bundled into one- now I have something distinct to fight, which has me strangely motivated. Now rather than "I want to get out of here" I feel "I want to conquer this IT band".
Strange, I know, but this real pain snapped my head back into the game.
Oh yes! I know exactly how the pain feels! For me it was a sharp pain when I tried lifting my left leg up and prevented me from performing several movements. It started around day 6-7. Give it a few days and it should disappear.
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Really? Thats good news. It seriously snapped me back to earth.
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August 13th-
Hard day but still focused and progressing. IT band is giving me hell but I insisted that we still stretch it good. I've gotten good at sort of going to a different place as they seriously stretch my body. I've got zero complaints about PT since bursts of pain aren't a big deal and really should be the last of anyones worries who's considering pursuing this(since you will quit day one).
I've been icing my IT band regularly and it does help- and I urge others who develop this issue to do so even though making ice packs can be a pain when you are alone.
I am somewhat adapting to not being able to sleep properly. For example last night I slept literally not at all- it was a bunch of awful confused tossing and turning. However even though I was a zombie when it was breakfast time I ate, showered to get loose and passed out till right before PT. Again- This is a very up and down experience but you do eventually start to settle into it, getting used to hellish nights of poor sleep and functioning off that and getting into the rhythm of lengthening, napping, eating, PT.
I've talked to a lot of lengtheners here and they keep assuring me things get better. If thats the case things will absolutely become tolerable since even with this incredible pain I am toughening up. I also met a new LL'er today that isn't at the hotels(rich dad, paid for operation and is renting an apartment) who is about a month ahead of me. He, like mostly everyone else reports sleeping issues, but says it does get better as well. Being the newest lengthener can be discouraging in a way, but if what everyone says is true then its also certainly very encouraging.
I tried crutches today, took me a bit to adjust but I actually do like them- the walker is freaking exhausting and the grips hurt so I am pretty keen to upgrade. Plus they said historically those who get on crutches do better overall.
Lastly due to the immense pain I may begin using painkillers before PT, since they basically told me theres no sense in being a hero if it has a chance of interfering there and I'm being responsible.
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Do you know your wingspan and sitting height? How does the length of your femurs currently compare to the length of your torso? Can you even notice the 2CM difference, proportionally?
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using painkillers before PT
That's definitely a good idea, should make things easier. What kind of painkillers do they offer btw?
Also, how much force it takes to straighten your legs right after waking up?
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I actually don't know my numbers, somewhat intentionally, since I don't want to get caught up on them, just what I like the most in terms of feel and look. It is hard to say if I can notice it yet or if it is weight loss/posture.
They offer oxycodone. I try and sleep with legs as straight as possible, but either way it takes a mild bit of effort to fully extend them when I get up to walk. Sleeping really badly again tonight.
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They offer oxycodone.
Holy moly, that's like heroin in pills! Can you send me some? Haha jk. I thought they'd give you something less potent like tramadol or NSAIDs. I'd be careful with oxy, it has a good potential of developing addiction. Though it really is FUN!
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I have been staying away from them- I was only glued to them the first few days after discharge where pain was absurd. Honestly right now taking them seems to do little to nothing in 5 mg tabs.
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They offer oxycodone. I try and sleep with legs as straight as possible, but either way it takes a mild bit of effort to fully extend them when I get up to walk. Sleeping really badly again tonight.
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You have to make efforts fully extend your legs at the knee area or hip?
I agree, it is wise to take as few oxycodone as possible.
Are you having pain at the ITB release site? Can you tell if ITB release surgery has helped (loose)?
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August 14th-
I really don't know if the release helped or not, all I know is it outright hurts, moreso than being tight(which is actually more of a good sign- tightness can mean bent nails and complications). Good news is working with my PT and independently icing it has helped make significant progress. Day 1 of the issue it would have taken a team of people to hold me down on my left side, and just yesterday it was still impossible to lie on that side and pressing down would make me jolt. Today my PT was able to massage into it well and stretch it. Certainly feels good to conquer issues- or at least make progress. So in 3 days 10/10 pain(with pressure) to 2/10 with pressure. One of the many reasons competent PT are ESSENTIAL for this process. They were able to identify the issue day 1, stretch me properly and turn things around/instruct me on how to turn things around in a matter of 48 hours.
As far as straightening, they can be straight fine- But they are anal about wanting them CONSTANTLY locked out. This is one of the big advantages to losing the wheelchair and using the walker/crutches.
Today I bought crutches and will be using those as much as possible. They are priced VERY fairly for the extreme quality and I look forward to getting used to them. They certainly feel more mobile and unlike the walker don't BUTCHER your palms. Seriously the walker gets old fast- waiting for the elevator every day using that is such a pain.
Just about halfway through the month and think my next x rays are in a week so I'm feeling pretty good. Gonna go to a going away party downstairs for two of the LL'ers who are leaving, and hopefully tire myself out. I really don't want a repeat of last nights total lack of sleep.
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That is great that you get to use crutches soon. Hopefully you can go to more places with crutches.
I wonder what is Dr. Paley's reasoning to let you use crutches now instead of right after surgery. Is your bone more consolidated now, compared to right after surgery? Can the nail support more than 75lb now? I know you have lost some weight. But I am talking in general, not in your specific case.
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August 15th-
In my case its just that I lost 20 pounds that lets me use the crutches now. In theory once you were with it you could pretty much immediately use them.
Got some ZZZquil which a LL'er who left today swore by, which will hopefully help save me at night. Speaking of that LL'er, his nail stopped working around 7 CM, which fortunately for him was his goal.
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How were his proportions after doing 7CM?
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Fine from what I could tell, you would never think twice about his proportions, at least with shorts on. He started off very short at around 5 3 or so. He had shorter tibia to begin with too.
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Fine from what I could tell, you would never think twice about his proportions, at least with shorts on. He started off very short at around 5 3 or so. He had shorter tibia to begin with too.
Awesome! I'm glad for him! I have friends who are 5'6 and completely fine with their heights. I hate to admit it, but 5'3 almost seems freakishly short for an adult man, but 5'6 seems very normal. Definitely not "ideal", but perfectly normal. Going from crazy short (height is unfortunately the first thing I notice about 5'3 people, but not 5'6 people) to just normal (going from bellow the 1st percentile to 5th-8th percentile), must be a very positive and life changing experience.
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He seemed extremely happy and seemed keen on doing tibias sometime in the next few years.
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August 16th-
ZZZquill works how my LL friend advertised. Basically falling asleep is just about as difficult and you will still wake up fairly frequently- however unlike usually you will be able to pass out again. This led to a very weird night of me passing out and waking up at least 20 times. After 7ish hours I felt groggy and like crap but forced myself to go get breakfast at which point I felt a bit better. So this'll help me but not the end all be all for awesome sleep.
Two groups of LL'ers are gone so it seems really quiet here. I'm very happy for them though, they seemed very satisfied and because they had a good support system seemed to have a good journey, and were thankful for no complications.
I know theres been progress with my issues etc. but the physchological aspect of this is still very taxing- The big issues mostly defeated so I'm back to having just a general dull feeling of not being well-aches, stomach, not actually being able to focus on anything, poor sleep. Getting texts from people who think I'm off having a blast as I'm lying around in discomfort sort of sucks, and every day when I wheelchair to get food(the only way to carry it) I just feel so in the way of everyone in/around the elevator/trying to get food. I know this all sounds super petty, but it all combines and mixes together into a very real negative feeling that I think people should be aware of. I am closing in on that one month mark which does feel good, but I really need to see another X-Ray to get me going again. I think I have one sometime early next week though which is good assuming every things working fine(if the pain and tightness are anything to go by, it is).
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Interesting thoughts, regarding the negative feelings. As a non-LLer, I never think about those things. Also this is just a pure guess, but because you are more accomplished (have your business etc.), you are probably not used to being helpless.
Right now, keep up with the program, one month has passed the rest will pass as well.
I have a question regarding the ITB release, did Dr. Paley said that you needed ITB release because without that surgery, the nail was at risk for bending during lengthening? Did you says that ITB surgery was absolutely necessary or it is just helpful
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http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/6102_197852273687558_1968076425_n.jpg (http://sphotos-c.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/6102_197852273687558_1968076425_n.jpg)
Check the guy in red trousers. His torso is way to short for his legs. But arms balance it out imo.
If you put your fingers infront of his arm you will see the disperancy more obvious. Now that is how i don't want to look.
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Seems normal to me.
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He insisted on it, not that I argued. Based off the large amount of muscle I had- but I forget why this was a problem(if it was because of my goal of 8 cm, tightness, etc.).
Being helpless is certainly something I am loathing. For example not being able to just gather up my laundry and go do it grates on me. And today I ordered delivery they said it would be an hour but it was 30 mins, so instead of being in the lobby as planned I was in my room, I told him just to come up and I tried to get the crutches but by the time he was knocking I had to settle on the walker, plop in the wheelchair and get over there. Hard to explain why this is so frustrating, but literally taking twice as long to get from the bed to the doorway as it takes some dude to get from the lobby to your third floor room sucks. I know these sound petty- and they ARE petty, but day after day, week after week, moment after moment they do get to you if you don't have a proper support system.
Hope people don't view this as being dramatic etc. I just want people to be aware of how you mentally feel going through this the way I have.
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Aug 18th- A little bummed out, they don't have me scheduled for x rays for a full week which will be 3 weeks since my last x rays. Was really looking forward to seeing/confirming progress(although based off how I feel I'm sure its working). At least I should be on the way to 4 CM by then.
Btw, as of 2 days ago I've been in FL two months, and just 4 days till its been a month post op.
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He insisted on it, not that I argued. Based off the large amount of muscle I had- but I forget why this was a problem(if it was because of my goal of 8 cm, tightness, etc.).
Being helpless is certainly something I am loathing. For example not being able to just gather up my laundry and go do it grates on me. And today I ordered delivery they said it would be an hour but it was 30 mins, so instead of being in the lobby as planned I was in my room, I told him just to come up and I tried to get the crutches but by the time he was knocking I had to settle on the walker, plop in the wheelchair and get over there. Hard to explain why this is so frustrating, but literally taking twice as long to get from the bed to the doorway as it takes some dude to get from the lobby to your third floor room sucks. I know these sound petty- and they ARE petty, but day after day, week after week, moment after moment they do get to you if you don't have a proper support system.
Hope people don't view this as being dramatic etc. I just want people to be aware of how you mentally feel going through this the way I have.
Lol i would not take myself to serious. Just laugh at the whole situation and 4 months from then you are where you want to be. What else can we ask for. Love it.
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Don't get me wrong, usually do that. When I'm hanging out with my LL buds I just joke about how crazy/crippled we are. Its really when I'm alone and can't focus on anything but the discomfort that things are bad(which is also when I write these). Weekends with no PT are especially hard since that means more tightness and less social interaction and the days in general are longer and emptier- I honestly think doing this with someone around to support you/help out just a bit would be twice as easy.
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Don't get me wrong, usually do that. When I'm hanging out with my LL buds I just joke about how crazy/crippled we are. Its really when I'm alone and can't focus on anything but the discomfort that things are bad(which is also when I write these). Weekends with no PT are especially hard since that means more tightness and less social interaction and the days in general are longer and emptier- I honestly think doing this with someone around to support you/help out just a bit would be twice as easy.
Either the glass is half full or half empty. Why dont you look into information online so you can get smarter and eventually find your true self. Not your psudo self (ego) that i think you have now. Now is the time to harvest information. Or some music. Get to know your creative side.
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That all sounds really familiar to me, programdude. Joking with your buddies about how crazy you all are, having a difficult time focusing on anything because of the discomfort, getting mentally and emotionally drained about being helpless... all part of the LL experience. Which WILL END, mind you, and results in your being taller! :)
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Either the glass is half full or half empty. Why dont you look into information online so you can get smarter and eventually find your true self. Not your psudo self (ego) that i think you have now. Now is the time to harvest information. Or some music. Get to know your creative side.
Easy there lol. The pain is too constant to focus on anything and absorb it. I have zero complaints about the bursts of pain during PT/certain movements- its the constant distracting pain thats the problem. I'm actually very in touch with my creative side, given that one of my passions is writing. I think you are making too many assumptions about me.
Once I'm halfway through this it'll be half full but until then its 1/3rd full.
MDOW- Thanks for that. I appreciate the support and the reminder from someone who's been through this all before. Certainly a reminder that theres a light at the end of the tunnel.
I think my mood will improve a lot once I see my next X-rays if everything is good, because then it'll be past the 1/3rd and towards the 1/2- and thats assuming I'm lengthening to 8 cm which I very well may not do.
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Easy there lol. The pain is too constant to focus on anything and absorb it. I have zero complaints about the bursts of pain during PT/certain movements- its the constant distracting pain thats the problem. I'm actually very in touch with my creative side, given that one of my passions is writing. I think you are making too many assumptions about me.
Once I'm halfway through this it'll be half full but until then its 1/3rd full.
MDOW- Thanks for that. I appreciate the support and the reminder from someone who's been through this all before. Certainly a reminder that theres a light at the end of the tunnel.
I think my mood will improve a lot once I see my next X-rays if everything is good, because then it'll be past the 1/3rd and towards the 1/2- and thats assuming I'm lengthening to 8 cm which I very well may not do.
Great man, aslong as you keep fighting and stay positive.
How come you don't think you will hit the 8 cm mark?
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Well theres quite a few reasons.
First of all- if I am one of the cases where things get harder towards the end, my body may physically not allow 8 cm due to tightness etc. Although I will say that Paley and his team sort of misled me, saying no one had ever not achieved 8 cm who wanted it, but then after surgery the PA was basically saying how if I develop issues keeping my legs straight etc that they would need to stop lengthening me.
A theoretical reason is the nail stopping to work, which happened for another LL'er at 7 CM.
Then theres proportions, which I might find to get a bit off, although its hard to tell when not filled in by muscle.
Lastly theres the fact I want to recover in a reasonable time frame and get back to my life- I'm already sick of this lifestyle/the pain/limitations etc. and there are also people who depend on me to an extent back home, and I'll have been away from being full time with my business/focused for awhile and really will need to get back to that.
Who knows, maybe there will be no more setbacks, things will improve, and at the last ten days I'll decide to keep going, but currently I'm certainly open to stopping at 7 or so.
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Aug 19th-
Two days in a row PT has been brutal. Again, this pain I don't mind and I prefer infinitely to the dull aches(and the more I push myself in PT the less of those aches I get). My IT bands are TIGHT and painful. Random motions can send an insane stabbing pain through the whole band. During a stretch where my legs are elevated, if the PT I was working with dropped the leg whatsoever without significant support, a pain significant enough that I'd have to stifle a yell would shoot through it- and I have a pretty good tolerance for pain. While the pain doesn't get to me, I could certainly see someone with a lower tolerance finding it unbearable.
There is a chance due to this tightness that I will have to slow down my lengthening based off what my PT said, so hopefully things seriously loosen up since I would like to stay on the steady path to my goal. The good news is he noted that progress had been made between monday and today, which could mean by the weekend I'll be in a better spot, though the problem is then theres two days in a row with no professional PT, and my X rays are gonna be on the monday right after, so they'll be seeing me at my tightest.
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Aug 22nd-
Alright! Today marks one month post op 3 CM's for your viewing pleasure. They said my X- Rays look great and that bone growth is very solid. I am exactly as lengthened as I should be, not counting the 2 mm discrepancy on my left.
(http://s29.postimg.org/437rh0w3n/photo.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/437rh0w3n/)
Really good to get this visual and hear two of them say I was doing amazing. In two weeks I'll be past the halfway mark, even if I go the full 8 CM, and will be getting an X ray and finally meeting with paley himself again.
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How old are u?
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23
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Hi programdude I was wondering if you have any info about the people who did quadrilateral, like how they're doing?
I am thinking of doing quadrilateral with Paley, but it seems Sweatpants just disappeared and there's not much info available.
I'd like to do 10-11 cm. Do you know if Paley is really strict with the 10 cm limit, or would he allow 11-12 with quadrilateral?
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I havent pursued information on quadrilateral since I've had no interest. I do know sweatpants had a complication but haven't followed her diary so don't know if its something she discussed or wants to discuss. No one I've actually seen is doing quadrilateral.
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Can you ask someone about SweatPants?
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I can give it a shot, sure.
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So my insurance is asking for further details about the surgery pertaining to the nursing aids- asking for the surgery the cost etc. I'm assuming the best thing to do here is just not provide anything and pay out of pocket but any advice from someone better versed on these matters would be great.
Today was my first day not working with Mike in a week, and working with one of the female PT's again. The session was much less savage, but I take this as them thinking I've made enough progress to not need Mike every time- which is nice because a half massage session here and there is a welcome break.
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A very nice family insisted on taking me shopping today since they overheard I was here alone. I got a bunch of zzzquill as it is essential to get adequate sleep. I also got some aleve which Paley wants me taking since my bone growth is TOO good. It will also help a bit with the pain.
Speaking of the pain- I was back with Mike today and got totally ruined again, legs turned to jello and barely able to get back to my hotel room. My muscle tightness is under control overall though so I'm glad to still be having sessions with him to keep it that way.
A good reflection of how I'm in a better place now than the first month here is that I've been crossing off days the day after, as opposed to the night of- which I just realized :P
On the subject of my friend from Hong Kong, unfortunately he has spoken to me this morning and felt very unhappy with the IT band quote, and told me he would see if he could get 5 CM and stop there. I feel bad for him, though he is very successful from the sounds of it, and is pleased to be seeing his family soon, and is considering tibias in a few months.
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Long weekend so it'll be three days with no PT at the clinic which isn't great. Good news is that Mike, who is brutally honest says only my ITB is really being tricky and everything else is progressing, especially my strength. The pool has helped me a lot I'd say.
The bad news is for a few days I've been sick and its certainly not helping the experience. Trying to eat well and sleep a lot to try and power past it. I'm at least thankful that its happening now and not during the first month.
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Sept 3rd- Met short kid and was treated out to a great lunch which was a nice break from the monotony of all this. Also got a break from being ruined by Mike and got one of the girls(albeit the toughest one but she's very good) which was a welcome reprieve. The last time I worked with her was 3 or 4 weeks ago and she noticed the height increase right away.
Sleep continues to be the biggest problem here, tonight I was doing ok until my left knee woke me up and has kept me up, so much so I actually used one of the oxycodone for the first time in nearly a month.
My leg strength is improving significantly which is great, and my tightness is under control, with the ITB being the only real thing to work on.
Previously I shared the book that I thought was good for LL'ers to check out before, but I also wanted to share this quote from my favorite movie, which sort of sums up why I took this massive leap of faith in my life:
"Someday my dream will come? One night you’ll wake up and you’ll discover it never happened. It’s all turned around on you. It never will. Suddenly you are old. Didn’t happen. And it never will because you were never going to do it anyway. You’ll push into memory, then zone out in your Barcalounger, being hypnotized by daytime TV for the rest of your life."
Just some food for thought for those who are thinking about the surgery. My next X-Rays are monday which will also be with Paley himself, finally. I eagerly await it, though I am sure everything is working fine due to the tightness and discomfort, and the fact my knees are starting to look pretty distant.
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I continue to wish you good luck, I hope your sleep will get better.
I was away for awhile, so I missed some of the conversation. What do you mean about your friend (from Hong Kong) being sad about IT band quote?
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Since it was 25k not 5k.
My sleep has totally deteriorated. I've slept 2 hours in the past 48. Mike took some mercy on me seeing my state, but I need some real sleep.
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My latest X-Rays, about 4.3 on right, 1-2 less on left. He couldn't be sure since they X-Rays were low quality.
Pains cropping up in my left leg, hoping they pass.
(http://s16.postimg.org/ajkrwgn81/photo_2.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/ajkrwgn81/)
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PD,
How are you doing? Are you able to sleep any better? Is your pain better?
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Im doing ok. Sleep is still poor, but I'm well enough adjusted to it. Today marks two months I've been in Florida. Monday will be two months post op.
Pain isnt great, but then again Im taking nothing for it. My left leg is making some noises and hurts a good deal, and I can feel it sort of click when its moved or pressed in certain ways. Its probably fine since this whole process has had pains bouncing from one part of my leg to another, but I'll know on monday.
I'm certainly feeling better since I'm getting closer and closer to the end of the lengthening road. Looking forward to kissing the machine goodbye and my sleep and aches slowly improving.
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You are now at the average height of an adult male in the United States! Congratulations!
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Thanks man, technically if my posture was better(no duck ass) I should be 5 10, so a little more than average even. It certainly feels good, and unlike the first month where you don't notice much, I certainly can note the difference now.
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Exactly two months post op and my right leg is EXACTLY where it should be. I told the PA I should be at 57.25 mm and he came up with 57.33. Left is 2 mm behind. My next appointment will have me past the 7 CM mark, so my new goal I am thinking is 7.5, but we will see how my body is tolerating it all.
Saw Dr. Paley who I was surprised checked in briefly. Said I was doing excellent based off my x rays and range of motion measurements my PT put together.
Anxious to be done with this machine, but it looks like I should be on the last leg of this journey at last.
(http://s23.postimg.org/f2h5r67qv/photo_3.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/f2h5r67qv/)
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Hi PD, glad to hear you're doing fine.
I've been following your diaries for sometime, and I thank you for being so honest and informative about the surgery in general.
I have a few questions if you don't mind answering...
1) How much money have you spent so far? I might consider PRECICE2 with Paley sometime next year, but I have no experience living the USA. I need to know the budget range. I'll probably have to go through the whole process on my own, just like you.
2) You seem to be pretty confident that Paley is the best bet in LL. During your stay in WPB, have you seen anyone who disagrees with your opinion? If so, why would he/she say so?
3) I'm considering tibias, have you seen anyone who's done tibials LL with PRECICE2? How have they fared? Any complications?
Thanks mate. Stay strong.
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1. I would say around 100k- 85k for surgery and ITB release, probably 150-200 for medication(but I have insurance, it will be more costly for your because of xeralto being pricy, so add maybe 600-800. Housing is 63 a night. Then theres food, which will probably be a couple hundred since you will need dinner thurs- sun and will want some food for if you miss the breakfast buffet. Then theres the cost of your flying tickets. If you do tibias you will be spending more on the surgery mind you.
2. I've met many people and even those who don't like Paley as a person respect his skill and knowledge. Everyone I've met so far has been satisfied with their experience. I've even met people messed up by other dr.'s who've come here to get better.
3. I wouldn't do tibias. I've met a guy who did them, but he didn't even do a full inch, though he did recover fast and without issue. I've met one female, and heard of another who did tibias. Both had their screws come out, though this is considered more likely in females. I still wouldn't take any chances personally.
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Is that so?
Do you know why he stopped so short? Complications maybe?
What did he/the two ladies say about tibial lengthening?
I heard that tibia is much less painful...maybe that's not true after all. :(
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He was nuts. He did an inch on femurs and less than an inch on tibias.
I've been told it is much less painful. But who cares about pain? Extremely expensive complications/longterm issues are the real reasons to avoid it.
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Hi programdude, just read this entire thread and am pleased to hear your experience has been overall going swell. I am in a similar boat as you were. I am 5'6, weigh 160 and am nearly 21 years of age. I beginning to strongly consider this procedure but am curious as to how long it takes before you can be physically active. I play college soccer and have one more year left. I am curious, how long do you think it takes before someone can get back to training/working out daily?
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Keep in mind I am still lengthening not done. However, the past few weeks i have been gaining weight and feeling very strong. Working out should happen fast. Obviously upper body isn't affected, and when bones are consolidated leg press etc. would be easy with lighter weight.
Running etc. I don't know, but I could walk now in theory, just would break my rods lol.
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are those rods permanent? Does bone build around it?
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Rods can be removed, some choose not to though. Yes the bones grow back while they are in.
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Im curious to know how all these people afford this!!! At the age of 20 I don't think I can for quite some time. I doubt my insurance (in Canada) would cover any of it.
I did see people in this forum talking about getting the procedure done in India for like a total of 25k (rough estimation), so back to actually considering it...
I have a question and would like all of you to provide your input if possible. I would like to get around 10cm taller. What would you all recommend? Tibial? Femur?
All input is greatly appreciated.
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I've met people here who have been butchered in india. Food for thought.
10 CM is a pretty ridiculous gain for one surgery, I don't think any reputable doctor will allow that.
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So 7cm would be more realistic?
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7-8 cm in femurs is a normal gain, though I think lengthening femurs is better for people who are 170+ because below that their Tobias are too stumpy
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Wow, that guy you mentioned must have been obsessed with proportions. A proper nuts. And a rich one too.
Anyways, I know that femur takes shorter to get back to normal life(1~2 months faster rehab), but the end product are similar compared to tibias, or at least that's what I've been told on this forum.
PD, do you really tibial lengthening is more dangerous in the long run?
The reason I'm considering tibias is because I have relatively short tibias compared to femur with approximately 0.76 ratio.
I was thinking maybe 2 inches to be on the safe side.
What do you think?
PS: by the way, how does you day go by these days? What do you do to keep you occupied during the daytime?
I'm a little worried about depression and being lonely etc, because I will most likely be alone for the 2 months in WPB.
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Cholo- 7 cm is normal. Not a lot seem to actually go for, or achieve 8 here for one reason or another, but if it is your goal and your nail doesn't fail theres no reason you can't do it.
Don- All I know is that there are reports of knee pain from various people who have had rods inserted in their tibia. The other reason is the much higher complication rate. Keep in mind most complications don't really have much to do with the amount you lengthen. Having personally seen someones screws coming out has really left me biased against tibias. Research the knee pain and see if you are willing to risk it, then save up a lot of money just in case, and hope you don't need it.
On the plus side tibias are much more comfortable than femurs- every single person I've met doing femurs has a terrible time sleeping. The people I've met doing tibias sleep like a rock for 8-10 hours. The stretches are also less painful to my understanding.
My days are the same over and over- wake up at a crappy hour, force myself to eat breakfast, depending on when my PT is either try and sleep again, or hop in the shower, do PT, come back and rest for a couple hours, head to the pool or get dinner(order may vary), head back to room and shower again, browse internet, stretch, take zzquill, try and fall asleep for hours, sleep a total of 2-5 hours on and off. Repeat.
