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[SpeedDialer]

So the point of the "Americans" part is the currency exchange issue for someone who has USD. In greece I think they use euros and in India they use rupees (lakh is 100,000 Indina rupeees evidently https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lakh). I believe that young people in Greece and India are taught English in school in addition to their native languages, though I imagine Mumbai has more English speakers overall?

1. Which is cheaper overall when all the costs have been added up?

2. What are the other pros and cons?

On one hand, the cleanliness of Parihar's facility and the stomach virus Kilohan got are very scary. I'm under the impression that westerners/people who haven't lived in India don't always do so well when they go to India in terms of stomach issues and getting diseases.

On the other hand, Parihar's interview on youtube did make him look very good and if he is cheaper (ex: if the Indian rupee/lakh depreciates relative to the USD moreso than the euro relative to the USD) then its a real consideration. The other issue that makes Parihar look like a good option is that he says that he will have access to Stryde just like Giotikas.

I've saved up about 155k$ USD, hoping to do both tibia and femur internal with stryde in about two years after covid. I'll probably have like $160k ish max saved by then but maybe still 155k.

[readyprecisestryde]

I traveled to India a few years ago and also got the stomach virus. I think the locals are immune to it.

[Body Builder]

There are no pros of Parihar compared to Giotikas for noone except maybe for an Indian from the same town.

No sane person would prefer India from Greece, especially for almost the same price and a worst nail (precise 2 vs stryde).

[KiloKAHN]

Dr Parihar pretty much has access to Stryde already. He said in the interview that Nuvasive is currently being audited, so due to Nuvasive's internal nails being shipped into the country on an individual basis, it'll be available again within a couple weeks from the interview date. Since the nails take 1.5 to 2 months to arrive in Mumbai after the license is obtained, one could probably coordinate with him now to get the Stryde license process started. With the covid situation I don't think anyone outside of India can even get the surgery there before Nuvasive's audit is finished, anyway.

Dr Giotikas seems like he'd be a good doc based on what I was able to hear in his interview, and Greece is a better destination than India in a lot of ways. However, if you stay at a nicer hotel in Mumbai during distraction, you're not living like the average person there and would be very comfortable.

I think it will ultimately boil down to what's more important to you during lengthening, be it doctor experience or scenery or whatever else, and then go from there.

[frenchie]

I don't know why Giotikas has such a high standing here without any strong evidence. All we see are some cosmetic LL cases of him on the forum.

He is relatively less experienced, works out of 2 countries and isn't particularly known outside of this forum.

Greece is not without its problems. But even if someone were to think Greece is a very developed country, it doesn't work that way with this field of medicine because it is too niche. I live in a "developed" country and wouldn't trust my legs with any local doctor here with any limb lengthening or deformity correction.

That said, Giotikas might be good, but one needs to do their own research outside of this forum.

Also, India is also probably a very difficult place to do this procedure for anyone from outside India.

[Body Builder]

I don't know why Giotikas has such a high standing here without any strong evidence. All we see are some cosmetic LL cases of him on the forum.

He is relatively less experienced, works out of 2 countries and isn't particularly known outside of this forum.

Greece is not without its problems. But even if someone were to think Greece is a very developed country, it doesn't work that way with this field of medicine because it is too niche. I live in a "developed" country and wouldn't trust my legs with any local doctor here with any limb lengthening or deformity correction.

That said, Giotikas might be good, but one needs to do their own research outside of this forum.

Also, India is also probably a very difficult place to do this procedure for anyone from outside India.

Giotikas works on Greece but also on a university hospital on London so there is a great evidence that he is a capable doctor.
I haven't seen some proof that Parihar is a better one doctor.

Anyway, dr Parihar may be a good doctor but his prices are way too much for India and I would never do such a risky surgery to a third world country's hospital.
Even if Parihar is a s good as Giotikas or even more experienced (I doubt personally), still I can't find any reason to do LL on India compared to Greece with the same price.

[SpeedDialer]

Thanks!!!! When all costs are factored in, is Dr. Parihar considerably cheaper than Giotikas for someone who has all his money in US dollars?

[SpeedDialer]

If you traveled to India again, what would you do differently to decrease the odds of catching something?

[Body Builder]

Thanks!!!! When all costs are factored in, is Dr. Parihar considerably cheaper than Giotikas for someone who has all his money in US dollars?

No he is not.

[exceeding2meters]

Parihar is like 40k+ for stryde (if it is even stryde, maybe he does only precise 2)

Giotikas is 45k for stryde. Needless to say Greece is a much better country, food is especially better and cheap

[RB]

Parihar definitely seems like a competent surgeon especially in cases of deformities and discrepancies, however in his interview with cyborg, he stated that he has only done 3 cosmetic cases. Although cosmetic cases are more straightforward, I struggle to see why anyone would chose to go to India when Giotikas has a dedicated cosmetic practice including multiple diaries on this forum and is a lead trauma consultant in a UK hospial which demonstrates he can deal with complex deformity cases as well as cosmetic cases. Add to the fact that Greece is a very liveable country and you won't deal with the potential stomach virus and hygiene issues that you may face in India.

