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Author Topic: Risks/Complications Of LL  (Read 80898 times)

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Muse

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Risks/Complications Of LL
« on: May 20, 2014, 12:15:40 PM »

What Tall says is true. The very first thing I came to terms with was accepting/expecting this to be the most painful experience ever. If it isn't, then great, but you should be expecting it to be bad. Remember there are some who pay for the operation and quiet after a CM due to pain.

You are destroying your body and building it anew. Safety should be a concern, but pain, while a factor, will not be avoided.

Some people think that's it's just a pain thing and then that's it, increased height.  But unfortunately, it is not.

I communicated with too many people who learned so the hard way.   This is a combination of feedback I received from a few people who has already done limb lengthening via both internal and external methods:

"Pain during this procedure should be the least of ones concerns....it's the lingering after effects of doing limb lengthening that people should be concerned about.

Whether that be

- nerve damage (numbness, altered sensation, painful supersensitivity (from neuromas formations),
- paralysis, or reduced motor function or response times, especially in high level sports);
- pain and stiffness from internal trauma and scarring;
- bio mechanical load changes and it's added load stresses on joints (back, hip, knees, and ankles) leading to pain and possible early Arthritis
- reduced Athletic response time and abilities;
- permanent muscle / adipose tissue damage / atrophy; mobility issues; reduced agility;
- osteoporosis and increased chances of osteochonral lesions;
- lingering aches and pains months or years, or even a lifetime after the lengthening is complete and you say Good Bye to your CLL doctor.etc."

One may or may not notice or realize it at the beginning, but long term, it's a different story.

This is not simply working out and building anew like some people put it....if it was, then there would be a whole lot less lasting complications since people would recover completely from it...

But unfortunately, Limb lengthening surgery is not like working out like how some people think it is...it's not just going through some pain and then rebuilding back stronger.

Instead, this is more like how a healthy athlete/person who gets in a serious injury, such as in a sporting accident or car accident, and has to undergoes traumatic surgery which cuts open, damages, scars (internally and externally) and alters the natural body...sure they may recover to a point...but they will never be like their PRE-surgical / PRE-injured self.

If physical pain during the lengthening procedure, as well as the cost and time; were the only things one has to deal with when undergoing Limb Lengthening, then this would be heaven....but unfortunately, it is not.

Countless patients in the past, who lengthened various amounts with various Doctors (From the some of the best, to some of the worst) and various techniques (internal, external, or both) have found out.

This is the reality, and even though people may not want to hear, I feel it's something people need to know beforehand because it's critically important for their lives, before making this life-altering decision.

Of course, if the mental anguish of height neurosis is so bad, and if you feel that you will miss out more in life due to height prejudice / height neurosis even though you would be at peak physical healthiness / abilities, then maybe it's worth sacrificing some (or a lot) of physical freedom / health to open one's life up to the increased benefits from the increased height.

Height increase does have its benefits, but there will always be a cost, and it's not just temporary Lengthening pain, money, or time...a lot of times, it's more.

But then again, physical abilities go down overtime anyway, but the life you have with the increased in height, well that may be worth it...in the end, one must decide which possible path is the best for them to live the fullest life possible with the least amount of restrictions ...if it has to be with the height then maybe height increase is worth it.

But if the height is not really something that's worth permanently damaging yourself or losing a portion of your athletic / everyday freedom, as well as being symptom-free from ongoing aches, pains, nerve damages, and increased risk of other physical consequences in the future, then maybe one should work on their mental state and other physical attributes like working out, rather then their height."

« Last Edit: May 20, 2014, 12:22:50 PM by Dameon »
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BilateralDamage

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2014, 03:41:36 PM »

Dameon, that was a fantastic post.  You should sticky that somewhere on the forums.  Too many users here are unaware that there's permanent side effects to LL and that this is something that's unavoidable.  When I read that people want to run faster with longer legs or start a professional sports career, I just shake my head.  You cannot stretch and build muscle through these problems, they will definitely affect you regardless of your PT.  Your body is not at a naturally increased height, you are the product of artificial lengthening.  Saying you can run faster after LL is like saying muscle implants in your arms will make you lift more weights.  ::)
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Moubgf

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2014, 05:13:40 PM »

Some people think that's it's just a pain thing and then that's it, increased height.  But unfortunately, it is not.