Towards the beginning the routine was spirit crushing, because early on my sleep was especially bad and accompanied by borderline hallucinations as I mentioned before. My discomfort was very high and I couldn't even focus on watching a show or reading properly, and the loneliness was certainly present, which I had initially thought wouldn't be an issue at all. The whole first month was a battle to not give up, with lots of ups and downs. During the day while I was with friends by the pool or at a cookout, or at PT I felt ok and strong, but each day going back to my room was like death. I've heard a few other patients who have done this alone have felt exactly the same, including one who couldn't take it.
But it does get better. The second month was quite a bit more bearable, and although I am weary from all this now, the fact I'm at the end of the road is keeping me going just fine. For anyone doing femurs you really should have someone with you, especially that first month- I am strong mentally and physically with a high pain tolerance and it was extremely challenging for me. For tibias, because you won't feel tortured and will be able to focus on things as a result I think you would cope a lot better. Also just the fact you will know you only have two months instead of three will help, since just the fact I had three months of lengthening really wore me down when I was at the beginning.
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Thanks PD for the reply.
I will research stuff on knee pain with intramedullary nailing.
I hope you stay strong and everything goes well for you during the remaining few weeks of lengthening.
I
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Very strange day.
Pt is going well, pain is negligible, sleep fairly typical.
One of the patients here is leaving but a new patient just arrived who has already done femurs and is returning for tibia.
I was interviewed by someone hired by Paley who has been talking to patients about ways to improve things and about the forums. It sounds like they want to stay ahead of the curve and be sure they are out there seeing as so many LL doctors are popping up globally.
The most interesting part was paley arriving and having a very long discussion with me/the interviewer, and eventually another man who joined, seemingly to make the surgery with Paley more accessible to those in Japan. Lots of interesting things came up including certain complications with other dr.'s and most interestingly that they are developing a nail for times stronger than the current.
Bad news is either someones hand I shook, or the lemonade I drank set off my first ever allergic reaction with me bursting out and still being in hives/having itchy palms out of nowhere.
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(http://s3.postimg.org/41hfeq4ov/photo_4.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/41hfeq4ov/)
Despite believing my left leg was lengthening improperly due to a vibration in the leg as well as it being incredibly looser, things are on point, with me still 2mm behind on my left. I am about 7.1 on my right. I am waiting to hear back from paley about when I start to get surcharged for x rays, because I don't want that and will plan accordingly. This is also my last week of pt, though I cancelled tomorrow and moved it to monday.
Because of these factors as well as the slight bend in the rod(and its vulnerability) I may stop at 7.5 or so.
It feels good to be at the end.
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I've been there to witness you start the thread (before I registered), and now you're done, lol, while I'm still consolidating with the annoying frames. Nice x-rays. Did Paley give you an estimate on when you can start walking unaided? And did he tell you to use xeralto after you're done with disctraction phase?
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Congrats on your progress! Are you 5'11 now?
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Congrats!!! Dude that's awesome, wish I was at your place ! :) Good luck
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I haven't had my final appointment yet where I suspect I will be told about medications etc. The dr. today said I should consolidate very quickly since my bone growth is excellent even on aleve. I'm 5 11 in a couple days I believe. I am pretty much at the gain where I'm pretty satisfied, and anything more is just great.
It is also pretty incredible how loose my left leg is considering it is lengthening on par. My right leg is ok too, the only thing really a problem at all is my duck ass. Otherwise the tightness etc has just gotten better since the midway point.
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Wow, I can't wait to hear how your life changes for the better once you're 5'11 and fully recovered. Regardless of when you stop at this point, you can easily be 5'11.5 or even 6'0 in the right pair of shoes. Pretty sweet height for sure!
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Well already my symmetry is greatly improved. As for height in shoes I am easily 6 ft in them even now if I had no duck ass.
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Very nice 8)
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One week left, final appointment next thursday.
Really happy with my left legs looseness at 3 inches of lengthening. Hip flexors are pretty much all we are working on in PT now. Noticing more and more new patients appearing at PT center.
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How old are the new patients?
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ranges from 20 to 50 it seems. I've met a few of them, very nice people. I was told by another patient theres a few in the hospital that are coming to the hotel soon, one who apparently wants to meet me when he's out.
So far with the exception of one girl who deliberately seems to want to avoid people, every single patient I've met is social and quite nice.
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Damn seems like it would have been a good time to do it then.
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I get the impression theres always a lot of patients, and as awareness spreads I'm sure there will be even more. It sounded like earlier in summer there were even more too, as Paley said thats his busy season.
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Hey Programdude. Is your femur longer than your torso when you sit down and look at them from the side? What pant inseam fits you best at 5'11? Would you happen to know your sitting height? How far down on your new femurs do your hands reach down to when you stand up?
Sorry for all the questions. I'm just trying to get a sense of what looks good proportionally after LL. I'm still going to do LL anyways (just tryin to get enough money for a good doc at the moment), but I'm just curious.
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I haven't looked particularly but yeah my femurs probably similar to my torso. Kinda hard to tell with my bit of duckass. Remember I can't exactly stand up unaided to try the hand experiment and have the duckass, but before they went down with my fingers past my kneecaps. Now when I lie flat they are about above the knee which looks much better. Not sure about the numbers you're asking for though since Im just wearing loose shorts at the moment and never cared to measure seated height.
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Wow, you still have long arms relative to your body, which looks very good in moderation. It sounds like you were meant for leg lengthening. Cheers!
Personally, my femurs seem about 2-4CM shorter than my torso when I sit down. I'm kind of annoyed that they'll probably be longer than my torso after lengthening but console myself with the idea that most people probably won't notice or care.
My fingers only reach about halfway down my femurs as it is. After lengthening, it would likely be only a third of the way down. I have really broad shoulders for my height and a slim waist though, so hopefully I won't appear disproportionate to most people.
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Wow only halfway down? I didn't realize my arm length was THAT ridiculous compared to others.
I really don't think people will notice anything off for the average femur lengthener though.
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So today marks exactly 3 months I've been in West Palm, and its the end of the road.... Sort of. Got my x rays taken today and was seen by a PA I haven't seen since the beginning. He gave me grief about removing my wheelchairs leg supports that would keep my legs straight and went to test my range of motion and was echoing the basics of how important it is to keep your legs straight even after I told him I just used the wheelchair when I had to use the van for last 1 CM. I found that weird and told him I was at 8 CM at which point he said "oh. Nevermind I retract everything I just said, you're doing incredible to have that ROM".
Unfortunately when he tried to open the X rays the system was too slow, so he went to check on it in the offices computer which was the only working one. Much later he comes back and says he measured me at 8, but the computer still can't display them so he asks me to wait more, was nice enough to extend lunch to me, though it ended up being for naught since two hours later they were down and I ended up scheduling for tomorrow morning.
So the suspense builds, but it sounds like everything is where it should be. He said ROM measurements and bone growth are the main things they look at both of which were great for me.
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(http://s18.postimg.org/j4q4y1a3p/photo_6.jpg) (http://postimg.org/image/j4q4y1a3p/)
Attached is my final X ray at 8 CM. Feels great to be officially done with the hardest part, and slowly be getting more restorative sleep. I am pretty loose aside from hip flexors and as a result have duckass I need to work on.
Now the last thing I need to decide is if I am going home or not. Since there is no guarantee I will be consolidated in a month, I think I may just want to say I fractured my legs doing... Something?... And just tell my roommates not to tell anyone Im back in the meanwhile. The idea of staying here for a month let alone two is pretty unappealing after all.
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Congratulations, man. For those on the forum, I had the chance to meet with program dude for a bit and I can attest to the fact he looks entirely normal after 8cm and indeed does have a large wing span for his height. Other than the atrophy and your duck ass, you should be back on your feet in due time. I wasn't a big fan of West Palm Beach either, and I only spent one night. If I were you I'd probably go back ASAP as well.
It's unfortunate Paley operates out of West Palm and not some other more attractive city in Florida. His hospital is nice, but it's not spectacular or out of the ordinary. For the price he commands, I was expecting more than what I came to see. It's pretty much like any run of the mill hospital in the USA . His surgical skill is probably the only thing that he has leverage on compared to other first world doctors. Of course, that is the most important factor in this procedure.
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Congratulations, man. For those on the forum, I had the chance to meet with program dude for a bit and I can attest to the fact he looks entirely normal after 8cm and indeed does have a large wing span for his height. Other than the atrophy and your duck ass, you should be back on your feet in due time. I wasn't a big fan of West Palm Beach either, and I only spent one night. If I were you I'd probably go back ASAP as well.
It's unfortunate Paley operates out of West Palm and not some other more attractive city in Florida. His hospital is nice, but it's not spectacular or out of the ordinary. For the price he commands, I was expecting more than what I came to see. It's pretty much like any run of the mill hospital in the USA . His surgical skill is probably the only thing that he has leverage on compared to other first world doctors. Of course, that is the most important factor in this procedure.
ohh that's great
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Congratulations, man. For those on the forum, I had the chance to meet with program dude for a bit and I can attest to the fact he looks entirely normal after 8cm and indeed does have a large wing span for his height. Other than the atrophy and your duck ass, you should be back on your feet in due time. I wasn't a big fan of West Palm Beach either, and I only spent one night. If I were you I'd probably go back ASAP as well.
It's unfortunate Paley operates out of West Palm and not some other more attractive city in Florida. His hospital is nice, but it's not spectacular or out of the ordinary. For the price he commands, I was expecting more than what I came to see. It's pretty much like any run of the mill hospital in the USA . His surgical skill is probably the only thing that he has leverage on compared to other first world doctors. Of course, that is the most important factor in this procedure.
I think thats a bit of a superficial evaluation and are overlooking the PT center, which is the biggest upside of Paley next to his skills, and a very significant one. I think the hospital itself is pretty much a non factor since you spend only a couple of days there and they are perfectly fine.
While West Palm gets boring with no legs, and the immediate areas not great, anywhere gets old in the same circumstances. The perk of the area is the living costs, which as you mentioned are favorable even when compared to india. Personally, I would much prefer him operating out of WPB than a more expensive area since during this process, since a lot of your stay is spent inside regardless, and I'm guessing all but those with no budgetary concerns would probably agree.
If one is to go down the path of internals I definitely think Paley is by far the best choice. I've said it before, but I think most people forget that PT and equipment etc. is included in the price, so the price difference with him and other first world dr.'s really isn't that steep.
I dont blame you for your first impression though. My first time coming here for my consultation I was pretty unimpressed as well on an aesthetic level and sort of thought "this is it?".
Was good to meet you and see quite a success come out of India. I can attest to your proportions and walking being great as well. Didn't even notice at first.
BTW, of interest it sounds like there are plans for Paley to open a center in Mexico as well to get prices down approx 20k. The struggle sounds like getting PT to the level of the current establishment. In general it sounds like Paley is looking to expand and become more mainstream, as I was interviewed along with others on how to improve operations, and separately by a web designer who showed me the new much more polished website they are working on. They are also redoing the whole waiting room area of the institute. It seemed pretty clear to me that he aims to plant his flag firmly as the top dr. as awareness spreads about the surgery and it becomes more mainstream.
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Yeah,
I should have been more specific in my post that I was by no means put off by what I saw. It's just that I held in my mind an unrealistic view of how spectacular Dr. Paley's institution and accommodation set up would be and I was brought back to reality when I found it all to be still of this world, if that makes sense. It's important to note I never got access into the PT centre or the opportunity to meet Paley unfortunately, but from some of the deformities he is helping to correct that I saw coming out of the clinic in the brief time I was there, it is obvious that cosmetic LL is an absolute breeze in comparison for him.
I really hope Paley succeeds in opening a practice in Mexico. I've lived there for a brief time and know how much cheaper all facets of living are. The country can be safe under the right circumstances (keep out of anything related to oil or drugs) and most people there are nice and well intended. If he can do that and get the cost of a package to under 80kUSD, then future lengtheners will be in for a real treat.
Thanks again for the kind compliments. I've been doing a lot of walking and stretching since I posted my first videos. For those interested in my progress, I'm going to attempt some running and other activities and will probably have some videos available by the new year.
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If by package you mean including accommodations etc, then yea. If you mean for just surgery and PT then it would still be better just to come here for the more experienced PT. But yeah, I think its a great idea if he can get it to a price similar to other internal dr.'s, though because of how busy the man is, I'm sure there will always be at least a slight premium to pay.
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Yeah, a package that's all inclusive would be ideal and is what I meant. It's a guarantee he'd have a huge influx of patients as virtually all people go elsewhere based solely on the price factor. It's good he wants to change this limitation however possible.
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I think the future may hold that, although by the time it happens Im sure inflation will have tampered with the numbers a bit. Im also wondering what the precice 3 will cost since Im assuming Paley will move exclusively to that when its released. I'd hope its comparable price, since really the precice 2 is pretty good IMO and a huge price hike for better weight bearing wouldn't be the best direction for most people.
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Returned my machine and am leaving tomorrow morning! Will be one day before 3 months post op.
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So I'm back home in one piece. Seeing my roommates(two of them picked me up from a bus stop from the airport) was good, and their initial reaction to me on a walker was priceless. They fluctuated from thinking it was a joke, to sudden concern I was paralyzed or seriously impaired, to laughing their asses off with me when they realized I was in good spirits. The houses new game seems to be trying to guess what happened to me. Even with my horrible posture and without shoes I immediately noticed I'm distinctly taller than my friend who was just slightly shorter than me and taller than my friend who was previously notably taller, so maybe they'll get it, but I doubt it.
Really really good to actually be home, even though my rooms now a mess. Gonna try and stock up on supplies tonight and hermit it up for the next few weeks. Trying to not let it out that I'm back until consolidation at least.
I'll go over the flying process, because I am sure many people here don't really know what to expect from traveling handicapped.
As helpful as the airline people are, flying was an utterly miserable experience for me. I didn't get sleep, since packing and getting set for departure was a pretty big process and I was also anxious to get out of there on time. I left early so the drive was smooth, and the curb side assistance got me in the wheelchair and was extremely friendly while checking me and my bags/walker/crutches in. Boarded without much of a problem, although they had a bit of a difficulty understanding my exact limitations of being able to walk, but needing aid- Ultimately they got me on an aisle wheelchair and wheeled me next to my seat and I just climbed over into it. The flight was pretty standard, with the main exception of my legs getting tight, and even more so, my weak atrophied butt/bones getting really sore At least a dozen times it was so unbearable I had to lift my butt by doing a dip in my seat for relief. I was very very fortunate that the flight was ahead of schedule and only 2 1/2 hours as opposed to many others like my friend from hong kong who must have nearly been flying all day.
Even so, it was pretty unpleasant, and I had to wait for the plane to empty to be helped off, then sit around while they buzzed about trying to find my misplaced crutches. This time the person helping with my wheelchair was dead silent and not sociable which would have been more awkward if I wasn't exhausted, uncomfortable, and holding in a massive piss. The bus that took me to where my roomies were had a wheelchair lift that literally took the guy 10 minutes to get working and 20 minutes to put away, all while a horrible siren went off from it. Being very independent the whole airport experience(and especially this) annoyed me since even though it was the guys incompetence, it was me and my legs causing the delay in general. They helped me off easy enough and put my bags by the bench I indicated and bam- 97 days, 110k, and an incredible amount of pain and gain later, and I'm home sweet home.
What a journey this has all been.
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What an update that has been!
And now begins the most enjoyable part of your story: recovering and enjoying all the benefits your new height and, more importantly, your new and confident height-neurosis-free mind, have to offer.
Congrats on your truly remarkable journey.
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What an update that has been!
And now begins the most enjoyable part of your story: recovering and enjoying all the benefits your new height and, more importantly, your new and confident height-neurosis-free mind, have to offer.
Congrats on your truly remarkable journey.
Thank you! As of now my only concern is duckass. Everything else is pretty great, and honestly I don't mind just taking it easy for consolidation.
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Oh man I can only imagine how happy you are to finally be back home! Hope your recovery goes smoothly! Do you know what your final tibia to femur ratio was?
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All I know is I was told if I did about two more inches I'd have perfect proportion between them.
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Good news and bad. The good news is that my aches have gone away totally within the past few days and that my sleep is completely normal and uninterrupted. The bad news is my left leg in particular is hurting around where the bones growing back. Its not that bad at all though(only feel it when I move occasionally), and I'm guessing its just from all the growth going on there.
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Hi programdude,
I have been following your progress. First of all congrats on the completion of a very trying process. I am new leg lengthening and have been doing quite a bit of research. Our stats are very similar so hopefully you can answer some questions for me. I am definitely going with Dr. Paley with the precice 2 internal rod.
I am in my late 20's, very good shape, and slightly below 5'8''. I would like to hit min 5'10'' and ideally 5'11 for a gain of 76mm. I am currently in medical school so unfortunately time is my biggest constraint. I am basically going to only have somewhere in the middle of april to july 1st when my residency starts so around 2.5months. I understand 1mm increase per day=76 days of lengthening=2.5months roughly. So I basically finish lengthening and then have to go to work. Is this possible? Will I be able to walk around with crutches at work all day during the consolidation period? I am going contact Dr. Paley soon to get some specifics but I wanted to ask and other members who have knowledge of precise2 to if something like this is even feasible before I get my heart set on it.
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Hey man. The good news is yes using crutches or a walker is quite possible during consolidation(assuming you aren't too over weight bearing). One thing you need to consider though is that you may have duck ass during that phase- if you are trying to keep the nature of the reason for the crutches a secret. If doing this is important to you like it was to me, I'd say you could certainly do it- and that duck ass might be a good way to not be as obvious about the height gain. A lot of people say you are tightest near the end but that wasn't true at all for me. But in the even you were close to the goal and getting real tight you could just stop and get stretched to resolve it before you return since you are willing to budge a little on the result.
Speaking of people noticing in a combination of one of my friends being a dr. and me being suddenly taller than my 5 11 friend somehow, all my roomies are aware lol.
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Yikes! So they know that you got LL? And how did you become taller than 5'11 and manage lengthen more than 8CM if you started under 5'8?
I guess that your doctor friend must have fully figured out that you got LL. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together here. What were their reactions to the revelation?
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Yikes! So they know that you got LL? And how did you become taller than 5'11 and manage lengthen more than 8CM if you started under 5'8?
I guess that your doctor friend must have fully figured out that you got LL. It's not hard to put 2 and 2 together here. What were their reactions to the revelation?
I never really cared if they knew. Main concern was no one else knowing I was back. I don't think its as plainly obvious if you don't have two broken legs(which was the giveaway). Everyone but the dr. slowly realized so the reactions were more subdued disbelief than overblown shock. Reactions were all fun and positive though.
Not sure how I'm taller than him. Either his measurements or my starting height aren't accurate. Either way I'm happy.
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PD,
How is life back at home? Do you think it is tougher or easier? I am not asking mentally, I am asking day to day stuff (like taking showers, laundry etc.). Is your bathroom modified for handicap people? I assume it is tough to sit and then stand up from toilet. Also the same as getting in and getting out of shower. Do you use walker or crutches at home?
Congratulation on your new height.
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The bathroom in my bedroom is kind of slow to get into since the door is narrow for the walker, but sitting is easy. I feel like a totally normal person who just has to impose limits on myself for the safety of the nail- aside from some occasional very minor discomfort and the general bit of weakness from atrophy. The shower isn't great, but because I'm basically normal, its not hard to transfer myself into the bath tub at all.
I went out to an appointment today and managed fine. Other than needing to stay low key in town and some minor things like reheating food being hard etc. things really aren't bad at all. This is by FAR the best part of the LL process as my sleep is fantastic finally, sleeping 10 hours at times. I can really tell those now who are suffering through LL- the process DOES end, and it gets so much better. Pretty fast too.
Its weird sitting here with my friends and just living life. Already all the suffering and difficulties are like a pretty distant memory. Before long I can already feel that life is gonna get back into its rhythm again- Only with me very noticeably taller.
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so you legthened 8cm in less than 3 months, are you weightbearing now? , how much time post op to weigthbear? can you post some pictures of your legs to see your proportions femur/tibia?
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Agreed with Kirp1
Please show us some progresstion
Wish you have new gorgeous body
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At this stage not too interested in pics, but when my postures good and legs have some meat back on them I might.
I am doing really well with everything but duck ass. Cant weight bear till I take x rays to confirm consolidation, but getting around is easy.
And yes I did 8 cm in under 3 months.
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hey
already asked in therisingshortys thread:
did you personally experience any kind of hair loss due to surgery / medication?
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None at all for me
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Would you say that your leg to torso/tibia proportions are pretty similar to these? How is your walking at this point?
(http://img.imagesia.com/fichiers/jw/dscn0142_imagesia-com_jwbb_large.jpg) (http://imagesia.com/dscn0142_jwbb)
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Roughly maybe
Walking is hard to say since I am on walker/crutches.
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Hey programdude .Is it possible if i went with wheelchair for go to english school where is far from hospital 4.3 miles on my own everyday?
And How have you been?
off crutches now?
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No I still need x ray, I will schedule one soon.
The biggest factor to attending school would be the building itself, and if it is handicap friendly. Wheelchair seems a pain, I would just use a walker.
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About your bone alignment. I think this technique make degree as the same as before ll?
Am i right?
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Yes my alignment is good.
Also worth noting the screw scars, as well as my osectomy site scars are almost totally faded.
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When does Dr. Paley say that you should be walking? He claims that he usually gets his patients back on their feet again in five months.
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That sounds pretty accurate. I am getting close to 5 months post op now having done the full 8, and could definitely walk if I were consolidated. I feel very strong.
I have been delaying x rays since I want to be definitively consolidated when I get them taken, not have to go back repeatedly- But I will be scheduling soon.
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I'm sorry, I meant four months. If you did it in July, then it would've four months post op.
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Thats correct for someone doing 5 or so CM, unless you have quick consolidation seems a little bit quick for 8 CM, but its possible, sure.
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Now you can walk unaided?
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I am waiting for feedback about my x rays I just took. Hoping to hear I can lose the crutches
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Paley has my x rays but still have not heard back anything.
This is a it frustrating, particularly because my left legs pain at the base which Paley recently said was "ts the point of stress, where the rod ends. not uncommon. most people feel it when they run. goes away and especially after rod removal. "
The one thing that concerns me is that if anything it seems to be getting worse, and is mainly a problem when lying down and lifting it as opposed to standing or walking. And not present in my right leg which feels totally 100% like a normal leg.
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Its probably nothing related to bone btw, it seems to improve with hard stretching, so likely a muscle issue since it happens with movement. Still want to be walking normally so I can better use an stretch the muscle.
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Sure enough, as soon as I write that I hear back my right leg is 100% healed! My left nearly fully healed(and these x rays were taken over a week ago). I was informed I could begin walking with one crutch, and I have begun doing so. Feels good to slowly be working back to normal walking.
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It would have been better if both legs were 100% healed. I guess it is still partial good news that your one leg is 100% healed. Just give it some more time. Hopefully the other leg will all heal soon.
So how are you feeling in general? Are you working yet? Going to Gym/grocery store/mall? How is your life (in general) now compared to when you were lengthening? Are you having any pain that requires pain medications?
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My comfort is incomparably better to the lengthening phase. I sleep soundly, can go out on crutches to the gym, drive, dine out, comfortably have women over. My only complaint now is boredom and the pain in my left leg, but that is very mild compared to the discomforts of the process, and I suspect will go away when the left is healed or after serious stretching. Certainly nothing even close to even thinking about pain meds.
I'm not going to grocery stores or malls because A. I know people and want to remain incognito currently and B. I can't conveniently carry items. I do drive there and have someone run in for me though.
My right is very much healed and feels totally normal in its movements. I can balance on just it fine. I've learned to walk with one crutch as Paley instructed quickly and it feels much more like natural walking.
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Had my first (right) leg workout today. Very good strength considering. 100 pound one legged leg press, 50 pound leg extension, and hamstring curls/calf work. Felt very natural, and great to be getting back to fitness.
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Had my first (right) leg workout today. Very good strength considering. 100 pound one legged leg press, 50 pound leg extension, and hamstring curls/calf work. Felt very natural, and great to be getting back to fitness.
Now you could walk unaided?
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no, it is only my right leg that is fully healed
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Quick update. Things are going well. Told my mom and she was sad but I am seeing her today.
Had sex last night including doggystyle(which between the fumbling for the position and condom wasn't the best position) but it was relieving to see how even with one not fully healed leg how achievable it was. The positioning was actually drastically improved with longer femurs too, though obviously this depends on the girl(though in the past I often noted how ideal longer femurs would be).
Really can't wait to heal and be able to do it smoothly.
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congratulation. I hope you will keep improving further.
When is your next x-ray scheduled? How is walking with one walker?
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I am moving better with one crutch and move very fast with two- having one leg healed makes it so much easier.
My x ray I will probably take in a week and a half.
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Told my mom about the surgery since I was going to be missing x mas without explanation, and honestly I think she'd notice anyways.
Cried when I told her on phone briefly, saying she wished she could talk me out of it, but then calmed down, and when she saw me in person said she thought she would freak out when she saw me but didn't.
Met with my dad but didn't tell him, though he noticed I was taller.
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Posted this elsewhere, but gonna post it here:
Left leg has a pain in it towards the bottom, seemingly in the muscle above the knee(lower front quad). This seems to be only a problem when activating the muscle usually 1. Raising leg up straight 2. When walking(just approved for full weight bearing on both legs), specifically right after using the left leg(standing not an issue) 3. Getting into position for doggystyle etc.
The pain is pretty much the only thing prevent me from saying I am mostly recovered, since with it walking is difficult. Unfortunately I can't see Dr. Paley for his opinion unless I got back to FL, which I can't really accommodate for right now.
Really hope to see that resolved. It is the one thing hindering me from a total recovery.
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Sorry to hear that, can't you get another doctors opinion?
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Im sure I could, but realistically my PMC, while a cool guy, would be a bit belwidered about what the problem could be. LL is a crazy thing after all.
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LL is a crazy thing after all.
It sure is, that's for damn sure.
Have you tried syrectching that muscle? I think it's a contracture, and should go away with stretching. At least that's what my experience has led me to believe.
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Yeah I am stretching it multiple times a day in hope of progress.