Parihar would be a great choice if he was located in a more developed country imo. The cost factor is also too similar to make that the basis of your decision. At the end of the day it's up to where you feel more comfortable and which surgeon you trust more.

[SpeedDialer]

[KiloKAHN]

Parihar definitely seems like a competent surgeon especially in cases of deformities and discrepancies, however in his interview with cyborg, he stated that he has only done 3 cosmetic cases. Although cosmetic cases are more straightforward, I struggle to see why anyone would chose to go to India when Giotikas has a dedicated cosmetic practice including multiple diaries on this forum and is a lead trauma consultant in a UK hospial which demonstrates he can deal with complex deformity cases as well as cosmetic cases. Add to the fact that Greece is a very liveable country and you won't deal with the potential stomach virus and hygiene issues that you may face in India.

Parihar would be a great choice if he was located in a more developed country imo. The cost factor is also too similar to make that the basis of your decision. At the end of the day it's up to where you feel more comfortable and which surgeon you trust more.

He was specifically referring to cosmetic cases using the Precice. He has also performed 2 unilateral Precice tibia lengthenings for leg length discrepancy.

As to total cosmetic patients, I did external tibias with him in 2014 and at the time I was his 11th cosmetic patient, and I know of at least 1 person who did LON with him after me, so he's had at least 15 cosmetic cases in his 30 years of lengthening.

[RB]

He was specifically referring to cosmetic cases using the Precice. He has also performed 2 unilateral Precice tibia lengthenings for leg length discrepancy.

As to total cosmetic patients, I did external tibias with him in 2014 and at the time I was his 11th cosmetic patient, and I know of at least 1 person who did LON with him after me, so he's had at least 15 cosmetic cases in his 30 years of lengthening.

Oh that makes sense. Thanks for the clarification.

[SpeedDialer]

Thanks for replying RB!!

1. If you were leaving from D.C. to see Dr. Giotikas in Athens for a consultation, how many days total would you budget for the whole thing and what day would you leave?

2. What would you bring with you to Athens for the consultation?

[asian]

You should go to Sinai Hospital since Baltimore is very close to D.C.  I think their price is about 70k for femurs.

[RB]

Thanks for replying RB!!

1. If you were leaving from D.C. to see Dr. Giotikas in Athens for a consultation, how many days total would you budget for the whole thing and what day would you leave?

2. What would you bring with you to Athens for the consultation?

No problem mate!

I am scheduled to do femurs using stryde with Dr Giotikas in March next year.

I didn't go for the in-person consultation as I am in Australia. I did everything completely online and was approved for surgery after I sent my medical history and completed a psychological assessment and discussed everything with him. I would recommend doing an online consultation as you won't have to make 2 separate trips to Greece.

If you have any other questions feel free to let me know.

[SpeedDialer]

Thanks!!!

Online consultation with Giotikas? Wait so he doesn't need to take X rays or examine or measure your legs? What was this process like, what kind of doctors did you go to, and what documents did you need to send to him?

[SpeedDialer]

Right? Except I'm a bit confused because I read from Assayag's page is like 100k not 70k so I'm not sure what's going on. But then I would not be able to afford internal tibias too if I did this in America.

[SpeedDialer]

Thanks, I really appreciate it.

With Dr. Giotikas, how far in advance can you schedule a surgery after the online consultation?

 I'm planning on the doing the surgery the year after getting a covid vaccine and am concerned about prices rising oer time. Currently hoping to do a consultation late 2022 and then start surgery in January of 2023. I wonder if doing a consultation early will let me get earlier prices or if I'll just need to do a second consultation if I do it too early

[RB]

Thanks!!!

Online consultation with Giotikas? Wait so he doesn't need to take X rays or examine or measure your legs? What was this process like, what kind of doctors did you go to, and what documents did you need to send to him?

You don't need to send him x-rays as they do all that the day before the surgery at the pre-op checks. It may be a different process for tibias as they need to determine if the stryde can fit in your tibia as it is a smaller bone than the femur. I also completed a questionnaire about my medical history and height goals etc on a form before the consultation. I had my consult back in October and am doing the surgery in March. I believe you can schedule the surgery and do the consult a maximum of 6 months out.

[overandover]

The price for stryde with Parihar is 900k + 2300k INR which is 43,780 USD whereas with Giotikas it is 55,511.51 USD. You can go to this website and read reviews about Parihar https://www.practo.com/mumbai/doctor/mangal-parihar-orthopedist/recommended for non-cometic procedures. Also, If you'll avoid street food then you won't get any stomach infections. There are apps where you can order healthy and hygienic food (swiggy, curefit). The cost of living is also cheaper compared to Greece. You can live in an Airbnb and also hire a helper who can speak English. I think for 3 months the total cost will be 400k INR for all this which around 5500 USD.

