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Author Topic: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy  (Read 14292 times)

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8cm

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Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« on: April 07, 2014, 10:28:38 AM »

This is my first post to this forum but I have been following it pretty closely for a couple of months now. To start off, I recently made the decision to one day(hopefully within the next year) go through with LL. One of the primary reasons I felt comfortable reaching this conclusion was having found a doctor with as stellar a reputation as Dr. Paley. Knowing that I could do this surgery with relative safety and trust in my doctor gave me a great deal of assurance. Recently however I have come across a few things that have made me wonder if I am misguided about Dr. Paley. I honestly hope I am wrong about this and you guys can give me some insight.

The patient diaries on here and just the general tone on here clearly indicate that Dr. Paley is absolutely world class and respected internationally. While I know this to be true (come on the dude was on Oprah), my suspicions were first aroused when I noticed a post a few months back from BilateralDamage in which he(as well as a few other users) commented that Dr. Paley may or may not have had a deal with old forum . I have seen users dispute this and others express general confusion, does anyone have any clear insight on this? Clearly Bilateral must have changed his mind as he has ultimately chosen Dr. Paley.

After becoming a bit worried after finding this I looked at some general review sites for Dr. Paley which mostly showed reviews from parents who brought their children to Dr. Paley. http://www.vitals.com/doctors/Dr_Dror_Paley/reviews
The reviews on Vital.com range from entirely positive to a surprisingly large number of negative reviews. Many seem simply upset with Paley's ckiness and lack of time which isn't at all surprising for a world-class surgeon. However, I haven't seen anyone complaining about his demeanor the way any of these reviews do. And then there a number which claim he actually botched their operations. Could Bilateral or Sweatpants maybe speak to these issues.

If that wasn't enough to scare the crap out of me I then found this review site: http://www.ratemds.com/doctor-ratings/30268/Dr-Dror-Paley-West+Palm+Beach-FL.html.
Not only did I find more negative reviews but one alleges that Dr. Paley was forced to leave his position in Baltimore due to splitting profits from the devices he was using! Supposedly the device rep. was also his girlfriend. Did anyone ever hear about this? This makes me suspicious about his relationship with the PRECICE manufacturers since he is of course involved in the development of the device. Yet if he stands to gain financially from its sale he may be overestimating its efficacy. Further, this seems to lend credence to previous allegations that he had some shady deal going on at old forum . That part still sounds strange since even the average ortho surgeon makes in the upper 6 figures, so Paley is no doubt beyond well off. Why would he resort to such shady tactics? He does nearly a thousand non-cosmetic operations a year what does he need the extra business for??

Finally (sorry i'm typing a wall of text here guys), I decided to do a search on old forum  and found a number of posts questioning his legitimacy. Specifically, a number of old forum  had made allegations against him regarding bad operations. Unfortunately I haven't been able to see the content of these threads since they have been deleted from old forum  (go-figure). Maybe some of the older users here who perhaps remember these allegations can shed some light? The best I can do is link to people referring to these allegations and questioning them without much help. One user mentioned a number of unhappy surprises he experienced with Paley, promised to update with details, and then did not seem to do so(unless he did on another thread I could not find).

Okay if anyone actually had the patience to read through all that I thank you. Basically finding out about Paley with his incredible reputation was the confidence I needed to go through with LL. Now all this information is casting doubt on that. Honestly I want LL so badly I hope these are just rumors but altogether I am getting a bit nervous now. Anyone with insight please contribute!
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 10:45:52 AM by 8cm »
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ChrisIsaak

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2014, 10:42:42 AM »

Although this is never written in the forums, it is true that Dr.Paley was forced to leave his position at Baltimore. I would prefer to keep my source secret (although you can imagine how many doctors and physios I've been in contact with, and of course they know a lot about each other). However, I don't know the exact reason why he was forced to leave. I've heard that he performed surgeries abroad (like in Saudi Arabia) for wealthy patients and that's why he got in trouble with the hospital, but I honestly don't know if this is true or not.
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Polycrates.

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2014, 12:24:49 PM »

Every man has his past. Show me one person in the world that has an absolute stellar reputation and not one detractor. In terms of experience and honesty, from what I've witnessed in news articles and in video clips, Paley is near the top of the pyramid, relative to other doctors, of benevolence when it comes to the charity meter of MDs.
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Tibial LON for 6cm- Nov 2013, Dr Sringari -177/178cm to 183/184cm
Prospective Femoral Lengthening w/ Precise 3 (if out) Nail for 7cm- Jan 2019, Dr Birkholtz -183/184cm to 190/191cm

And it was here that he professed to his disciples: all of life's bounties lay somewhere upon the dreaded bell curve

HK

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2014, 12:31:22 PM »

Hi,

Indeed, there is a cancelled thread about him on old forum  but you can also see some posts about Paley in a thread called "Knee pain after LL". The poster is sallythrusters.
As for him leaving Baltimore, it's the same mystery than Guichet leaving France. Business reasons or serious problems.
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8cm

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2014, 03:51:32 PM »

Thanks for responding guys.

