Limb Lengthening Forum
Limb Lengthening Surgery => Limb Lengthening Discussions => Topic started by: .. on July 07, 2018, 03:48:52 PM
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Here are some that I've been studying:
- Dr. Dimitrios Giotikas: Reception gives a professional honest response, solid background of the doctor, use TSF, nice city in Athens, but lack of proofs so far and doctor is relatively young. Price-wise while is affordable but still far more costly compared to Solomin. Never had fat embolism cases, claims only minor complications such as broken nails and pin-site infections. The best thing is he doesn't do ATL at all cost and has his own procedure to treat ballerina. 43 CLL cases (24 tibia, 19 femur), up to 150 LL cases per/year (for the last 5 years)
- Dr. Leonid Solomin (ft. Dr. Kulesh) : Solid background, experienced, many successful diaries on the forum and unbelievably cheap. But he uses conventional Illizarov fixator instead of modern TSF and seems to be very blatantly honest about risks and expect a loss of athletic function. I'm not sure if he's honest or just lacks of confidence. However, he never had FE cases, no amputations and only 1 death following an elongation surgery (leg length inequality) over the past 18 years due to an intolerance to anesthesia. Another problem is he does ATL.
Because of his extremely low price though, one could probably consider unilateral external surgery for extra safety and guaranteed maximum results.
- Dr. Robert Rozbruch : Widely regarded as the best LL doctor in the world after Paley but he asked the same price of $125 for TSF as PRECICE which I think is hilarious. Worth it?
- Dr. Mangal Parihar : Eventhough he seems to be a good capable and responsible doctor with experience, unfortunately his clinic looks like a chithole in a 3rd world country and price wise, still more expensive than Dr. Solomin. Worth considering?
- Dr. Shahab Mahboubian : Has never been very appealing to me, but does have some positive notes: In US, a few successful diaries on the forum and quite experienced. TSF Price = $400
I really question the wisdom of choosing Dr. Giotikas over Dr. Solomin. It seems that the only reason is just to avoid ATL.
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Solomin and Kulesh without question IMO. Wish I had the balls to do externals. Their experience at that price is almost unmatched.
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Solomin and Kulesh without question IMO. Wish I had the balls to do externals. Their experience at that price is almost unmatched.
Wish I had the balls to do internals. lol. I'm not sure what you mean by that, internals are always dangerous.
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Wish I had the balls to do internals. lol. I'm not sure what you mean by that, internals are always dangerous.
Well for external femur i'm out of the country for 200+ days for internal with STRYDE i'm only out for about 3 months although it's infinitely more expensive. The procedure is less barbaric and theres less scarring with internal.
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Well for external femur i'm out of the country for 200+ days for internal with STRYDE i'm only out for about 3 months although it's infinitely more expensive. The procedure is less barbaric and theres less scarring with internal.
What you describe is about saving time and has nothing to do with safety. Internal procedure is definitely more barbaric. I think you need to reconsider it if those are your reasons.
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What you describe is about saving time and has nothing to do with safety. Internal procedure is definitely more barbaric. I think you need to reconsider it if those are your reasons.
How is internal more barbaric for femurs?
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Mahboubian told me 50k for tsf.
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How is internal more barbaric for femurs?
External is just a few screws going through your bones, Internal nail literally drills a hole into your bone canal.
Mahboubian told me 50k for tsf.
Lol I wanted to write 40k actually, but maybe you're spot on.
Who do you think is the best among my list?
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External is just a few screws going through your bones, Internal nail literally drills a hole into your bone canal.
Lol I wanted to write 40k actually, but maybe you're spot on.
Who do you think is the best among my list?
im saving up for Mahboubian
can't afford Rozbruch even though I think he's the best out of all.
Mahboubian has a good track record for pts so far, and I plan on meeting a few of them face to face too when the time comes.
TSF frame is the best external frame and allows for early weight-bearing. I trust the US healthcare system (hospital, surgeon, anesthesiologist, nurses, staff, etc). I researched Mahboubian a ton and I also want to be a physician so I know how hard it is to get a fellowship in deformity and limb lengthening at HSS (#1 orthopedic hospital in the country) as an orthopedic surgeon.
My second choice that fits my budget for external fixator would be Dr. Mangal Parihar in India. One of the best orthopedic surgeons in the world imo. Only problem is he's in India. I don't think I would feel safe in that old broken down hospital and it will be a stressful time for me
side note: haven't researched Dr. Dimitrios Giotikas
also do not choose dr. Solomon for ll
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im saving up for Mahboubian
can't afford Rozbruch even though I think he's the best out of all.