[KiloKAHN]

I think finding a hotel to stay in is the best option lengthening in Mumbai. Not only do most staff act as helpers essentially, but you have an extra layer of security and the rooms are likely to be much nicer.  Plus if an outage occurs, hotels are quick to fix it. A three star hotel should average $1500 a month with an extended stay discount.

[SpeedDialer]

Thank you so much, indian!!!!!

Things sound very good so I'm just going to ask some questions in case

1. What do you feel are the worst things about doing this in Mumbai?

2. What do you feel are the worst thing about Parihar? I imagine he hasn't done alot of cosmetic cases and then probably hasn't done alot of tibias then?

Maybe some more forum members should go with Parihar and write diaries, 43,780 USD for stryde and a Paley student sounds amazing

[SpeedDialer]

Man, I'm having second thoughts on my Greece plan even though I've been listening to intro greek language audiobooks in prep for Athens (originally was planning to be doing it fall 2020 but then covid struck and I got embroiled in other things)

43,780 USD with Parihar whereas with Giotikas it is 55,511.51 USD

That's almost 12k$ USD difference which is a big difference if you do two surgeries. 24k$ difference total?

And the hotel people being helpers sounds nice.

If Giotikas changes prices and the euro gets stronger relative to the dollar, I wonder if in two years after covid if Parihar is the only way I'll be able to do internals on both with a budget of 155k-160k

I was thinking of maybe getting an FUT hair transplant in Athens though which would be slightly cheaper than USA and Athens does look cleaner than Mumbai. But the Mumbai stomach virus reports are still scary. And Athens will feel more like America I'm sure b/c its western. Wonder if the weather feels better in athens in January 2023 vs January in Mumbai? I've never thought about researching FUT hair transplant in Mumbai, I assumed it must be too dangerous for some reason?

AAAAGH decisions, decisions 

[SpeedDialer]

Hmmmm if you walk around in Mumbai with a face mask + face shield + gloves even after covid, will taxi drivers refuse to pick you up/people get weirded out? To decrease the chance of getting a disease if you're a westerner who presumably hasn't built up the immunity to diseases in the new location?

[overandover]

You can get the vaccine for the stomach virus. But this shouldn't be a problem if you order from good places. Also, you can just call an uber you don't have to worry about taxi drivers and stuff. No one uses those taxies these days.

1. What do you feel are the worst things about doing this in Mumbai?
A.I don't think you'll face any issues because of the city itself. There are a lot of apps for everything like food, taxi, pickup and drop etc. You can order anything you want from Amazon and other apps. Everything is in English. Medicines, physio, caretaker everything will be cheaper compared to Greece.

2. What do you feel are the worst thing about Parihar? I imagine he hasn't done alot of cosmetic cases and then probably hasn't done alot of tibias then?
A. He hasn't done a lot of internal cosmetic cases. But he has done some complex noncosmetic cases and he fixed bone infection and other complex things for people. He is a popular doctor in India. I think Giotikas has more cosmetic and precise experience than Parihar. If you can afford Giotikas then It's better to talk to both docs and then decide.

[Activatedxx]

Parihar is like 40k+ for stryde (if it is even stryde, maybe he does only precise 2)

Giotikas is 45k for stryde. Needless to say Greece is a much better country, food is especially better and cheap

Giotikas is euros, he is over 54k in usd

[Gman23]

I am from India but live in the UK. As I’ve lived in India, I know how it is the good and bad...
This is how I know India
- The county is beautiful and does has good people, but most of them are bad,
- The government of India is corrupt and hence there are bad people

The good thing about India is it is fairy cheap and there are many decent places, decent hotels, decent restaurants and many more things.
A lot of tourist spots and Dr Parihar is a great surgeon according to many people

But there are more bad things then good about India.
First of all India has too much population, too many people hence there is a lot of beggars and slums and poverty

You could land at the airport and even get robbed ... that’s how bad India is. It’s not really a safe place, the police are corrupt, they take bribes and there’s a lot of thief’s and all kinds of people.
They scam people who are foreigners, outsiders knowing that they are new in India.
As much as I love India, I don’t love its people.
Infact I hate the Indian government

In my opinion Greece is a better option if you want to live in a good place and feel safe
But if you want something cheaper I believe India could be possibly cheaper also I believe Dr Parihar is possibly cheaper.

I am not saying India is a bad place but from my experience India is not so safe,I’m an Indian and I know how the people are ...

[Gman23]

Also as I said Indian government doesn’t really care about its people hence the hospitals and other places are filthy... and the street foods are not hygienic either...

It’s the Indian government to blame for making India a shxt place

Anyways there are good sides of India and it’s people so goes both ways

[SpeedDialer]

Hey Gman, will you go with Parihar? Assuming one wears mask/gloves/face mask, avoids certain foods, and gets stomach virus immunization beforehand to avoid illnesses, it seems like a good way to save 12k$ or 24k$ and live in a hotel.

I'm considering it, the dirtiness doesn't sound so bad if I can bring an occulus quest 2 and escape into virtual reality in a hotel