I communicated with too many people who learned so the hard way.   This is a combination of feedback I received from a few people who has already done limb lengthening via both internal and external methods:

"Pain during this procedure should be the least of ones concerns....it's the lingering after effects of doing limb lengthening that people should be concerned about.

Whether that be

- nerve damage (numbness, altered sensation, painful supersensitivity (from neuromas formations),
- paralysis, or reduced motor function or response times, especially in high level sports);
- pain and stiffness from internal trauma and scarring;
- bio mechanical load changes and it's added load stresses on joints (back, hip, knees, and ankles) leading to pain and possible early Arthritis
- reduced Athletic response time and abilities;
- permanent muscle / adipose tissue damage / atrophy; mobility issues; reduced agility;
- osteoporosis and increased chances of osteochonral lesions;
- lingering aches and pains months or years, or even a lifetime after the lengthening is complete and you say Good Bye to your CLL doctor.etc."

One may or may not notice or realize it at the beginning, but long term, it's a different story.

This is not simply working out and building anew like some people put it....if it was, then there would be a whole lot less lasting complications since people would recover completely from it...

But unfortunately, Limb lengthening surgery is not like working out like how some people think it is...it's not just going through some pain and then rebuilding back stronger.

Instead, this is more like how a healthy athlete/person who gets in a serious injury, such as in a sporting accident or car accident, and has to undergoes traumatic surgery which cuts open, damages, scars (internally and externally) and alters the natural body...sure they may recover to a point...but they will never be like their PRE-surgical / PRE-injured self.

If physical pain during the lengthening procedure, as well as the cost and time; were the only things one has to deal with when undergoing Limb Lengthening, then this would be heaven....but unfortunately, it is not.

Countless patients in the past, who lengthened various amounts with various Doctors (From the some of the best, to some of the worst) and various techniques (internal, external, or both) have found out.

This is the reality, and even though people may not want to hear, I feel it's something people need to know beforehand because it's critically important for their lives, before making this life-altering decision.

Of course, if the mental anguish of height neurosis is so bad, and if you feel that you will miss out more in life due to height prejudice / height neurosis even though you would be at peak physical healthiness / abilities, then maybe it's worth sacrificing some (or a lot) of physical freedom / health to open one's life up to the increased benefits from the increased height.

Height increase does have its benefits, but there will always be a cost, and it's not just temporary Lengthening pain, money, or time...a lot of times, it's more.

But then again, physical abilities go down overtime anyway, but the life you have with the increased in height, well that may be worth it...in the end, one must decide which possible path is the best for them to live the fullest life possible with the least amount of restrictions ...if it has to be with the height then maybe height increase is worth it.

But if the height is not really something that's worth permanently damaging yourself or losing a portion of your athletic / everyday freedom, as well as being symptom-free from ongoing aches, pains, nerve damages, and increased risk of other physical consequences in the future, then maybe one should work on their mental state and other physical attributes like working out, rather then their height."


meh...as long as i can run i be straight. Of all the videos i've seen of people they all are running at 80% speed hell i cant even do that now. So the pain and all that bullcrap is overrated. If everything goes as it should. e.g no pin infection no traumatic experience while lengthening all these things.


IF EVERYTHING GOES As IT SHOULD DURING LENGTHENING YOU ARE STRAIGHT. AND CAN MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE.
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Gichelu

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #3 on: May 20, 2014, 05:56:49 PM »

Dameon, that was a fantastic post.  You should sticky that somewhere on the forums.  Too many users here are unaware that there's permanent side effects to LL and that this is something that's unavoidable.  When I read that people want to run faster with longer legs or start a professional sports career, I just shake my head.  You cannot stretch and build muscle through these problems, they will definitely affect you regardless of your PT.  Your body is not at a naturally increased height, you are the product of artificial lengthening.  Saying you can run faster after LL is like saying muscle implants in your arms will make you lift more weights.  ::)

That sounds like the theory of admin of the old forum.

"There has been an ongoing debate about how much athletic ability an LL patient can expect to have after they have fully healed from their lengthening. People like to discuss recovery in percentages. The only way to prove recovery based on a percentage would be to do athletic tests on a patient in elite physical shape before their LL, and then do those same tests on them after they have healed from their lengthening. This has so far never been done in a scientific study.