Mahboubian has a good track record for pts so far, and I plan on meeting a few of them face to face too when the time comes.
TSF frame is the best external frame and allows for early weight-bearing. I trust the US healthcare system (hospital, surgeon, anesthesiologist, nurses, staff, etc). I researched Mahboubian a ton and I also want to be a physician so I know how hard it is to get a fellowship in deformity and limb lengthening at HSS (#1 orthopedic hospital in the country) as an orthopedic surgeon.
My second choice that fits my budget for external fixator would be Dr. Mangal Parihar in India. One of the best orthopedic surgeons in the world imo. Only problem is he's in India. I don't think I would feel safe in that old broken down hospital and it will be a stressful time for me
Why not Dr. Solomin or Dr. Giotikas? Solomin uses classic Illizarov while Giotikas uses TSF.
You think TSF frame is necessary to increase the chance of success of the whole treatment?
I also think Rozbruch TSF is hilarious. I wondered if he's joking.
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Why not Dr. Solomin or Dr. Giotikas? Solomin uses classic Illizarov while Giotikas uses TSF.
You think TSF frame is necessary to increase the chance of success of the whole treatment?
I also think Rozbruch TSF is hilarious. I wondered if he's joking.
not enough diaries from dr Solomon
also ive heard a few bad stories from pts of his if I remember correctly.
haven't researched Dr. Giotikas
TSF frame allows early weight bearing so I think that would be beneficial. but from the studies ive read, tsf frame took same amount of time to recover when compared to classic externals.
I also have some curvature of the tibias I would like to get corrected. so tsf would be good for that too, and I want to weight bear as soon as possible
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just looked up Dr. Giotikas
has very solid credentials. I am going to research him more
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Here are some that I've been studying:
- Dr. Dimitrios Giotikas: Reception gives a professional honest response, solid background of the doctor, use TSF, nice city in Athens, but lack of proofs so far and doctor is relatively young. Price-wise while is affordable but still far more costly compared to Solomin. Never had fat embolism cases, claims only minor complications such as broken nails and pin-site infections. The best thing is he doesn't do ATL at all cost and has his own procedure to treat ballerina. 43 CLL cases (24 tibia, 19 femur), up to 150 LL cases per/year (for the last 5 years)
- Dr. Leonid Solomin (ft. Dr. Kulesh) : Solid background, experienced, many successful diaries on the forum and unbelievably cheap. But he uses conventional Illizarov fixator instead of modern TSF and seems to be very blatantly honest about risks and expect a loss of athletic function. I'm not sure if he's honest or just lacks of confidence. However, he never had FE cases, no amputations and only 1 death following an elongation surgery (leg length inequality) over the past 18 years due to an intolerance to anesthesia. Another problem is he does ATL.
Because of his extremely low price though, one could probably consider unilateral external surgery for extra safety and guaranteed maximum results.
- Dr. Robert Rozbruch : Widely regarded as the best LL doctor in the world after Paley but he asked the same price of $125 for TSF as PRECICE which I think is hilarious. Worth it?
- Dr. Mangal Parihar : Eventhough he seems to be a good capable and responsible doctor with experience, unfortunately his clinic looks like a chithole in a 3rd world country and price wise, still more expensive than Dr. Solomin. Worth considering?
- Dr. Shahab Mahboubian : Has never been very appealing to me, but does have some positive notes: In US, a few successful diaries on the forum and quite experienced. TSF Price = $400
I really question the wisdom of choosing Dr. Giotikas over Dr. Solomin. It seems that the only reason is just to avoid ATL.
I think external Dr. Catagni is fine.
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not enough diaries from dr Solomon
also ive heard a few bad stories from pts of his if I remember correctly.
haven't researched Dr. Giotikas
TSF frame allows early weight bearing so I think that would be beneficial. but from the studies ive read, tsf frame took same amount of time to recover when compared to classic externals.
I also have some curvature of the tibias I would like to get corrected. so tsf would be good for that too, and I want to weight bear as soon as possible
Really? It looks like we have more diaries on Solomin than Giotikas. Fallen had some problem with Mahboubian too.
just looked up Dr. Giotikas
has very solid credentials. I am going to research him more
Great! Let us know what you find.
I think external Dr. Catagni is fine.
He doesn't do anyone above 160m and likes to do ATL.
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Really? It looks like we have more diaries on Solomin than Giotikas. Fallen had some problem with Mahboubian too.