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Walking seems to improve, but is still pretty awkward from a combination of tight hip flexors(mainly right) and pain in my left leg. Can only really do it brief periods of time and not prettily.
Meanwhile I heard from someone who finished a month after me and is already walking. Happy for them, but the contrast is discouraging.
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Update?
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My condition is a lot better. The pain in my left leg stopped after a few workouts using heavier weights. My speed in general and strength is increasing a lot. My duck ass needs improvement. When I stand for too long my lower back hurts a lot. If not for that I would be pretty much 100%.
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If you're comfortable posting any pictures/videos just know that it would be greatly appreciated.
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My condition is a lot better. The pain in my left leg stopped after a few workouts using heavier weights. My speed in general and strength is increasing a lot. My duck ass needs improvement. When I stand for too long my lower back hurts a lot. If not for that I would be pretty much 100%.
So happy for you! (And me haha)
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Yeah I will have to think about videos etc.
Not sure how I feel about it. I can confidently and easily move around gym etc. with one crutch used as a walking stick basically. Things have taken awhile but are getting a lot better, quickly.
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Yeah I will have to think about videos etc.
Not sure how I feel about it. I can confidently and easily move around gym etc. with one crutch used as a walking stick basically. Things have taken awhile but are getting a lot better, quickly.
Only do it if you're comfortable.
The reason we like diaries with videos is because they give us a good (if rough) idea of what we can expect post-op. The recovery phase is underreported compared to the actual surgery and lenghtening, so videos are a helpful addition to any diary. The only reason for you to do them is to get feeback on how you're doing really.
As for pictures, well, - a picture says more than a thousand words, right?
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I acknowledge the value of them, just comes down to comfort. Right now I can walk very quickly using a shortened crutch as a walking stick. My walking is probably a 7/10 with 10 being normal.
I shoveled my walkways today, so I am in pretty good shape, just not 100%
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I acknowledge the value of them, just comes down to comfort. Right now I can walk very quickly using a shortened crutch as a walking stick. My walking is probably a 7/10 with 10 being normal.
I shoveled my walkways today, so I am in pretty good shape, just not 100%
Good to hear. Paley did say it was about six months to return to full sports, and it looks like you are almost there after about five months.
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People who do internal femurs seem to recover significantly quicker in terms of being able to walk pretty normally compared to those who get their tibias lengthened. That's great you're walking with a walking stick already.
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People who do internal femurs seem to recover significantly quicker in terms of being able to walk pretty normally compared to those who get their tibias lengthened. That's great you're walking with a walking stick already.
Also noticed this, could it have something to do with muscle tightness?
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I think that has something to do with it. Although I can get both feet on the ground now my calves are still very tight. It might have something to do with balance, too. I'm able to stand as long as I want with my back against the wall but otherwise I constantly feel like I'm going to fall over and hit the ground if I don't hold on to my walker firmly.
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Does your balance feel similar to, say, standing on your toes or wearing platform shoes (if you ever did)?
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Yep. It feels as though I'm tiptoeing forward even when my feet are completely neutral.
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Yep. It feels as though I'm tiptoeing forward even when my feet are completely neutral.
Right, well that's to be expected honestly as you've gained height in the lowest part of your body while not gaining width anywhere else. I don't know if it'll pass or not, you'll probably adapt but MDoW said he still can feel a bit wingly sometimes.
I get the same kind of muscle tightness you describe when I go hiking in the spring, because my muscles are stale from not being used as much during winter. It always goes away after exercises and stretches, sometimes it only takes a day and sometimes it takes months but it always goes away, don't worry about it.
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I think it's probably true that femurs are better for post-surgical balance and faster recovery. You've got a lot of muscles up there completely surrounding the femur that can stretch and support the new length, compared to the few smaller ones on the lower part of the leg.
I think if you can afford it you should probably go for internal femurs. But I would've been middle aged before I could've afforded it, and this way I've been enjoying being 5'10 since I was 25. This was actually one of the arguments Dr. Roger Li made when addressing concerns about the run-down Guang Ji Hospital - that they wanted to make the surgery affordable for young people and had to make sacrifices. He used himself as an example, saying he was already established in his career and married, so there was no reason for him to get LL at his age.
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MDoW If the cons of having longer tibias is bad balance and muscle tightness, what are the drawbacks of having relatively long femurs?
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Unfortunately, I have no way of knowing. I just know my experience with elongated tibiae. Maybe there are drawbacks of doing femurs that I'm not aware of, but no femur patients seem to be talking about any of it on here.
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Its actually been like 6 months for me. I think the combination of going there alone and therefore not having as ideal stretching and whatever the pain in my left leg was, set me back a little.
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Its actually been like 6 months for me. I think the combination of going there alone and therefore not having as ideal stretching and whatever the pain in my left leg was, set me back a little.
There's a lesson for all of us, then.
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Yes, please
A. Handle hospital medication properly. They will not.
B. Do not be a tough guy and go there alone. You will regret it for many reasons. I could have easily had a friend come for free but decided to keep things secret while I was doing it. I'd be pretty perfect if I had listened, even though my ROM was excellent for having done 8 CM.
C. Have PLENTY of time if doing 8 CM. Recovery can be crazy at that length, and do not consider more than this. If I had a normal job I would have been screwed with my original projections.
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Yes, please
A. Handle hospital medication properly. They will not.
B. Do not be a tough guy and go there alone. You will regret it for many reasons. I could have easily had a friend come for free but decided to keep things secret while I was doing it. I'd be pretty perfect if I had listened, even though my ROM was excellent for having done 8 CM.
C. Have PLENTY of time if doing 8 CM. Recovery can be crazy at that length, and do not consider more than this. If I had a normal job I would have been screwed with my original projections.
But seriously you have some really good friend(s). I can't think of a single friend who would agree to help me through LL. Forget LL, not even a legitimate health concern if I had one.
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But seriously you have some really good friend(s). I can't think of a single friend who would agree to help me through LL. Forget LL, not even a legitimate health concern if I had one.
Those are good friends, bro.
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I have friends who basically rely on me for housing. Not freeloading but a very ideal arrangement. They also don't really have jobs so the free hotel room and change of scenery would have been welcome to them. Still good friends though, yeah.
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Good to see you back again and doing well. I am judging how my recovery will go loosely based on how yours went. Original plan was to get it done in april 2016 and have 2.5months to lengthen and 1-2 weeks to recover then on to residency but I don't think that recovery is going to go well if I am working 70+hrs a week as an intern. Kind of a disappointment and a relief. I am going to be 34 when I am done and have the time to do it. Its kind of a life's little joke, when I had the time to do this I didn't have the money, now I have the money saved but no time. So frustrating.
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Keep your recovery realistic. I can't stress that enough. I am VERY fortunate for my situation but in many other situations I can see the recovery time being a big issue for someone.
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I was wondering exactly how long your recovery took from the day of the surgery up until the time you returned to NYC. I did read that you had a cosmetic surgeon attend to the scars. However, when you returned home were you completely finished with LL ie xrays, Dr. visits..Thanks again.
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I think you got some misinformation. I haven't had any cosmetic work on my scars, and I am also not fully recovered. It is around 8 months post op. By 9 months I imagine my walking will be almost fine.
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Programdude how are things holding up for you? I too plan on using Dr paler for my operation to gain 7.5cm next year. Any suggestions on how to manage the pain? I heard if you go from epidural to IV pain meds to oral pain meds in sequence the pain is much more bareable. Is this true? Do you know a good number of patients that have gone through procedure with moderate pain?
What are your thoughts of the side effects of the precise II? Can a person safely get to 7.5 cm without massive risk of permanent pain?
Also in regards to Dr paley, what is his procedure to prepare for the operation?
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For preparation, very little, just keeping generally loose.
For safety, I think I am doing ok, and i am doing the worst out of everyone I met. Most recovered fully a month or so sooner than what it took for me to get here(walking ok, standing for showers, working out legs, able to jog albeit oddly.), so yes if you are going to LL I think it is a great way to go.
For pain, use an epidural and when you come off be sure you have dilauded. If you read my journal you will see some pointers I left about this.
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So you think it was the height they you want for that delayed your recovery speed? I am also looking for similar height increase. Do you recommend this, 7.5 cm as being the limit?
Also after consolidation did you stay by paley ? Or did you go home? Can you go home for recovery after full consolidation? What do you recommend?
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I went home almost immediately after finishing lengthening.
For length, if you have help I really think 8 CM is usually fine. Everyone else bounced back really fast.
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That's good news. I just have one real question. How bad was the pain level ? What did you use to let you sleep at night?
If people follow Dr. Paleys pain med prescriptions did they appear to be in much pain through the process? How long is the pain unbearable for ? When does it wear off?
Did you fear lengthing too much in one leg and getting a limp?
Sorry for the questions I just want to hear from a person who has gone through it like you. You are my inspiration.
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Hey, the first few weeks are the ones where the pain in unbearable. After that the only unbearable part is the constant aches that make sleeping nearly impossible, it really grates on your sanity.
In terms of actual raw pain, the only times it is a factor is the beginning and during PT. If pain is a VERY large concern please reconsider the surgery. While most people can get through it, there have been some who give up.
No I didn't fear that since you can retract if needed.
To you and others, if you want an actual conversation with me I extend again my Skype: program.dude
I don't check it too often since not many people followed me or added me when I first posted it, but I will keep logged in more for the next few weeks.
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Ok cool. I just tried to add you on Skype. Can you accept request and we can talk more offline
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Hey, the first few weeks are the ones where the pain in unbearable. After that the only unbearable part is the constant aches that make sleeping nearly impossible, it really grates on your sanity.
In terms of actual raw pain, the only times it is a factor is the beginning and during PT. If pain is a VERY large concern please reconsider the surgery. While most people can get through it, there have been some who give up.
No I didn't fear that since you can retract if needed.
To you and others, if you want an actual conversation with me I extend again my Skype: program.dude
I don't check it too often since not many people followed me or added me when I first posted it, but I will keep logged in more for the next few weeks.
This is going to sound strange, but is it that type of pain that feels good? Sometimes I strain a muscle, and pulling on it and stretching it feels painful, but then relieving.
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Accepted all the requests I got.
And no, honestly it feels really bad for the most part. The thing that feels nice is waking up way after you are done, and stretching your muscles as you wake up in bed.
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So, good and bad news.
With an event I had this whole weekend which involved lots and lots of walking. As of two weeks before the even I wasn't really in great shape and was super worried. However I was able to walk around for spans of usually 20- 30 mins. Which were usually followed by another walk and endurance, while not ideal, was never a problem. This involved hills and stairs sometimes too.
The bad news is the pain in my lower left leg is really quite bad, and made my walking strides not great. Some people when I was in less pain noticed nothing, but there were certainly comments about it, and most importantly I wasn't feeling great.
Really wondering whats causing this pain and how to resolve it, since it seems to be the only hurdle to mostly recovered.
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So, good and bad news.
With an event I had this whole weekend which involved lots and lots of walking. As of two weeks before the even I wasn't really in great shape and was super worried. However I was able to walk around for spans of usually 20- 30 mins. Which were usually followed by another walk and endurance, while not ideal, was never a problem. This involved hills and stairs sometimes too.
The bad news is the pain in my lower left leg is really quite bad, and made my walking strides not great. Some people when I was in less pain noticed nothing, but there were certainly comments about it, and most importantly I wasn't feeling great.
Really wondering whats causing this pain and how to resolve it, since it seems to be the only hurdle to mostly recovered.
Can't you make an appointment with an orthopedist?
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I'm not sure if they could really help with something like this though? If I don't see serious improvement I was going to go to florida to see Paley as he said I should.
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if paley says you should see him... then seeing him is the only option
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Doing a lot better. To those concerned by my serious complaints after the weekend that involved a lot of walking- I think it was just a bit too much and built up over the days. I'm doing much better now, to the point I think no one that saw me when I was out today even batted an eye.
I did a hard leg workout, once I recover from it I plan on practicing jogging. Jogging feels really weird with much longer legs right now.
For those wondering, things like stairs haven't been a problem for awhile.
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Progamdude, the last x-ray image you posted was on October 06, 2014. Would you please post some x-ray images after that, like in December, February, and April?
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Doing a lot better. To those concerned by my serious complaints after the weekend that involved a lot of walking- I think it was just a bit too much and built up over the days. I'm doing much better now, to the point I think no one that saw me when I was out today even batted an eye.
I did a hard leg workout, once I recover from it I plan on practicing jogging. Jogging feels really weird with much longer legs right now.
For those wondering, things like stairs haven't been a problem for awhile.
wow what a great news!
from 1 to 10 (10 is being like you were before the surgery) where do you consider yourself in term of recovering?
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I'd say probably a 6 right now, at least until I can jog acceptably. My walking itself is probably an 8 in the sense that unless my legs are tired and someone is trying to see something amiss with my strides it looks normal. The main issues with the walking at this stage is endurance, which really isn't that bad for anything that comes up in my day to day. At the gym I can walk with a 45 pound plate in my hands, but walking two 50 pound dumbbells to a bench would still be damn hard and mainly look silly.
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I'd say probably a 6 right now, at least until I can jog acceptably. My walking itself is probably an 8 in the sense that unless my legs are tired and someone is trying to see something amiss with my strides it looks normal. The main issues with the walking at this stage is endurance, which really isn't that bad for anything that comes up in my day to day. At the gym I can walk with a 45 pound plate in my hands, but walking two 50 pound dumbbells to a bench would still be damn hard and mainly look silly.
It is very good news.
I hope you better and better .
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Thanks. Gonna attempt jogging again today but my faith is not too high. I would be surprised in a month though if some size, strength and the jogging was not back.
My recovery has taken awhile but the improvements have come fast since I started walking.
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Hi Progamdude, the last x-ray image you posted was on October 06, 2014. Would you please post some x-ray images after that, like in December, February, and April, so that we can see how the bone consolidation progress is? Thanks
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I haven't felt the need to update with that as I am past that phase, but I may in the future.
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have you seen the broken bone gap have been filled with new bone from the x-ray? How is the new bone's density look like in the x-ray?
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My last x ray looked ok. Not rock solid but Paley referred to my right as such anyways. I am sure now they are looking a lot more sturdy if I were to have them x rayed
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Pain in my left leg seems to be totally gone though I haven't tried jogging again yet. For those wondering the cure seems to be strengthening what must have been a very weakened muscle through isolated left leg workouts, specifically leg press and extensions. I look forward to bulking my legs more and getting my glutes back, as I believe the latter is why my hips are still slightly tight.
My estimation for totally normal walking is two weeks most likely. Will post about my jogging as it is applicable.
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So aside from that pain are you back to at least 90% of what you were?
Also it concerns me a bit that recover is taking so long for you, do you still recommend Dr.Paley? Have others taken as long to recover.
Any info would help as paley is guy I have in mind.
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I lengthened with others, all of whom are doing much better than me. I don't know why I've taken so long(a portion was not having someone there to help stretch me) though so there is a chance of your recovery taking awhile too. I would still recommend Paley, especially based off others, but you aren't guaranteed to have an effortless journey.
I am not 90%. As I said before my walking is at the point where it almost looks normal and is getting easier, and jogging is mostly untested.
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I lengthened with others, all of whom are doing much better than me. I don't know why I've taken so long(a portion was not having someone there to help stretch me) though so there is a chance of your recovery taking awhile too. I would still recommend Paley, especially based off others, but you aren't guaranteed to have an effortless journey.
I am not 90%. As I said before my walking is at the point where it almost looks normal and is getting easier, and jogging is mostly untested.
How much worse are you than the other patients?
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I mean, they are playing sports and I am not even at baseline, so they are doing a lot better. Hard to say exactly how much better, but since they recovered in half the time we will go with them doing twice as well as me.
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I mean, they are playing sports and I am not even at baseline, so they are doing a lot better. Hard to say exactly how much better, but since they recovered in half the time we will go with them doing twice as well as me.
Any major difference between their surgery/lengthening period and yours?
Did they lengthen less, stretch more or anything such?
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Some lengthened less, one lengthened the same and was better two or so months ago, having started a month later.
Stretching was probably a factor.
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Some lengthened less, one lengthened the same and was better two or so months ago, having started a month later.
Stretching was probably a factor.
Are you suggesting that you didn't stretch the amount that Paley and his PT team told you to stretch? Or are you saying that you should have stretched more than that? Or do you mean you should have stretch more prior to the lengthening process?
Asking because I'm doing internal femurs with Paley in a few months and diaries like yours have me worried. Congrats on your new height, though. I'm going from 5'5" to 5'8" (your starting height). Is 5'8" still discriminated against for being short?
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ofcourse he is, didnt you get the memo.
To be accepted as a "man" (sorry everybody offended and not really open to R3al1ty) 5'11 is the limit to go without any smerk replies and preconcieved ideas about you.
I personally dont meassure anyone by bone length to determine their masculinity.
But get on topic with Perception. Perception is KEY!! to everything. Thats why there will be dudes 5'8 doing just "fine" and others who suffer like more than you could imagine like wow that bad.
But the two of them give of different perceptions to the reciever thus gets a different response in return that fits that specific scenario. Thats why im doing LL atleast.
And thats all people without 2 brain cells on active duty goes for in the world aswell. The world is a hall of mirrors and the top dog is the most reflective one.
Thats why we like our politicans,leaders,famous people etc etc Tall-er.
Because it feeds our Ego of security in "What the fk is all this.. where am i. who am i, etc". The one that is thinking in your mind IS the EGO and it has ALOT of filters i found this out the hard way when i took mushrooms and got blown away and could more clearly see the current world in a different light and gain more personal power form the whole trip.
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Im absolutely not saying I didn't do the stretches. However I didn't have a family member there to stretch me every day, or a personal assistant. As I've said, if I could change something, it would have been to bring a friend to help stretch me during the process in addition to doing the personal stretches.
I dedicated a large amount of time to stretches/PT in the pool, solo ones, and never missed a PT session at the center. I was told explicitly when I had my consult that it was possible to do it this way and one complaint I have about going to Paley was how ok they were with me doing it solo before I paid, and how one of the PA's acted after I had paid when I said I was doing it solo.
However, when I finished lengthening I was told my range of motion was fantastic for 8 CM, which is proof my stretching regimen was working for mostly everything.
5 8 is a fine height, and I never really faced heigh discrimination(unless you count dating websites where people will post height preferences). I was successful, had quite a strong social group, and a robust sex life at 5 8. The problem was mostly just internal.
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Im absolutely not saying I didn't do the stretches. However I didn't have a family member there to stretch me every day, or a personal assistant. As I've said, if I could change something, it would have been to bring a friend to help stretch me during the process in addition to doing the personal stretches.
I dedicated a large amount of time to stretches/PT in the pool, solo ones, and never missed a PT session at the center. I was told explicitly when I had my consult that it was possible to do it this way and one complaint I have about going to Paley was how ok they were with me doing it solo before I paid, and how one of the PA's acted after I had paid when I said I was doing it solo.
However, when I finished lengthening I was told my range of motion was fantastic for 8 CM, which is proof my stretching regimen was working for mostly everything.
5 8 is a fine height, and I never really faced heigh discrimination(unless you count dating websites where people will post height preferences). I was successful, had quite a strong social group, and a robust sex life at 5 8. The problem was mostly just internal.
I think you said that you had a caretaker for a week and then fired her? How long do you think you actually needed it for now that you can look back? A month? 6 weeks?
Glad to hear that 5'8 is a fine height to live a great life. At 5'5", it's a different type of story (even though I'm very successful, and have a great personality according to many strangers). I think at 5'7" and below for a guy, you start feeling the discrimination. 5'8 is somewhat of a maybe (which is why I asked you). And then 5'9 and above, nobody notices. 5'9-5'11 is probably the ideal height - the goldilocks zone.
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Welcome to the forum DoingItForMe, I hope you will share your ll journey with us! :)
Don't mind Melan_sprint's weird behaviour and comments. He did too much mushroom and now he sees reflective dogs in a hall of mirrors, so to speak ;)
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Welcome to the forum DoingItForMe, I hope you will share your ll journey with us! :)
Don't mind Melan_sprint's weird behaviour and comments. He did too much mushroom and now he sees reflective dogs in a hall of mirrors, so to speak ;)
Hes right, i say out there stuff sometimes...just ignore me when im in my weird zone.
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Welcome to the forum DoingItForMe, I hope you will share your ll journey with us! :)
Don't mind Melan_sprint's weird behaviour and comments. He did too much mushroom and now he sees reflective dogs in a hall of mirrors, so to speak ;)
Thanks and I will create a diary. Reading the diaries were very helpful, and I'd gladly pay it forward with details of my own journey. I used to be part of the old forum under a different username back in 2013. After reading all the diaries, I decided against LL, and chose to accept being short, since my life wasn't that bad at all. But two years later, I'm still thinking about, because I still get discriminated against because of my height. I'm worried about missed opportunities in the future because of my height. I know for sure that in the past, I've missed a lot of opportunities because of it. Also, I wear shoe lifts, and I did notice a change in how people treat me. This was the affirmation I needed, and I don't want to wear shoe lifts my entire life. I also notice that I look more proportional when I'm on my tippy-toes. I'm quite bulky and have thick arms/legs/shoulders/chest. I booked a consultation with Paley back in March. He was booked until early May. That's when I will see him for the consultation and schedule my surgery hopefully in late June or early July.
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I don't think I needed a caretaker so much as just someone to stretch me daily and especially over the weekends. It starts off with you being pretty loose(in my case, in some others they were excruciatingly tight) and creeps up on you if you aren't getting constant stretching.
Below 5 8 I do agree is where there are some real problems. On one hand it is hard for me to advocate this surgery as it is insanely expensive, brutal, and consumes so much time. On the other the benefits are incredibly tangible, even going 5 8-5 11, having people remark and comment on my height is great, and I can imagine going from a height that garners very real discrimination to about average is an even greater feeling.
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I don't think I needed a caretaker so much as just someone to stretch me daily and especially over the weekends. It starts off with you being pretty loose(in my case, in some others they were excruciatingly tight) and creeps up on you if you aren't getting constant stretching.
Below 5 8 I do agree is where there are some real problems. On one hand it is hard for me to advocate this surgery as it is insanely expensive, brutal, and consumes so much time. On the other the benefits are incredibly tangible, even going 5 8-5 11, having people remark and comment on my height is great, and I can imagine going from a height that garners very real discrimination to about average is an even greater feeling.
You mean you wished you had someone to stretch you daily for 3 months? I'm asking because I only planned to have someone close to me help me out for about a month, but the next two months I'll be alone in the hotel (same one as yours probably). Is it possible to do the stretches yourself or something?
It already feels great wearing shoe lifts that bring me to 5'7" (well, actually more like 5'6.5" if everyone else had .5" shoe soles). So I can't wait to be 5'8" and wear some shoe lifts to bring me to 5'10" or so. Money and loss of time isn't an issue for me. The risk of long-term pain is a risk I'm willing to take, but I hope you make a recovery, because your diary is a constant reminder of that risk. If you recovered, I'd be more relieved. I'm rooting for ya, man! I'd much rather hear about the benefits and noticeable differences now that you're taller. Since you have been both 5'8" and 5'11", you actually have a way to compare the two. Sorry if this question is too personal, but do more girls talk to you or seem more interested in you? Or are there not much differences?
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Girls were already pretty interested in mine, and are outright blunt about liking my height. One girl I've been with since has said she hated how the guy she dated before was short and it was great I am tall, another said I could be christian grey because of my height. The girls in florida even when I was crippled who knew what I was doing would keep saying how perfect my height was for them now. One who hadn't seen me until I returned said she loved "how big I was now". So in short, yes they are much more enthusiastic, incredibly so.
A friend for the full time is what I recommend.
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Girls were already pretty interested in mine, and are outright blunt about liking my height. One girl I've been with since has said she hated how the guy she dated before was short and it was great I am tall, another said I could be christian grey because of my height. The girls in florida even when I was crippled who knew what I was doing would keep saying how perfect my height was for them now. One who hadn't seen me until I returned said she loved "how big I was now". So in short, yes they are much more enthusiastic, incredibly so.
A friend for the full time is what I recommend.
How tall are women in Florida, as I understand they're quite short?
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The ones lengthening their legs fairly. The average woman not very, probably around 5 5.
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Girls were already pretty interested in mine, and are outright blunt about liking my height. One girl I've been with since has said she hated how the guy she dated before was short and it was great I am tall, another said I could be christian grey because of my height. The girls in florida even when I was crippled who knew what I was doing would keep saying how perfect my height was for them now. One who hadn't seen me until I returned said she loved "how big I was now". So in short, yes they are much more enthusiastic, incredibly so.
A friend for the full time is what I recommend.
lol, whoever is remotely tall is christian grey in the eyes of the female 13 year old brain.
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lol, whoever is remotely tall is christian grey in the eyes of the female 13 year old brain.
Not really, programdude is probably both handsome and with a certain je sais quoi to warrant such a comment.
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Girls were already pretty interested in mine, and are outright blunt about liking my height. One girl I've been with since has said she hated how the guy she dated before was short
:) Sounds like you're much happier now. Congrats!
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I didn't lengthen to impress women, since I wasnt having trouble there before- But its definitely nice and goes to show how differently people perceive you. Still no one but the original seems to have noticed despite me not being 100% which is kind of what I expected.
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I didn't lengthen to impress women, since I wasnt having trouble there before- But its definitely nice and goes to show how differently people perceive you. Still no one but the original seems to have noticed despite me not being 100% which is kind of what I expected.
But you ARE much happier now, right? I'm hoping that this surgery will make me feel better about the way I look. I can't stand looking at myself at full length mirror, because I don't like the way I look. Hence my username "Doing It For Me". Is this the same reason why you're doing it?
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Yes, girls love tall men above everything else.
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My legs need some bulk before I look natural in a mirror when in boxer briefs or something, but in clothes I look more proportional than before.
Even around people significantly taller than me, it no longer is something that makes me feel short, I'm perfectly happy in my own skin.
I never think about being short, where before it was a problem, and reap the benefits with women I previously mentioned which is nice. So yes, despite being not recovered I am happier. This would change if I stopped making improvements in my looseness, leg strength, and strides, but it seems to be a winning battle at this point.