I would like to posit a theory. An elite athlete can actually become faster after LL than they were before. Here is my reasoning. The average male femur bone is 48 CM long and the average male tibia is 36 CM long. Lengthening the average femur 8 CM would be a 16% increase of that bone, and lengthening the average tibia 7 CM would be a 19% increase in length of that bone. The total increase of 15 CM on both sections would be an 18% increase in total bone length of both sections and thus increase the running stride of that average male by almost 17% (taking into consideration loss from other body parts involved in the stride, namely the feet). Even if that elite level athlete lost 5% or 10% of their maximum muscle strength and capacity because of damage to the tissues from being stretched, that loss would be eclipsed by the increased length of the running stride.

A non-athlete that does LL will most likely not train themselves back to a point of recovery that is beyond where they were physically before LL, or they probably would have been an athlete before LL. But an elite athlete that knows how to train their body to its maximum potential should be able to do LL, train themselves back to a near full recovery, and still make themselves faster than they were before LL because of their increased stride length."

http://www.scienceofrunning.com/2010/11/speed-stride-length-x-stride-frequency.html



meh...as long as i can run i be straight. Of all the videos i've seen of people they all are running at 80% speed hell i cant even do that now. So the pain and all that bullcrap is overrated. If everything goes as it should. e.g no pin infection no traumatic experience while lengthening all these things.


IF EVERYTHING GOES As IT SHOULD DURING LENGTHENING YOU ARE STRAIGHT. AND CAN MOVE ON WITH YOUR LIFE.

Why are you not even running 80% of what you could normally do? Injury or something? Because after lengthening you might get a reduction in speed from your already reduced speed.
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programdude

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #4 on: May 20, 2014, 06:02:33 PM »

I dont think if you go with a top doctor and follow their protocol, you will have serious issues. Of course there are isolated incidents and you WONT be quite as athletic as previously but you should be able to run, work out, walk. If sports were an important part of my life I don't think I'd consider LL. However unless you consider working out a sport, it isn't.

Also if you are REALLY short, even if you were to have some of the unfortunate side effects like knee pain for the rest of your life, it might be worth it. I know that my height has been somewhat mentally damaging to me at 5 8- I can't imagine the struggle of someone less than that unless they were somehow already set for life.
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My Diary for those who want a real play by play to know what to expect:http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=733.0

Starting height: 5 8
End Height-:5 11 +

Medium Drink Of Water

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #5 on: May 20, 2014, 08:39:50 PM »

Great post by Dameon here.  I have:

-Altered sensation in my knees when kneeling or touching them, around the IM nail insertion sites and around the osteotomy sites
-Stiffness in my knees unless I exercise regularly
-Hypersensitivity in my knees when kneeling on a hard surface
-Worse balance than before
-A left ostoetomy scar that's thin and weak, that I have to protect from getting bumped or it'll break and bleed
-Altered mechanics in my legs which led to exertional compartment syndrome when walking, requiring fasciotomy

I hope my posts and diary here don't whitewash the issues I've dealt with and continue to deal with as an LLer.  I did it and got my 3 inches without getting crippled.  Those 3 inches changed my life, but sacrifices were made.  LL is a tradeoff and there are consequences I'll have to live with from now on.
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Gained 3 inches on tibias (Ilizarov LON) in 2007 at the Beijing Institute of External Skeletal Fixation Technology with Prof. Hetao Xia and Dr. Aiming Peng.

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Blackhawk

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #6 on: May 20, 2014, 09:03:50 PM »

Hey MDOW,

Can you tell us more about this?


-Altered mechanics in my legs which led to exertional compartment syndrome when walking, requiring fasciotomy


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Medium Drink Of Water

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #7 on: May 20, 2014, 09:12:05 PM »

I haven't gotten to this point in my diary, so here's a brief summary...

LL changed the way I walk.  Because of this, the tibialis anterior muscle had to work harder than it was able to.  I couldn't walk very far without getting tired because walking became a serious workout for that specific muscle.  Pressure would build up because there was too much blood flowing into it.