Great! Let us know what you find.
He doesn't do anyone above 160m and likes to do ATL.
What is ATL?
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What is ATL?
Achilles tendon lengthening.
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Achilles tendon lengthening.
You can choose not to lengthen your Achilles tendon.
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Really? It looks like we have more diaries on Solomin than Giotikas. Fallen had some problem with Mahboubian too.
Great! Let us know what you find.
He doesn't do anyone above 160m and likes to do ATL.
His surgery doesn't seem to limit his height.
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Really? It looks like we have more diaries on Solomin than Giotikas. Fallen had some problem with Mahboubian too.
Great! Let us know what you find.
He doesn't do anyone above 160m and likes to do ATL.
He's barely got any scars.
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You can choose not to lengthen your Achilles tendon.
I'm not sure about that. We might be in so much pain and have no choice but to do the surgery if he doesn't have other procedures to treat it.
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Why would you even consider external?!
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Why would you even consider external?!
Safest and cheap. I am lengthening my tibias.
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Has tradeoffs tho. Extended hospitalisation, more scarring, less mobility during procedure. What's your budget if you don't mind me asking?
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My target is 7cm, I wonder if I should set for tibias and do it sooner or save more money and wait a few years to do internals.
Since my torso is relatively short, tibias may look better than having a femur almost longer than my torso. lol
Knowing external is safer makes me give it priority over internals, and to that extend, tibia over femur.
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Has tradeoffs tho. Extended hospitalisation, more scarring, less mobility during procedure. What's your budget if you don't mind me asking?
I can stand extended hospitalisation, more scarring, less mobility during procedure. IMO, these are trivial and very temporary. However, I can't stand fat embolism. Internal method isn't best for tibias anyway and will almost certainly cause permanent knee pain as reported.
I don't really set a limitiation for my budget. I don't actually intend to go cheap. My priorities are the safety of the lengthening method and the capability of the doctor. However, I wouldn't mind a more attractive price if the quality is not any less.
My target is 7cm, I wonder if I should set for tibias and do it sooner or save more money and wait a few years to do internals.
Since my torso is relatively short, tibias may look better than having a femur almost longer than my torso. lol
Knowing external is safer makes me give it priority over internals, and to that extend, tibia over femur.
IMO, proportions should be the priority. Remember that it's your proportions for life. It's much better to be 174cm and looking aesthetic and proportional than 175cm but looking like a freak.
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Why have you decided on tibias? IMO anyone considering LL should first do femurs and tibias only if additional gain is required. The femur is one bone (as opposed to 2 for tibs) it is a bigger stronger bone with more capacity. Less messing with your knees and ankles/achilles. I am really at a loss. Your concerns about internal methods are unfounded. Internal is perfectly safe, tried and tested. No adverse long term effects. I am proof of that. I did mine 14 years ago. You've seen my photos in my diary? I gained 11cm on femurs alone and everyone thinks I am naturally that height.
"IMO, proportions should be the priority. Remember that it's your proportions for life. It's much better to be 174cm and looking aesthetic and proportional than 175cm but looking like a freak."
Lol, one additional cm is not going to make you look like a freak!
If you have €50k, my advice to you is to start on your femurs, aim for 7-8cm. If you are reasonably fit and young, you should be able to achieve this with relative ease and minimal complications and very good recovery.
I will soon post a vid.
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Hmm, well I agree, the proportions are important but 7cm won't make anyone a freak, try standing on a 7cm plataform and check it out, I'm mostly worried if the bone CAN take 7cm.
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Why have you decided on tibias? IMO anyone considering LL should first do femurs and tibias only if additional gain is required. The femur is one bone (as opposed to 2 for tibs) it is a bigger stronger bone with more capacity. Less messing with your knees and ankles/achilles. I am really at a loss. Your concerns about internal methods are unfounded. Internal is perfectly safe, tried and tested. No adverse long term effects. I am proof of that. I did mine 14 years ago. You've seen my photos in my diary? I gained 11cm on femurs alone and everyone thinks I am naturally that height.
"IMO, proportions should be the priority. Remember that it's your proportions for life. It's much better to be 174cm and looking aesthetic and proportional than 175cm but looking like a freak."
Lol, one additional cm is not going to make you look like a freak!
If you have €50k, my advice to you is to start on your femurs, aim for 7-8cm. If you are reasonably fit and young, you should be able to achieve this with relative ease and minimal complications and very good recovery.
I will soon post a vid.