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You mean you wished you had someone to stretch you daily for 3 months? I'm asking because I only planned to have someone close to me help me out for about a month, but the next two months I'll be alone in the hotel (same one as yours probably). Is it possible to do the stretches yourself or something?
It already feels great wearing shoe lifts that bring me to 5'7" (well, actually more like 5'6.5" if everyone else had .5" shoe soles). So I can't wait to be 5'8" and wear some shoe lifts to bring me to 5'10" or so. Money and loss of time isn't an issue for me. The risk of long-term pain is a risk I'm willing to take, but I hope you make a recovery, because your diary is a constant reminder of that risk. If you recovered, I'd be more relieved. I'm rooting for ya, man! I'd much rather hear about the benefits and noticeable differences now that you're taller. Since you have been both 5'8" and 5'11", you actually have a way to compare the two. Sorry if this question is too personal, but do more girls talk to you or seem more interested in you? Or are there not much differences?
What shoe lifts are you wearing?
Where do you buy them or do you buy elevator shoes?
I tried some shoes a few years ago but they weren't comfortable and the lifts only add about an inch inside.
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What shoe lifts are you wearing?
Where do you buy them or do you buy elevator shoes?
I tried some shoes a few years ago but they weren't comfortable and the lifts only add about an inch inside.
Ah, I've been wearing lifts since high school. I can help you here. Back then, I used to stuff socks under my foot to get taller. That's how desperate I was to not be the shortest male in my senior class. I don't recommend that method at all. What you want is a type of gel. Anything hard will be painful. If you go on eBay, and look up "shoe lifts", you will find a lot of listings for this black multi-layered shoe lift with this red air-cushion on the largest layer. The layers fit like lego pieces, smelled oddly like strawberries, and they ship from China. I think I paid $8 for them or something really cheap like that. This is what I use, and it's pretty comfortable. Now you just got to find the right shoes. For me, boot cut jeans are almost a must. You have to cover up the fact that the soles of your feet are very close to the top of your shoe. I've tried Timberlands and other boots. Some were okay. Some were very painful. The painful ones are the ones that don't give you much leeway where the laces are. What you want to do is go to your shoe store (preferably one of those warehouse ones where people don't bother you), and just bring your shoe lifts and test them out. There should be no area that feels tight with the lifts in. If it feels tight in any one spot, then it's going to rub your skin all day long and you will get blisters.
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Things seem to be going better. Strength, pains, and posture/tightness all improving.
Still not jogging around the block, but I see it in the near future at this point.
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Good to hear, buddy. I'm still waiting for the day you tell us that you're fully recovered.
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It might be awhile before I say fully. But compared to where I was mere weeks ago I am doing much better.
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It has been 9 months op, how do u find about ur scocial, body conditions?
Do u recommend people to do both tibias and femurs three weeks apart just to save the time and cost as well as long term pain. Get hard pain at once
Because Uve been through the surgery and stay there so I thought somehow u might kno things cnt be found on the website
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It's great to hear that u are doing better and recovering. :)
Keep it up.
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Not really sure what you mean by social body conditions?
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I'm glad you are improving but I cannot believe you said your legs need to become more bulk to seem natural still... It's been like a whole year almost since you did your LL. I know the surgery is not easy but this is just frustrating.
Do you go to the gym? Can you even work out?
Does your body or legs look skinny?
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I workout, leg press, extension, glute exercises no problem. My legs are quite strong, with my left being slightly weaker due to the pain it was suffering.
When I say I need more size for things to look well, its mainly because my torso is well, jacked. I just look like I skip leg day now. If I were scrawny and bulked down my legs would look fine.
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Oh I see... Well when did you start working out your legs after surgery? After how many months?
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When will you return to your modelling career?
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I'm already making money and would say my walking is around 85-90% now. MASSIVE improvements once you actually start being able to walk decently.
I started lightly working out legs probably three months ago, or whenever I said in my diary, but have been upping the intensity each week.
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Walked and jogged a bit on the treadmill. Its weird jogging and not having the same strength and confidence in each stride at settings I used to destroy, and having poor endurance, but I am going to drill myself with it along with my numerous leg days each week which seem to have done me a lot of good.
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Hey Programdude,
Idk if this has been asked already, what do you think about your proportions right now?
What wingspan do you have?
I wish you the best of luck with your further recovery!
Cheers!
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I don't have measurements, but my wingspan was very long before surgery in comparison to my height and is now much better. This was an added bonus of doing the surgery.
As I am convinced building my glutes and strengthening my legs is the key to recovery, I'm going to start doing half hour walks every night. I did my first yesterday and it went quite well. I'd imagine a few weeks of that and I can add jogging around the area to the regimen- and then should finally be close to 100%.
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That's exactly what I'm doing. I'm trying to walk at least 30 minutes, but closer to an hour every night after I'm done with work. It sucks and it's tiring and still a bit painful, but it's getting better, and I know I have no choice. I carry my crutches with me just in case I get too tired or have to go up stairs (left leg is almost fused but not quite, so still need the crutches for stairs).
Definitely do not regret my decision one bit, even though recovery has been the most frustrating part in this process.
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So you think you will be able to get back to 100% of your pre op-level?
I'm asking this because 100% after 8cm's of lengthening simply sounds too good to be true. It would be awesome though haha
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I don't play sports so yes I think I will get to what I'd consider 100%. The progress so far has gone from a standstill to monumental(A month ago for my long outing I was in really bad limping shape, and now I am striding along, not getting tired for awhile, and I am sure as I make a habit of it my legs will strengthen up, especially in conjunction with my workouts.
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Walking is exponentially improved. Have been walking miles every day. Endurance is still a bit of an issue, with fatigue setting in fast, but this is improving. I still remember when I could barely lurch around the corner within eyesight of my house not so long ago. Now I can walk with my friends fine for large distances. My walking my friends noted was basically back to normal, even looking for it. Carrying weights in the gym is easier by the day. My jogging is still not very good at all.
Only real complaints though are 1. The pain still present in my lower left femur in front. 2.There is a bit of a click, that feels like muscle rubbing against each other or something. Its pretty irritating sometimes, and I think due to tightness in my hip flexor or weakness in my glutes.
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Walking is exponentially improved. Have been walking miles every day. Endurance is still a bit of an issue, with fatigue setting in fast, but this is improving. I still remember when I could barely lurch around the corner within eyesight of my house not so long ago. Now I can walk with my friends fine for large distances. My walking my friends noted was basically back to normal, even looking for it. Carrying weights in the gym is easier by the day. My jogging is still not very good at all.
Only real complaints though are 1. The pain still present in my lower left femur in front. 2.There is a bit of a click, that feels like muscle rubbing against each other or something. Its pretty irritating sometimes, and I think due to tightness in my hip flexor or weakness in my glutes.
How long was it since your bones fused?
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Around 3 months I think
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Jogging is still pretty crap today. My right upper hamstring/glute area has been getting pretty tight from extended walking. The clicking in my right hip when my leg goes back persists.
Other than that things are good as I reported earlier. Gym, pretty long walks, and store trips are no problem.
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Jogging is still pretty crap today. My right upper hamstring/glute area has been getting pretty tight from extended walking. The clicking in my right hip when my leg goes back persists.
Other than that things are good as I reported earlier. Gym, pretty long walks, and store trips are no problem.
Thanks for keeping us updated. Are you satisfied with how your body is right now? I'm sure you lost fitness after this surgery... Did you gain it back?
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What pant inseam do you wear after LL?
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I'm jacked in my upper body, and am at about my pre LL weight. I will be extremely satisfied with how I look once I get my ass and legs some size, as right now it looks like I skip leg day. I can take long walks, like I did today for about an hour or more straight. My jogging I still need some more size and stability I feel before I can do respectably. I can have sex in almost all positions, other than doggystyle which feels weird at the moment, which is a bit of a bummer since a lot of my partners do like it. I actually got my first comment on my long legs as a girl was trying to do this position where she arches her back up. When she had trouble she touched my leg and sort of ran her hand up it and was shocked by their length, but not really in a negative way.
Every time I get annoyed by something though, the new height does make up for it to be honest. The whole family has commented on how tall I am, joking that I'm taller than the tallest uncle in the family. With almost every girl theres been some kind of height comment, one talking about her short ex, another who's first words to me were "You are as tall as you said you were!". And these countless moments add up. Now my size and strides much more match my charisma and how I feel about myself. I still don't feel great about my size, and ideally will bulk up another 30 pounds, a lot of it on my legs and ass. I would estimate than in 4 months I will be huge and barring anything thats being caused by the device, at 100%. I think I will be around 90% much sooner though, as every leg workout and walk is a vast improvement.
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who are all these girls you speak of, dude? you must be a millionaire.
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who are all these girls you speak of, dude? you must be a millionaire.
The guy is hot, as he mentioned he is a model.
Other than that, thank you for replying to us programdude.
It's a shame that after so long you are still not satisfied with your legs and ass, I hope you achieve your goal. For me that was my main concern, legs and ass... How f-ing frustating.
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You planning on posting some videos once your running recovers?
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I think we need a username change for this guy - Playboydude.
In all seriousness, I share many of the same frustrations as PD does, although I don't think I'm too far behind from where he is now. I can walk a good amount before getting very tired. Waddling is now under control, but I still sway my hips. When I get tired, then the walking looks funnier. I believe I will be able to tackle this quickly once I can get back to the gym and start weight training again. My legs aren't crazy thin, but they look thin compared to where they were, especially because I have naturally thick/muscular legs. I've been trying to eat healthier (I let that go for a while), but don't want to eat too many calories until I'm back to working out. My upper body looks about the same (chest/arm size have been mostly retained), just need to cut some body fat, while building back my legs. I will get there.
I'm also frustrated with my ass lol that seems to be something all internal femur patients go through. One girl said it was fine, but I know it's not as good as it used to be. I'm hoping that once I'm back to walking to my normal routine and I can do weight training again, it will start to come back. I'm hoping that since my legs/ass were naturally big, that will help me in getting them back eventually.
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who are all these girls you speak of, dude? you must be a millionaire.
Lol, I do pretty well but don't think thats what catches their attention. My number of sexual partners has pretty much gone down since surgery though, as not counting the ones in Florida, I've only slept with about 8 in the past two months.
I may post videos, but I am not making promises. I almost certainly will post pictures though. My life will basically just be the gym, eating, resting until I am at a better place. I intend for my legs to be much stronger than ever, and much bigger even with the added length. I think the long femurs will look great with serious muscle filling them in.
I've gotten comments about my butt being cute too, but for both practical and aesthetic reasons I want it much better.
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Daaamn son 8 chicks while not even being fully recovered, pretty impressive ;D
Wish you all the best with your recovery!
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Lol, I do pretty well but don't think thats what catches their attention.
what then? model's body?
Also, I'm curious about your line of work. I wish I could chill out and do LL like you, being self employed.
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I am not gonna go too much into what I do, but yes for the most part I can relax. But don't get me wrong, I have definitely been making less than I could be due to LL.
And yes my body/face are more of a draw, seeing as its usually clear I won't be spending money on them, and many don't know my financial status, car aside.
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Have you ever done any other sort of cosmetic surgery? If it's OK with me asking this. You do not need to reply to this.
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Nope, the only other thing remotely cosmetic was getting invisalign to fix minor misalignment.
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Reading this thread just reminds me how much I wish I was handsome. Being ugly sucks. Being short and ugly sucks worse.
Good looking people truly have a completely different experience of life.
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I can't disagree. When I was younger I wasn't particularly good looking, and really grew into my looks and the difference in how I was regarded was immense. The worlds a superficial place which has only become clearer after lengthening my legs with the ridiculous amount of comments on my height, and also the opening up about the importance of height in conversations now that I am tall.
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I have to agree with PD's sentiments. It kinda makes me sad how superficial this world is sometimes, because there is more to a person than just their looks. When I was younger, I was always told I was "handsome" but I never believed it. I was always short, and a bit chubby as a kid. I got girls in college, but that was all random luck/drunken bar hookups. I had a girlfriend for half of my 20s, but it wasn't until my mid 20s when I started doing my hair a certain way, did Invisalign for my teeth, whiten my teeth, and really worked on my fitness did things get good. And after all that...I realized that my height was a huge hindrance.
Coming up to 5'8" from a little over 5'5" has made huge difference, even though I'm still not tall at all.
The difference between men and women...we as men don't care why girls like us, we just want them to like us. As such, we have to bust our asses in all facets of our life...our looks, career, education, personality/charm...the whole bit. Only then can you access a decent dating pool.
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I can't disagree. When I was younger I wasn't particularly good looking, and really grew into my looks and the difference in how I was regarded was immense. The worlds a superficial place which has only become clearer after lengthening my legs with the ridiculous amount of comments on my height, and also the opening up about the importance of height in conversations now that I am tall.
Hey man , how is your recovery going?
you didn't update long time ?
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Well, I am doing pretty decently. I do think I will need the hardware removed for close to 100% though, which I am not too happy about. Gluts still need strength but leg size and power is really coming back. Harder to fill in the size on the legs now that they are ridiculously long, but its starting to show, at last.
Funny thing is I had someone from the local gym privately ask me if I did LL, and that he had been considering it for a long time. Only the second person to actually notice what I did, even though all my family members are joking about how I'm 6 feet tall now.
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Well, I am doing pretty decently. I do think I will need the hardware removed for close to 100% though, which I am not too happy about. Gluts still need strength but leg size and power is really coming back. Harder to fill in the size on the legs now that they are ridiculously long, but its starting to show, at last.
Funny thing is I had someone from the local gym privately ask me if I did LL, and that he had been considering it for a long time. Only the second person to actually notice what I did, even though all my family members are joking about how I'm 6 feet tall now.
Huh, did you ask him how he could tell, also how tall was he?
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Well, he goes to my gym so he saw me in bad shape when I got back. Then much taller when I stood up. I had told him I broke my legs when he asked before, so I think he did the math seeing as he was someone who already knew a lot about it. He was familiar with my pre op height.
He is around 5 5
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Well, I am doing pretty decently. I do think I will need the hardware removed for close to 100% though, which I am not too happy about. Gluts still need strength but leg size and power is really coming back. Harder to fill in the size on the legs now that they are ridiculously long, but its starting to show, at last.
How is running coming along PD?
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Pretty crap still. Think I am gonna need the hardware out to be honest.
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How are you feeling PD? When do you plan to remove the nail?
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Getting x rays on monday to see if I can have it taken out. Gonna then shoot for july 1st ish to get them out if all looks good.
I know a girl that lives minutes from dr. R and will be keen on me staying there for my consult/op/recovery so I don't need to worry about a hotel or anything which is good. This process has been costly enough.
I am feeling good, and my strength is still increasing along with size, but filling it in is gonna take time. They are quite long now.
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You've mentioned that your legs are now pretty long a few times. What pant inseam length fit you best before LL and what fits you best now? Has your ass recovered from atrophy caused by the procedure? If not, the lack of ass (lol) might make your legs look even longer than they are.
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Yes the ass and muscle filling in in general is helping. I believe a month of training the glutes and legs will make it all look pretty good(they look normal now, just not impressive as the rest of me). No idea on the inseam but a lot of the pants I used to wear don't fit, though some ill fitting ones from before are now perfect.
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Heres an update. Got x rays as I am hoping to get rods removed asap. Idk how they should be looking to be removed but they don't look fantastic to me at first blush. What do you all think?
(http://i.imgur.com/v2y8Tj8.jpg)
(http://i.imgur.com/49KCYzJ.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/rOLjns0.png)
(http://i.imgur.com/Fq4SXok.png)
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Hey PD, I'm no expert but imo, they dont look as well consolidated (less dense than surrounding) as they ought to be for safe removal :(
Thats a bummer I know, with regards to hardware removal but by any other definition, the bone seems to be growing well and really its just be a matter of time so hang on a tad longer bro! Needless to say, you've been stoic this far, kudos!
Yogi
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Yea didn't look great. Big bummer.
Guess we will see. Whatever though. I am functional and will just wait awhile before checking again. Wanted to get it out before a big bulking cycle I'm gonna do, but will need to do it with rods inside.
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Damn PD, that sucks. Are you taking any supplements?
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Not the stuff I was during lengthening, but I eat three to four times what a normal person would eat, including lots of calcium sources, vitamin d supplementation, and other nutrient rich foods. Also I work out legs hard which should be stimulating growth more.
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So, good news, turns out my bones actually are good enough for rod removal.
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Congrats, man!
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Yahoo! Good stuff
When are u doing it and who with?
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Dr R says he can do it through insurance. So him! Theres a girl there I can stay with so parking should be my only expense! :D Very happy if it all pans out.
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Dr R says he can do it through insurance. So him! Theres a girl there I can stay with so parking should be my only expense! :D Very happy if it all pans out.
That's awesome. So insurance will cover rod removal for a surgery it wouldn't pay for initially?
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From my talks with dr. R yes
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So what is the post-op recovery time that you're looking at PD? Your LL journey is at its close, once these rods are out it'll be smooth-sailing(hopefully) back to 100%. How does it feel now that you're almost done?
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It feels good. But I won't be totally optimistic till the rods are out and actually covered by insurance. Once they are out I think I will basically be at full capacity a month after(figure I will lose a slight bit of muscle after removal). My jogging is a lot better now, but still very poor endurance. Legs are filling in etc. very nicely considering. I am confident the clicking in my right hip is a result of the rod, so with that gone I will be pretty happy.
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Great to hear that you are getting the rods removed. Are you going to a different doc for removal? You've been mentioning Dr. R...are you not getting the removal done by Paley?
Congrats again!
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Correct. Dr R takes insurance
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Just a quick question to ask whether your second guessing going to Paley over say Dr.R or one of the other better known LL docs? Looking foward to hearing from you.
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Just a quick question to ask whether your second guessing going to Paley over say Dr.R or one of the other better known LL docs? Looking foward to hearing from you.
Can you elaborate on what you mean? Do you mean for rod removal?
My consult with Dr. R was today. Basically hospital fees which was the main concern will be covered. His fee is then 10k for surgery(half of Paley's) HOWEVER all I need to deposit is 5k. If my insurance denies the claim then he accepts the 5k at the most. If they cover more then I get a refund.
He confirmed the lower left leg pain almost assuredly is coming from the device, and I was able to see how this is not present on the right side which makes total sense. The clicking in my hip wasnt as evident but he said it wasnt uncommon. So basically it is likely my issues are all about to be resolved.
Also I heard someone in their LL consultation the room over. Reveal yourself!
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Hi Programdude, Just for clarification purposes, I meant would you rather have had DR R have done the Precice surgery than Dr Paley? U seem to have good report with Dr R. I'm sure he's as highly regarded as Paley.
Last but not least, in a previous post I think you mentioned your search to find cosmetic doctors to remove the small incision scars. Can you recommend any doctors for removing the scars.thanks again.
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I haven't followed up with scar removal since I will get scars refreshed with the removal.
Dr. R seems like a better dr. to have on your case, but Dr. Paley is still overall the better choice I believe.
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Could you tell me how much price for D R and how long will stay here
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For removal? For the initial surgery itself I have no idea.
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Dr. R's total costs are between 120-150K I believe.
lol...
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Officially one year post op. Its been a ride!
48 hours and the rods should be out of my legs and this journey should be pretty much complete.
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Good luck programdude! I am sure you will do fine with dr. R. You are in safe hands.
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Congrats bro! Wishing you a speedy recovery and a healthy new chapter in life
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Great meeting you PD. Congrats on being officially done with this sh*t. Now get on dat full recovery time so we can spit game to NYC chicks 8)
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Thanks all for your support. Removal has been a joke compared to insertion, as many said. Surgery seemed to be 3-4 hours or so, and I was walking without crutches immediately(to the nurses horror).
I drove back to boston around 7-8 hours post op after a much needed feast. Pain is bearable, though I've got temporary duck ass again since straightening the muscle hurts right now. Surgery was a total success with all components being removed without incident.
Good meeting you yellowspike, your proportions were on point and walking only looked off a bit cuz I knew what to look for. Looks like a LL success to me.
I am glad this chapter in my life looks to be just about closed, and I can get back on track to getting my physique where I want it to be. If anyone has any questions about this all I am happy to answer. In NYC I still need to fill out a form and wait for approval for a few months before getting my rods to take home.
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Thats awesome, congrats! And great motivation for the rest of us...enjoy the new life!
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It is genuinely great to hear that your journey has been a success after a long year.
Would you possibly mind posting pictures of your proportions? You can feel free to cover your face with a blur or black spot; anything that focuses more on your body image would be greatly appreciated for refrence.
Also have there been any other complications with your knees or so? Thank you!
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Knees are 100% fine. In a few days I will report on if those other issues the hardware seems to have caused are totally gone.
I will probably post pics at some point once I am a bit more filled in. Yellowspike can weigh in with his honest opinion about how I looked/my proportions also since he got to meet me in nyc.
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ProgramDude's proportions looked fantastic to me. And will look even more awesome when he bulks his legs back up more (I'm working on the same thing too).
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Are your femurs longer than your torso and, if so, is it noticeable? I guess those proportions actually look good (and makes you look taller than you really are) BUT you have to have long arms to pull it off. But you're fine in that regard, it seems.
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ProgramDude's proportions looked fantastic to me. And will look even more awesome when he bulks his legs back up more (I'm working on the same thing too).
Also, the real question we all want answered: are Programdude and Yellowspike really as good looking as it would seem they are? Lol.
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Great meeting you PD. Congrats on being officially done with this sh*t. Now get on dat full recovery time so we can spit game to NYC chicks 8)
Oh, crap. Looks like these two are gonna bite a large chunk out of the big apple.
Seriously though, congrats to both of you.
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Also, the real question we all want answered: are Programdude and Yellowspike really as good looking as it would seem they are? Lol.
Regarding ProgrameDude...I mean, was there ever any doubt? Lol.
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Yellowspike kept the train going of most people I've met doing LL being good looking and sane going. We would clean up a NYC bar nicely.
I am feeling alright, pain meds keep the pain quite tolerable though the sides are unfortunate. I can walk relatively normally when on the meds, and it already feels like the issues I had pre removal aren't present. Nasty bruise on my left hip when I took bandages off, but dr. R said it should be no problem though.
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Your insurance is paying for a cosmetic limb lengthening procedure??!! Wtf, who you have your insurance with? Lol
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Glad to see you're doing well. I had my surgery on the 22nd, so it's been about 11 days post-op. PT is going fine and pain is manageable but my only trouble is sleeping. I can't remember the last time I slept at night. I take brief naps during the day (which I realize I should stop doing) but other than that I'm constantly awake. It's 2am right now and have zero hopes of falling asleep anytime soon. I'll probably just end up watching It's Always Sunny or reading till the morning. What tips do you have for sleeping at night? Nothing seems to work for me. Thanks.
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Your insurance is paying for a cosmetic limb lengthening procedure??!! Wtf, who you have your insurance with? Lol
It covered some of the hospital fees for removal only...
As for sleep, the bad news is, as my diary indicates, sleep is the worst part of all this and never gets better. ZZZquill helped. Read through my thread and you will pick up some things here and there. It can be brutal.
Ps. it seems running again was only hindered by the rods, I ran today fine, despite not being full recovered from removal. Also walked around a lot today NO more clicking, NO more pain in my left leg. It looks like I am finally free.
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Very happy for you, bro.
I undergo mine on August 25th in Spain.
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Hi PD,
Congrats on removal and successful completion!
I was wondering what pain meds you take now and how often? how is the pain from 1 to 10? did you do xray post op?
Since i am having my removal soon I d like to get some general idea about it .
Thanks!
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Hi PD,
Congrats on removal and successful completion!
I was wondering what pain meds you take now and how often? how is the pain from 1 to 10? did you do xray post op?
Since i am having my removal soon I d like to get some general idea about it .
Thanks!
Hey sweatpants, good seeing you here.
To give you an idea, even though I was told I'd need my crutches, I was able to walk out of recovery, and stand up to get dressed and use the bathroom etc. right away. I even could walk up and down stairs of the house I stayed at, and was able to drive home at around 4 am the morning after my evening surgery. In other words: nothing how you felt after your initial surgery.
You will get some duck ass just right after since you be too sore in the hips to straighten, but this will go away. The days right after pain when walking and moving is around a 5, and when stationary, almost painless. My back did get seriously tight to the point of being painful and is still somewhat tight even after deep massages, but thats probably not overly common and is probably just because I was mostly stationary a few days.
Now, about a week and a half later, there is still soreness but I don't need pain killers and I walked around almost all of saturday normally.
No x rays post op, and in the days after I was using about 4 of the percocets per day.
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Programdude i have some duck ass
I emailed dr paley and he told me that doing femurs will reduce or not change my duck ass but not get worse
Is this true?
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From my experience, at least a year later, this doesn't seem to be true. I have certainly not had duck ass improvement(had slight going into it). And if anything the tightness makes it worse after. Its possible with more time and very rigorous training it will get better, but I can't imagine this helping duck ass.
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Most people who do femurs will get duckass. I just don't see any way around it. Dr. G told me once you start getting to high lengthening amounts (7cm and up), it can take up to a year to completely go away. I'm almost 8 months post-op, and while I feel great (just came back from gym, did a killer glutes workout), I still have some duckass. Much better than what it was, but it's still there for sure.
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What is duckass? I keep seeing this word on this forum but I don't understand what it means. I've only lengthened 13mm but as far as I can tell there's nothing seriously wrong with my posture.
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What is duckass? I keep seeing this word on this forum but I don't understand what it means. I've only lengthened 13mm but as far as I can tell there's nothing seriously wrong with my posture.
Duckass is the layman's term for lordosis. You can google it. Basically, it is caused by a combination of super tight hip flexors (due to the lengthening of femurs), weak glutes (from not using them while lengthening), and to a lesser extent, weak abs.
It basically looks like you're sticking your ass out like a Kartrashian.
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Hey sweatpants, good seeing you here.
To give you an idea, even though I was told I'd need my crutches, I was able to walk out of recovery, and stand up to get dressed and use the bathroom etc. right away. I even could walk up and down stairs of the house I stayed at, and was able to drive home at around 4 am the morning after my evening surgery. In other words: nothing how you felt after your initial surgery.
