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Author Topic: Permanent effects of LL  (Read 123860 times)

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Infinity

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #62 on: December 01, 2015, 11:59:03 PM »

There are always residual effects of every surgery, let alone LL. The trick is to minimize them by efficient planning in choosing the right doctor, being realistic with your goals and following correct recovery protocol.
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programdude

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #63 on: December 12, 2015, 12:17:29 AM »

I've had a rough recovery. I think a year from now however I will be good, with the exception of worse running, which currently is terrible.

I am happy to report that most the people I am in contact with still that I lengthened with are playing sports/have no issues, and I am very happy for them. These were all Paley patients.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

Alu

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #64 on: December 12, 2015, 04:21:39 AM »

That's by all accounts great to hear PD. If I may bother you with just two questions; how much did each of these individuals lengthen? How many people did you lengthen with?
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goodlucktomylegs

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #65 on: December 12, 2015, 12:42:31 PM »

That's by all accounts great to hear PD. If I may bother you with just two questions; how much did each of these individuals lengthen? How many people did you lengthen with?
It is a good point
I guess less tan 8cm may be 6cm maximum?
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programdude

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #66 on: December 12, 2015, 02:00:26 PM »

Nope. One individual did the same amount as me, starting an inch shorter than me.

One did indeed only do 6 cm, though he was over 40 years old! Starting around two shorter than me.

Another example did just about a cm less than me, starting a whopping 5 or so inches shorter than me.

Proportionately I did far more than two of them, and slightly more than the other, yet they have had great recoveries. I think this mostly proves that even moreso than amount lengthened(although I am sure my recovery would have been phenomenal with an inch less of lengthening), how your body responds to it determines your outcome, and is somewhat luck of the draw.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

Tallexpectations

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #67 on: December 18, 2015, 05:49:19 PM »

It depends on each individual
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Madmax_01

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #68 on: December 29, 2015, 01:06:47 AM »

Does anyone know of any long term effects of LL on femur (approx. 7,5 cm). I was wondering if the massive gain of bone, and therefore the increased weight on your tibias could cause long term problems such as Arthritis, Osteoarthritis, Osteoporosis, knee pain, etc. ?
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crimsontide

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #69 on: January 05, 2016, 05:40:01 PM »

well,if i dont get better, id say dont do it

might be diue t achilles issues

i  just cant enjoy walking now

paley said id never get near 90% recovery after achilles lengthening, while catagni says 100% is possible or probable

hard to know who's right

i cant stand on my tiptoes now.... and i used to have very strong lower legs

worst thing though is my walking speed.... im so slow,no power

im not sure what my options are now, if ill recover

definitely cant enjoy life like this
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Madmax_01

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #70 on: January 05, 2016, 08:23:45 PM »

well,if i dont get better, id say dont do it

might be diue t achilles issues

i  just cant enjoy walking now

paley said id never get near 90% recovery after achilles lengthening, while catagni says 100% is possible or probable

hard to know who's right

i cant stand on my tiptoes now.... and i used to have very strong lower legs

worst thing though is my walking speed.... im so slow,no power

im not sure what my options are now, if ill recover

definitely cant enjoy life like this

I am sorry that LL did not work out for you as you hoped it would.  :( If I may ask, how much did you lenghten your tibias?
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salutewomens

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #71 on: January 12, 2016, 10:28:41 AM »

very nicely explained and I do understand the risk associated with this surgery and after effects but I am willing to go for it because I cannot stay whole life being short.
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vetpat

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #72 on: January 13, 2016, 12:15:17 PM »

take a look at the poll for itsmylifes diary.

the statistic never seems to change.

40% believe in 5-6cm
20% believe in 6-7cm
20% believe in 7-8cm
20% believe in 8-9cm

this is the very reason why so many people get fked up. the second reason is because we all know soft tissue cant go past 0.66mm per day and NO MUTHERfkER STICKS TO IT.

instead they (ultimately do an average of 0.66mm perday) but destroy their body 1 day at a time by over lengthening on a daily basis, they think they are fine during this process because they mask the symptoms of the damage with massive levels of pain killers. ultimately they are fking their body up.