ChrisIsaak, why do you think that isn't discussed? Do people just not know or is this just a result of some sort of bias?

Polycrates I totally agree with you I wouldn't expect anyone to have a perfect past, but being removed from a hospital is worse than what ever happens to most doctors. If the allegations of botches surgeries are also correct it is hard to say. Then again, if it was something truly awful his medical license would have been comprised in the US. Clearly that's not the case.

HK, I haven't been able to find the thread you mentioned but did see someone else refer to the poster as sallystruther? I'm not sure but I did find a different allegation from another user on old forum (link removed).
« Last Edit: April 07, 2014, 05:13:28 PM by 8cm »
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HK

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2014, 04:41:01 PM »

   
Re: Knee pain after LL
« Reply #35 on: January 11, 2013, 03:48:26 PM »
Hi All,

I had heard about this forum, but never visited it until recently.  I felt compelled to speak out after undergoing LL (Precice internal nail) last year.  Like someone else already said here, all I read is this frenzy over gaining height without discussion of consequences or long-term effects.  After my experience, I can't imagine anyone ever choosing to do this voluntarily. 

I have significant knee pain and problems.  I underwent LL with Dr.  Paley last year.  I have abandoned him, because I don't care for the man - I read the part about him being on the "good" list and as I read through the answers to the questions, I thought, "LIE, LIE, LIE. " Dr.  Paley will give you the absolute best-case scenario.  He provides virtually no aftercare.  His cost estimates are extremely conservative - prepare to be inundated by what I call the Paley Racket in South Florida.  You will end up needing LOTS of things that aren't stated there - basically, you need to have access to virtually unlimited funds (I know, I shared a lot of my resources with the ones who were self-pay, because I felt so bad for them).  It actually depends on who you are, as he's very preferential about his patients.  I think I know more former patients who hate the man and are in bad predicaments, than those that had success.  That's not to say you can't have a success story with him - but I don't think you're getting the whole picture here.  All I read is sunshine and daisies, and that couldn't be farther from the truth.  Also, Dr.  Paley told me personally that he cannot say no to anyone and that's extremely concerning (quantity over quality).  He is but one man, but thinks he can operate on anyone that walks through the door.  There are finite limits to what one man can do, and he ignores them.  It's downright scary.  If you are hellbent on getting it done with Paley, consider NOT doing it during the American summer, which is when all his kid patients are trying to get their surgeries done.  It's a madhouse and mistakes happen.  Scary, scary mistakes.  Like someone getting the nail in the wrong leg.  Like your lengthening stopping, but it takes them 10 days to catch it, potentially creating the need for another surgery to re-break the bone.

I still have many months to go before my local doctor and I determine if I will need more surgeries.  I hope that I don't, but I've had to deal with a lot of anger over what I felt like was deception - they really didn't know what they were doing with the Precice nail, and my one surgery turned into three.  Could you afford an extra $50K, which is what my surgeries #2 and #3 cost?

Again, I am friends with some people who went through LL with NO problems.  Is it worth the risk to you to not know whether you'll be in that group? Think long and hard about it before you choose to do LL.  If anyone wants to send me a private message about specific questions, I'll be happy to answer.  My desire wasn't to come here and shi* all over the boards about what a disaster it is, but I at least wanted to put some caution out here where there doesn't seem to be much.  A last comment - males seem to have better success at LL than females, which is probably most of the forum users here.  If you're female and considering this, I'd probably try to talk you out of it.  The people I know who succeeded - males; the people I know with problems now - females.  I don't know why that is.

The fact is, I don't think they really know how LL affects you later in life.  I know many people with significant knee issues following LL.  I also know people who underwent lengthening via external fixators years and years ago, and are now experiencing the effects of that - it's not good.


==> That's sallystruthers' post. Page 2 of "Knee pain after LL".
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KiloKAHN

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2014, 04:41:32 PM »

Hi 8cm,

Interesting thread. There may be some things we don't know about certain doctors, but if the question is about legitimacy, Dr. Paley is as legit as you can get in doing LL. Every doctor has complications, which just go along with Ilizarov techniques.

Also,

If you are still able to edit your post, please remove the url to old forum  from your post as it is against one of the site rules to link directly to old forum .