The solution?  Cut a hole in the outer cover of the muscle so blood can flow out when the pressure gets too high.  The surgery was successful, so it ended up not being a serious complication of my LL in the long run.

What caused the problem?  I don't know for sure.  It could be that I lengthened too much, or it could be because they straightened my feet by rotating the entire leg below the osteotomy.  Possibly a combination of both.
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Gained 3 inches on tibias (Ilizarov LON) in 2007 at the Beijing Institute of External Skeletal Fixation Technology with Prof. Hetao Xia and Dr. Aiming Peng.

If you have any questions, ask them here rather than by Private Message:
http://www.limblengtheningforum.com/index.php?topic=64544

Franz

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #8 on: May 21, 2014, 07:54:16 AM »

Some people think that's it's just a pain thing and then that's it, increased height.  But unfortunately, it is not.

I communicated with too many people who learned so the hard way.   This is a combination of feedback I received from a few people who has already done limb lengthening via both internal and external methods:

"Pain during this procedure should be the least of ones concerns....it's the lingering after effects of doing limb lengthening that people should be concerned about.

Whether that be

- nerve damage (numbness, altered sensation, painful supersensitivity (from neuromas formations),
- paralysis, or reduced motor function or response times, especially in high level sports);
- pain and stiffness from internal trauma and scarring;
- bio mechanical load changes and it's added load stresses on joints (back, hip, knees, and ankles) leading to pain and possible early Arthritis
- reduced Athletic response time and abilities;
- permanent muscle / adipose tissue damage / atrophy; mobility issues; reduced agility;
- osteoporosis and increased chances of osteochonral lesions;
- lingering aches and pains months or years, or even a lifetime after the lengthening is complete and you say Good Bye to your CLL doctor.etc."

One may or may not notice or realize it at the beginning, but long term, it's a different story.

This is not simply working out and building anew like some people put it....if it was, then there would be a whole lot less lasting complications since people would recover completely from it...

But unfortunately, Limb lengthening surgery is not like working out like how some people think it is...it's not just going through some pain and then rebuilding back stronger.

Instead, this is more like how a healthy athlete/person who gets in a serious injury, such as in a sporting accident or car accident, and has to undergoes traumatic surgery which cuts open, damages, scars (internally and externally) and alters the natural body...sure they may recover to a point...but they will never be like their PRE-surgical / PRE-injured self.

If physical pain during the lengthening procedure, as well as the cost and time; were the only things one has to deal with when undergoing Limb Lengthening, then this would be heaven....but unfortunately, it is not.

Countless patients in the past, who lengthened various amounts with various Doctors (From the some of the best, to some of the worst) and various techniques (internal, external, or both) have found out.

This is the reality, and even though people may not want to hear, I feel it's something people need to know beforehand because it's critically important for their lives, before making this life-altering decision.

Of course, if the mental anguish of height neurosis is so bad, and if you feel that you will miss out more in life due to height prejudice / height neurosis even though you would be at peak physical healthiness / abilities, then maybe it's worth sacrificing some (or a lot) of physical freedom / health to open one's life up to the increased benefits from the increased height.

Height increase does have its benefits, but there will always be a cost, and it's not just temporary Lengthening pain, money, or time...a lot of times, it's more.

But then again, physical abilities go down overtime anyway, but the life you have with the increased in height, well that may be worth it...in the end, one must decide which possible path is the best for them to live the fullest life possible with the least amount of restrictions ...if it has to be with the height then maybe height increase is worth it.

But if the height is not really something that's worth permanently damaging yourself or losing a portion of your athletic / everyday freedom, as well as being symptom-free from ongoing aches, pains, nerve damages, and increased risk of other physical consequences in the future, then maybe one should work on their mental state and other physical attributes like working out, rather then their height."