I can tell you with certainty the body can not lengthen past this level unless you use medication to lie to yourself about how fast you can lengthen. when you do something bad the body produces pain to tell you to fking stop. my doctor will not give me any pain killers and I tell you now going above 0.66 is impossible. because your body screams to stop this madness. the same for going above 5cm in total length.

I have never seen a diary where someone did 5cm or less and had permanent damage. with a good doctor. and lengthened 0.66mm per day every single day.

the problem is that people need to be informed about how serious this surgery is. but NOOOOOO every stupid mutherfker comes here wanting to lengthen 20cm, and then ultimately decides on less but still decide to do too much. the problem is greed. people are greedy they want to complete the surgery as fast as possible and want to lengthen the maximum as possible.

greed needs to end.
6cm tibia is the MAX LIMIT. not a mm more.
external femur 5cm MAX LIMIT. not a mm more.

internal femur...... I cant answer. but every stupid nobody who does answer will answer this question with greed in their mind wanting it to be as high as possible. and that again is the problem. your body has limits.

You remind me a guy I've met in Serbia. Many didn't liked him because he was "too honest".

Screw the political correctness. You've summed up pretty well.
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mini_me

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #73 on: January 23, 2016, 04:51:57 PM »


Proportionately I did far more than two of them, and slightly more than the other, yet they have had great recoveries. I think this mostly proves that even moreso than amount lengthened(although I am sure my recovery would have been phenomenal with an inch less of lengthening), how your body responds to it determines your outcome, and is somewhat luck of the draw.

I noticed people saying others have great recoveries… but unless it's medically documented or you know them personally and in contact with them, you'd never know if they have complications. I would never have known your leg snapped if you weren't willing to openly discuss your recovery here… so thanks for your updates. I find your updates, along with Medium's to be 2 of the most credible sources on this website that I can find on this subject.

It's notoriously hard to verify anyone having full recoveries. Crimson says that many are happy they had the surgery but that says nothing about them being fully recovered. That can simply mean they find moderate pain or having a limp or some other handicap is better than being short. Kinda like all those people in Hollywood who look like the Joker after doing too many facelifts but are still happy with the surgeries.
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LLuser1

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #74 on: January 23, 2016, 06:33:36 PM »

I've seen most people having some kind of complications even with the best doctors. LL is no joke.
If you go to  ty doctor the higher your chances are of getting complications.
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Sweden

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #75 on: January 24, 2016, 01:48:50 AM »

It's now been 3 years since I did my first operation(frames on, nail in legs).

Today I have X-legs which affects my walking and running to the point my back hurts insanely in some evenings. I even broke my foot bc of it(lower part of tibia around the foot). It has healed very bad and actually hurts every single day if I don't do drugs like an addict.

My muscles are like 45% of what they used to be on my thighs. My calfs have totally exploded in hyper trophy to the point where it's difficult to pull over most jeans around them and then they're loose around the thighs.

There is a constant stretch in my calfs and ankles when I stand up straight and standing up for a long time hurts my back.

I'm slow in my body as an old man(I'm 30+).

Running is ALWAYS very difficult and it's not something I just do even if I need to(like catch the train or stuff like that)

I can jump up to 40-50% of what I used to be able to.

Jumping from one leg is close to impossible.

Sometimes my calfs get cramps and I need to point with my feet(like standing on toes).

My knees ache a little every morning and when I stand up from sitting down.

I can barely sit down on the ground anymore in any position bc then I fall back. My back muscles are too short.

If I sit more than 30 seconds on my knees I can almost not get up by myself. And some days it's impossible to sit on my knees.

My shins are just too long. It doesn't look natural - especially when I sit on my knees. Heels almost stick out from my butt then.

When I do the splits, which I still can on a good day, I can't grab on to my feet bc my legs are too long for my arms. It's BEYOND unnatural. Every gymnast can grab their feet - but me. And it's bc I can't reach them anymore. It looks W E I R D !!!

Standing up I can't reach my feet. It's also unnatural. Sure, some days I can, but not easy - like before.