You will get some duck ass just right after since you be too sore in the hips to straighten, but this will go away. The days right after pain when walking and moving is around a 5, and when stationary, almost painless. My back did get seriously tight to the point of being painful and is still somewhat tight even after deep massages, but thats probably not overly common and is probably just because I was mostly stationary a few days.
Now, about a week and a half later, there is still soreness but I don't need pain killers and I walked around almost all of saturday normally.
No x rays post op, and in the days after I was using about 4 of the percocets per day.
Thanks PD for the answer, it helps a lot :)
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This is a part of the email dr Paley sent me:
Finally, if it has any effect on spine it is to lessen lordosis not increase it. The increase you may read about called ‘duckass’ is due to contracture of the TFL (iliotibial band) which we routinely lengthen.
-did he does iliotibial release on you?
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IT band? Yes, but that is by the knees... not the hip area which is where the duck ass seems to radiate from...
I can speak only from personal experience as a patient, Paley is obviously more qualified, though I found him and his team to really underplay the intensity of a lot of this process- Whether it is to drive sales or genuine lack of understanding of what a patient goes through I won't speculate on.
I will keep people posted with how my duckass is once my hips are no longer sore, though its already basically back to where it was before removal.
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Duckass is the layman's term for lordosis. You can google it. Basically, it is caused by a combination of super tight hip flexors (due to the lengthening of femurs), weak glutes (from not using them while lengthening), and to a lesser extent, weak abs.
It basically looks like you're sticking your ass out like a Kartrashian.
:-\ Now that I look in a mirror this may be developing...
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It is very normal and I haven't heard of anyone not getting it.
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I stayed up till nearly 3 am to try and read this entire diary but couldn't keep my eyes open. Just finished now in the morning as the last 5-6 pages are a quicker read lol. Thank you PD for doing this. It's given me (and others) a lot more confidence and assurance about doing LL. As a very short man of only 5-2.25 (158-159 cm), I was afraid that only doing 5-6.5 centimeters on both femurs and tibias meant a double surgery would only result in being like 5-6 or 5-7. Meaning I'd still be short. But reading your journal I can see that getting 3 inches/8 cm from the internal nail shouldn't be a problem. Being man who's been into bodybuilding for 17 years (I'm 31, started working out when I was 14), I feel confident that the post-op PT would be a breeze for me, as I also enjoy the challenge of pushing myself to the limit.
So who knows, maybe if I ever get the cash someday, I'll go for 8cm on the femur, and like 7-8 cm on the tibia, and I can result with being like 5-8 or 5-8.5. Sure I'd still be short in many people's eyes, but at least I wouldn't be "technically" short in the most general of terms.
Thanks again!!
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No problem! Between the pain killers and lack of sleep some parts of the diary are definitely embarrassing but I'm glad I did it and like to think its a thorough idea of what to expect from this process.
Still haven't read back over the thread, but I am sure it will be interesting to say the least.
Sometimes I look back and honestly don't know how I did this all. There are so many components to it all, and thats not even accounting for the crazy amount of money or fear one could have, neither of which were an issue for me fortunately(the former was still hard to swallow). To have gone from short, to almost bed ridden, to a gimp, and now just simply tall to the untrained eye is wild. And the funniest thing is that if you do it well and discretely, pretty much no one will know what you've been through. I look forward to being 100% once the trauma from the legs goes away. I've definitely considered writing a book/starting a resource website since I remember how overwhelmed and lost I felt going into this, and know having a friend or guide would have made it all easier.
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I especially loved the part where you said Paley has a lot of patients do this and how it's getting bigger. As it gets more well known, it'll be less embarrassing to hide from others (I honestly don't think it should be embarrassing at all, and you can bet if I ever do have it done, I WILL let my girlfriend know). Who knows, maybe someday LL will be just as common and accepted as every other cosmetic procedure that people get and don't think anything of it.
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Its only as big a deal as you make it. I don't want to be known as "that guy who got cosmetic surgery", sure, but I haven't flinched in telling those close to me about it. Not to mention I told a lot of girls there in florida about it, and a couple locally and it doesn't stop their enthusiasm.
If you are insecure about it and don't own it then it might not go so well though.
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I especially loved the part where you said Paley has a lot of patients do this and how it's getting bigger. As it gets more well known, it'll be less embarrassing to hide from others (I honestly don't think it should be embarrassing at all, and you can bet if I ever do have it done, I WILL let my girlfriend know). Who knows, maybe someday LL will be just as common and accepted as every other cosmetic procedure that people get and don't think anything of it.
I personally think the future of CLL is more bleak. As the legit doctors retire there probably won't be as many safe options to choose from, and the ones left will jack up the price because the demand will be higher. Then you'll get joint replacement surgeons with barely any specialty training doing botch jobs on people and the reputation of the surgery will decline further as more and more people need repeat surgeries for corrections. The stigma will stay, imo.
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There will always be stigma to cosmetic surgeries. Other than braces there is basically nothing that isn't looked down on to some extent, be it hair transplants, breast implants, nose jobs, etc.
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No problem! Between the pain killers and lack of sleep some parts of the diary are definitely embarrassing but I'm glad I did it and like to think its a thorough idea of what to expect from this process.
Still haven't read back over the thread, but I am sure it will be interesting to say the least.
Sometimes I look back and honestly don't know how I did this all. There are so many components to it all, and thats not even accounting for the crazy amount of money or fear one could have, neither of which were an issue for me fortunately(the former was still hard to swallow). To have gone from short, to almost bed ridden, to a gimp, and now just simply tall to the untrained eye is wild. And the funniest thing is that if you do it well and discretely, pretty much no one will know what you've been through. I look forward to being 100% once the trauma from the legs goes away. I've definitely considered writing a book/starting a resource website since I remember how overwhelmed and lost I felt going into this, and know having a friend or guide would have made it all easier.
This would be great, especially for someone like me would is heavily considering following in your footsteps and doing internal femurs with Dr.Paley. Any and all advice from you would be a great relief for me and anyone else. With that in mind I do have an abundance of questions to ask you but I feel those would be best reserved for months later considering my biggest worries with CLL have always been the long term effects on my body more than anything. But for now I have just two simple questions:
1) In terms of recovery how would 5-6CM in height be in terms of recovery?
2) Thus far how are your muscles holding up to this change? Any do you think you might ever be better?
Thanks m8
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I would guess two or three months to be mostly recovered from 5 CM of lengthening.
My muscles are filling in, but because they keep getting trauma and I can't work them out properly they are lagging a bit, and also because they are long it takes longer for it to show. I doubt as far as muscular performance and appearance I am or will be better than ever, though with enough training it will look great.
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There will always be stigma to cosmetic surgeries. Other than braces there is basically nothing that isn't looked down on to some extent, be it hair transplants, breast implants, nose jobs, etc.
Agreed. But the stigma for cosmetic surgeries is far, far worse for men. As men, we're expected to "hit the gym" and "be confident (24/7/365)." That is why there are tons of beauty aids (makeup, push-up bras, high heels) for women, and none of that for men (aside maybe from certain clothes and workout routines lol).
I totally own the fact that I did LL to the select friends that I told. But I definitely will not be telling future women about it.
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I especially loved the part where you said Paley has a lot of patients do this and how it's getting bigger. As it gets more well known, it'll be less embarrassing to hide from others (I honestly don't think it should be embarrassing at all, and you can bet if I ever do have it done, I WILL let my girlfriend know). Who knows, maybe someday LL will be just as common and accepted as every other cosmetic procedure that people get and don't think anything of it.
I actually managed to sleep for 8 hours (from 11-3 then 4-8) last night. 14 days post-op. Hopefully this'll continue and my journey will go by much smoother.
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Feeling well, but have pain in my left upper femur now.. presumably from removal so hopefully it subsides. Has been making things tricky for physical activities but I can still function... Just doesn't feel great. Bones are supposed to be healed and all that by 6 week mark, so if not resolved by then I will be concerned, but hoping for the best.
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How is the pain? Is it tolerable? Do you have any lingering pain from the procedure with rods inside and removed from leg? Do you know of anybody with long term repercussions from the LL?
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As said, I generally feel a lot better except for this weird left hip pain that is likely from trauma from removal, I'd have to imagine.. It hurts when I walk and when exerting it like standing etc.
I will have a verdict in a few weeks. I will be either great when that resolves or it won't and will need serious investigation lol...
My left hip was SERIOUSLY bruised after unlike my right which was fine, so there may just be some excessive trauma to it especially.
I've got bad LL luck, but I'm optimistic.
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Hey man
How are you feeling? Does your hip still hurt? Looking forward to an update!
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Hips improving, leaving only a faint hint of pain. I can now kneel and stand normally without the sharp pain.
Currently my main complaint is pain/tightness in the hip flexors area(not sure if its bone or muscle) when attempting running. If that can be resolved through bone recovery or stretching, I am pretty much golden.
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Hips improving, leaving only a faint hint of pain. I can now kneel and stand normally without the sharp pain.
Currently my main complaint is pain/tightness in the hip flexors area(not sure if its bone or muscle) when attempting running. If that can be resolved through bone recovery or stretching, I am pretty much golden.
How is your running other than that, can you move like you used to, what about your speed and agility?
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As said, I generally feel a lot better except for this weird left hip pain that is likely from trauma from removal, I'd have to imagine.. It hurts when I walk and when exerting it like standing etc.
I will have a verdict in a few weeks. I will be either great when that resolves or it won't and will need serious investigation lol...
My left hip was SERIOUSLY bruised after unlike my right which was fine, so there may just be some excessive trauma to it especially.
I've got bad LL luck, but I'm optimistic.
If you've seen how they remove it, you'd probably know why you might be bruised. They take a hammer and hammer the nail out of you. And if it's really stuck, imagine how hard they have to strike that hammer and how much impact that vibration has on the rest of your bones.
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Hey man, hope you are recovering well! I'm considering LL with Paley as well. I have the same starting height as yours. May I ask how long is your tibia and your femur now? Do they look proportional? I may consider to do 8cm on my femurs as well. Your diary really helps. Thanks, man
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Upp- It is hard to say, but everything feels good other than that when I run. That area is tight/fatigues very quickly. Unfortunately I can only run for maybe a minute right now before extreme discomfort is a problem. I suspect through more stretching and my glutes getting back to being strong it will be better.
My legs look pretty proportional now that my femurs aren't completely emaciated.
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Upp- It is hard to say, but everything feels good other than that when I run. That area is tight/fatigues very quickly. Unfortunately I can only run for maybe a minute right now before extreme discomfort is a problem. I suspect through more stretching and my glutes getting back to being strong it will be better.
My legs look pretty proportional now that my femurs aren't completely emaciated.
How much walking did you do each day on the crutches or in the pool during lengthening?
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I spent a lot of time in the pool. Almost no time walking in crutches as I was told it wasnt safe- until much later Paley told me it was ok and that the others were wrong.
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Hi PD,
Every detailed diary. I loved reading your experience and think you'd be great at writing a book on the subject.
My goal is to lengthen 4.5 cm on the fibia and 3.5 on the tibia for a total of 8cm.. If you could go back, would you do the 8cm over two portions of bone for a easier recovery and better proportions?
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I wouldn't do that- mainly because of scarring than anything else. The femur scars after nail removal aren't terrible, and will be pretty good once the new ones are healed... But having tibia and femurs totally jacked up wouldn't be something I'd like.
Its possible depending on recovery, I would have simply wished to lengthen less, but at this point things are getting pretty good. Long walks, lifting etc. not really a problem. Short running is pretty good. It is quite the process but I think things will get back to where they need to be soon.
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walking long distances is fine now. Strength and everything recovering. size is normal but looks small since I am otherwise jacked.
jogging remains the only difficulty. Will keep people posted about that
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So when are you going to post some pics?
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Disclaimer: This update to PD's diary is fully authorized by PD himself.
Now for the dark side of LL. I got a text tonight from our boy ProgramDude, and could hardly believe what I read. "Dude...my leg snapped in half." I called him and he was getting ready for surgery. We didn't talk long, and he sounded very calm and collected, all things considered (kudos to him, I'd be freaking out). Apparently, he was trying to just stretch his left quad...and he heard a "snap," and it was exactly as he feared. As far as I know, PD followed the doctor's orders completely, and wasn't over exerting himself. So we can't blame PD.
PD - good luck bro and hang in there. Keep us all posted.
To everyone else - LL is SERIOUS crap. This surgery takes a long ass time to recovery from (I will begrudgingly update my diary shortly), and there are significant risks, even with the best possible doctors out there. Proceed with extreme caution (something I need to do more, and will talk about that in my diary).
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yellow
i had a feeling... we havent spoken in a bit
i agree with you.... people need to listen to your post
it takes a long time to recover from... a long time
i hope youve stopped thinking about a second surgery...
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No way man. I will be 5'9" in about a year's time. I refuse to settle for anything less than average. 5'8" is the start of short, not ok with me.
We'll talk soon. Been trying to avoid this whole LL sh*t (even though I"ll be back next year).
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Christ this makes me sick. I really hope he's doing ok and that it's nothing too serious. Please send him my best regards. Keep us updated on his condition and post your own opinion on your diary as we are mostly aware of the lengthening process but the recovery sometimes becomes undermined by it. This doesn't make me rethink my decision to undergo the surgery, but it sure does put much more emphasis on how truly serious this is.
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I dont believe real Paley patient would have his leg snap unless he was doing something against his advice. Doctor Paley is god of leg lengthening.
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im sick of ll talk too
its fking ridiculous how long it takes if you go over 6 cm
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Weird that you can break a bone in half just by stretching your muscles, wasn't he consolidated?
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I dont believe real Paley patient would have his leg snap unless he was doing something against his advice. Doctor Paley is god of leg lengthening.
Very ignorant comment. Complications (including serious ones) can happen with an doctor and this proves it.
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The muscles surrounding the femurs are very powerful. Some people can lift insane amounts when doing squats. Having those powerful muscles exerting pressure on the leg in a weird way, it appears, can cause the bone to break.
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This is very very depressing news to hear. I've been rooting for Programdude for a long time now. His diary was my go-to guide when I was doing my femurs with Paley.
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But wasn't the bone significantly consolidated? Muscles can be sprained, but how can a stretch just break a bone?
Hope he gets better.
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Wow. Hope all goes well brother and you could recover fast !
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But wasn't the bone significantly consolidated? Muscles can be sprained, but how can a stretch just break a bone?
This. 1000 times this. I don't know how can a muscle stretch break a healthy bone. Maybe the Precice was somewhat damaged (for example due to early weight bearing) and it finally broke, snapping the bone? Just an idea...
My best wishes to him.
Hi dude. I also had a bad fracture while LLing and had to be reoperated. Im sure you will be OK. As a matter of fact, its better you have had a fracture at this stage of the process, and not before, which would have been much worse. Keep strong. You will be fine. We support you. :D
Hi musicmaker. What was the cause of the fracture? I'm considering internal for femurs and these news are really worrying to say the least.
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The bone was probably still hollow from rod removal and not completely healed where the rods used to be. Stretching may have been the needle that broke the camel's back, meaning that the unhealed bones were so weakened by other strenuous activities not related to stretching, that a simple stretch pushed the femur past its stress threshhold, making it snap.
Programdude, I hope you bounce back from this as well as possible and make a speedy and total recovery.
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Hey all. Thanks for all the support.
I am back home after a pretty awful experience with my leg being broken in half for 24 hours.
For two days prior to this incident I had felt some leg pain, but assumed it was muscular pain as I am long past weight training clearance dr. R gave me, and was given immediate clearance for walking etc. I was doing a few extra stretches to try and resolve this pain, and was standing in line at the store when I casually did a stretch using one arm. There was a huge snap audible to everyone around me, every muscle in my leg spasmed, and to my shock when I went to place the leg on the ground it bent the wrong way at the femur. Adrenaline caused me to be extraordinarily calm as I called a friend to bring me to the hospital, and asked the person besides me to please bring over the electric shopping cart.
I got to the front of the store then the pain and severity of the situation hit me like a truck. My friend arrived and had to carry me into the back seat. Upon arrival it took TWO HOURS to get pain medication as because my pain tolerance is high and I told them I had snapped is stretching, they didn't fully believe me. Of course once they saw the x ray they apologized profusely and medicated me. i had to be transferred to a higher calibur facility, and after a terrible night was operate on, with a rod being put back in my leg.
I was extremely nervous before PT and walking, worrying it would be extremely painful and that an important trip I had coming up would be off the table. Fortunately walking on crutches was ok, and I even walked some without them. I believe my muscular development and previous experience with these injuries is doing me a lot of favors. Currently it is actually my knee which hurts more than anything else for some reason. I probably hurt it by stepping on it funny while medicated on crutches.
The next few days/weeks I hope will be promising, as trauma settles down.
And to the fool talking about not listening to Paley's protocol, this has nothing to do with him. It was Dr. R, his former partner who removed my rods, and is responsible for this event.
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Also, there seems to be misinformation here- my precice rods have been removed for MONTHS. They were not in during this fracture.
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Do you know why this happened? It seemed as if you should have been fully to near consolidated by now. I mean it didn't happen to your other leg. Anyways how does this erect your recovery time now, any time frames for this? Stay strong dude.
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I have the same questions as Alu. And get well soon!
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Who is dr R.?
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dr. R removed my rods.
I am doing well other than crippling knee area pain. really not sure why it is so bad there of all places but holy cow does it hurt.
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Do you think the rod removal technique caused your femur to be unnaturally weak?
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Its possible. All I know is the theory was that it was just not mature enough.
they checked for infection etc. and it was not present.
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ROZBRUCH?
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yes
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Why did Rozbruch remove your rods? Why not Paley himself?
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Dr. R accepts insurance, and is considerably cheaper. As well as Paleys former partner. I never would have thought I'd end up here following his protocol.
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LOL dude! ;D
If any of you thinks that stretching a leg by 8 cm or something like that leave no mark on biomechanics and rigidity on a bone is delusional!
If bone is consolidated it is. Also if the rods have been removed months ago rather then days the bone already did what it could to get better.
Its not Dr. Rozbuch or Dr. Paley's fault but yours. Your body cannot handle that kinda procedure and be fine, you lost some of your bone strengths.
Lets be clear we dont do it because we need to, we do it because we want. LL is cosmetic procedure and we need to be realistic of its consequences.
That begin said I feel sorry for you and really hope you recover fast. Keep up good spirit.
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But that dr shouldnt have accepted to remove the nails so soon.
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You are missing the point.
I was given clearance immediately for walking etc. and of course encouraged to stretch as it is an essential component of recovery. I was given clearance for weight lifting after 6 weeks which I MORE than listened to and was cautious with even when returning to.
I listened to protocol given by dr. R. Obviously my body changed from this, but you are saying I should have expected normal walking with a stretch to break my FEMUR?? No, that is ridiculous.
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Its not programdude s fault
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Its not Dr. Rozbuch or Dr. Paley's fault but yours. Your body cannot handle that kinda procedure and be fine, you lost some of your bone strengths.
Losing a bit of strength and a bone snapping in two is quite different.
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Fractures are quite common after rod removal. Musicmaker case is more strange.
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Losing a bit of strength and a bone snapping in two is quite different.
This is my point. I have been the most patient person in the world as far as athletic recovery goes and have always expected changes/to not have a fast or total recovery.
But to say I should expect my bone to snap in half from a stretch after getting clearance for removal and weightbearing is outrageous and pretty offensive.
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Definitely it was not your fault. Your doctor should have cheked your bone condition better before remove your rodds and allow you to do some exercises
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People are mean when they say its programdudes fault
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hope you heal fast my friend!
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programdude, really sorry about your situation and having to deal with this LL complication so far after your original surgery and months after nail removal. completely agree that it's not his fault since he was following his doctor's recommendations completely. my guess is that the femur may have already been fractured from some activity based on the pain he had prior to the stretch that completely broke it. a similar thing happened to the guy that did quadrilateral lengthening with paley in the old forum. he had a stress fracture in his tibia months after the nail removal.
his exact words "Again, the femurs hardened really fast, and I was walking again in January, 2015, but when I started running (March), the femurs where fine, but I had a stress fracture of the left tibia. Admittedly, I was running really hard on the trail, rough terrain, but still, I was surprised they weren't completely solid by then. It probably has something to do with the bones needing to be loaded, stressed, in order to fully consolidate, and with the rods in place in the tibias, even though I was lifting and running, the rods were protecting the tibial from the stress, and I had to stress them with the rods out (and pushed it a touch too far) for them to fully consolidate."
anyways what's done is done. wishing you the best programdude- I know you'll make it through this man. please do let us know though if you ever figure out the cause and maybe how it could have been prevented.
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Maybe I needed a ton of walking and stuff before any running or lifting, even though both were kept very minimal. Crazy that it is such a balancing act of being sure to stress them to consolidate, but not the little extra that results in fractures.
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I have to ask really quickly, but are you considerably putting much more force into that leg compared to the other? I find it surprising how one was able to break like that while the other didn't.
Also before this incident how were you feeling in terms of recovery? I know it may not sound the most appropriate thing to say/consider but I'm just wanting to put this into a time frame and to also see now how much longer it's going to take you to recover from this.
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Get better programdude
How did they react åt the hospital when they found out you hade lenghthened your femur?
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I have to ask really quickly, but are you considerably putting much more force into that leg compared to the other? I find it surprising how one was able to break like that while the other didn't.
Also before this incident how were you feeling in terms of recovery? I know it may not sound the most appropriate thing to say/consider but I'm just wanting to put this into a time frame and to also see now how much longer it's going to take you to recover from this.
Im happy to answer any and all questions. Recovery felt good, other than walking still being a little off/stiff(abductors could use work). Running wasnt great, and felt pain, probably from the bone not being fully together, so I never would do that other than very brief bursts.
My right was always light years ahead of my left but nonetheless I wasnt warned of anything by Dr. R. My right Paley said was good for removal after just about 3 months, while my left took over 6 for dr. R to say it was good when it obviously wasnt. Sometimes things just don't go symmetrically. My right healed faster therefore I used it more therefore it healed more.
Everyone was professional about my lengthening, with a few being familiar with the rod I used even. The only part that infuriated me was when I was explaining the story in detail, but in so much pain she was saying she was having a hard time understanding me. She is the same one who apologized after they realized I wasnt wrong about breaking my femur, and they got me the pain meds.
My main advice is if you feel pain, even if it feels muscular- INVESTIGATE. This was a horrifying experience and if I didn't have the pain tolerance and build I do I can't even imagine how I would be coping. Plus this will be more expenses and opportunity costs. I am very lucky I have my savings and job type/arrangement, and even still this is all certainly taking its toll. Also fortunately my current girl knows about this operation or she would be very confused...
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Thanks for answering our questions. As always you've been a great help and window through this operation.
Considering this was really separate from the cosmetic surgery couldn't some insurance have covered this? Or was it really your savings?
Regarding your girl...ouch... how did you react when you told her you had done LL?
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She was one of the few I told about it when I went to get it done in the first place, before we were dating. She has always been ok with it.
And yes insurance is going to cover some of the costs of this. But it still probably won't be cheap.
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Do you know where in the femur it fractured? Was it below the lengthened portion or at the lengthened portion? I also planned on using Dr. R to remove my rods. Are you not recommending to use him for rod removal now? He seems cheaper than Dr. Paley for rod removal ($7,000 vs $15,000). Was that the exact cost or did insurance help pay for some of it?
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I think you need to be extra careful with him, since even one case like this is very troubling.
Mention that another patient had their leg snap while following his exact protocol when he is giving you clearance etc.
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It was near the top of the lengthening site that fractured
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I just walked across my house to make food and walked back to my room with no crutches. Not comfortable but I have my fingers crossed things will be good once trauma goes down
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Thanks for the information. Did you hear back from Dr. R or Dr. Paley on what the issue may have been? Were the rods removed too early or what it that you walked/exercised too soon after rod removal? Any tips on how other LLs getting their rods removed can avoid what happened to you?
Good luck with recovery. Once this fracture heals, your bones should be stronger than ever.
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I will need to get more information. I suspect my left leg just wasnt ready.
My advice is if you feel ANY pain to get x rays. What I felt felt like muscle pain, and it went from no pain to snapping really quick, but there are probably cases you could catch a problem with an x ray.
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I will need to get more information. I suspect my left leg just wasnt ready.
My advice is if you feel ANY pain to get x rays. What I felt felt like muscle pain, and it went from no pain to snapping really quick, but there are probably cases you could catch a problem with an x ray.
Was it a temporary pain or constant pain? The only time I feel muscle pain is when I overstretch my legs on purpose to try to regain flexibility. I was told to never apply force near the ankles when doing knee bends, but to always apply it closer to the knees. That's because the leg acts as a lever when you hold it by the ankles and thus can fracture your legs. When you were doing your left leg stretch, were you holding your leg near the foot?
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I forget the stretch that fractured it.. But thing is, it was really a very light mild stretch regardless.. It really must have been fractured signifigantly from walking for that to have done it in... I am considering contacting the store I was in to try and secure the footage of the incident to indicate this should it be relevant.
The pain was pretty constant.
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I forget the stretch that fractured it.. But thing is, it was really a very light mild stretch regardless.. It really must have been fractured signifigantly from walking for that to have done it in... I am considering contacting the store I was in to try and secure the footage of the incident to indicate this should it be relevant.
The pain was pretty constant.
Yea, if it's a constant pain, then I doubt that the stretch was the initial cause of the fracture. The constant pain sounds like you had a stress fracture on your bone prior to the stretch. And then the stretch just caused your bone to snap when it was already fractured. Dr. Paley had warned me to immediately contact him if I felt any constant sharp pains in a specific spot on the femur. It usually is a sign of a fracture, because it had happened to a former patient of his. That patient felt a sharp pain in a specific part, right where the bottom of the rod touched the femur. And then after lengthening the internal rod further, it snapped the leg. From my research online, it appears that stress fracture occur when you apply too much stress on the bone, which causes the bone to be reabsorbed into the body, not resting the bone enough to let to rebuild.
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So weird that I got a fracture then... I would walk a lot(for post ll standards) at a time occasionally, but then go a long while with eating/resting PLENTY. And I had done nothing that was particularly strenuous before the pain at all.. It occurred after a 15 minute walk and continued. But again this is long after I had even weight training clearing...