Great post. This is the type of reality check needed. If you are so unhappy with your height that you are prepared to take the risks described, only then should you consider CLL.
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KiloKAHN

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #9 on: May 21, 2014, 06:57:24 PM »

Dameon, that was a fantastic post.  You should sticky that somewhere on the forums.  Too many users here are unaware that there's permanent side effects to LL and that this is something that's unavoidable.  When I read that people want to run faster with longer legs or start a professional sports career, I just shake my head.  You cannot stretch and build muscle through these problems, they will definitely affect you regardless of your PT.  Your body is not at a naturally increased height, you are the product of artificial lengthening.  Saying you can run faster after LL is like saying muscle implants in your arms will make you lift more weights.  ::)

I agree. Either Dameon's post or this page in particular should be stickied to the top of the Limb Lengthening Discussion and Questions section. It's something that everyone considering this surgery should read.
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shortkid

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #10 on: June 25, 2014, 05:47:18 AM »

This post just made me a little depressed. I thought you could make a full recovery after LL. I know people say they lose a little athletic ability but I thought after a couple years if you work on it everything would get back to normal :/
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crimsontide

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #11 on: June 25, 2014, 06:30:14 AM »

short kid... I'm not done yet, but i  will tell you the most likely longterm complications from ll

i guess early arthritis is possible, but for various reasons,I'm not too worried about it, and won't not show up for a while,.. if it ever did in the future,  I'm confident that i could deal with it, especially with all the medical advances that will happen in next 20-30 years

reduced athletic ability is a given... by that i mean you'll never  be equal to the athlete you were before, but could be 90%,  though it depends

painmaches, i guess its possible, thought i don't think this happens with all/most


what i think is a definite possibility is the numbness,reduced sensations in certain parts of my legs... it does not  hinder the functioning of the leg, but it does feel odd to touch a part of your leg and have  it be numb.... id say this complication appears to be quite frequent... permeant in a lot of cases too...  its wort it to me though... id much rather be taller and deal with numbness than  short and no numbness
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gettingtaller

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #12 on: June 25, 2014, 06:52:00 AM »

I absolutely have some numbness (1 month post ckicking).
I've met lots of patients who are a few years post surgery and they've all been free of any of the scary stuff. It's worth knowing all of the above but I think a lot of it is worst case scenario stuff.
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Did internal femurs with Prof. Betz in February 2014.
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Wannabegiant

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #13 on: June 25, 2014, 07:05:33 AM »

This post just made me a little depressed. I thought you could make a full recovery after LL. I know people say they lose a little athletic ability but I thought after a couple years if you work on it everything would get back to normal :/

It depends a bit on how much you lengthen, and what method you use. A lot of the the problems with the knees can be avoided if you dont use an internal nail on your tibias, and like doctor Franz (an ortopedic surgeon posting on this forum) confirmed, doing 5 cm or less is significantly safer than doing more. If you stay within that threshold, you should theoretically be able to recover to the point of not noticing the loss of athletic ability in the long run.

Since the mechanics of the legs are always changed, its probably impossible to technically reach 100% of what you where before, but the less you lengthen the less you change the mechanics of your legs, so it will probably not be noticeable at 5 or less cm.
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ReadRothbard

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #14 on: October 06, 2014, 05:08:06 AM »

You can; Dr. Paley and Dr. Guichet say you can themselves.
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“If you're afraid - don't do it, - if you're doing it - don't be afraid!” ― Genghis Khan

Height: 170 cm(66.9") Sitting Height: 95 cm (37.5") Goal: 183-185 cm (6'0-6'1)

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Ajax2thousand20

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #15 on: December 06, 2014, 09:34:53 AM »

People are stupid. South Africa is a developed nation. Everyone knows that.

The only thing that turned me off about going to Birkholtz was him mentioning that amputated the leg is a possibility. I know something like that probably won't happen and don't know if it has but it's not a risk I'm willing to take.
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Starting height: 185.5cms Goal/ dream height:190-193cms!
Sitting height:94 cms Arm Length: 86.5 cms 
Leg length:104 cms Arm Span:191 cms
Tibia: 48 cms Femurs:55cms

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #16 on: December 06, 2014, 10:19:24 AM »

The only thing that turned me off about going to Birkholtz was him mentioning that amputated the leg is a possibility. I know something like that probably won't happen and don't know if it has but it's not a risk I'm willing to take.