My stamina is like a 60-year old.

Doing properly squats is very dangerous for my back bc my total biomechanics are changed and altered. I have to do it in the machines. But I'm still strong in my legs compared to most people.

If anything touches the lower screws in my tibias I want to die bc of the pain it gives for one second.

Don't do more than 5cm on tibias god damn it!!!!!!

------------------

My doctor measured me last week. I was 179,5cm tall. It felt good. I asked for the checkup I did with him back in 2011 and checked my height. It said 173cm tall.
He didn't notice by the way......

The fact that I'm now around average is actually very satisfactory for me. I went to India, sure, but I got the height. No question about it.
The one thing that bothers me the most is my broken foot. Everything else is tolerable and right before I broke my foot I ran 10km in 55 minutes.

I haven't started working yet. I'm still in school and will do so until June 2017. Hopefully after that I will get a very good office job where I can relax my destroyed body, my new destroyed TALL body.
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173cm before LL with Sarin, jan -13. Now 180cm tall. Considering 5cm on femurs.

Tiny

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #76 on: January 24, 2016, 02:56:52 AM »

How much did you lengthen in total? Do you regret doing it?


It's now been 3 years since I did my first operation(frames on, nail in legs).

Today I have X-legs which affects my walking and running to the point my back hurts insanely in some evenings. I even broke my foot bc of it(lower part of tibia around the foot). It has healed very bad and actually hurts every single day if I don't do drugs like an addict.

My muscles are like 45% of what they used to be on my thighs. My calfs have totally exploded in hyper trophy to the point where it's difficult to pull over most jeans around them and then they're loose around the thighs.

There is a constant stretch in my calfs and ankles when I stand up straight and standing up for a long time hurts my back.

I'm slow in my body as an old man(I'm 30+).

Running is ALWAYS very difficult and it's not something I just do even if I need to(like catch the train or stuff like that)

I can jump up to 40-50% of what I used to be able to.

Jumping from one leg is close to impossible.

Sometimes my calfs get cramps and I need to point with my feet(like standing on toes).

My knees ache a little every morning and when I stand up from sitting down.

I can barely sit down on the ground anymore in any position bc then I fall back. My back muscles are too short.

If I sit more than 30 seconds on my knees I can almost not get up by myself. And some days it's impossible to sit on my knees.

My shins are just too long. It doesn't look natural - especially when I sit on my knees. Heels almost stick out from my butt then.

When I do the splits, which I still can on a good day, I can't grab on to my feet bc my legs are too long for my arms. It's BEYOND unnatural. Every gymnast can grab their feet - but me. And it's bc I can't reach them anymore. It looks W E I R D !!!

Standing up I can't reach my feet. It's also unnatural. Sure, some days I can, but not easy - like before.

My stamina is like a 60-year old.

Doing properly squats is very dangerous for my back bc my total biomechanics are changed and altered. I have to do it in the machines. But I'm still strong in my legs compared to most people.

If anything touches the lower screws in my tibias I want to die bc of the pain it gives for one second.

Don't do more than 5cm on tibias god damn it!!!!!!

------------------

My doctor measured me last week. I was 179,5cm tall. It felt good. I asked for the checkup I did with him back in 2011 and checked my height. It said 173cm tall.
He didn't notice by the way......

The fact that I'm now around average is actually very satisfactory for me. I went to India, sure, but I got the height. No question about it.
The one thing that bothers me the most is my broken foot. Everything else is tolerable and right before I broke my foot I ran 10km in 55 minutes.

I haven't started working yet. I'm still in school and will do so until June 2017. Hopefully after that I will get a very good office job where I can relax my destroyed body, my new destroyed TALL body.
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theuprising

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #77 on: January 24, 2016, 06:59:53 AM »

Respect to Sweden where its due. For the newbies although the permanent decrease in athleticism is better known now he was warning people about doing over 5cm years ago when it was common to see diaries of guys doing 7,8 even 9 cm on tibia!
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Overdozer

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #78 on: January 24, 2016, 07:18:14 AM »

Respect to Sweden where its due. For the newbies although the permanent decrease in athleticism is better known now he was warning people about doing over 5cm years ago when it was common to see diaries of guys doing 7,8 even 9 cm on tibia!