Hmm, well I agree, the proportions are important but 7cm won't make anyone a freak, try standing on a 7cm plataform and check it out, I'm mostly worried if the bone CAN take 7cm.
"Lol, one additional cm is not going to make you look like a freak!"
You misunderstood completely what I was saying. Additional 5cm on tibias would make us look more aesthetic and natural whereas additional 6cm on femurs could make us look like a freak/weird.
@taller_in_Kiev I'm not sure about you, but I did my mockups and decided right away that I wouldn't do femur lengthening without the tibia first. Sure I would love to gain 6cm over 5cm but I don't think I can't stand the proportions. I've also seen the pics of UNICORN. Regardless of her surgery issues, I personally do think that her proportions look pretty off. If you lengthen 11cm on femur and look natural, then I should really question the genuinity of everything you post her. And even if I want to do femurs, Dr. Jamal would be the last person I'd go to. :)
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What do you have against Dr. Jamal? I think he's one of, if not, THE best out there. I owe him much.
You can check out my photos here.
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=9023.0
Best of luck with your journey.
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What do you have against Dr. Jamal? I think he's one of, if not, THE best out there. I owe him much.
You can check out my photos here.
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=9023.0
Best of luck with your journey.
I've just been observing you. Chances are you are either Jamal himself or his hired salesman.
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I've just been observing you. Chances are you are either Jamal himself or his hired salesman.
I like to think otherwise... look closely at his proportions in the photo in jeans, the femurs actually look oddly long for such small Tibias. It is just that overall he is good looking, takes attention away from this weirdness but still look at the photo in jeans where curvedness near knees is much farther from the belly than from the feet. Please post your observations also.
Link of photos: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=9023.0
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I like to think otherwise... look closely at his proportions in the photo in jeans, the femurs actually look oddly long for such small Tibias. It is just that overall he is good looking, takes attention away from this weirdness but still look at the photo in jeans where curvedness near knees is much farther from the belly than from the feet. Please post your observations also.
Link of photos: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=9023.0
How do you even know he's good looking when his face is blurred?
Ok, now that you brought it up, I noticed that his femurs are actually oddly long. I saw it before, at first glance it looked good because he pulled down his shorts below the natural waist level (in the shirtless pic).
As for my observations, just look at how many times he's trying hard promoting this doc.
Kiev is the place in my opinion
I believe Dr Jamal's method has advanced some more since I did mine.
Like I said in my opening post, I am very grateful to Dr Jamal and the medical team here in Kiev.
My experience of LL was with Dr Jamal, so I can only speak of his method and clinic. I was very fortunate to have an excellent result.
Having seen Rocky, I don't think his scars were so bad, so I think Dr Jamal's procedure has come a long way since I did it in '04.
This one is so blatant lol:
I'd say the best method and nail in the business is the current Bliskunov/Jamal nail (internal) and method in Kiev Ukraine. Very strong, fully load bearing etc. But of course, do your own research.
For those considering Kiev as an LL destination, I'm happy to provide mentoring and support during your LL journey, while I am here - at no cost to you.
As stated in my other posts, anyone considering having the surgery with the good Dr Jamal in Kiev, I am happy to provide mentoring and support during your LL journey at no additional cost to you. While I am here of course. Time for me to give back to the LL world.
You forgot to mention the main attraction of coming to Kiev: the most gorgeous women!
And when someone asked about a completely different doc, he just tried to direct them to Kiev again.
I'd say no chance!! Why have you decided on Paley, may I ask? Geographical convenience?
Now in my thread:
Why have you decided on tibias? IMO anyone considering LL should first do femurs and tibias only if additional gain is required. The femur is one bone (as opposed to 2 for tibs) it is a bigger stronger bone with more capacity. Less messing with your knees and ankles/achilles. I am really at a loss. Your concerns about internal methods are unfounded. Internal is perfectly safe, tried and tested. No adverse long term effects. I am proof of that. I did mine 14 years ago. You've seen my photos in my diary? I gained 11cm on femurs alone and everyone thinks I am naturally that height.
"IMO, proportions should be the priority. Remember that it's your proportions for life. It's much better to be 174cm and looking aesthetic and proportional than 175cm but looking like a freak."
Lol, one additional cm is not going to make you look like a freak!
If you have €50k, my advice to you is to start on your femurs, aim for 7-8cm. If you are reasonably fit and young, you should be able to achieve this with relative ease and minimal complications and very good recovery.
I will soon post a vid.
It's pretty clear, he's selling me Dr. Jamal.
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hey guys! I finally have done the surgery. In Mexico..