That can happen with any doctor, he's just honest.
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TRS

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #17 on: December 06, 2014, 10:32:41 AM »

The only thing that turned me off about going to Birkholtz was him mentioning that amputated the leg is a possibility. I know something like that probably won't happen and don't know if it has but it's not a risk I'm willing to take.
He is being honest about the worst possible outcome of LL which includes ampuation. It is important for prospective LL'ers to know that complications such as severe osteomyelitis, non-union, compartment syndrome and nerve damage can possibly lead to amputation. Keep in mind that death is also a possibility and it can happen with any surgeon.   
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Ajax2thousand20

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #18 on: December 06, 2014, 08:53:47 PM »

Yes right. I'm aware anything is possible and there is a price to pay for altering the anatomy of your body. The way he said it made it sound like the chances were greater with him that's all.
What are the odds of losing a limb and death (from the mental anguish or severe pain)
and has they're been any reports of them from any ll patient or forum? Also, is it more likely this would happen on exceeding 5 cms or 7.5 cms or even below 5cms?
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Starting height: 185.5cms Goal/ dream height:190-193cms!
Sitting height:94 cms Arm Length: 86.5 cms 
Leg length:104 cms Arm Span:191 cms
Tibia: 48 cms Femurs:55cms

Blackhawk

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #19 on: December 06, 2014, 10:00:12 PM »

Yes right. I'm aware anything is possible and there is a price to pay for altering the anatomy of your body. The way he said it made it sound like the chances were greater with him that's all.
What are the odds of losing a limb and death (from the mental anguish or severe pain)
and has they're been any reports of them from any ll patient or forum? Also, is it more likely this would happen on exceeding 5 cms or 7.5 cms or even below 5cms?

I have read a lot if diaries and articles about LL the last couple of years but I haven't read any personal accounts of amputation.  There are a lot of unfinished diaries and LLers that seem to disappear.  That always concerns me and I think about the bad things that may have happened to them.
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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #20 on: December 06, 2014, 10:17:47 PM »

Yes right. I'm aware anything is possible and there is a price to pay for altering the anatomy of your body. The way he said it made it sound like the chances were greater with him that's all.
What are the odds of losing a limb and death (from the mental anguish or severe pain)
and has they're been any reports of them from any ll patient or forum? Also, is it more likely this would happen on exceeding 5 cms or 7.5 cms or even below 5cms?

That can happen quite fast, it doesn't really matter how much you lengthen, a bone infection can always happen and if the antibiotics won't work and the OP is not a success an amputation is the last possible way to save you from death. Also a deep vein thrombosis, which can cause a pulmonary embolism, can kill you, that happens quite often.
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Ajax2thousand20

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #21 on: December 06, 2014, 10:50:19 PM »

That can happen quite fast, it doesn't really matter how much you lengthen, a bone infection can always happen and if the antibiotics won't work and the OP is not a success an amputation is the last possible way to save you from death. Also a deep vein thrombosis, which can cause a pulmonary embolism, can kill you, that happens quite often.

Yeah. I can just imagine something went wrong with the unfinished Mahboubian Diary on here Such a sleazy doctor.
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Starting height: 185.5cms Goal/ dream height:190-193cms!
Sitting height:94 cms Arm Length: 86.5 cms 
Leg length:104 cms Arm Span:191 cms
Tibia: 48 cms Femurs:55cms

ReadRothbard

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #22 on: December 07, 2014, 03:19:14 AM »

There has never been a case of amputation with ll. I don't know what you're talking about.
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“If you're afraid - don't do it, - if you're doing it - don't be afraid!” ― Genghis Khan

Height: 170 cm(66.9") Sitting Height: 95 cm (37.5") Goal: 183-185 cm (6'0-6'1)

Physics major, male stripper, powerlifter,

goodlucktomylegs

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #23 on: December 07, 2014, 03:57:06 AM »

I'm very scare word"amputation" :'( :'(
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TRS

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2014, 06:29:29 AM »