Thanks.
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Initial height: 164 cm / ~5'5" (Surgery on 6/25/2014)
Current height: 170 cm / 5'7" (Frames removed 6/29/2015)
External Tibia lengthening performed by Dr Mangal Parihar in Mumbai, India.
My Cosmetic Leg Lengthening Experience

Cooper

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2014, 04:45:08 PM »

It takes years of experience to perfect the procedure. CLL is very complicated  surgery with lots of moving parts. Every patient is so different and the same routine might result different outcome. There are certainly risk associated with this surgery. The question is who is most experience not only on LL but other non CLL case. Have the doctor seen vitually all types of complication before and knows exactly how to handle seamlessly. That is why dr. Paley tops the list with some other doctor with his vast experience. He has done 13,000 LL surgery, probably the record in the industry.
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Starting Height: 160
Gained Femur: 6.9cm (Dr. Paley)
Right Tibia Goal: 5.5/6CM

manderin

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2014, 03:39:23 PM »

males seem to have better success at LL than females, which is probably most of the forum users here.  If you're female and considering this, I'd probably try to talk you out of it.  The people I know who succeeded - males; the people I know with problems now - females.  I don't know why that is.

==> That's sallystruthers' post. Page 2 of "Knee pain after LL".

Even females who do not get LL tend to have more knee problems than males and more knee sports injuries in the knees too.  The reason is because of the female pelvis being larger in proportion to the rest of her body.  It's where her center of gravity is.  This puts more strain on the knee joints than for a male.  I think that if the thighs are lengthened in a female it would aggravate the knees even more because the wider pelvis makes the thigh bone (and therefore also the knees) turn more inward for balance, but I don't see why lengthening the calves would.

http://www.healthcommunities.com/knee-pain/women-sports-injuries.crapml
« Last Edit: July 21, 2014, 03:57:21 PM by manderin »
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programdude

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #9 on: July 21, 2014, 04:11:24 PM »

Well, I'm going with Paley. I can't say for certainty that theres no risk in going with him, but keep in mind that when dealing with the sheer volume of surgeries he does its not that outrageous that there have been a few less than ideal experiences.

Paley did explicitly state to me that:
1. With the exception of a patient who did not follow instruction, no one has needed a second surgery. Another user here has disputed the legitimacy of his claim and also referenced two female patients who had screws come out.
2. When I inquired about this he indicated that they were female and it was on their tibia, which heightened the risk of this. And that I was "worrying too much".
3. He did state that I would be able to achieve the full amount I desired and that no one had ever stopped lengthening to the limit unless they wanted to leave for unrelated reasons.

I will be reporting here pretty diligently, after my surgery which is tomorrow. You can be sure anything shady going on I will very vocally report. Granted being female or having tibia operated on may prove very different than what I am signing up for.

It is worth noting I have yet to see a single negative post on either forum about Paley(although maybe some were screened as indicated in this thread), which is a good indicator because if someone A. Ruins your legs aka you life or B. lies to you costing you tens of thousands, you'd better believe that you'd be on here posting to no end.

Also, his attitude I could see people being very off put by, and yes he is constantly rescheduling people. Including myself for both my appointments. However, if he has the skill to back up his attitude I see no problem with it. If I was a miracle worker and made what he did I'd be in my own bubble too. He has responded very quickly to emails after my consultation(within an hour), so I think he has a certain respect for those who are actually his patients, but regards those still on the fence about surgery lowly.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

programdude

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #10 on: July 21, 2014, 04:17:16 PM »

Well, I'm going with Paley. I can't say for certainty that theres no risk in going with him, but keep in mind that when dealing with the sheer volume of surgeries he does its not that outrageous that there have been a few less than ideal experiences.

Paley did explicitly state to me that:
1. With the exception of a patient who did not follow instruction, no one has needed a second surgery. Another user here has disputed the legitimacy of his claim and also referenced two female patients who had screws come out.
2. When I inquired about this he indicated that they were female and it was on their tibia, which heightened the risk of this. And that I was "worrying too much".
3. He did state that I would be able to achieve the full amount I desired and that no one had ever stopped lengthening to the limit unless they wanted to leave for unrelated reasons.

I will be reporting here pretty diligently, after my surgery which is tomorrow. You can be sure anything shady going on I will very vocally report. Granted being female or having tibia operated on may prove very different than what I am signing up for.

It is worth noting I have yet to see a single negative post on either forum about Paley(although maybe some were screened as indicated in this thread), which is a good indicator because if someone A. Ruins your legs aka you life or B. lies to you costing you tens of thousands, you'd better believe that you'd be on here posting to no end.