Yet we still see people doing 7-9 cms on femurs, which is in no way better. The biomechanics are changed anyways and squatting is much harder with longer femurs.

Thanks for being honest, Sweden. Even for me it's a good read. However, I believe most of your negative effects come from complications namely x-legs and broken foot, the later isn't even related to LL. If you get to fix your foot and x-legs and remove the rod, you should feel much better I think.
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Pre-surgery - 167 cm, Post-surgery - 181 cm
Final arm span - 177 cm, Sitting height - 90 cm

Lengthened 7.5 cm in tibias and femurs and 3.5 cm in each humerus. Surgeries performed all external by Dr. Kulesh, in Saint-Petersburg, Russia - http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=1671.0

Sweden

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #79 on: January 24, 2016, 10:41:45 AM »

It's not very painful. Just daily difficulties.

I regret going past my goal of 6cm. I went for 7cm bc the other guys looked good even after doing 8cm.

It will be impossible to fix my X-legs and the foot. The foot has already healed improperly and it's the femurs that are twisted which causes the X-legs.

LL will fk your body up.
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173cm before LL with Sarin, jan -13. Now 180cm tall. Considering 5cm on femurs.

chineseguy

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #80 on: January 24, 2016, 12:25:45 PM »

if time is reverse before you did ll,   will you do ll again?   if yes,   how many cm
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Thatdude950

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #81 on: January 26, 2016, 05:41:06 AM »

Respect to Sweden where its due. For the newbies although the permanent decrease in athleticism is better known now he was warning people about doing over 5cm years ago when it was common to see diaries of guys doing 7,8 even 9 cm on tibia!

Nothing but respect for Sweden & his honesty.
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mrblack

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #82 on: January 26, 2016, 11:04:05 AM »

I understand when people who are perhaps only 150cm want to be 170 cm and not 160 cm, which is still short. But it does not help if you risk very serious complications with every inch more.

Diaries are always mentioned here and many users are really afraid because of negative reports of other patients. But in my opinion you must not overlook one thing. If everything went well, you are not so motivated to register to a forum and share your story with the world as if something went wrong because then you are pissed of and disappointed and want to warn other people! So its very important to get to know patients with limb lengthening procedures who had bad experiences and find out what went wrong. I appreciate that these patients share their information with us. Such diaries have to be taken very seriously but perhaps, been weighted too heavily. I am convinced that there are also many happy, satisfied but unknown patients with successful surgeries and recoveries of whom we know nothing because they never write and tell a word about their cases.
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Thatdude950

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #83 on: January 26, 2016, 11:42:33 AM »

^There are a number of diaries which begin *before* the day of surgery, or very close to it.
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aspirant185

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #84 on: January 26, 2016, 12:11:13 PM »

I understand when people who are perhaps only 150cm want to be 170 cm and not 160 cm, which is still short. But it does not help if you risk very serious complications with every inch more.

Diaries are always mentioned here and many users are really afraid because of negative reports of other patients. But in my opinion you must not overlook one thing. If everything went well, you are not so motivated to register to a forum and share your story with the world as if something went wrong because then you are pissed of and disappointed and want to warn other people! So its very important to get to know patients with limb lengthening procedures who had bad experiences and find out what went wrong. I appreciate that these patients share their information with us. Such diaries have to be taken very seriously but perhaps, been weighted too heavily. I am convinced that there are also many happy, satisfied but unknown patients with successful surgeries and recoveries of whom we know nothing because they never write and tell a word about their cases.