Again my advice is ANYONE experiencing ANY pain no matter how long post op should immediately get an x ray.
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How's everything going dude? Considering it's been awhile since your last update, how'd the healing with your fracture go? Also how's the other leg?
Cheers
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Other leg seems ok, and health wise my left leg is great now.
I still haven't gotten a bill for my surgery though, which I am kind of dreading. The ER visit with 600 after insurance and the ambulance 3700!!!
The financial assault is definitely getting me down, especially since I've had a few other unexpected expenses. Realistically I won't go broke or anything since I have good savings, but I am pretty bummed about everything. Yeah I am thrilled to be taller, but I just keep getting hammered by this decision.
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If you had enough money to play with you should have done the smaller amount over two portions.. I thought being a model and all that you would be anal about your proportions.
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Yea, hospital bills are killer. Hang in there.
But your ambulance bill sounds too high. With insurance, it should have covered most of it so that you only copay like $100. But even without insurance, the most an ambulance should be charging is about $1000 or so. $3700 sounds like a rip off unless the trip was very very far away like hundreds of miles away, since they charge around $10 per mile.
As for the surgery bill, your insurance should help cover most of it again, and your out-of-pocket expense is whatever deductible your insurance plan is. But if you don't have insurance, then the surgery would cost around $17,000 to $35,000. But hearing that you're getting ripped off for the ambulance, I wouldn't be surprised if they tried charging you $50,000 for the surgery.
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If you had enough money to play with you should have done the smaller amount over two portions.. I thought being a model and all that you would be anal about your proportions.
I've always been curious about this. I thought the average height for a male model was 6'2 yet Programdude was apparently doing modelling at 5'8?
Is there a different area of modelling for guys who are that height? One of my old flatmates did male modelling was 5'11 and told me he was one of the
shortest guys at his agency. What sort of modelling did you do Programdude?
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I've always been curious about this. I thought the average height for a male model was 6'2 yet Programdude was apparently doing modelling at 5'8?
Is there a different area of modelling for guys who are that height? One of my old flatmates did male modelling was 5'11 and told me he was one of the
shortest guys at his agency. What sort of modelling did you do Programdude?
I guess a shorter guy could be in a magazine for clothing or something that only required being photographed. Catwalk models are traditionally taller.
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Who cares guys. Models can come in all sizes. Especially fitness models. Look on Instagram there are tall dudes modeling and short ripped guys with just as much sponsors. Big world out there. It's not just runway modeling.
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About my insurance: It is generally very good. My theory is that perhaps they thought it was something that was non essential or that the hospital gave me the option to transfer myself another way. My insurance paid plenty for my hospital stay in NYC, even my medications for my lengthening procedure- So unless this is the MOST expensive ambulance ever I think there has to be a misunderstanding there... Also I have a max out of pocket expense with my insurance which should protect me.
As for why two surgeries didn't appeal to me: Insane expenses and opportunity costs lost. It would basically be 400k between the costs and time lost. The scarring is already pretty significant with femurs, though not awful. Tibia has even more scars plus they would be all up and down your legs.. its just too much. Also there is very bad complications and takes even more time to heal. Would it be nice to have done conservative amounts and have perfect proportions? Absolutely. But my proportions look normal now that I have some meat on my legs. Other than when I was less muscled in the legs and a girl was attempting a ridiculous position that involved me on my knees and her lower body in the air with her back against the bed- I've never had a comment on the length of my legs.
As far as my aesthetics I can't stress enough I have only had good feedback and am satisfied. I did well with women before but now they are outright reverent of me. Friends and family comment on how tall I am, and respect is significant. It is because of how happy I am with that aspect of things that I am not outright angry and bitter despite how poorly recovery and everything has gone. My journal should be a testament both to the risks of and the benefits of this procedure. They only question in my mind, is knowing what I know now- would I have lengthened slightly less?
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About my insurance: It is generally very good. My theory is that perhaps they thought it was something that was non essential or that the hospital gave me the option to transfer myself another way. My insurance paid plenty for my hospital stay in NYC, even my medications for my lengthening procedure- So unless this is the MOST expensive ambulance ever I think there has to be a misunderstanding there... Also I have a max out of pocket expense with my insurance which should protect me.
As for why two surgeries didn't appeal to me: Insane expenses and opportunity costs lost. It would basically be 400k between the costs and time lost. The scarring is already pretty significant with femurs, though not awful. Tibia has even more scars plus they would be all up and down your legs.. its just too much. Also there is very bad complications and takes even more time to heal. Would it be nice to have done conservative amounts and have perfect proportions? Absolutely. But my proportions look normal now that I have some meat on my legs. Other than when I was less muscled in the legs and a girl was attempting a ridiculous position that involved me on my knees and her lower body in the air with her back against the bed- I've never had a comment on the length of my legs.
As far as my aesthetics I can't stress enough I have only had good feedback and am satisfied. I did well with women before but now they are outright reverent of me. Friends and family comment on how tall I am, and respect is significant. It is because of how happy I am with that aspect of things that I am not outright angry and bitter despite how poorly recovery and everything has gone. My journal should be a testament both to the risks of and the benefits of this procedure. They only question in my mind, is knowing what I know now- would I have lengthened slightly less?
Yeah the costs are significant over 2 surgeries. I'm thinking that going with Dr Alex Monegal will side step the cost issue. Two of his surgeries are not much more than 1 of Paleys.
My health is priceless to me. If I'm going to do a surgery that may jeopardise my health or quality of life, then I'd rather fork out the extra money to ensure I have the quickest and most successful recovery.
Also, if you do two surgeries, each individual surgery will take less time if you are lengthening less on each individual portion.. Less distraction, less tissue stretching and less overall consolidation time.
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You're not wrong. The real cost for me will be my athleticism going with my plan vs. yours. Which within reason is a sacrifice I was and am willing to make. Do I want to get back to running well? Sure. But between the extra money and the scarring I was willing to have a smaller chance of that.
Also given how bad my recovery and experience has been even with Paley, I wouldn't like to think how it would go with someone "lesser".
Not saying your plan is bad. If you are ok with the scarring, confident in your dr., and have the money, you will probably be very happy.
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You're not wrong. The real cost for me will be my athleticism going with my plan vs. yours. Which within reason is a sacrifice I was and am willing to make. Do I want to get back to running well? Sure. But between the extra money and the scarring I was willing to have a smaller chance of that.
Also given how bad my recovery and experience has been even with Paley, I wouldn't like to think how it would go with someone "lesser".
Not saying your plan is bad. If you are ok with the scarring, confident in your dr., and have the money, you will probably be very happy.
I believe you said that you had the worst recovery out of several patients you knew?
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As far as my aesthetics I can't stress enough I have only had good feedback and am satisfied. I did well with women before but now they are outright reverent of me. Friends and family comment on how tall I am, and respect is significant. It is because of how happy I am with that aspect of things that I am not outright angry and bitter despite how poorly recovery and everything has gone. My journal should be a testament both to the risks of and the benefits of this procedure. They only question in my mind, is knowing what I know now- would I have lengthened slightly less?
LL is definitely a life altering experience. Sounds like you gain in some areas while you sacrifice other areas. Your courage is admirable because you took the plunge instead of settling for uncertainty, and "what ifs".
I'm curious on your opinion of lengthening less..... at what point in the lengthening process would you recommend stopping? Do you know of patients at Paley's that lengthened less and got the results you were hoping for?
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Yes, by far of the FEMUR patients I know I did the worst. I know of females doing tibias who did worse in some ways... But my leg snapped on half- hard to beat that lol.
I know that an older patient who did only around 6 CM did significantly better than me. Around that seems to be quite safe on femurs. However its honestly mostly a gamble. I know someone who was slightly shorter than me to begin with and did the same amount to great recovery though. But you need to ask yourself at what point is it not worth all the money and pain? Would 1 inch be worth it? Certainly not. Two? Noticeable, but hardly worth the downpayment on a house, no?
The last thing I would want is for someone to go through this, and still be physically compromised, spend the money, have the scarring, but not be satisfied with the result. Because I wasnt short to begin with, maybe I would have accepted just a little over 2 inches if I knew it would be complication free and my recovery would be expedient and 100%. But I feel I wouldn't be as happy with the height as I am now, which would beg the question if it was all worth it.
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But I feel I wouldn't be as happy with the height as I am now, which would beg the question if it was all worth it.
Well I guess time will tell how your overall recovery is.. And only then will the answer become apparent to you.
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Even with my freshly broken leg I can at least jog mediocrely. Walking endurance I recently found to be excellent as I did a lot of that every day for a few weeks recently, including hikes.
Sports aren't important to me, but running is to an extent so I would like to improve there. If sports are important to you I would strongly consider 2 inches of lengthening at the most based off my experiences. And if they are very important I wouldn't risk this at all.
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how are doing programdude?
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I'm doing alright. Still sorting out bills and such from my incident. Walking and mild jogging is alright.
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I'm doing alright. Still sorting out bills and such from my incident. Walking and mild jogging is alright.
Any pain from surgery left over?
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Not at all when stationary, and not really when walking. Some discomfort when jogging.
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Not at all when stationary, and not really when walking. Some discomfort when jogging.
Discomfort only on the fractured leg or both?
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Any improvements?
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Hi PD, I'm a pretty new user, and this is my first post. I've read a lot, much as a guest before even joining. I've read your entire diary. It was very helpful to me, and I wanted to say thanks for doing it! Feels like you might be done with posting in your diary, but if you would update us about your continued recovery that'd be great. Also, i had a question, could you try to describe or quantify in some way the amount of swelling which occurred with the original procedure when the precice rods were inserted? and how long does the swelling last before legs go back to normal pre-op size? Hope you are continuing to recover and improve back to normal or nearly normal.
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So in general I am doing well, and my leg that was fractured feels great, but now my non fractured leg has continuously felt sore on the side.
My paranoia from my left leg breaking has gotten to me, so I'll probably get it scanned. Its felt sore for a LONG time now though, as in months so I am guessing its not something serious, seeing as it basically as remained the same. One thought I've had is perhaps there was slight shortening on the left leg, which has been causing more pressure on the longer right leg? But i've got nothing to substantiate that or any other theory.
It isn't the constant or radiating pain accompanied by lots of cracks with movements I got from my left leg so thats certainly encouraging at least.
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Nice, glad to hear things with the fractured leg are going well. Any comments on how your new height has impacted you? Any stories or experiences would help.
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Sure. Again I am always somewhat reserved about sharing my experiences- Because they are VERY positive and I don't like the idea of making people feel worse or even more compelled towards this risky surgery.
Most importantly- I never even think about being short. If someone is taller, even a lot taller than me, it doesn't affect me at all. Everything feels "right".
Lots of girls have commented on it. Just the other night one said "you're, like, specifically tall". Despite not being 6 1, most people assume I'm around that.
Just in general respect has been amplified during any social interaction. Not that I did poorly in this regard before, but now theres no weakness.
And just overall my confidence and happiness with my proportions are on point.
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Sure. Again I am always somewhat reserved about sharing my experiences- Because they are VERY positive and I don't like the idea of making people feel worse or even more compelled towards this risky surgery.
Most importantly- I never even think about being short. If someone is taller, even a lot taller than me, it doesn't affect me at all. Everything feels "right".
Lots of girls have commented on it. Just the other night one said "you're, like, specifically tall". Despite not being 6 1, most people assume I'm around that.
Just in general respect has been amplified during any social interaction. Not that I did poorly in this regard before, but now theres no weakness.
And just overall my confidence and happiness with my proportions are on point.
In Paley's office you were measured "just shy of 5'8" if I remember correctly.. That sould put you at 172+/-.. Means that now you are 180cm?
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I should be just about 5 11 in actuality.
Also here are my femurs as of today:
http://i.imgur.com/a0Vup32.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/5cSJzmd.jpg
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I should be just about 5 11 in actuality.
Also here are my femurs as of today:
http://i.imgur.com/a0Vup32.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/5cSJzmd.jpg
Thanks for the update. Are you completely painless now?
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my broken leg funnily enough feels great. My right leg has some discomfort on the side, which is why I got the x rays to send to dr. R.
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my broken leg funnily enough feels great. My right leg has some discomfort on the side, which is why I got the x rays to send to dr. R.
Sorry if this is an awkward question, but do certain sex positions feel weird now with the longer femurs? For me, I'm having trouble with certain positions that I didn't have trouble with before, because I'm not as flexible as I used to be and my longer femurs put me in a higher position. I'm wondering if you had this same problem and fixed it or never had this problem at all.
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Sorry if this is an awkward question, but do certain sex positions feel weird now with the longer femurs? For me, I'm having trouble with certain positions that I didn't have trouble with before, because I'm not as flexible as I used to be and my longer femurs put me in a higher position. I'm wondering if you had this same problem and fixed it or never had this problem at all.
no more doggy style for you buddy
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no more doggy style for you buddy
Actually, doggy style is now better, because I'm hitting it from a higher angle. It's missionary and pronebone that are messed up now. Sad, because those were my two favorite.
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Actually, doggy style is now better, because I'm hitting it from a higher angle. It's missionary and pronebone that are messed up now. Sad, because those were my two favorite.
Depends on the angle of entrance... I know it sounds wierd, but in some vaginas the entrance is closer to the rectum than others.. So it will be better with women who have posterior pelvic tilt (The exact opposite of lordosis or duck-ass).
And missionary being more favorite than doggystyle???
Agree on pronbone though
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Depends on the angle of entrance... I know it sounds wierd, but in some vaginas the entrance is closer to the rectum than others.. So it will be better with women who have posterior pelvic tilt (The exact opposite of lordosis or duck-ass).
And missionary being more favorite than doggystyle???
Agree on pronbone though
After LL you'll just have to go on a fact finding mission. Explore as many vaginas as possible and report back.
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Doggy isn't great but mostly because of muscle tightness/weakness etc.
I think in a year once I build up my glutes etc. it'll feel great.
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Doggystyle is awesome for me. Pronebone and missionary seem to be just fine for me as well.
But my favorite is either doggy or me off the side of the bed with her legs cross or over my shoulders (not sure if there's a name for that lol)
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So it was still worth it even with a fractured leg? I think the mental toll on me thinking every ache is a sign my legs about to snap would be pretty draining.
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Thats kind of how I feel about my right leg right now, but I got it scanned for that reason. Once I have peace of mind on that front then yes, ultimately it is worth it since otherwise I would be eating myself up every day over my height. The real question is if there was a sweet spot for stopping where I would have been happy and not suffered complications, but at least this way I'll be happy once I've fought my way to recovery.
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Heard back today that the results of x'rays indicate my legs healed normally and without deformity.
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Congrats PD. Whats the status on your recovery? Walking? Light Running?
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I've been walking for awhile, can jog/run in bursts and do long hikes etc. Only thing that isn't ideal is long distance running which I haven't don't much of, partially because of concerns about further fractures.
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That's great to hear. How long did it take before you could walk on crutches and be somewhat self-sufficient?
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Walking on crutches doesn't take long at all. But the crutch phase lasted awhile for me, longer than it did for most. Its why I advise people be prepared to not be walking normally for a long while after surgery.
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Hey programdude,
I've been interested in LL for some time now and I really want to add 7-8cm to my height and have followed your story and read most of your thread. You seem like the type of dude I could ask these questions seeing as how you're into bodybuilding and had LL done.
I've looked into and read most of the relevant information, but what really concerns me right now is the ability to continue to work on my body in the gym after LL.
Especially upper body workouts.
How has LL effected you ability to weightlifting? Benching, squatting, deadlifting, etc?
Is it viable for someone to go through the motions and still be able to maintain/build a good body weightlifitng at the gym after LL?
Can you workout your legs still?
How do you legs look, muscle wise compared to your upper body now?
How long did it take you to really walk normally and go back to the gym?
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To answer- You can work out upper body fine. Once you have clearance to, working out legs isn't that bad, but squats aren't happening for a longgg time.
You will look fine for the most part after, my legs look like nice athletic legs, and that is with very light workouts compared to my upper body. I can and do workout legs, though obviously the fracture was a set back.
Normal walking can take awhile though, it certainly did for me.
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So what can you and can't you do at this point PD?
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So what can you and can't you do at this point PD?
I want to expand this sentence by asking more specific questions about what you can and can't do.
1. Can you do squats with your own weight?
2. Can you walk normally or do you feel that something push you back?
3. Can you jog?
4. Can you jog up and down from stairs without any pain?
5. Can you do "high knee hops"? https://gyazo.com/c99f5e6c777de0b76c7c984afd581a69
If no at any question, what prevents you from doing this?
/Svensk
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1. I can squat, but haven't. Certainly not with my bodyweight. I suspect it would be possible but weird because of biomechanics.
2. Walking is fine, even long distances and on hikes etc. Even two weeks after my fracture I went on vacation which involved lots of walking.
3. I can. Yesterday I actually had my best jogging session that felt great. My left leg bothered me after a bit/after but thats because of my still technically broken leg with the rod in it.
4. I have never really jogged up and down stairs in general. But yes I think it would be fine.
5. Yes. The only limiting thing right now is some pain in my broken leg after something rigorous like jogging. I suspect that will improve as my bone fully heals around the rod.
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Hey pd,have you ever considered sharing a proportion pic?
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1. I can squat, but haven't. Certainly not with my bodyweight. I suspect it would be possible but weird because of biomechanics.
2. Walking is fine, even long distances and on hikes etc. Even two weeks after my fracture I went on vacation which involved lots of walking.
3. I can. Yesterday I actually had my best jogging session that felt great. My left leg bothered me after a bit/after but thats because of my still technically broken leg with the rod in it.
4. I have never really jogged up and down stairs in general. But yes I think it would be fine.
5. Yes. The only limiting thing right now is some pain in my broken leg after something rigorous like jogging. I suspect that will improve as my bone fully heals around the rod.
Hi Programdude,
1. Why is your leg still broken so long after surgery, you fractured it right?
2. Is this common post surgery?
3. Could you elaborate a bit more on squatting, you said it's possible but would be weird, weird how?
4. Could you do squatting every week and incorporate it into your gym routine like normal?
5. Can you work your upperbody properly?
(As in do upperbody workout you feel obliged to do.)
6. How jacked are you? Are you able to do all the same upperbody and core work outs that you would have previously without any issues?
7. How bad was the pain and did you have to take alot of pain medication, or could you go without and opt for a temporary local anesthetic instead? (Addictive personally runs in my family)
Knowing what you know now would you lengthen more or less, or stay the same?
Thanks dude let me know
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How's the recovery going?
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Hi Programdude,
1. Why is your leg still broken so long after surgery, you fractured it right?
2. Is this common post surgery?
3. Could you elaborate a bit more on squatting, you said it's possible but would be weird, weird how?
4. Could you do squatting every week and incorporate it into your gym routine like normal?
5. Can you work your upperbody properly?
(As in do upperbody workout you feel obliged to do.)
6. How jacked are you? Are you able to do all the same upperbody and core work outs that you would have previously without any issues?
7. How bad was the pain and did you have to take alot of pain medication, or could you go without and opt for a temporary local anesthetic instead? (Addictive personally runs in my family)
Knowing what you know now would you lengthen more or less, or stay the same?
Thanks dude let me know
After a total fracture it is normal to take a year or so to heal up. Especially since it involved not fully healed bone to begin with.
Fracture post surgery is somewhat common from my understanding, though fracture as long after rod removal as mine was is not common.
your legs will be differently proportioned than they are meant to be for natural squatting. As such it is a weird motion. Not impossible but very weird and harder.
Upper body isn't affected at all, I would describe myself as quite jacked
You will need to take pain meds most likely. Be careful if this is a weakness.
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Pain today is under control so far, though I have yet needed to stand which is always the brutal part. Richard and I will get too that after I get some IV pain relief.
In some post on one of these sites, someone was talking about receiving no aftercare from Paley which simply isn't true. I emailed him about my hurt tibia and despite being out of the country he immediately emailed me back saying he was sending his primary PA up who investigated thoroughly and positioned my leg better than the nurses. Turns out that my operation was abnormally long due to having extremely hard bones and he believe at some point in the surgery someone had my leg pressed against something which caused pressure damage. Sucks, since it actually hurts as much as my straight up broken femurs, if not a bit more for some reason but after reviewing the picture his PA sent him he said it should recover shortly. Again this is proof that even with the best things can go wrong, fortunately this seems to be minor in the grand scheme of things.
Insurance is definitively paying for all but potentially one of my medications, which is still pending but I am really happy about. Be sure to talk to your planner about this, she is very proactive about getting things done the best and cheapest way for you. If your insurance isn't good be SURE to calculate these costs into your budget, they can be substantial.
Even though it will be expensive, from noon tomorrow until sunday night I will have a home aid the whole time. Not taking chances and need to evaluate just how messed up I'll be from the tibia issue but hope to drastically drop the number of hours needed and replace them with my less professional but welcome company before too long.
The bad news for me is that this is what is that tibia injury is making standing really really hard, since basically one of my tibias is in the same condition as the femurs, the good news for all of you is that this probably won't happen unless an accident occurs during your surgery which isn't likely since the PA made it sound like my bones were very uncommonly tough and they had never seen it happen before. In other words your experience standing should be less painful.
Tony came up today and we did a full 1mm lengthening in one sitting. No pain at all and the device couldn't be easier to use. In the future this will be broken up into four sessions- However these need to be done before midnight without fail.
In retrospect about yesterday, now that I am less drugged and not in a pain induced daze, the main things to take away to enhance your experience is to:
1. Be sure you are heavily medicated by the time the epidural has worn off.
2. Ask for assistance with going to the bathroom well in advance, not much is worse than being in severe pain on the verge of exploding in your wheelchair while knowing you need to fight against your legs to sit in an uncomfortable chair that is probably poorly adjusted which will leave your legs painfully high. Seriously don't do this to yourself.
3. Ask about IV medication asap, this made me go from literally shaking and heaving from pain to able to sleep comfortably. The nurses may not recommend it so ask yourself. I was very poorly allowed to take only one percocet after the epi, where the more logical management would have saved me lots of agony and enabled me to begin lengthening yesterday.
4. Similar to point 2, be sure to ask for medication as needed. The timing is just a recommendation as nurses will note, their job is to stay ahead of the pain and not chase it. The first nurses I had didn't give me this impression but the later ones have been very explicit about this.
5. Ask for your PT(in my case richard) to help you move. My desperate move onto the commode for the first time was urgent so I had no time to ask for richard and she was not much of a help at all. The nurses dont always have a gauge on how ridiculous a request of theirs is, so when she wanted me to move from the commode to the bed I asked for Richard who hoisted me up with a rope. Later when Richard wasn't around for trip number 2 the nurse wanted me to stand but I told her to bring in another nurse which made the process a lot easier.
6. The nurses may try and give you stool softener after your first movement. I highly advise against this and (most) of the nurses will agree because after you get it out the first time, you do not want to have diarrhea or even regular bowel movements. Using the commode even twice a day will wear on you- even sitting on the commode when you're already there gets extremely painful after awhile however some nurses won't take this into consideration, or realize you had a movement, or will ask you, and if you are drugged you may lightheadedly accept assuming its good since a nurse is offering. Fortunately I thought better of this despite my mind set.
7. To summarize, the nurses really don't always know best and sometimes you do need to instruct them as per your needs, which can be hard when you aren't feeling so hot, but be wiling to abuse the call button when the going gets rough.
Hopefully these posts are helping inform some of you guys considering, or heading into LL.
hey man
what did you insurance covered?
also im lost with your point #6, can you please explain in other words?
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hey man
what did you insurance covered?
also im lost with your point #6, can you please explain in other words?
never mind, i just came across the next post and (insurance covered all meds)
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Percocet might do the trick out of the hospital but NOT in any way shape or form after the epi is out. It was honestly irresponsible of her to give me so little. I told the anesthesiologist about it and his eyes bugged out of his head. The shock from going from epi to nothing is downright insane. I've never had so little control over my vocalizations. Now however I am pretty good even on minimal medication. I recommend keeping your feet moving to keep circulation going and to stretch and bend your knees often. It hurts but gets easier. The day after the epi comes out, a challenge I did was to rotate and get my legs over the side of the bed by myself(this is much harder than it sounds pre op my friend) and grab the bar above you and stand as straight as possible. I did that a few times and have been stretching my legs as much as possible. I honestly am really bummed out about the tibia since it is really the main thing holding me back right now and I think I would barely need help in a couple days without that limitation. I was however very pleased with Dr. Paleys prompt concern and that he treated it as a serious potentially grave issue in his response(within five minutes of reading my email his top PA was in the room). Its funny, at least three people here have likened him to jesus.
As far as the girls, honestly just sign up to some dating sites or tinder. I am shocked at how many are lining up to either visit or live in/take care of me lol. Getting a little something something(even though my performance will be at an all time rock bottom) will be very nice. Heck even just having a few different ones to cuddle up with and keep the romantic game somewhat alive is more than welcome.
Debi with United Nursing Services came by and made me feel very good about the whole home aid process, giving me her personal cell number if I need anything. Heck she even offered me a complimentary dinner date over sushi when I am feeling a bit better. I'll be sure to let everyone knows how this part goes.
As of now my pain meds are basically not in my system and I actually don't feel awful, even during my standing exercises which yesterday would have had me screaming and passing out. I will be taking basic percocets and seeing if that can sustain me for today. If so I am in very good shape for my discharge tomorrow. Regardless I know the worst has passed, and once my tibia is healed I will be eagerly forcing myself to be mobile.
You will feel like stiff hell, but force yourself to move and you will be thankful for it guys.
A guy in other post mentioned that he was still hooked up to the epidural for several days after the surgery so he couldn't feel he's legs at all, from your postings i think that wasn't the case with your surgery, any idea why?
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My epidural was in for a few days. Once it was removed was when things got brutal.
By point number 6, what I mean is they will give you a medication called stool softener if you want it, which makes you need to go to the bathroom to try and help you go once the epidural is out and youre ready to go. This is a bad idea, because in the first days going to the bathroom is HORRIBLE, both difficult and painful, and the softener will make it easy to go, but then might make you go more after the first.
As a general note, I am still around, but as so many others, as my recovery continues I am less active on the forums. I still care about helping people through the process, so dont hesitate to post questions in the thread or PM me. I think its best to ask what you can here, because that way it is a resource for others who may have the same questions.