Also, his attitude I could see people being very off put by, and yes he is constantly rescheduling people. Including myself for both my appointments- But his building is genuinely extremely busy. However, if he has the skill to back up his attitude I see no problem with it. If I was a miracle worker and made what he did I'd be in my own bubble too. He has responded very quickly to emails after my consultation(within an hour), so I think he has a certain respect for those who are actually his patients, but regards those still on the fence about surgery lowly.

My biggest issue so far is with the St. Marys staff, who were totally incompetent in confirming my payments being received, resulting in a big headache and phone tag with my bank, as well as never responding about my pre surgical evaluation papers arriving. These are however, totally irrelevant issues to me if the surgery and recovery go well.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

ReadRothbard

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #11 on: October 06, 2014, 05:00:13 AM »

Stop right there. Questioning Dr. Paley is almost sacreligious. He is the closest thing there is to an infallible god in the ll community.
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“If you're afraid - don't do it, - if you're doing it - don't be afraid!” ― Genghis Khan

172 cm in the morning (67.8"); 170 cm (67”) at night; Sitting Height: 96 cm (37.8”); Goal: 184.5 cm (6'0.7"); Ultimate Goal: 192 cm (6’3.5) morning height, 190 cm (6’3) “night” height
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GROWtalORdieTRYING1

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #12 on: October 06, 2014, 07:46:44 AM »

my philosophy is question everything lol :)
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Ajax2thousand20

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #13 on: October 06, 2014, 08:39:15 AM »

From what I've seen, Paley is quick to reply and no one needed a second surgery. If I could pick any doctor to go to for free, I'd pick him in a nanosecond.
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Starting height: 185.5cms Goal/ dream height:190-193cms!
Sitting height:94 cms Arm Length: 86.5 cms 
Leg length:104 cms Arm Span:191 cms
Tibia: 48 cms Femurs:55cms

GROWtalORdieTRYING1

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2014, 09:46:03 AM »

I agree that paley seems like a good doctor.

but I don't plan on going with him so I have not researched him thoroughly.


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GeTs

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #15 on: October 06, 2014, 01:00:20 PM »

Stop right there. Questioning Dr. Paley is almost sacreligious. He is the closest thing there is to an infallible god in the ll community.
ahahahah,pls tellme u're joking
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programdude

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #16 on: October 06, 2014, 01:33:15 PM »

So far so good with Paley. Many satisfied patients, even females who have had complications seem content.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

chrisperez

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2014, 02:19:03 PM »

Dr. Paley tells everyone that he doesn't have complications. What females had complications you know? I know he had patients with fat embolism. One almost died. How can he say he doesn't have complications?
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ReadRothbard

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #18 on: October 06, 2014, 02:21:08 PM »

ahahahah,pls tellme u're joking

Not really. Dr. Paley is essentially the gold standard for leg lengthening--cosmetic or otherwise.
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“If you're afraid - don't do it, - if you're doing it - don't be afraid!” ― Genghis Khan

172 cm in the morning (67.8"); 170 cm (67”) at night; Sitting Height: 96 cm (37.8”); Goal: 184.5 cm (6'0.7"); Ultimate Goal: 192 cm (6’3.5) morning height, 190 cm (6’3) “night” height
Future space tycoon

programdude

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2014, 01:16:03 AM »

Dr. Paley tells everyone that he doesn't have complications. What females had complications you know? I know he had patients with fat embolism. One almost died. How can he say he doesn't have complications?

I think he means with the actual formation of the bone like pre consolidation, rods failing etc. I will admit I don't think he is totally honest in the sense that I know the patients who had the embolism, and one other patients here had their rods stop at 7 cm. But as far as any males having femur issues before 7 cm I've heard nothing and I have met many people here and heard of many many more.

Tibias, especially tibias on female are a very different story. Two females including one on these forums had screws come out, and one of them had a contracture. Then there is the case with the males screws. I would hope Paley would honestly express these risks, specifically to females. The number one thing I'd yell to any female is to not do internal tibia unless you are 100% ready and expecting to pay upwards of 50k.

Its also worth mentioning that the first precice 2 break, at least with paley, just occurred. However this was two months post finishing lengthening with the patient walking before consolidation. A 30 thousand dollar mistake, and the fault of the patient(and to an extent the precices limitations), not Paley.

As for questioning Paley being sacrilege- I think thats true in the sense that pretty undeniably he is the best if price is no object and comes with the immense perk of the PT center that works in harmony with the PA's and Paley. I find a lot of people are wanting this done so badly they want to get it done as cheap as possible and ignore that the PT and X-rays is included with Paley which makes the savings with another internal doctor somewhat negligible since those are both mandatory, and slacking with them will result in a worse outcome or outright disaster. I've met people who had their first operations in Europe and say it is a night and day difference here- And also that while there they had seen patients who still hadn't walked after two years.