Yes right. I'm aware anything is possible and there is a price to pay for altering the anatomy of your body. The way he said it made it sound like the chances were greater with him that's all.
What are the odds of losing a limb and death (from the mental anguish or severe pain)
and has they're been any reports of them from any ll patient or forum? Also, is it more likely this would happen on exceeding 5 cms or 7.5 cms or even below 5cms?
Chances of amputation or death is very slim to zero with a good surgeon. Deep infection, embolism and compartment syndrome can happen regardless of how much you lengthen, the latter two mostly happens after surgery. Non-union could be multifactorial and nerve damage could happen with higher lengthening amount. There have not been any reported amputation cases in forum patient diaries but I have read studies that exclude some patients from the study because their outcome was amputation. They don't state the reason why they were amputated but these patients did have pre-existing trauma before fixation and some resulted in osteomyelitis and non-union. Compartment syndrome, complex non-union and osteomyelitis resulting to amputation have been reported in studies.
Just remember that these are worst possible outcomes to LL, although rare with a good surgeon. Judging from some of the posts in this forum, it seems that some prospective LL'ers take this surgery very lightly and believe that they're immune to very serious complications. It's not a good idea to be overconfident. You must consider and accept the worst case scenario before LL. A forum member did experience a life threatening condition a day after his surgery and he immediately had to be shifted to the ICU unit, despite having surgery with the best. His experience was horrifying and seriously made me reconsider LL. It was an eye opener. I believe that majority of serious complications related to LL will not be reported in LL forums and only a very few percent of LL patients do have diaries. 
       
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Ajax2thousand20

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2014, 06:53:59 AM »

Chances of amputation or death is very slim to zero with a good surgeon. Deep infection, embolism and compartment syndrome can happen regardless of how much you lengthen, the latter two mostly happens after surgery. Non-union could be multifactorial and nerve damage could happen with higher lengthening amount. There have not been any reported amputation cases in forum patient diaries but I have read studies that exclude some patients from the study because their outcome was amputation. They don't state the reason why they were amputated but these patients did have pre-existing trauma before fixation and some resulted in osteomyelitis and non-union. Compartment syndrome, complex non-union and osteomyelitis resulting to amputation have been reported in studies.
Just remember that these are worst possible outcomes to LL, although rare with a good surgeon. Judging from some of the posts in this forum, it seems that some prospective LL'ers take this surgery very lightly and believe that they're immune to very serious complications. It's not a good idea to be overconfident. You must consider and accept the worst case scenario before LL. A forum member did experience a life threatening condition a day after his surgery and he immediately had to be shifted to the ICU unit, despite having surgery with the best. His experience was horrifying and seriously made me reconsider LL. It was an eye opener. I believe that majority of serious complications related to LL will not be reported in LL forums and only a very few percent of LL patients do have diaries. 
     

Yes I know. I knew that the outcome of losing life or a limb is very unlikely to happen but they're is still a chance. I think the fact that Dr. Birkholtz brought it up made me think that it happened under his supervision. I do not think I would lose a limb or die doing this operation but I do know that you are going to lose something with this surgery because no matter how successful the operation is you'll lose something like job promotion, personal relationships, lose of athletic ability etc. In my case, I think it's definitely worth going to various countries to get a good view of what it's like because all though I want this surgery more than almost anything, I know the thing that I want most could destroy me in the end even If I don't die or lose a limb.
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Starting height: 185.5cms Goal/ dream height:190-193cms!
Sitting height:94 cms Arm Length: 86.5 cms 
Leg length:104 cms Arm Span:191 cms
Tibia: 48 cms Femurs:55cms

TRS

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #26 on: December 07, 2014, 07:10:07 AM »

Yes I know. I knew that the outcome of losing life or a limb is very unlikely to happen but they're is still a chance. I think the fact that Dr. Birkholtz brought it up made me think that it happened under his supervision. I do not think I would lose a limb or die doing this operation but I do know that you are going to lose something with this surgery because no matter how successful the operation is you'll lose something like job promotion, personal relationships, lose of athletic ability etc. In my case, I think it's definitely worth going to various countries to get a good view of what it's like because all though I want this surgery more than almost anything, I know the thing that I want most could destroy me in the end even If I don't die or lose a limb.
I remember the initial reaction in Dr.B's page when he mentioned amputation and was derided by several forum members. But as a prospective LL patient I would want to hear the worst case scenario before entering the operation theatre. Sometimes patients only like to hear what they want to hear and many doctors can take advantage of this, but a good doctor will always let their patients know about the worst possible outcome and not guarantee anything with a risky surgery.
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Moubgf

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #27 on: December 07, 2014, 07:33:06 AM »

mehh if its amputation, Just end your own life fast easy. Not alot lost. But if you gain that new height. life begins. 50-50. Only the worthy survive
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Ajax2thousand20