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In terms of recovering, it's been quite a long time now even considering the fracture. I was wondering if you've made a full recovery yet. Hope so :)! If not, what's still wrong or bothering you?
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I still wouldnt say full at all. But thats mainly with running, and a lot of that is because of how the hardware in my leg feels. Once its removed we will see where things are. However, in terms of walking and hiking etc. I am totally comfortable and efficient.
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I still wouldnt say full at all. But thats mainly with running, and a lot of that is because of how the hardware in my leg feels. Once its removed we will see where things are. However, in terms of walking and hiking etc. I am totally comfortable and efficient.
what about walking and enjoying life? can people notice something unusual?
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Hey PD, i've just went through your entire diary.. I have a question for you: do you think that if you had lengthened "only" 5.5 - 6cm you would have gotten far less complications?
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what about walking and enjoying life? can people notice something unusual?
No one notices anything. My walking is normal, hiking, and doing leg exercises all normal. Jogging looks fairly normal albeit the hardrware doesnt let me go long. My scars are mild, even after sex no one ever notices except for very consistent long term partners. People I havent seen in awhile comment on my height, but no one has commented on the leg length, other than one partner contorting into an outrageous sexual position. For everything other than activities I didnt even really do pre LL(jogging/running/sports), I am fine.
I think 5-6 would have cut the recovery down by at least half and avoided any complication. However personally I dont think it would have been worth it all just for that.
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No one notices anything. My walking is normal, hiking, and doing leg exercises all normal. Jogging looks fairly normal albeit the hardrware doesnt let me go long. My scars are mild, even after sxx no one ever notices except for very consistent long term partners. People I havent seen in awhile comment on my height, but no one has commented on the leg length, other than one partner contorting into an outrageous sxxual position. For everything other than activities I didnt even really do pre LL(jogging/running/sports), I am fine.
I think 5-6 would have cut the recovery down by at least half and avoided any complication. However personally I dont think it would have been worth it all just for that.
its great news, so we know you had some difficult couple months or more, but when did you start walking normaly after surgery?
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People have asked that, but I really cant remember. It is such a slow ease into it. I cant remember a specific moment. For a bit, throughout the day I would feel it, then not, then feel it then not, and eventually that phase just ended. I can say it took me forever though.
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I mean it took you more than 8 months?
Anyways you had a green light to enjoy your height, be proud of yourself, you had balls to go through this gambling surgery ;)
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It has been worth it, despite the immense physical time and monetary costs. However there are some who would have been devastated/ruined by the insane down time, so as I always say prepared for the absolute worst.
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A lot of Paley femur patients when you were there. You mentioned several consolidated faster than you and were walking soon after that right? Do you know anyone who actually was back to sports, not just jogging a few miles, but like playing soccer or skiing after only 6-8 months? That would be nice and it's a goal of mine, but one I'm starting to think is only for a lucky few despite my rehab being off to a good start in most ways.
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The ones I'm aware of who play some level of sports(not professional), only did 6 or so CM. Thats not to say it isnt possible with more, just that those are the people I know who played sports.
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At the beginning you said that you were almost 5 8", exactly were you 172 cm( some mm less than 5 8")?
A little doubt
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Measurements varied beforehand. Some said 5 8, others said slightly below. So my exact starting isnt known. but it was 5 8 tops
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A lot of Paley femur patients when you were there. You mentioned several consolidated faster than you and were walking soon after that right? Do you know anyone who actually was back to sports, not just jogging a few miles, but like playing soccer or skiing after only 6-8 months? That would be nice and it's a goal of mine, but one I'm starting to think is only for a lucky few despite my rehab being off to a good start in most ways.
If that's honestly your goal, you better be stretching 30min - 1 hr a day and that doesn't include leg work outs.
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If that's honestly your goal, you better be stretching 30min - 1 hr a day and that doesn't include leg work outs.
True that
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True that
It's been a long time since your LL. Do you still find you need to stretch daily?
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Theres some tightness in my right leg in particular sometimes, but I havent felt that need for a longgggg time. I could go weeks without stretching if I really wanted to without any real issues.
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Theres some tightness in my right leg in particular sometimes, but I havent felt that need for a longgggg time. I could go weeks without stretching if I really wanted to without any real issues.
1- whats the real cause of fracture you had? it suppose to be fully consolidate and Paley gave you green light right?
2- Do you think the accident is the reason you're not fully recovered yet?
3- should you stretch for ever after fully recovered? or you can stop it like a normal person again?
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Hard to say about the cause. No one really knows since it happened very long after the rod removal. Just really bad luck of somehow a small fracture forming and growing huge. Yes it is probably a contributor to why I am not fully recovered but even if it didnt happen I dont think I'd be running at full capacity. The rest is fine but LL affects running quite a bit in my opinion/case when you do this much.
You should keep stretching I would say, but in my case I dont have to. Like I said I can go weeks without being any worse off. I still do it out of habit pretty often but there are gaps where it falls out of my mind because I feel normal.
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Hi programdude,
I read all your diary, thanks for the huge contribute to the community.
Since I'm about the same height as you were prior to surgery (174 cm), and my goal height is the same you obtained, I have a specific question for you:
How did your "social perception" change with your new height?
I mean, do you think people treat you differently because of your new height? I'm talking about everything, from women to peers, coworkers, strangers, friends..
I saw you've already written something about women, but I'd be grateful if you could expand a bit more on all this.
Thanks, cheers.
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Yes it is probably a contributor to why I am not fully recovered but even if it didnt happen I dont think I'd be running at full capacity. The rest is fine but LL affects running quite a bit in my opinion/case when you do this much.
I didn't fracture my leg again and I'm not running at full capacity, too. So you're probably right.
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Hi programdude,
I read all your diary, thanks for the huge contribute to the community.
Since I'm about the same height as you were prior to surgery (174 cm), and my goal height is the same you obtained, I have a specific question for you:
How did your "social perception" change with your new height?
I mean, do you think people treat you differently because of your new height? I'm talking about everything, from women to peers, coworkers, strangers, friends..
I saw you've already written something about women, but I'd be grateful if you could expand a bit more on all this.
Thanks, cheers.
Been awhile but I haven't forgot my brothers on this journey.
As I have mentioned before I always have some hesitation laying out the benefits in society from the operation because I know that comments like that can enforce someones dysphoria. But I can definitely say there is a change- People will use comments like "carry myself well" and various things that they previously wouldn't have. People generally regard me with more gravity and as being intimidating. Women definitely note and like it referring to me as generally "big", saying they feel safe, and overtly commenting on height. It is very distinct, though a part of it could be attributed to the confidence of being a certain stature as well.
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Been awhile but I haven't forgot my brothers on this journey.
As I have mentioned before I always have some hesitation laying out the benefits in society from the operation because I know that comments like that can enforce someones dysphoria. But I can definitely say there is a change- People will use comments like "carry myself well" and various things that they previously wouldn't have. People generally regard me with more gravity and as being intimidating. Women definitely note and like it referring to me as generally "big", saying they feel safe, and overtly commenting on height. It is very distinct, though a part of it could be attributed to the confidence of being a certain stature as well.
I get the carry myself well a lot as well. Also the "big" comments (But I attribute it to having a large framed torso).
Surely these comments come from the fact that you don't feel insecure about your height anymore.
About the fact that girls like your height, it's because of the height hihi
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I get the carry myself well a lot as well. Also the "big" comments (But I attribute it to having a large framed torso).
Surely these comments come from the fact that you don't feel insecure about your height anymore.
About the fact that girls like your height, it's because of the height hihi
TIBIKE, how tall are you now and how much did you lengthen? what technique did you use?
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I get the carry myself well a lot as well. Also the "big" comments (But I attribute it to having a large framed torso).
Surely these comments come from the fact that you don't feel insecure about your height anymore.
About the fact that girls like your height, it's because of the height hihi
its definitely two pronged. It is hard to compare since I had a robust sex life pre op. In my case its less about receptiveness and more about the comments but I'd be curious to hear other perspectives.
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Been awhile since posting here. Just wanted to say I am doing well, I do still definitely get discomfort from the rod from the fracture, but thats unrelated to LL pain aside from the fact the LL caused it, obviously. In other words when I get the rod removed I will be 100% for all non intensive activities. Running time will tell but I suspect that will be pretty good without the discomfort from the rod.
I will say it is crazy to reflect on the whole process now, from very healthy before the surgery, to unbelievably crippled for so long, to great condition to the fracture, to where I am now. If taking the rod out has no complications I can say its been a long and wild but worthwhile venture. Aside from the day of and after long walks, I no longer even think of LL, which is where I think a lot of people want to ultimately be on these forums, and why so many eventually vanish after recovery. I can say confidently however I'll never totally forget this community, even if the spans between checkins grow longer.
I get lots of messages but posting in this thread is really the best way for me to reply and will also give info to other people.
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I wanted to say thank you for this forum post it has helped me tremendously. I am probably the same height as you now and around 5.5 cm lengthening, i will definitely try to stop at 6 or 6.5. Not sure if going for the 8 cm is worth the extra downtime and risk of complications...but i definitely understand the take on the risk/reward ratio pre op. Glad to see you're doing better, no doubt you'll be 100%.
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Just be safe my friend. I think most people eventually will be normal after awhile, but even with great health and work ethic it could be many years like in my case.
My main hope with people who undergo this surgery is A. No permanent complications and B. Completely being over their height dysphoria.
I can say the absolute removal of any displeasure with my height and proportions has been worth it, I just hope everyone else who has read me diary and taken the plunge can achieve the same.
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Do you think that the amount you lengthened has anything to do with your current aches?
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I still wouldnt say full at all. But thats mainly with running, and a lot of that is because of how the hardware in my leg feels. Once its removed we will see where things are. However, in terms of walking and hiking etc. I am totally comfortable and efficient.
How is your running now? Has the hardware been removed? Do you think that your running would have been better if your tibias had been lengthened by 5 cm or a little less instead?
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I've just finished reading your entire diary, Programdude! Thanks so much for taking the time and sticking with the community for 3+ years now.
I took a lot of notes along the way, so I'll try to give back to the community by answering the question about sleep based on what you wrote along the journey:
As for sleep, the bad news is, as my diary indicates, sleep is the worst part of all this and never gets better. ZZZquill helped. Read through my thread and you will pick up some things here and there. It can be brutal.
Sleep was generally pretty bad for everyone distracting femurs, but not tibias, and it improved radically once the distraction phased stopped:
- "Nights are somewhat hard for me(my Hong Kong LL'er friend has reported the same), as discomfort has me waking up every hour or two. Mornings are also somewhat tough because of this, being weak bodied and ill rested making it hard to find the motivation"
- "I've talked to my LL friends and they report similar sleeping issues."
- [Hong Kong guy] "like mostly everyone else reports sleeping issues"
- "Its not the actual hour of day that makes sleeping difficult, just that sleeping in general is rough."
- "every single person I've met doing femurs has a terrible time sleeping (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.msg16942#msg16942). The people I've met doing tibias sleep like a rock for 8-10 hours"
- "Again- This is a very up and down experience but you do eventually start to settle into it, getting used to hellish nights of poor sleep and functioning off that and getting into the rhythm of lengthening, napping, eating, PT."
What helped:
- strenuous exercise makes sleep easier
- "Slept well again thanks to my new/good friend valium"
- "Best thing I've found is taking an Ultracet and it makes it easier to find a sleeping position that doesn't cause me to be uncomfortable."
- zzzquil helped, but not much (easier to fall asleep after waking up). 6 weeks in, still ty sleep
- Try benadryl?
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Hi all,
I definitely feel like I should participate here. I am pretty happy with my LL experience so far but I need to admit once again pain is coming back at night. I remember that after I came back home from Spain (except in the flight coming over), I did not experience any pain, however, pain has kicked back in once again since this week
But now I feel the pain is coming from the muscle. Not long ago tramadol used to work like a charm but somehow now is not working so well. Honestly, I can't wait to be over this and have some proper sleep.
Cheers!!!
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Problems with sleep are only during lengthening phase or even after, till full consolidation lets say?
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Hi all,
I definitely feel like I should participate here. I am pretty happy with my LL experience so far but I need to admit once again pain is coming back at night. I remember that after I came back home from Spain (except in the flight coming over), I did not experience any pain, however, pain has kicked back in once again since this week
But now I feel the pain is coming from the muscle. Not long ago tramadol used to work like a charm but somehow now is not working so well. Honestly, I can't wait to be over this and have some proper sleep.
Cheers!!!
Get it checked.
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Problems with sleep are only during lengthening phase or even after, till full consolidation lets say?
Hi bodybuilder,
Do you think pain may persist even after the lengthening stage ? Although my pain is 1 or 2/10 at the most, I would not like to have it after the lengthening phase!
Maybe as a word of advice to others, I have noticed pain goes away when I exercise my leg. The problem is that I work in the mornings and waking up in the middle of the night to exercise my leg is not very nice, I guess this is some of the extra price you need to pay should you wanna be taller.
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I've had LITERALLY 0 pain, and i mean 0. since 2 weeks after operation...sleeping was weird the first month but now i sleep even too much...It's with fitbone and i have lengthened 6 +. Bodybuilder you should be more than fine :) Walk in the park if you're young i guess?
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Hi bodybuilder,
Do you think pain may persist even after the lengthening stage ? Although my pain is 1 or 2/10 at the most, I would not like to have it after the lengthening phase!
Maybe as a word of advice to others, I have noticed pain goes away when I exercise my leg. The problem is that I work in the mornings and waking up in the middle of the night to exercise my leg is not very nice, I guess this is some of the extra price you need to pay should you wanna be taller.
Usually pain stops after lengthening withe externals but I am not sure about internals. I think it will be the same but Idk.
Personally I had almost zero pain even when I was lengthening. My LL experience was painless except from the first 2-3 days after initial surgery.
Of course I was very young (23) and when I'll do ly second LL I'd be about 31-2 but still you are not old for that surgery at that age and human body heals fast till 40-45 so I hope I won't experience much pain with internals.
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I've had LITERALLY 0 pain, and i mean 0. since 2 weeks after operation...sleeping was weird the first month but now i sleep even too much...It's with fitbone and i have lengthened 6 +. Bodybuilder you should be more than fine :) Walk in the park if you're young i guess?
Hi InferiorityComplex, Congratulations on your progress. did you do Femurs ? Who with?
I'm happy to hear you're sleeping well since after week 2. I'm scheduled for January 2018 with Dr. Mahboubian and concerned about sleep after surgery. From what I hear, pain is present with internal femurs until week 2, then it seems almost non existent.
Do you have a diary ? I tried looking for one.
All the best.
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To be clear the aches I have are from the fact I broke my leg again and had to get a rod put in lol. I am convinced if not for the hardware I would be 100% for walking, as most of the time I currently am unless the hardware area is irritated, and 85-90% on running.
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To be clear the aches I have are from the fact I broke my leg again and had to get a rod put in lol. I am convinced if not for the hardware I would be 100% for walking, as most of the time I currently am unless the hardware area is irritated, and 85-90% on running.
When does the rod come out? Is the pain the hip area due to the nail?
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I spent a lot of time in the pool. Almost no time walking in crutches as I was told it wasnt safe- until much later Paley told me it was ok and that the others were wrong.
PD, how come Paley's team of physical therapists hasn't told you that you can walk with crutches during the lengthening phase? That seems like a huge oversight.
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Hi Programdude
I am new on the forum. This is my post. I am 21 year old male that is 5'4.5, although I say 5'5 because it just sounds better. I am looking to do internal femurs with Dr.Paley within 5 years if possible. I'm just wondering how you have been holding up so long after the inital operation. An update would be super helpful.
Cheers.
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Hey PD,
how are you now?
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Hey PD! I just had my nails removed with Dr. Roz. I read your diary several times. When you broke your bone while stretching (I think it was 2 months post nail removal), how did you know your bone had snapped? I'm asking as a precausion because some people break their bones and don't know their bones are broken for a long time (until the pain suddenly hits them at once). I'm obviously going to talk to Dr. Roz tomorrow but I want to make sure that my leg pain is not from a broken bone.
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regards
In Colombia we do the same procedure at a lower value, with the nail precice.
I leave you my whatsapp (+57) 3193784166
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I read your diary several times. When you broke your bone while stretching (I think it was 2 months post nail removal), how did you know your bone had snapped?
Are you sure you've read the diary? He had INTENSE PAIN when the bone suddenly snapped.
You're probably looking for his post Early signs of a stress fracture (http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=2984.msg45834#msg45834).
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Hello all! Have been getting a steady stream of PM's so I figured I'd post something public to keep the community as informed as possible.
I am honestly at the point where the LL dust has pretty much totally settled, hence being on less and less. Take it from me LL goes from being this all consuming thing that defines your life and days to a blip in your past. Theres comes a point where you at your new height is just how people know you, as opposed to it being anything aberrant. No one new you meet will have any idea etc. even in my case where, as I mentioned, I had that stress fracture ages ago and (occasionally) the hardware still in there irritates the area and can cause discomfort.
I will try to roll through a few questions before leaving some comments for people considering surgery(also I will check back now and then in the coming days/weeks to try and answer questions.
To answer the most recent question, it was EXTREMELY obvious when my bone fractured. I had been in immense pain, applied pressure thinking I would "stretch" and then my femur snapped in two which is an experience really beyond description. My muscles immediately spasmed and the adrenaline was so incredibly strong that I had to put my leg to the ground and watch it bend three times before realizing fully what had happened. It was a hellish experience especially because they refused to administer me pain meds initially because- Get this- I wasn't crying(even though my leg was visibly bent). Let me tell you once adrenaline wears off its an all around intolerable experience, definitely something you would immediately realize once the first few seconds of shock dissipate.
I don't mean to speak ill of Dr. R but from my disastrous experience I would er on the side of being a little more conservative with physical activity than he permits. At the end of the day if I was at the rod removal phase again, I'd still favor the significant savings going with Dr. R than Paley, despite maintaining my perspective of Paley being the only choice I considered when it came to the surgery itself.
As for early identification of a stress fracture(since like I mentioned a full fracture isn't going to be missed), a steadily growing aching radiating pain that feels like a deep muscle pain is the best way I can recollect/put it. It does NOT feel usual or normal so please don't take that as me saying to run to the hospital any time your a bit sore- But if you feel something like that which doesn't get better, and steadily worsens over a semi significant period of time you owe it to yourself to get it checked out unless you want to be wheeling yourself out of a market with a bent leg program dude style.
Great question about Paleys team and him having a miscommunication. Its a distant memory at this point but from what I recall people were always slightly walking on egg shells in terms of adhering to Paley's decrees. I remember Mike being visibly distraught and vocalizing to me displeasure about the kids not being allowed to use the exercise bikes abruptly, considering it was barely any stress compared to other things they were allowed to do. I think for whatever reason certain people thought a similar no crutch policy was instituted either for me or for cosmetic LL'ers in general. However when I mentioned it to Paley he didn't have even the slightest reservations/didnt seem like he thought he had ever given such a decree. Something to remember is the PT team there works with a vast array of cases, its entirely possible it was a matter of someone getting someone else's limits mixed up with mine.
That being said it was certainly a huge oversight as you put it and I would strongly advise you to always maintain contact with Paley. Even though he can be terse, shooting him an email if you think staff are wrong about something or you have questions/concerns is ALWAYS the right thing to do. Be proactive, you are paying an insane amount of money for his service so be sure to make use of it.
As for questions about how I am post LL, the answer is great! Like I alluded to earlier I am farrr past the phase of LL even being on my mind in my day to day. Things in my personal life have been going swimmingly and as far as my physical post LL experience things are good. I mentioned the irritation from the hardware that was put in after my fracture, which is the only thing that occasionally is out of the norm with my left leg. My right experiences none of that, and it is a fairly simple operation to get the hardware out. The only reason for my postponing it was that it is something that only even occurs seldomly and is usually minor and I was working towards some financial goals which I've now achieved, which means I plan on getting it out fairly soon at which point aside from sports performance(which as people here know was never a priority for me) I'll be 100%.
As far as my height dysphoria it is completely and utterly gone to the point that it seems almost preposterous that I ever had it. Even if I am standing next to someone incredibly tall its irrelevant, I simply feel "right" at this height.
I believe I've mentioned this before but I am always wary about expressing my satisfaction with the surgery too strongly, because I know that could exacerbate someones dysphoria depending on their disposition.
I think it is essential when evaluating if LL is right for you, that if you are using my testimonial to really get a feel on if your head in general was at a similar place as mine before the surgery. I say that because while I had a strong dysphoria, it truly was dysphoria, whereas I have certainly seen some people in the community that I honestly believe if they magically grew three inches would still be discontent, or who are channeling their general frustrations in life and attributing its to their height. Yes certain elements in your life are going to improve post LL but its not something that will magically fix all your problems. I cannot imagine the depression that spending the money and time on this surgery and enduring its pain as well as any complications, babe them physical or in your personal life, only to not feel any different at the end of it.
I really feel for people with body image issues, and having immersed myself in the community both online and in person I would never want to steer people in the wrong direction. That being said I would also not want to ever deter someone who genuinely was in my head space pre LL from getting it. Despite my words of warning I had that horrific complication and a very slow recovery and paid for everything from my hard earned cash and I still am fully satisfied with it, and everyone I personally met and stayed in touch with have been complication free to my knowledge, and are also satisfied. That being said a large chunk of them had a parent bankrolling it(lucky I know!) which obviously takes away a huge barrier.
That was far lengthier than anticipated but I just wanted to address some things and check back in with everyone. Like I said I am happy to try and answer questions. I also plan on re-reading my diary and perhaps commentating on it now that I'm removed from it by a few years in the effort to make my journal as informative a tool as it can be to those mulling over or diving into the big decision!
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Wow. I love seeing a big update from LL veteran regulars. I used to follow your diary (along with DoingItForMe's and Penguinn's) religiously when I was going LL to compare the experiences (should I be stretching more, should I be feeling tightness/pain, yet, etc).
Take it from me LL goes from being this all consuming thing that defines your life and days to a blip in your past. Theres comes a point where you at your new height is just how people know you, as opposed to it being anything aberrant. No one new you meet will have any idea etc.
very relatable. "Blip in your past" is an apt way to describe it.
To answer the most recent question, it was EXTREMELY obvious when my bone fractured. I had been in immense pain, applied pressure thinking I would "stretch" and then my femur snapped in two which is an experience really beyond description. My muscles immediately spasmed and the adrenaline was so incredibly strong that I had to put my leg to the ground and watch it bend three times before realizing fully what had happened. It was a hellish experience especially because they refused to administer me pain meds initially because- Get this- I wasn't crying(even though my leg was visibly bent). Let me tell you once adrenaline wears off its an all around intolerable experience, definitely something you would immediately realize once the first few seconds of shock dissipate.
Thanks for answering my question. I had my nail removal in late March with Dr. Roz. I was really worried about that happening. The part about them refusing pain meds was a nightmare scenario for me. Thankfully they prescribed me some opioids (post surgery pain). I never used a single one. I was saving them for a scenario like the one you described. I flushed them down the toilet last month.
As far as my height dysphoria it is completely and utterly gone to the point that it seems almost preposterous that I ever had it. Even if I am standing next to someone incredibly tall its irrelevant, I simply feel "right" at this height.
Also very relatable. This used to be the only thing I thought about and it consumed me. It was really exhausting. Now its completely irrelevant.
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Wow, Purushrottam and ProgramDude coming back to share their thoughts. It is a good time to be on this forum. I really believe the elimination of dysphoria that PD and Purush experienced comes from going below average (honestly not even that short) to firm average-above average. It's close to the bell curve so the percentiles jumped is very large with the addition of three inches completely changing perspective. In the same vein, I think it's also why yellowspike struggled at first with dysphoria after the surgery because although 5'5 to 5'8 is a great jump, It's still firmly below average in the end, so the main social category doesn't undeniable change. In general, especially in america, he was still a short dude after the procedure, so dysphoria lingered. On the bright side, the last few posts on his diary suggest that he accepted and enjoyed his new height in the end.
That's my analysis that nobody asked for. It seems 5'7-5'8 seem to benefit most from the journey due to the complete social category shift.
Obviously, that doesn't benefit me because I am 5'4 flat and I only want to go for 2 inches due to worries on proportion and recovery. It's fine because I just wanted to be closer in height to my father anyway and feel more in line with some of my ethnic friends.
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I think it is essential when evaluating if LL is right for you, that if you are using my testimonial to really get a feel on if your head in general was at a similar place as mine before the surgery. I say that because while I had a strong dysphoria, it truly was dysphoria, whereas I have certainly seen some people in the community that I honestly believe if they magically grew three inches would still be discontent, or who are channeling their general frustrations in life and attributing its to their height. Yes certain elements in your life are going to improve post LL but its not something that will magically fix all your problems. I cannot imagine the depression that spending the money and time on this surgery and enduring its pain as well as any complications, babe them physical or in your personal life, only to not feel any different at the end of it.
I really feel for people with body image issues, and having immersed myself in the community both online and in person I would never want to steer people in the wrong direction. That being said I would also not want to ever deter someone who genuinely was in my head space pre LL from getting it. Despite my words of warning I had that horrific complication and a very slow recovery and paid for everything from my hard earned cash and I still am fully satisfied with it, and everyone I personally met and stayed in touch with have been complication free to my knowledge, and are also satisfied. That being said a large chunk of them had a parent bankrolling it(lucky I know!) which obviously takes away a huge barrier.
Amazing to see two LL veterans drop in multiple years after their operations. For future LLers like myself, times like these give us a rare glimpse into the long term outlook of this procedure.
I want to start off by saying thank you to both programdude and purushrottam for sharing their experiences and diaries with the community, I've read both of your diaries twice over and gleaned several valuable insights along the way. I'm actually sitting alone in my room at Homewood Suites in WPB, my operation for bilateral Stryde femurs with Paley is this Tuesday. Knowing that both of you were in my shoes before this is a huge motivator. You've both shared the good, the bad, and the ugly of this journey and I feel way more informed because of it.....THANK YOU!