Now is that to say no other dr. can't perform the operation? Nope. Paley himself has called Dr. G and M "decent", but that they make a critical mistake with how(I believe) they insert the screws, which he said can and has led to issues. However you can look at diaries and see plenty of success stories- with shy shy being the most impressive documented recovery I've seen.

As for things I can attest to that are somewhat questionable they do exist, but it doesn't pertain to his actual skill with surgery or the team. One of the sketchier things was when my friend from hong kong had his IT bands getting incredibly tight to the point he would have to stop around 5 CM because he did not get a release initially. He wanted a release and Paley quoted it at a whopping 15k. When he sought to schedule a date for surgery he was quoted an outrageous 25k and decided to go home.

His consultations are very expensive(x rays are not included in that already high price) and I don't believe properly detail the difficulties of LL. They make it seem significantly easier than it is. For example they said ANYONE can reach 8 CM and everyone does unless they decided to go home. Thats a meaningless statement since sometimes they decide to go home because they cannot take it. I've heard of one guy who stopped before an inch and another who stopped after a few mm.

At the consult I also mentioned I'd be coming alone, and they mentioned I'd need help for two weeks but would be otherwise fine. When I came for surgery after paying they were suddenly a lot less enthusiastic about me being here alone, and when I had a discrepancy early on and they wanted me to lengthen lying on my side with someone helping me and I said I hadn't brought anyone he said "programdude, buddy, we talked about this", implying I should have had someone with me to which I responded with "yes we did and you said it would be fine". Things ended up fine for me, but this is sort of to point out how things are sunshine and rainbows before they get your money.

However, especially after going through this, I think the extra expertise and PT more than justify the costs. If you are a US native even more so because of the benefits insurance may offer towards your nursing aids, medication, and x rays.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

Polycrates.

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #20 on: October 07, 2014, 02:11:26 AM »

I've never personally met Dr. Paley, so I cannot judge his character or surgical ability, but I do respect the work he's done for charity and people truly in need. He's clearly capable of performing this surgery, however from the information I've gathered from people I've recently met in the States who have first hand experience with him, he may very well be quite egotistical and unforgiving at times. I've been told that you should have infinite dollars when going with Paley, because you never know when new charges will arise.

I've concluded that any doctor you see out there heavily investing in advertisement to attract cosmetic LL interest has sold their soul and is now looking to cash in. People have to remember that this ultimately boils down to business and profitability for the doctor at the end of the day. You shouldn't let your desperation blind you from this reality.
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Tibial LON for 6cm- Nov 2013, Dr Sringari -177/178cm to 183/184cm
Prospective Femoral Lengthening w/ Precise 3 (if out) Nail for 7cm- Jan 2019, Dr Birkholtz -183/184cm to 190/191cm

And it was here that he professed to his disciples: all of life's bounties lay somewhere upon the dreaded bell curve

programdude

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #21 on: October 07, 2014, 02:22:38 AM »

I've never personally met Dr. Paley, so I cannot judge his character or surgical ability, but I do respect the work he's done for charity and people truly in need. He's clearly capable of performing this surgery, however from the information I've gathered from people I've recently met in the States who have first hand experience with him, he may very well be quite egotistical and unforgiving at times. I've been told that you should have infinite dollars when going with Paley, because you never know when new charges will arise.

I've concluded that any doctor you see out there heavily investing in advertisement to attract cosmetic LL interest has sold their soul and is now looking to cash in. People have to remember that this ultimately boils down to business and profitability for the doctor at the end of the day. You shouldn't let your desperation blind you from this reality.

Paley absolutely has an ego and from what I've heard his bedside manners not great in general. But from my experience its been fine, and again I've met plenty of people none of them so off put by it that its a problem for them. Safety should be the top concern so as long as it doesn't interfere with that I don't think its a real issue.

As for expenses, out of the many people I've met only a female doing tibia had to spend additional cash.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

alps

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #22 on: October 07, 2014, 06:00:20 AM »

Why do people call him an angel? I've myself seen two patients say that. Not sure who.
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programdude

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Re: Questions on Dr. Paley's Legitimacy
« Reply #23 on: October 07, 2014, 07:54:17 AM »

Why do people call him an angel? I've myself seen two patients say that. Not sure who.
At least from my experience, the non cosmetic patients here view him as saintly, since from their perspective insurance is covering everything and this guy with incredible skills is doing the "impossible" and healing them.
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Dr. Paley Patient- Surgery completed successfully on July 22nd
My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +
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