I totally agree. I believe the overwhelmingly vast majority of patients are perfectly fine, their surgeries went without problems. Whether they are happy with their proportions and new height and in life, in general, that is another questions. But from purely surgical point of view I am absolutely certain that almost all surgeries, statistically speaking, go without complications. People are just not into writing in online forums. Especially when everything is fine. If it is not, they might consider asking for an advice or warning others but otherwise they just move on with their life.
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Current afternoon height: 175.5 cm
Wingspan - 182 cm
Target height 184 cm
Considering doing 4.3 cm Femurs and 4.2 cm Tibias with Dr. Milorad Mitkovic in Serbia.

crimsontide

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #85 on: February 08, 2016, 03:47:06 AM »

I got bad news fior you guys doing ll


i should have listened to swden... dont go over 5 cm if u must do this surgery

something ive never brought up either

even before my achilles surgery... when i was in morocco..  i would walk  to the bathroom and back..

now one day, i noticed something... it just seemed like i had lost power.... didnt think much of it at that time, but it was noticeable...

this occurred around 5 cm or so

now if i hadnt gotten the achilles surgery, id  be better... and i still think ill recover,  even if i have to do more surgeries, and get a prosthesis.. i think ill be walking ok again

dont go over 5 cm..... my ballerina and power issues seemingly overnight...


dont do this surgery... if you do it, then  5 cm max

what swden says about not doing thihs even if he has to, i can relate to that

 for me, and im sure for himself too,  I wouldn't think about going for a walk, or having to run if needed.. it was so easy and natural

now its something that's constantly on my mind...

only way either of us is gonna be ok is if exchanged our  current legs with better ones

its not biomechanics.. its the stretching of the tendons, nerves and muscles, along with bone issues


dont get this surgery
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crimsontide

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #86 on: February 08, 2016, 03:54:28 AM »

another thing

 getting a rod in your legs will make it hard to kneel

my left leg  hurts like hell when i kneel because of the rod and screws... right one is ok


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hyong

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #87 on: February 12, 2016, 06:04:17 AM »

It's not very painful. Just daily difficulties.

I regret going past my goal of 6cm. I went for 7cm bc the other guys looked good even after doing 8cm.

It will be impossible to fix my X-legs and the foot. The foot has already healed improperly and it's the femurs that are twisted which causes the X-legs.

LL will fk your body up.


Sweden,
i am at the same height as you before LL, do u feel the last cm had a hugh impact on ur  bio-mechanics and recovery ?

i am thinking of 6cm at most, i would be happy with 179, but i have short legs, mine seating height is similar to mine 5'10 friend, but mine legs..............
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Sweden

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #88 on: February 15, 2016, 02:13:04 PM »


Sweden,
i am at the same height as you before LL, do u feel the last cm had a hugh impact on ur  bio-mechanics and recovery ?

i am thinking of 6cm at most, i would be happy with 179, but i have short legs, mine seating height is similar to mine 5'10 friend, but mine legs..............

If you're 179 right now you are a total idiot if you do LL.

You will mess up your body for life. You need to get it that doing more than 5cm is catastrophic. Doing LL at your current starting height is useless and insane.

Don't do it.
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173cm before LL with Sarin, jan -13. Now 180cm tall. Considering 5cm on femurs.

Alittletooshort

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #89 on: February 15, 2016, 02:40:52 PM »

If you're 179 right now you are a total idiot if you do LL.

You will mess up your body for life. You need to get it that doing more than 5cm is catastrophic. Doing LL at your current starting height is useless and insane.

Don't do it.
No, he is 171 (or something around that height) If I remeber correcctly.
Aren´t you still thinking about femur lengthening?
How much better do you think would your recovery have been if you had only lengthened 3,5-4cm´s instead of the 7 you did?
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applesandoranges

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #90 on: February 15, 2016, 02:45:30 PM »

Sweden, my tibias measure in at 38cm long. If I keep lengthening to around 10%, so 4cm gain, would that be catastrophic? I value your opinion more since you actually did LL. Also In your opinion would I make a recovery close to 100%? do I need Achilles lengthening?
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crimsontide

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #91 on: February 15, 2016, 04:14:37 PM »

it's not the biomechanics, its the  soft tissue stretching which really messes everything up
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chineseguy

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Re: Permanent effects of LL
« Reply #92 on: February 15, 2016, 04:54:47 PM »

Crimson,   if i lengthen only 5 cm,  will it be alot better?
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