@programdude a couple of questions:
1) How did you transition back to normal life post op 3 inches taller in the context of friends, family and coworkers? I know you mentioned you came clean to your roommates as they noticed the height gain and you told your mom, but how about everyone else in your life? Did they notice? In my case, for the past 4 years I've been wearing lifts that have added about 2 inches to my height, I'm shooting for 7 cm here to end up at 5'11.5, (I'm currently about 5'8.5 to 5'9 in the morning) and plan on taking the lifts out post op so I'm hoping I can hide this, but wanted to get your take.
2) When you say you are satisfied with the results, is this more freedom of height dysphoria/neurosis or actual incremental gains in different aspects of life such as dating/career/etc? For me, I was generally happy and content with the core areas of my life (career, friends/family, and women) before LL, I just struggled with height dysphoria every day and that nagging psychological constraint has started to wear on me. All I'm seeking here is freedom of height neurosis. I'm currently addicted to wearing lifts which as put a constraint on living life (e.g no beach, pool, no getting too intimate or serious with dating due to concealing lifts, etc.)
3) Any advice for someone doing this alone? My experience is very similar to yours. Doing it solo, keeping it private from friends and family, and staying at Homewood Suites. My biggest fear is the psychological challenge of solitude and loneliness moreso than the physical pain (although I know the physical part will be no walk in the park and will require every ounce of strength.)
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Amazing to see two LL veterans drop in multiple years after their operations. For future LLers like myself, times like these give us a rare glimpse into the long term outlook of this procedure.
I want to start off by saying thank you to both programdude and purushrottam for sharing their experiences and diaries with the community, I've read both of your diaries twice over and gleaned several valuable insights along the way. I'm actually sitting alone in my room at Homewood Suites in WPB, my operation for bilateral Stryde femurs with Paley is this Tuesday. Knowing that both of you were in my shoes before this is a huge motivator. You've both shared the good, the bad, and the ugly of this journey and I feel way more informed because of it.....THANK YOU!
@programdude a couple of questions:
1) How did you transition back to normal life post op 3 inches taller in the context of friends, family and coworkers? I know you mentioned you came clean to your roommates as they noticed the height gain and you told your mom, but how about everyone else in your life? Did they notice? In my case, for the past 4 years I've been wearing lifts that have added about 2 inches to my height, I'm shooting for 7 cm here to end up at 5'11.5, (I'm currently about 5'8.5 to 5'9 in the morning) and plan on taking the lifts out post op so I'm hoping I can hide this, but wanted to get your take.
2) When you say you are satisfied with the results, is this more freedom of height dysphoria/neurosis or actual incremental gains in different aspects of life such as dating/career/etc? For me, I was generally happy and content with the core areas of my life (career, friends/family, and women) before LL, I just struggled with height dysphoria every day and that nagging psychological constraint has started to wear on me. All I'm seeking here is freedom of height neurosis. I'm currently addicted to wearing lifts which as put a constraint on living life (e.g no beach, pool, no getting too intimate or serious with dating due to concealing lifts, etc.)
3) Any advice for someone doing this alone? My experience is very similar to yours. Doing it solo, keeping it private from friends and family, and staying at Homewood Suites. My biggest fear is the psychological challenge of solitude and loneliness moreso than the physical pain (although I know the physical part will be no walk in the park and will require every ounce of strength.)
Hey Alchemist, congrats on taking that huge dive! I'm glad documenting my journey here has been helpful to some people, my jaw dropped a bit when I actually realized what its view count was. One day I'll have to swing by there again for some nostalgia.
Hopefully my answers can be helpful since you are indeed in a similar situation to the one I was in.
1. Even without lifts/getting people ready preemptively, those who didn't see me crippled were none the wiser to a surgery being involved, even if they did notice me being taller. Off the top of my head my dad noticed I was taller, and a friend I had been close to but not seen until I was nearly fully recovered noticed but otherwise there were no comments and even in those instances it was just a brief and awed mention before moving on.
Even though LL and your height change are at the forefront of your mind, the same isn't true for those around you, even those who do register a change in height. Because LL is not mainstream peoples minds will automatically brush it away, thinking they are misremembering, you somehow grew, your posture got better, or ironically, even started wearing lifts.
My advice is to just own it mentally. Don't go into each day or interaction in with a defensive mindset. If someone mentions you growing, a confident/slightly happy "Oh yeah? Can't complain about that" response is a lot better than being hesitant and bashful. If you recover quicker than I did which is likely, and you are already wearing lifts I think this will be a breeze for you.
2. It sounds like what you are describing is essentially exactly the position I was in beforehand, though lifts didn't really assuage my dysphoria since there wasn't any actual physical change and the discomfort honestly probably exacerbated it. I've mentioned it before but my life was objectively great before LL-robust social life, good money, no shortage of women, and just in general no doors closed on me due to height. Height was not even on my mind as something I was unhappy with until relatively shortly before I did LL, however when it set in, it was exactly as you describe it.
The good news for you is that considering how much more significantly your method of coping with it has affected your life(limited activities, infringing on intimacy etc.), I would think you would get even MORE of a benefit psychologically than I did. If you feel "right" with your lifts on then I think you will be satisfied with the results, since its no exaggeration to say the dysphoria is gone without a trace.
3. The bad news is people in our shoes definitely are at a disadvantage, no sugar coating that. However if you can handle the physical side I think you should do fine. I don't want to scare you but some parts of the process early on are hard because it is both physical pain coupled with the isolation. Sitting in the shower for an hour or more with two broken legs at the most painful part of the process, with the heat turned up just to distract from the pain was a distinct low point. Since its not your main concern my one physical tip to you will just be to stretch even more than you think you need to, even though there will be plenty of times you'd rather not.
The stay doesn't have to be a lonely one however, and in many ways it can be one of the most unique and socially stimulating experiences you'll have. You will have regular interactions with your PT's, hotel staff, and ideally some fellow LL patients/their families, be it cosmetic or not. Embrace the fact you are in a place where you are free to be open about your situation, it can be interesting discussing with fellow cosmetic LL'ers what brought them to making the decision, as well as talking with patients and their families about things surrounding the process. Some days it might be tempting to be antisocial when you are feeling tired or in pain but its worth it to make connections.
Also if you have people who aren't in your life currently because they moved and aren't part of your family/your social circle striking up a conversation with them could be a good idea, whether it be for general talk or telling them what you were doing. Opening up to the few people I did was nice since it was a little tether to my normal life.
Once you are out of the early part of the process you could invite some girls over, having company in your room can definitely be a breath of fresh air, as well as physical contact etc.
Lastly I would get some shows and books you've been wanting to get through lined up since its the perfect time to get through some of them.
Best of luck man! I'll definitely be keeping my eyes peeled for how you're doing.
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Hey Alchemist, congrats on taking that huge dive! I'm glad documenting my journey here has been helpful to some people, my jaw dropped a bit when I actually realized what its view count was. One day I'll have to swing by there again for some nostalgia.
Hopefully my answers can be helpful since you are indeed in a similar situation to the one I was in.
1. Even without lifts/getting people ready preemptively, those who didn't see me crippled were none the wiser to a surgery being involved, even if they did notice me being taller. Off the top of my head my dad noticed I was taller, and a friend I had been close to but not seen until I was nearly fully recovered noticed but otherwise there were no comments and even in those instances it was just a brief and awed mention before moving on.
Even though LL and your height change are at the forefront of your mind, the same isn't true for those around you, even those who do register a change in height. Because LL is not mainstream peoples minds will automatically brush it away, thinking they are misremembering, you somehow grew, your posture got better, or ironically, even started wearing lifts.
My advice is to just own it mentally. Don't go into each day or interaction in with a defensive mindset. If someone mentions you growing, a confident/slightly happy "Oh yeah? Can't complain about that" response is a lot better than being hesitant and bashful. If you recover quicker than I did which is likely, and you are already wearing lifts I think this will be a breeze for you.
2. It sounds like what you are describing is essentially exactly the position I was in beforehand, though lifts didn't really assuage my dysphoria since there wasn't any actual physical change and the discomfort honestly probably exacerbated it. I've mentioned it before but my life was objectively great before LL-robust social life, good money, no shortage of women, and just in general no doors closed on me due to height. Height was not even on my mind as something I was unhappy with until relatively shortly before I did LL, however when it set in, it was exactly as you describe it.
The good news for you is that considering how much more significantly your method of coping with it has affected your life(limited activities, infringing on intimacy etc.), I would think you would get even MORE of a benefit psychologically than I did. If you feel "right" with your lifts on then I think you will be satisfied with the results, since its no exaggeration to say the dysphoria is gone without a trace.
3. The bad news is people in our shoes definitely are at a disadvantage, no sugar coating that. However if you can handle the physical side I think you should do fine. I don't want to scare you but some parts of the process early on are hard because it is both physical pain coupled with the isolation. Sitting in the shower for an hour or more with two broken legs at the most painful part of the process, with the heat turned up just to distract from the pain was a distinct low point. Since its not your main concern my one physical tip to you will just be to stretch even more than you think you need to, even though there will be plenty of times you'd rather not.
The stay doesn't have to be a lonely one however, and in many ways it can be one of the most unique and socially stimulating experiences you'll have. You will have regular interactions with your PT's, hotel staff, and ideally some fellow LL patients/their families, be it cosmetic or not. Embrace the fact you are in a place where you are free to be open about your situation, it can be interesting discussing with fellow cosmetic LL'ers what brought them to making the decision, as well as talking with patients and their families about things surrounding the process. Some days it might be tempting to be antisocial when you are feeling tired or in pain but its worth it to make connections.
Also if you have people who aren't in your life currently because they moved and aren't part of your family/your social circle striking up a conversation with them could be a good idea, whether it be for general talk or telling them what you were doing. Opening up to the few people I did was nice since it was a little tether to my normal life.
Once you are out of the early part of the process you could invite some girls over, having company in your room can definitely be a breath of fresh air, as well as physical contact etc.
Lastly I would get some shows and books you've been wanting to get through lined up since its the perfect time to get through some of them.
Best of luck man! I'll definitely be keeping my eyes peeled for how you're doing.
Thank you programdude! Super helpful advice. I gotta say, you have a gift with writing. Every single one of your posts are concise and eloquent.
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Thank you programdude! Super helpful advice. I gotta say, you have a gift with writing. Every single one of your posts are concise and eloquent.
I appreciate that! While not something I do professionally, writing is actually one of my main passions so I'm happy to hear that bleeds through a bit.
It's also ironic since I revisited the beginning of my journal today for the first time and was surprised at how evident the toll of the stress, pain, and drugs was on my writing and mindset. While I usually don't spell check posts rigorously, the amount of spelling errors was worth an eyebrow raise, not to mention some of the things I said in general.
Definitely plan on giving a bit more commentary than that as I re-read things since as insightful as my in the moment thoughts might be, a fully coherent breakdown of things might be more valuable to some.
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I've decided what I'm (most likely) going to do is re-read my diary and take some notes as I do, then use those notes as well as my perspective to give an objective breakdown of the LL journey broken into three parts.
The first which would cover as bit about me before LL, my interest in LL coming about, to me pulling the trigger and actually following through with it, as well as my first month or so post OP. The second would cover the second month or so, and the third would go into the end of the process as well as recovery and closing thoughts. It's possible I'll decide to just make it two parts or even divide it up further but I'll cross that bridge when I get there.
The format will likely be me going over the events of each period, as well as potentially commenting on my posts in this diary, clarifying and expounding on anything I feel needs it, then wrapping up the analysis with bullet points of advice, warnings, or overall thoughts that someone curious about LL, or who was preparing for their surgery might find most useful.
As useful and interesting as the in the moment and gritty play by play of things can be, I think a fully coherent revisiting of the process will be ultimately more informative, especially after revisiting some of my posts where the effects of either the medication, pain, or lack of sleep were extremely evident. Additionally, because a lot of people steadily drift away from the community completely or have very brief returns, a more in depth look at the whole topic/process of LL from someone who's been in the thick of it but has it far in their rear view mirror might be a slightly rare perspective since for so many people active in the community LL/height neurosis is THE thing in their lives.
Anyways that's the plan! Its been quite surreal reading over the diary so far, and I'm sure digging up some of my memories will be as I continue the read. If anyone has any thoughts on the format or ideas about information I could include that would be helpful to them or others I'm all ears.
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I basically want to know your current physical and athletic abilities. Are they now gone back to what they were pre op? Can you fit into the normal world like everyone else? Like run, walk, jump etc. Are you facing any physical difficulties right now ? Also it would be awesome if you could give some tips if a person wants to do LL on his own? Without family or friends getting involved. And I have almost finished your entire diary, it's mind blowing the way you went through your journey..! Thanks for this awesome diary, looking forward to read you analysis.
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I've decided what I'm (most likely) going to do is re-read my diary and take some notes as I do, then use those notes as well as my perspective to give an objective breakdown of the LL journey broken into three parts.
The first which would cover as bit about me before LL, my interest in LL coming about, to me pulling the trigger and actually following through with it, as well as my first month or so post OP. The second would cover the second month or so, and the third would go into the end of the process as well as recovery and closing thoughts. It's possible I'll decide to just make it two parts or even divide it up further but I'll cross that bridge when I get there.
The format will likely be me going over the events of each period, as well as potentially commenting on my posts in this diary, clarifying and expounding on anything I feel needs it, then wrapping up the analysis with bullet points of advice, warnings, or overall thoughts that someone curious about LL, or who was preparing for their surgery might find most useful.
As useful and interesting as the in the moment and gritty play by play of things can be, I think a fully coherent revisiting of the process will be ultimately more informative, especially after revisiting some of my posts where the effects of either the medication, pain, or lack of sleep were extremely evident. Additionally, because a lot of people steadily drift away from the community completely or have very brief returns, a more in depth look at the whole topic/process of LL from someone who's been in the thick of it but has it far in their rear view mirror might be a slightly rare perspective since for so many people active in the community LL/height neurosis is THE thing in their lives.
Anyways that's the plan! Its been quite surreal reading over the diary so far, and I'm sure digging up some of my memories will be as I continue the read. If anyone has any thoughts on the format or ideas about information I could include that would be helpful to them or others I'm all ears.
Amazing! Really looking forward to this. I don't there has ever been a comprehensive revisting of the entire LL process from an experienced veteran. Would love if you talked through how LL enhanced your day to day life as well as elements where it may have downgraded your day to day life post full recovery. Since you seem to have had been content with your life pre LL and looked LL to enhance it (rather than escape a miserable life) I'd love to hear your perspective here. Also, now that you are on the other side of freedom from height neurosis, in hindsight, would LL have been the only solution for height neurosis or would you advise on alternative methods (e.g therapy?)
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I basically want to know your current physical and athletic abilities. Are they now gone back to what they were pre op? Can you fit into the normal world like everyone else? Like run, walk, jump etc. Are you facing any physical difficulties right now ? Also it would be awesome if you could give some tips if a person wants to do LL on his own? Without family or friends getting involved. And I have almost finished your entire diary, it's mind blowing the way you went through your journey..! Thanks for this awesome diary, looking forward to read you analysis.
All good suggestions from you and the alchemist!
The short answer to your question in terms of physical ability is that my athleticism is certainly not close to pre op in terms of running/sprinting but aside from the irritation from the hardware from my fracture, in my day to day I am completely normal, don't even have LL pop into my head, and certainly to others look completely normal. I believe 6 CM would probably see a quite fast recovery to something close to 100% but really think people expecting to return to sports after 8 CM are playing a dangerous game.
If someone is going solo the main advice is to be ready and over prepare. Even when going with the best money can buy things can go wrong and it will still be taxing. Also if you are just barely coming up with surgery costs then it really is best to hold off. Things can go wrong, recovery can take awhile and cause delays in work, and insurance might not cover your meds which can all equate to more strain on your bank accounts.
As for your curiosity Alchemist, again I will incorporate a more thorough answer in my actual post, but in my case there were certainly significant short term downgrades, however after recovering aside from the soon to be removed hardware irritation there are none. I cant really conceive of therapy helping, but I do think people need to think really long and hard how badly they want it. As my diary illustrates, I spent a ton of money and brutalized myself, had a bumpy recovery and still think it was extremely worth it even this long after the initial relief of being unburdened by height neurosis when viewing it from an objective lens.
It's hard to say if anything could have assuaged it, or if it would have faded naturally to an extent, and that the money and time spent on eliminating the neurosis could have netted a more happy me but it really is hard to picture.
That being said I always try and be careful since I am quite sure there are people who are suffering temporary body image issues, have mental issues that not even the LL would remedy, or are in a situation financially where they would create a far bigger problem for themselves- A person with a social circle that they truly wanted to keep 100% in the dark, had to return to work on a set day after an estimated recovery date, or who hadn't had complications budgeted into things could easily find themself in a pit of depression from strain from many angles.
At the end of the day when someone who is a fit for LL does it, it is a respectable way of changing their stars, but when someone isn't its a recipe for disaster.
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All good suggestions from you and the alchemist!
The short answer to your question in terms of physical ability is that my athleticism is certainly not close to pre op in terms of running/sprinting but aside from the irritation from the hardware from my fracture, in my day to day I am completely normal, don't even have LL pop into my head, and certainly to others look completely normal. I believe 6 CM would probably see a quite fast recovery to something close to 100% but really think people expecting to return to sports after 8 CM are playing a dangerous game.
If someone is going solo the main advice isto be ready and over prepare. Even when going with the best money can buy things can go wrong and it will still be taxing. Also if you are just barely coming up with surgery costs then it really is best to hold off. Things can go wrong, recovery can take awhile and cause delays in work, and insurance might not cover your meds which can all equate to more strain on your bank accounts.
As for your curiosity Alchemist, again I will incorporate a more thorough answer in my actual post, but in my case there were certainly significant short term downgrades, however after recovering aside from the soon to be removed hardware irritation there are none. I cant really conceive of therapy helping, but I do think people need to think really long and hard how badly they want it. As my diary illustrates, I spent a ton of money and brutalized myself, had a bumpy recovery and still think it was extremely worth it even this long after the initial relief of being unburdened by height neurosis when viewing it from an objective lens.
It's hard to say if anything could have assuaged it, or if it would have faded naturally to an extent, and that the money and time spent on eliminating the neurosis could have netted a more happy me but it really is hard to picture.
That being said I always try and be careful since I am quite sure there are people who are suffering temporary body image issues, have mental issues that not even the LL would remedy, or are in a situation financially where they would create a far bigger problem for themselves- A person with a social circle that they truly wanted to keep 100% in the dark, had to return to work on a set day after an estimated recovery date, or who hadn't had complications budgeted into things could easily find themself in a pit of depression from strain from many angles.
At the end of the day when someone who is a fit for LL does it, it is a respectable way of changing their stars, but when someone isn't its a recipe for disaster.
It's really fantastic your height dysphoria is 100% cured!
It's interesting how this plays out sometimes.
Sometimes a 5'3 guy lengthens to 5'6 and ends up 100% cured of height dysphoria.
Maybe a 5'11 guy with alot of tall people in in his life lengthens to 6 feet and ends up 100% cured of height dysphoria.
Or a 5'3 guy lengthens to 5'6 and feels better but is still not quite happy.
There's maybe one or two people on this forum who are, deep inside, wishing they could compete with 6'-6'3 handsome guys at night clubs - people who feel the brunt of the emotions associated with this inequality are completely screwed I think. In 2019, we have no means to get the vast majority of people anywhere near that territory and it really fks people over when their life experiences cause them to compare themselves to such lucky men. An unwinnable fight. Good to hear that you are 100% free of body image issues.
What is something you would recommend people buy to help make the lengthening process a bit more convenient aside from walkers/wheelchairs/standard stuff? Ex: some people said that buying body wipes was convenient for when they wanted to clean themselves without walking to the bathroom.
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Hi bodybuilder,
Do you think pain may persist even after the lengthening stage ? Although my pain is 1 or 2/10 at the most, I would not like to have it after the lengthening phase!
Maybe as a word of advice to others, I have noticed pain goes away when I exercise my leg. The problem is that I work in the mornings and waking up in the middle of the night to exercise my leg is not very nice, I guess this is some of the extra price you need to pay should you wanna be taller.
Thanks!!
What exercises did you find most helpful? What are your thoughts on walking with a walker/cane vs stationary bike? I guess a bike is harder to get onto / more risk of falling if you have a pain spasm
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It's really fantastic your height dysphoria is 100% cured!
It's interesting how this plays out sometimes.
Sometimes a 5'3 guy lengthens to 5'6 and ends up 100% cured of height dysphoria.
Maybe a 5'11 guy with alot of tall people in in his life lengthens to 6 feet and ends up 100% cured of height dysphoria.
Or a 5'3 guy lengthens to 5'6 and feels better but is still not quite happy.
There's maybe one or two people on this forum who are, deep inside, wishing they could compete with 6'-6'3 handsome guys at night clubs - people who feel the brunt of the emotions associated with this inequality are completely screwed I think. In 2019, we have no means to get the vast majority of people anywhere near that territory and it really fks people over when their life experiences cause them to compare themselves to such lucky men. An unwinnable fight. Good to hear that you are 100% free of body image issues.
What is something you would recommend people buy to help make the lengthening process a bit more convenient aside from walkers/wheelchairs/standard stuff? Ex: some people said that buying body wipes was convenient for when they wanted to clean themselves without walking to the bathroom.
In terms of convenience, having any and all medications you might need, like zzzquill on hand is ideal since its not fun needing to make a trip to the store. Other than that, friends, and entertainment are both things that will go a long way in helping with the process.
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In terms of convenience, having any and all medications you might need, like zzzquill on hand is ideal since its not fun needing to make a trip to the store. Other than that, friends, and entertainment are both things that will go a long way in helping with the process.
Current status???
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Thanks for the awesome diary, programdude.
Your writing is really good, full of details and crisp!
My biggest concern is scars right now as I look to pursue LL surgery with Dr. Paley.
After a few years, have the scars become largely unnoticeable or are they still quite conspicuous?
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Current status please.
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Hey ProgramDude,
I read your complete diary and wow what a journey it was. I am happy that your out of your body image issues and thanks for your contribution to this forum and for future LLers. Hope everything is well with you and you are enjoying your life.
I have been saving up money for last 7 years and finally have taken the first step to have my appointment with Paley on 3rd and 4th of August. I have been reading many diaries so far and I will make sure to contribute to this forum from my end when my journey starts.
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Thanks for the awesome diary, programdude.
Your writing is really good, full of details and crisp!
My biggest concern is scars right now as I look to pursue LL surgery with Dr. Paley.
After a few years, have the scars become largely unnoticeable or are they still quite conspicuous?
Glad you enjoyed the read! Writing is a passion of mine so I'm glad that could shine through despite the many pained/drugged up posts throughout the process.
My scars have significantly diminished, and keep in mind thats with additional surgeries that a totally smooth LL process won't involve, and without me taking any measures to reduce the scars. Only one person has ever noticed my scars(one on my left glute to be specific), but they thought it was a bruise since thats essentially what it looks like.
If you have a mild amount of hair I think that'll cover them up for the most part, and when you're in shorts or swimming trunks you can't even see it. Someone scrutinizing you nked in bright light is really the only way I could see the scars being noticed.
Current status???
Good news- Although it took FAR too long, especially with COVID, I finally got the lower screws out of my leg. It was obvious to me that the radiating pain that particularly flared up was coming from a backed out screw, since the pain was localized and it poking out could be seen/felt. However, because the ER surgeon who had put the rod in when I had the fracture was seemingly unable to find my file I had to seek a new surgeon and despite getting X-Rays that showed an overtly backed out screw they needed those files regardless. I managed to get the needed to documents, and the kafkaesque process continued with many seemingly pointless appointments, an MRI, a COVID test before my surgery date which was cancelled, and another COVID test before my actual surgery.
As exhausting and demotivating as the process was, particularly with all the precautions taken since this was during the middle of the pandemic- The relief to my leg was immediate, and I could tell the issue was remedied even during the couple days of soreness that followed the surgery. I was so over appointments, and felt so good I cancelled my follow up appointment and haven't looked back.
EDIT: Damn, 220,018 views on this thread. I should have written a book!
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Also, I have received a lot of messages over the years- I've responded to as many as I could but to anyone wanting to ask one please post questions here instead since its much easier to answer several at once in a quote reply- And because a lot of the questions asked are very similar so your question may serve to educate others as well.
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Hey man! It's so great to hear from you again! We miss you I must say...
How are you? How is life?
Any updates about your legs and overall health?
How's your athletic ability?
Finally, how does it feel to be of the height that u always wanted to be!?
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Heyo- Part of my not posting in awhile has been on account of things finally being in a good spot for me. I no longer even think of LL as something I've done unless the rare situation occurs where someone that knows I've done it brings it up.
After the removal of the screws holding in the nail that I had put in after my unfortunate fracture, I've been in great shape all around. I can do all exercises and feel very much aligned with where I would be without the surgery.
Particularly now, my legs have filled in well with muscle making for a proportionate look.
As far as how it feels- simply put- Great. This is why I straddle a fine line when it comes to the surgery. It is costly, and an immense commitment even if all goes well- But does deliver on exactly the desired outcome. My proportions and height both feel exactly "right"-Obviously this might not universally be true, but my heigh/proportion discontent was completely solved post op.
My only words of warning are to those who genuinely cannot afford it, are already hatching plans for more surgeries since one won't be enough, and who would be devastated if recovery took longer than expected.
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Hows ur athletic abilities? Would you mind sharing a running video if you could?
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No videos sorry- But my athleticism is fine- I can work out legs hard without anything feeling amiss, other than my femurs being distinctly longer when doing squats. Things like walks and hikes are like before surgery. I was never a big sprinter/runner before this, so its hard to compare that, though as I've mentioned throughout this thread I would never expect to get back to 100% with sprints/high level sports.
Not that it isn't potentially possible, especially if you were actually training for it.
Keep in mind this recovery is with Paleys max femur lengthening and some serious complications. If you are lengthening less or dodge the complications I could only imagine even better results.
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isnt 3 inch longer femur too visible when sitting on chair?
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For some it might, but in my case due to long arms it actually looks more proportionate. I think the main time lengthened limbs will look weird is before muscle has filled back in. Once they do fill in you'd be surprised how normal they look, I can't even remember what my previous femurs looked like.
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It's really a good diary, do you have any recent x-ray?