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #28 on: December 07, 2014, 08:16:04 AM »

mehh if its amputation, Just end your own life fast easy. Not alot lost. But if you gain that new height. life begins. 50-50. Only the worthy survive

Don't agree. Some doctors are driven by greed and not your safety. Build a strong repport with your doc and if you genuinely trust him/her, you'll probably be okay.
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Starting height: 185.5cms Goal/ dream height:190-193cms!
Sitting height:94 cms Arm Length: 86.5 cms 
Leg length:104 cms Arm Span:191 cms
Tibia: 48 cms Femurs:55cms

Metanoia

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #29 on: December 07, 2014, 11:54:47 AM »

Chances of amputation or death is very slim to zero with a good surgeon. Deep infection, embolism and compartment syndrome can happen regardless of how much you lengthen, the latter two mostly happens after surgery. Non-union could be multifactorial and nerve damage could happen with higher lengthening amount. There have not been any reported amputation cases in forum patient diaries but I have read studies that exclude some patients from the study because their outcome was amputation. They don't state the reason why they were amputated but these patients did have pre-existing trauma before fixation and some resulted in osteomyelitis and non-union. Compartment syndrome, complex non-union and osteomyelitis resulting to amputation have been reported in studies.
Just remember that these are worst possible outcomes to LL, although rare with a good surgeon. Judging from some of the posts in this forum, it seems that some prospective LL'ers take this surgery very lightly and believe that they're immune to very serious complications. It's not a good idea to be overconfident. You must consider and accept the worst case scenario before LL. A forum member did experience a life threatening condition a day after his surgery and he immediately had to be shifted to the ICU unit, despite having surgery with the best. His experience was horrifying and seriously made me reconsider LL. It was an eye opener. I believe that majority of serious complications related to LL will not be reported in LL forums and only a very few percent of LL patients do have diaries. 
     
Very good comment. There's a clear bias in the forums not to show the complications. I have been attacked several times for writing about what i have seen at a very popular doctor. Nobody gets attacked for writing nice things. Even patients with diaries try to hide negative things (they are still under treatment , how could they dare openly criticise their doctors? ) . They rather stop writing or simply don't tell the truth.
I personally believe if i went to India my experience wouldn't have been worse than what has happened to me in Germany.
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alps

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Re: Risks/Complications Of LL
« Reply #30 on: December 07, 2014, 12:12:36 PM »

Chances of amputation or death is very slim to zero with a good surgeon. Deep infection, embolism and compartment syndrome can happen regardless of how much you lengthen, the latter two mostly happens after surgery. Non-union could be multifactorial and nerve damage could happen with higher lengthening amount. There have not been any reported amputation cases in forum patient diaries but I have read studies that exclude some patients from the study because their outcome was amputation. They don't state the reason why they were amputated but these patients did have pre-existing trauma before fixation and some resulted in osteomyelitis and non-union. Compartment syndrome, complex non-union and osteomyelitis resulting to amputation have been reported in studies.
Just remember that these are worst possible outcomes to LL, although rare with a good surgeon. Judging from some of the posts in this forum, it seems that some prospective LL'ers take this surgery very lightly and believe that they're immune to very serious complications. It's not a good idea to be overconfident. You must consider and accept the worst case scenario before LL. A forum member did experience a life threatening condition a day after his surgery and he immediately had to be shifted to the ICU unit, despite having surgery with the best. His experience was horrifying and seriously made me reconsider LL. It was an eye opener. I believe that majority of serious complications related to LL will not be reported in LL forums and only a very few percent of LL patients do have diaries. 
     

Questions rising shorty,
1. Why will non-union lead to amputation? Worst case let it stay unconsolidated, walk with crutches all your life.
2. Are there sudden "signs" of these dangers: nerve damage and compartment syndrome? So that you can stop lengthening in a timely fashion? It's not like you go to bed doing 1mm and the next morning it's over, right?
3. You seem to have a tone of someone prepared for this kind of stuff? Could you have really lived through if you faced a leg amputation? I don't understand how someone who feels so unhappy being short and considers a ridiculously crazy procedure can accept such an adverse outcome. No offense, just curious.
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