I have done the tibias, I will go for 6 cm.. happy I finally will grow a little bit more at the age of 33.
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How do you even know he's good looking when his face is blurred?
Ok, now that you brought it up, I noticed that his femurs are actually oddly long. I saw it before, at first glance it looked good because he pulled down his shorts below the natural waist level (in the shirtless pic).
As for my observations, just look at how many times he's trying hard promoting this doc.
This one is so blatant lol:
And when someone asked about a completely different doc, he just tried to direct them to Kiev again.
Now in my thread:
It's pretty clear, he's selling me Dr. Jamal.
Lol...seems very plausible. May be Jamal is the actual culprit behind all this. I was just putting my point that the person seems to have gone through LL.Apart from that I don't even understand why he would sell so foolishly anything so that other people may pick it up so easily.
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I've just been observing you. Chances are you are either Jamal himself or his hired salesman.
Haha, I am neither. Just a former patient who wants well for future LLers. Many pitfalls to avoid. And if they should consider Dr Jamal in Kiev, I'm happy to offer my personal support and experience. LL can be a tough journey in more ways than one and having someone who's been through it does help.
Please go ahead and do your tibias with external. I've already wished you good luck.
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I like to think otherwise... look closely at his proportions in the photo in jeans, the femurs actually look oddly long for such small Tibias. It is just that overall he is good looking, takes attention away from this weirdness but still look at the photo in jeans where curvedness near knees is much farther from the belly than from the feet. Please post your observations also.
Link of photos: http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=9023.0
Jesus fecking Christ, you guys want to lengthen your bones by umpteen centimetres and still expect to look perfectly proportional??! It's not gonna happen! Even if you lengthen femur/tibs in exact amounts, your legs will be longer in proportion to your torso, unless you have an unusually long torso to begin with. Fact: most short people are proportional for their heights. They are just smaller people, they have smaller frames, smaller bones etc. For me, having longer femurs than tibs is not a problem. Shoes add an inch to your tibs, so when seated, really isn't that obvious, even with such a significant gain. There are more important considerations like recovery, athleticism, strength and how you feel overall post LL. The whole point is to improve the quality of your life, how you feel about yourself, your relationships, your professional life. Not bleeding worry about whether this bone is longer that that lol. Best of luck to you all.
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i just want to know how about LL in Beijing.I am a chinese.i saw so many diary in Beijing before.but now there is little diary in Beijing.Do you think Beijing is a good choice now? :o
On June 22 i visited aiming peng in beijing.there is seems like no foreigner at all now....
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whats about Dr. Salameh in Frankfurt, Germany? Seems to be a good doctor for external, too.
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whats about Dr. Salameh in Frankfurt, Germany? Seems to be a good doctor for external, too.
No, he's definitely out. But he replies to email well.
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No, he's definitely out. But he replies to email well.
What means definitely out? Retired?
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What means definitely out? Retired?
I mean not in my list. He offers insane amount of lengthening which is why I don't trust him, he also uses his own fixator which isn't the standard.
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Yes on his website he shows big lengthening. I am not a fan of that, too but if it works why call it insane and not trustable. Nobody has to lengthen 10cm or even more. Its everybodys own decision. Should he forbid 10cm? Maybe but then patient goes to another surgeon.
He writes he uses his own fixator which is a development.
The system is small in size because of using deferent arc sizes which take the shape of leg ,fit it and possible to hide under pants. Sounds not bad
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Yes on his website he shows big lengthening. I am not a fan of that, too but if it works why call it insane and not trustable. Nobody has to lengthen 10cm or even more. Its everybodys own decision. Should he forbid 10cm? Maybe but then patient goes to another surgeon.
He writes he uses his own fixator which is a development.
The system is small in size because of using deferent arc sizes which take the shape of leg ,fit it and possible to hide under pants. Sounds not bad
It might seem to work post-surgery, but you could get screwed a few years later. When all top doctors say that most patients won't tolerate more than 5cm on tibia, I believe them.
Anyway, you can try Dr. Salameh and let us know how it goes.
He might not be the worst doctor, but to me, there are a lot of better options. Personally, I only trust Illizarov and TSF fixators and STRYDE nail.
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I live not far away from Frankfurt so it would be an advantage but of course I'll inform myself much more to find the right doctor. First I have to do my femurs this summer and then next year tibias. I've heard Paley himself warned many years ago not to go above 4cm, then not more than 6cm, now its 8cm. But I agree I would not lengthen my tibias more than 5/6 cm.